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BS: New rules for Grocery shopping

17 Mar 20 - 08:37 AM (#4040149)
Subject: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

The one exposure we may all face is food shopping

Since the virus can survive on plastic for 3 days and about one day on cardboard it would be less risk to isolate grocery store items for 4 days before unpacking. If something needs refridgertion, wipe down wih sanitizer before bringing it in.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/coronavirus-can-stay-infectious-for-days-on-surfaces/2020/03/12/9b54a99e-6472-11ea-845d-e3

Advice: Don't go.
If you must, protect yourself with gloves and a silly mask. Sillier the better.

Did you really need that jar of mayonaise?
Sure this is an abundance of caution and others will have different numbers for the virus but very bit helps. People will avoid you with social distancing.


What to buy: enjoy yourself


17 Mar 20 - 08:41 AM (#4040150)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

Availability will change sooner for produce or chicken but beans and rice works in the long run. You guys could probably make anything delicious.


17 Mar 20 - 09:21 AM (#4040154)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Doug Chadwick

I was in a large supermarket this morning and they were restricting the sale of bananas to 12 per customer. Who stockpiles bananas? Even if they are green at the start of the week, they will be black before the week is out if they are not eaten up.

My guess is that people are hoping to keep the family fed on banana loaf if bread becomes hard to find.

DC


17 Mar 20 - 09:36 AM (#4040157)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: gillymor

I peel and chunk and bananas wrap them in plastic (make sure the parts don't touch each other for ease of usage) freeze them and use them in smoothies as a sweetener and for their nutritional value.


17 Mar 20 - 09:44 AM (#4040162)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Mrrzy

My store is out of garlic. Really.


17 Mar 20 - 09:52 AM (#4040165)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Mrrzy

Also I tried to order delivery groceries but it would take a week to get them delivered.


17 Mar 20 - 10:01 AM (#4040167)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Rapparee

I'm going to enjoy some coffee with some other old farts and then go to the store and see if I can get some cough drops and perhaps some cookies (biscuits) and frozen vegetables. Then I'll go home and stay there until tomorrow, maybe. Wow! Days now are filled with thrills!


17 Mar 20 - 10:07 AM (#4040170)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains

Stores will likely be out of more than garlic going forward. Hopefully supply dislocations will only result while adjustment is made to the new reality.
In days of your the UK government stockpiled ministery marge, flour, dried milk and other basics. This finished in the 80's as the cold war threat was reviewed. In the intervening years food supply has morphed from stockpiles in stores to just in time deliveries. We will see how well that works in weeks to come. Meanwhile the UK imports a considerable amount from Europe and 40% of Irish supermarket shelves are stocked from the UK.

I keep my meat live on the hoof if required. My power comes from an onsite hydros exporting to the grid. I will be sowing a half acre of veg very shortly.
I was a boyscout.


17 Mar 20 - 10:39 AM (#4040179)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

At least UK preppers don't need to worry about buying, or making, enough bullets...


17 Mar 20 - 10:47 AM (#4040181)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Sandra in Sydney

we have shortages in our supermarkets due to fools panic buying stuff, including toilet paper (we make our own & will never run out) hand sanitisers, & lots more.

a few cartoons

Coronavirus panic buying still leaves empty shelves for elderly shoppers one of our supermarkets opens early for seniors & vulnerable people & still they can't always get what they need


17 Mar 20 - 10:48 AM (#4040182)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

As usual Iains you are not most people.
I like gillymor ideas

Garlic is known as a poor man's penacillin
It is also useful to ward off vampires :^{


17 Mar 20 - 11:06 AM (#4040188)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: gillymor

Sandra wrote: "...toilet paper (we make our own & will never run out)"

Can you share your method or is it an old family secret?


17 Mar 20 - 12:24 PM (#4040232)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Mr Red

My store is out of garlic. Really. my kind of store. Shame it is temporary!

It is also useful to ward off vampires - and those dressed in red

A little garlic goes a long way, as far away as is humanly possible IMNSHO.


17 Mar 20 - 12:37 PM (#4040239)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: DMcG

I was wondering what the consequences of AI systems on some shops would be. In the days of the old corner shop, the shopkeeper knew the customers and demand and stocked appropriately. Until recently, there was an analysis in the big chains of stock against date, so they knew what to order when.

Now we have AI monitoring of sales rates, and they will have noticed everyone is buying toilet roll (for example), some basics and not a lot else.

I predict in a few weeks time supermarkets will be wall to wall toilet rolls and little else, because that was where all the demand was …

I call this AS (Artificial Stupidity)


17 Mar 20 - 01:04 PM (#4040250)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

AI toilet paper glut? You could be right.


17 Mar 20 - 01:05 PM (#4040252)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Mr Red

AI is profoundly good at detecting trends. In historical data. Predicting future trends needs extraneous data like COVID-19 and (far from AI) real stupidity.

I have seen examples like a dog (husky) classified as a wolf by AI and, when suitably programmed to give reasons, revealed the presence of snow in the background. Because pictures of wolves are more numerous and distinct with snow in the background. Bias is in the data - our chosen data. eg clinical trials don't include pregnant women, and women of childbearing age are under-represented. We may applaud, but it is bias waiting to bite us on the bum, particularly women.

We used to say GIGO - Garbage In Garbage Out. How come the AI fraternity forgot that? History repeats itself, it has to, nobody is listening.

Groceries:
Once people have a stock, they will stop buying in bulk, but maintain there normal usage. Though when you have plenty, normal involves profligacy! So demand will be elevated - thus.


17 Mar 20 - 01:13 PM (#4040255)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

Last night my wife came home from Tesco saying all the essentials are depleted..
No bog rolls or anti-bac hand-washes and sprays, etc..

But not to worry, she'd brought home a bulk box of profiteroles..

I think that attitude might get us through the crisis...???


17 Mar 20 - 02:39 PM (#4040295)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Tattie Bogle

I did a brief supermarket shop yesterday: needed milk (but could do without if we had to), fresh tomatoes (ditto), spaghetti (only because we HAD nearly run out - took ONE of the few packs left), washing powder.
Toilet rolls? No - we always have a spare pack in the cupboard, bought before all this panic buying started, (But there weren't any anyway!)Paracetamol? - none but have enough already, also pre-dating panic buying.Soap? - got piles of those wee soap bars from hotels visited - while we still could!
Beer getting low but I don't drink it. Wines and spirits aplenty, so we can all drink ourselves to death rather than let Covid-19 do it. Pubs shutting daily!


17 Mar 20 - 03:25 PM (#4040317)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

A quick Google reveals this:

Homemade Substitutes for Toilet Paper

I have no idea why grass and leaves are added to the water before boiling.

What is interesting is that some other alternatives are also mentioned, including some non-poisonous and non-irritant leaves and corn husks.

Which reminds me of a little ditty my Dad used to say:

In days of old when knights were bold and paper wasn't invented,
They wiped their bots on tops of grass and walked away contented.


17 Mar 20 - 04:27 PM (#4040327)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: DMcG

I was talking to by sister in law at the weekend, and when our children were small we both used cloth nappies/diapers.

Presumably the material and boil wash would still work !


17 Mar 20 - 04:40 PM (#4040329)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

Of course it would DMcG. So would just washing one's bottom over the toilet bowl with warm water and drying oneself with a towel. Are people totally incapable of improvising nowadays?
I think a complete lack of toilet rolls is the very last of our worries. Getting in food supplies such as fresh fruit, vegetables, milk and eggs etc is going to become tricky.
We're lucky living in the countryside, as several villagers keep hens, and there are farm shops not too far away that sell lovely vegetables. Our two village farmers have dairy herds.
But I realise that people in large cities are not so fortunate.


17 Mar 20 - 05:16 PM (#4040338)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Doug Chadwick

Our two village farmers have dairy herds.

Are the farms able to treat the milk before sale?The high-risk groups for Covid-19 are similar to those for unpasteurised milk, which has considerable health hazards of its own.

DC


17 Mar 20 - 08:29 PM (#4040372)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: McGrath of Harlow

Use newspapers, like everyone used to.

As for hoarding, responsible shops already put in place a kind of unofficial rationing,, limiting how much people can buy of anything potentially in shirt supply. If need be an official rationing system could be introduced - there's evidence from polling that that would be popular, at least in the UK.

There's a fiolk memory of how to behave in a crisis of this scale in the UK anyway.


17 Mar 20 - 08:47 PM (#4040376)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

grocery deliveries are now at 2 weeks from Giant.


18 Mar 20 - 03:47 AM (#4040415)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Doug Chadwick

Use newspapers, like everyone used to.

I subscribe to the electronic edition of my chosen daily newspaper. I can't remember the last time we had actual newspaper in the house.

DC


18 Mar 20 - 03:52 AM (#4040416)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: BobL

But why toilet rolls FFS? It's coronavirus, not dysentery!

The run on strong flour is of more import to me, I bake my own bread.


18 Mar 20 - 03:57 AM (#4040417)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Mr Red

I have no idea why grass and leaves are added to the water before boiling - presume it adds longer fibres to re-cycled paper. BTW the Romans used a sponge on a stick, hence the expression "don't get the wrong end of the stick". And if you suffer diarrhea, the soapy cloth and warm water not only cleans, but prevents/reduces after-burn. Sitting over the edge of the bath and running the tap is not such a faff, bleach and rinse the cloth often! Don't put wet-wipes down the pan, they contain plastic fibres for strength, wot end up in the ocean.

Use newspapers, like everyone used to. - the reason fish and chips stopped using newspapers was that modern inks are in the paper itself or the ink is not fully dry. It will rub of on, er um, you!

There's a fiolk memory of how to behave in a crisis of this scale in the UK anyway. - for those wot can rush out and garner wot is available - I would submit it is merely grand or great grand or parent's tales.

WARNING. My old Gran would have remembered WW1/2 and all her tinned food had the date purchased written on and she used in rotation or as we electronic engineers style it FIFO (first in first out - other styles are available). Read the sell-by-date or make yer own! And use logically.


18 Mar 20 - 09:52 AM (#4040469)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

My old mum lost her home to a German air raid, and was evacuated as a child..

She has a vivid memory of that era..

But only randomly when you ask her about something entirely unrelated..

If I ask her a direct question about life during the war,
she can't recall much at all...


18 Mar 20 - 09:58 AM (#4040470)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

Can't buy yeast for breadmaking. Alpro unsweetened oat, forget it. Bog roll, what's that! Paracetamol, nowhere in sight. Not a scrap of fresh fish, chicken or eggs in Sainsbury's. But a litre of Baileys in Morrisons is twelve quid down from twenty. I panic-bought two bottles for me Mum. That'll keep her smiling for a week or two.


18 Mar 20 - 01:15 PM (#4040512)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Manitas_at_home

Supermarkets have been selling out here in London but corner shops seem to have all the basics. I think it's because you walk to a corner shop so can't carry much away.


18 Mar 20 - 02:14 PM (#4040519)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: gillymor

My Trader Joe's is only letting in 50 people at a time (it's not a big one as TJ's go). It's a 5-10 minute wait, they're able to keep the store pretty well stocked and it's not nearly as crowded as it usually is this time of year.


18 Mar 20 - 02:30 PM (#4040521)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Stilly River Sage

Whole Foods is open an hour early for senior citizens to shop. (Whole Paycheck to most of us). My discount grocery is doing the same, but so many shoppers are senior citizens that I expect it will still be crowded. I'm hoping the "regular" and smaller grocery stores will adopt this soon. Even though I don't care to get up early in the morning I will if this is offered.


18 Mar 20 - 02:43 PM (#4040527)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: gillymor

I've found that Whole Food's prices have become much more reasonable and competitive with the other local groceries for a number of items since Amazon bought them out. Especially in the produce, bulk foods and frozen section. If you've got Amazon Prime you'll want to put the app on your phone to get discounts.


18 Mar 20 - 03:52 PM (#4040542)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Charmion

In Stratford, Ontario, Zehr's supermarket has a sign on the front door saying that the store is reserved from nine o'clock to eleven for seniors and others in the "most at risk" group.

At half past noon, the baking section was innocent of all the most basic staple ingredients -- flour of all kinds (even rye), yeast, baking powder and sugar. Suddenly, we have all become baking fools, prepared to dig a hole and pull it in after ourselves. Likewise, the beans and pulses are gone, the oatmeal, the canned tomatoes and most of the pasta.

Signs taped to the shelves indicated that Zehr's doesn't allow hoarding.

The cereal section still looked robust, and the selection of sweeties. Dairy products were fully stocked, also the meat section and eggs. Fruit looked kinda thin, except apples, and pickings weren't good among the veg.

Toilet paper, kleenex and kitchen roll had been restocked. The beer aisle looked fine.


18 Mar 20 - 04:17 PM (#4040546)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

I've just had an email from Tesco saying older people can shop there from 9am to 10am as priority customers, and that everyone will now be limited to a maximum of three items of any one line. This should stop the greedy grabbers and stockpilers.
We mostly shop at Morrisons, and I don't know what their policy might be. The branch we use (in the sticks) is always crammed with old wrinklies anyway, many arriving in special minibuses complete with their wheelchairs/walkers/shopping trolleys etc. We might go there tomorrow morning. Hope I shan't be arrested for being in public over the age of seventy! My husband looks about forty though, so I'll have to explain he's my chauffeur/carer hee hee.


18 Mar 20 - 06:33 PM (#4040572)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

No a ToyBoy, Senoufou.


18 Mar 20 - 06:56 PM (#4040578)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Bill D

The line at my local COSTCO was 60 yards long this morning, so I went to the nearby supermarket. There were many empty shelves, but the produce was decently stocked.. and meat area also. I was going to buy pre-cut stew beef at COSTCO, but was able to get 2 chuck roasts at the supermarket..(Giant)... plus potatoes and baby carrots. Will make stew tomorrow. That, plus a sale on some frozen dinners and some other stuff has us pretty well ok for up to 3+ weeks..(got milk 2 days ago, and glad I did.... that area was bare. I had also bought canned tuna last Winter, so that's ok... and I have frozen 4-5 loaves of bread.

   I DO have a decent supply of TP..plus some high-quality paper towels and lots of tissues. Comes from a habit of stocking up during sales, so I had just shopped when the panic started.
   It remains to be seen how well stores are able to re-stock in the next couple of weeks, but I think that limits MUST be imposed, as some people simply can't manage to haunt stores for hours to be first in line when trucks arrive.

   Gonna be an interesting Spring & Summer.... :>(


18 Mar 20 - 07:02 PM (#4040580)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

Hee hee Helen! I've just told him what you posted and he's laughing like anything. Since he has his head practically shaved bald and doesn't have any facial hair (no beard or moustache) and his skin is like satin, he really does look so young. If he let his hair grow it would be snow-white though.
Do you suppose older folk 'at large' will be challenged? We're supposed to hide away indoors aren't we?
And I'm not making a shopping list as I usually do, because doubtless there will be gaps on the shelves. Interested to see what the situation is regarding supplies.
Husband is worried about obtaining his fierce chillies (Scotch bonnets)
I'm just hoping crumpets are available... and butter...


18 Mar 20 - 07:16 PM (#4040582)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

Like Bill, we stock up during special offers, and we have the space to store bog rolls, kitchen towels, tissues, kindling wood, firefighters and, very importantly, wine. So we haven't had to do any panic buying. I have loads of canned and bottled tuna and canned tomatoes and beans. But I always have!

The only worry could be fresh milk and fruit and veg. But there are millions worse off than us and with a lot more to worry about. If we die, it will be from Coronavirus, not starvation or malnutrition, and we have a roof over our heads and we have enough fuel to keep us going until next Christmas. There are many who are not so lucky. And lucky is the word...


18 Mar 20 - 07:36 PM (#4040585)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

The crumpet situation is alarming. Not a crumpet in sight in Morrisons this morning. I had to go to Sainsbury's and panic-buy two six-packs of Warburtons...


18 Mar 20 - 08:05 PM (#4040587)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

So Senoufou, that would make you a cougar.

I have made home-made crumpets before. You'd need yeast and flour of course, but it just takes a bit of time and patience. The trick is to mix the batter & yeast and then leave it for about an hour, then add baking powder etc and let it sit for another 30 mins. They were worth the effort but required a bit of pre-planning and a lot of patiently waiting. Remember, a watched crumpet batter never rises.

Here's one
Crumpet Recipe


19 Mar 20 - 04:59 AM (#4040636)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Mr Red

While out scribbling CANCELLED on all the publicity I have already put about - no cheap porridge oats anywhere.

There were a few amusing related things to photograph so I have started a page on my website covid-19.mister.red (opens in new tab)

Enjoy.


19 Mar 20 - 06:10 AM (#4040649)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

If you buy a thermometer this is the one to get for 2 million reasons.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/18/health/coronavirus-fever-thermometers.html


19 Mar 20 - 08:08 AM (#4040667)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

We have just got home from a trip to Morrisons supermarket out in the sticks, and oh dear! Most of the shelves were empty. The store was full of old wrinklies as usual, but there were no 'essentials' on display to buy. We did the best we could.
But on getting back to our little village we went into the shop and lo! most of the things we sought were there. We should have saved our petrol and gone there instead.
Lesson to be learned - 'stay local'!


19 Mar 20 - 08:22 AM (#4040669)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

I believed those here are mature enough to know the truth. Apparently I was wrong regarding the pandemic thread. So...

Age 32 - 50 has 38% of mild to severe symptoms from Covid 19 up to and including fatalities. The majority of fatal results are Older adults
People who have serious underlying medical conditions like:
Heart disease
Diabetes
Lung disease


19 Mar 20 - 08:32 AM (#4040673)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Rain Dog

Steve Shaw posted "Like Bill, we stock up during special offers, and we have the space to store bog rolls, kitchen towels, tissues, kindling wood, firefighters and, very importantly, wine."

I know that these are troubled times and that we all can be inclined to panic buy BUT I think the line should be drawn at stockpiling essential workers. Let them go now please.


19 Mar 20 - 08:49 AM (#4040678)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Dave the Gnome

Mrs G did her usual online shop on Sunday only to find she couldn't get a delivery till Thursday next week. We have online shopped with Morrisons from the word go and I helped to set it up anyway! So much for loyalty :-( Anyhow, no big deal as we are well and just about young enough not to be in the big risk category so we went to our local store. No serious shortage and we got most of what we wanted. No bog roll and no drugs as expected. What was really odd is that there was no cat litter and no straw bedding for small animals. We don't use it but I did notice the gap. What on earth are people doing with it?


19 Mar 20 - 09:05 AM (#4040683)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

No dog food in Morrisons yesterday, so I was informed by a disgruntled dog-owner...


19 Mar 20 - 09:16 AM (#4040687)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

It's interesting isn't it how people have become reliant on daft things which we can well do without? One can run the washing machine without any washing powder at all, and the clothes come out reasonably clean.
One can wash dishes by hand in plain hot water. Ditto.
And as for this insane attachment to toilet paper! Just wash your bum for goodness sake!
I saw a lady grabbing cans of Mr Sheen furniture polish. A damp duster will do surely?
We only need fresh vegetables and fruit, eggs, milk and bread. Our small freezer has quite a lot of meat in it. And Paul the Fish Man has just been down our street selling fresh fish from his van.
The simpler one's life is, the easier it is to adapt to these strange times.


19 Mar 20 - 09:18 AM (#4040688)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: DMcG

Daughter informed me all cat and dog food was sold out of a Sainsbury's last week. Apart from a few items, plenty of food for people, though.

We had to search for yeast but I eventually bought some. Does two packets constitute panic buying?

While there, I heard a security guard either telling a customer off quite gently, or talking to her about someone else. "Five items or less does not mean you can put them in your car and then come back for another five."


19 Mar 20 - 09:39 AM (#4040689)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Charmion

Himself is making bread right now; I can hear him slamming the dough ball on the countertop. Dunno if that really does any good, but he swears it develops the gluten.

The baking aisles at our two supermarkets are cleaned right out of flour and yeast, but we have enough to keep us going for a couple of weeks. When that runs out, the grist mill at Arva, a village about 45 minutes down Highway 7, sells to the public -- all you have to do is go there. They use wheat from Ontario growers.

Fleischman's active dry yeast (the old-fangled kind, but not quite as old-fangled as yeast cake) has been out of stock in Stratford since Saturday. I guess if things get really bad, we can start another sourdough culture.


19 Mar 20 - 09:41 AM (#4040691)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Dave the Gnome

On a serious note, how can one person do the shopping for a few vulnerable people when they are restricted in what they can take? The advice is to help your elderly or at risk neighbours but would you be able to justify the duplicates in your trolley?


19 Mar 20 - 10:24 AM (#4040707)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

That's a very good point Dave. We could have shopped for half the village (lots of elderly folk here) but we'd have been challenged if we'd had more than the permitted amount of items in the trolley.
I suppose one would have to go back and forth like a shuttle. But we'd have been recognised. ("Only black man in Fakenham...")


19 Mar 20 - 01:03 PM (#4040727)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

OK, Rain Dog, I've let them out now. But only because they insisted on not keeping the required social distance apart. At the same time, I've cleaned my reading glasses... :-(


19 Mar 20 - 01:12 PM (#4040729)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Rain Dog

Glad to hear it sir.


19 Mar 20 - 01:20 PM (#4040733)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

You will have to cope with things that are not well thought out on the fly. The least of these are Pet foods which will be available by and by.

You should note that most of what I have fortold has come to pass.
Its time to say what I DO NOT forsee.

IN A YEAR FROM NOW we will not see; still no petfood, in fact no more pets since most have been consumed. The Recipe thread will Not describe how to prepare and serve each other. etc

Yes anti virals and anti malarial drugs may be as or more helpful than aspirin, but do not pin your hopes on these miracle cures like Boris or Donald.

You are the ambassador of your culture/science and with sacrifice we shall see our finest hour.

EDIT '20' to 54 will display 39% of dire symptoms from corona infection. Older people with extra conditions carry most of the fatal results.


19 Mar 20 - 02:50 PM (#4040748)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Mr Red

How much stockpiling can one house hold?

Then again, when will panic buying level off?

Anyone in the UK remember the salt shortage? No reason, just irrational panic.


19 Mar 20 - 03:03 PM (#4040752)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

I'm wondering how many times I've watched a scene in 'break down of civilized society' movies,
where despised wealthy greedy hoarders, and black market spivs,
get beaten to death,
as their hoarded stash of vital supplies is ransacked by desperate starving local citizens...???


19 Mar 20 - 03:20 PM (#4040755)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

Is that why some Americans were (on the TV News) queuing up to buy guns?
"Stick 'em up! Hand over ya toilet rolls buddy!"


19 Mar 20 - 03:23 PM (#4040757)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Stilly River Sage

Good thing I bought next month's supply of dog food earlier this week, though it was to save myself having to make extra trips over there when I've only just started driving again.


19 Mar 20 - 05:46 PM (#4040775)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Mr Red

I was talking to a Folk Club Organiser now principally a vintage shop owner/muso.
He spent time in the Netherlands. And when talking about shortages and comparing now and tales of WW2 I commented "on that scale, we are barely registering". He was told the Netherlands had it much worse, and (exaggeration maybe, but not that much) - a person could get mugged, shot and who knows, for the turnip in their bag!

Judith van Dijkhuisen who runs the Cheltenham Folk Club wrote a tune for me "Drowning in the Deep Canal" from her mother's memories of the bodies that could be seen in canals during WW2 - collaborators and maybe black marketeers.

Call me perverse, but it is at the level of adventure/amusement/challenge at the moment to many of us. Even (hopefully) if we get 'flu.

King Boris's 12 weeks will put us in the middle of June. Personally I reckon: bless his tiny little mind, he has a job on his hands. AND hoping, against hope.


19 Mar 20 - 05:58 PM (#4040778)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

When I was teaching in TAFE (Technical and Further Education i.e. post-school) classes, at one stage I was working with the literacy and numeracy teachers. I sat in on one of the numeracy classes and the teacher was doing the numerical estimations topic. She was talking about scenarios like being at the supermarket and doing price comparisons on different brands. At that stage supermarkets were not showing the price per unit under the price of the items so the calculations needed to be done either in your head or with a calculator. E.g. if a 300 gram can of beans costs $1.20 is that better value than a 400 gram can which costs $1.50?

This is something I have always done whenever I shop, however for a lot of the students in that class this was a whole new way of thinking and decision making.

So then I was thinking about the panic buying of toilet paper. One estimation of the duration of the COVID 19 pandemic is about 6 months. so, if a family uses 2 toilet rolls per week and they panic-buy 5 packets of 30 toilet rolls, thats 150 toilet rolls divided by 2, that's 75 weeks' supply of toilet rolls for that family, or 1.5 years worth.

Have they really thought this through?

Anyway, after yet another dawn raid on the elderly & disability shopping hour I have finally come home with a packet of toilet rolls. I now do not have to contemplate making my own or using soap and water or an ancient Roman sponge on a stick. I have also offered some of my meagre stash to my sister and her hubby who are currently in self isolation after returning from overseas.

So, no more of this up at sparrowf@rt malarky. I can sleep easy tomorrow morning.


19 Mar 20 - 10:35 PM (#4040808)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Sandra in Sydney

I've seen some great cartoons about toilet rolls, here's a good collection The Cartoons Of Christopher Downes most of his current cartoons refer to covid 19 (p.s. his first cartoon refers to the belief that the long extinct Tasmanian tiger might not be extinct)

During the recent bushfires planes dropped water - picture a plane dropping toilet rolls to the happy population, & imagine a lovely photo of St Bernard dogs, with each barrel replaced by a toilet roll!

I'm heading to the supermarket soon & am down to my last 2 & a half rolls, & tho my younger neighbour has offered his spares if I need them, I'll inspect the empty shelves (in case I'm there at stocking time - a faint hope at lunch time, it's even a faint hope for those who wait for the doors to open) before calling on him in the future. He also gave me his spare (small) hand sanitiser & I've been looking for one to replace it - he needs his big bottle for work, but it might run out ...

sandra

we can never have too many cartons in trying times - Political Cartoons Australia
Political cartoons - US & more


19 Mar 20 - 10:42 PM (#4040809)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

Just use both sides of the paper, Sandra, and you'll be fine! :-)


19 Mar 20 - 10:43 PM (#4040810)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

Ok, second Christopher Downes cartoon, Where's Pestilence? He's self-isolating.

I've been thinking that having watched Terry Pratchett's Good Omens a couple of months ago, it might have been more prophetic than I realised.

Apocalypse, here we come!


19 Mar 20 - 10:49 PM (#4040814)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Sandra in Sydney

eek, a typo & I previewed twice

we can never have too many cartons (CARTOONS) in trying times

I was not referring to boxes of toilet paper, tho a family here ordered what they thought was a box of 48 rolls from a independent manufacturer Who gives crap & got 48 boxes, 12 years supply! The load is being sold to friends & will become a school fundraiser.


19 Mar 20 - 11:55 PM (#4040821)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains

Desperate Times


19 Mar 20 - 11:56 PM (#4040822)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Sandra in Sydney

I was there at stocking time! tho lots more shelves are empty, the shop is full of signs restricting purchases of various items, but I got everything on my list & a few sales items, too!   

Helen, when the series came out I re-read Good Omens (yet again!), & for once wished I had a Television to watch the series.

sandra


20 Mar 20 - 01:09 AM (#4040823)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

Sandra, I never saw Good Omens listed on TV here unless it was on the subscription channels. I only have free-to-air. I bought the DVD on pre-order, but re-read the book before the DVD arrived. I just Googled and the DVD's are only about $20 from a lot of shops.

And we all know you meant cartons and not cartoons. Of beer that is. Unless you are a teetotaller of course.


20 Mar 20 - 02:40 AM (#4040826)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Sandra in Sydney

Every one is a drinker, it's just that some of us don't drink fermented liquids!

Good Omens was on subscription channel, Amazon but not Netflix


20 Mar 20 - 03:02 AM (#4040829)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

Not even kombucha?


20 Mar 20 - 05:33 AM (#4040851)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Mr Red

that's 75 weeks' supply of toilet rolls for that family, or 1.5 years worth.

Well, Yes. In normal times, but COVID-19 - by its nature - demands higher usage, and more often. Say 3 times more. 1.5 years looks more like 0.5. And overstocking is insurance, ie redundancy in the original etymological meaning, not the JIT/kanban of modern thinking.

I'm not condoning it, but people are resourceful (& lazy), so the philosophy is: hoard toilet rolls first. Think of alternatives when supplies are gone.

I remember an example of East German humour in the Soviet era of shortages. Picture a man trying to snatch a toilet roll from a taller man holding it a loft. "Give it to me, I need it" - "Why should I? I have only just had it laundered!"


20 Mar 20 - 06:38 AM (#4040862)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

So Mr Red, does the virus cause diarrhoea? I didn't know that!

Husband has just got back from our little village shop with a small bag of potatoes. He's very sensible and didn't try to buy loads to stockpile, just a few spuds for our needs. If the shop continues to supply the village like this, we won't need to do battle in a virtually empty supermarket again for the 'duration'.
I see there are now eleven cases of the virus in the whole of Norfolk.


20 Mar 20 - 07:38 AM (#4040878)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: DMcG

I think he means that since you are at home, you are only using your home supply of toilet paper, whereas if you are employed and otherwise out and about, you will sometimes use the office supply, the cafe's supply, whoever hosts your folk club's supply ….


20 Mar 20 - 08:30 AM (#4040889)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

Ah I see DMcG, thank you!


20 Mar 20 - 10:52 AM (#4040919)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

The early news articles that I saw did mention diarrhoea, but not later ones.

My point was that I very much doubt that the panic buyers sat down with a calculator or pen and paper to work out how much toilet paper they normally consume over a specific period and therefore how much they may conceivably need if the supply becomes scarce. I doubt whether they even thought it through about whether toilet paper would become scarce and why. The definition of panic buying seems to imply a severe lack of rational analytical thought. (That's excluding the people who thought they would make a quick buck selling them at exorbitant prices.)

The people who now have a huge number of toilet rolls stored in their home are possibly looking a bit bewildered when they see how slowly their stash dwindles. A wall of toilet rolls today will still be a wall tomorrow and next week, and there will not be much of a dent in it even in a few months, even if they do contract diarrhoea.


20 Mar 20 - 11:07 AM (#4040927)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

It's a shame we can't get bogrolls on prescription for IBS...

or.. is it worth asking...???


20 Mar 20 - 11:14 AM (#4040928)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Mr Red

But why toilet rolls FFS? It's coronavirus, not dysentery!

Well one of the symptoms is diarrhea. So it is dysentery, I'm afraid.


20 Mar 20 - 11:20 AM (#4040931)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

Apparently, even worse.. violent coughing and the runs at the same time..

Is there panic buying of Tena adult nappies...???


20 Mar 20 - 11:35 AM (#4040933)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

I've been wondering whether our government will make an announcement that every household will receive a grant of a packet of toilet rolls and some hand sanitiser.


20 Mar 20 - 11:48 AM (#4040936)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

For a couple of years since realising just how expensive bogrolls were becoming,
I have been trying to implement a primarily arse wiping only rule,
but my wife can still find endless non essential uses to waste toilet paper..

EVEN NOW.. we had a row about it the other night...

What annoys me most is when she absent mindedly throws away the sheets of Kitchen roll
I've already used with anti bac spray for food preparation surfaces,
and have left to dry out to use for dirtier jobs like mopping the floor around the bins...

What were the world war 2 mottos about careless waste...???


20 Mar 20 - 12:47 PM (#4040945)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains

With supermarket shelves emptying at a vast rate of knots(hopefully a temporary aberration) Here are a couple of articles to give pause for thought.This is not to scare but indicate vulnerabilities to be aware of.
1)By 1995 the UK had dismantled strategic foodstocks
2)The truck driver refinery blockade of 2000 scared the UK government silly.   So much so that one has to go to Canada for an analysis
3)It is said that society is but 9 meals from anarchy.


https://www.subbrit.org.uk/features/strategic-food-stockpile/

http://www.iwar.org.uk/cip/resources/PSEPC/fuel-price-protests.htm

https://internationalman.com/articles/nine-meals-from-anarchy/

https://neweconomics.org/uploads/files/e0923bb9ffdeef6ebd_34m6bv9jo.pdf


20 Mar 20 - 12:52 PM (#4040946)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

We'd better hope organised crime gangs get too ill
to hijack food and bog roll lorries...


20 Mar 20 - 01:57 PM (#4040959)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

When the schools close will robber-gangs break in and steal the bog rolls and hand sanitisers?


20 Mar 20 - 02:13 PM (#4040964)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

More to the point, if we do have any bogrolls left in the house,
do we need to notify our insurers
to add them to the list of valuables...???

Gold may soon be worth it's weight in bog rolls...


20 Mar 20 - 02:31 PM (#4040969)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

I didn't even bother trying a Walmart or Costco but large local grocery stores have everything we needed even a couple days ago.


20 Mar 20 - 02:42 PM (#4040972)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

I saw one of the recent Adam Hills The Last Leg episodes and there was an image of a man at the seaside playing one of those game things with the big glass case and the hook to pick up prizes but the case contained toilet rolls instead of trinkets or chocolate bars.


20 Mar 20 - 03:31 PM (#4040980)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Stilly River Sage

Aldi had everything I needed today, though some categories are running low, and they were limiting facial tissue to two boxes. I will note that it's a really good thing that I love spinach, because that's about all that was left in the frozen vegetables section. There were plenty of opinions while standing in line to check out, and I did suggest that the three women behind me were standing too close together so they spread out.

I live near a restaurant supply store, and today their staff were in the parking lot directing traffic. It has always been my well kept secret, a little placed tucked out of sight in the middle of an industrial area, but not so much now. But I did buy three boxes of vinyl gloves (one for me, two for family members.) I've used them for years for cooking and crafts and painting and such. Now, they'r also for things in public like doors and shopping carts. Since I intend to be in for at least the next two weeks I was fortunate to find frozen broccoli and bags of frozen carrots at the restaurant supply cash and carry store.

If I can get the garden started soon I can soon have my own lettuce.


20 Mar 20 - 03:48 PM (#4040983)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: WalkaboutsVerse

If incubation is taking on average 5 days, I'm thinking do buy more than normal such that one may have a couple of weeks worth of groceries, in order to, if need be, effectively isolate...but, in my case, that would mean going without sliced bread - the best thing since...

Either way, provided people are not buying foods that will go off, after a while the shelves may go back to normal with such change in shopping habits/frequency, yes?

My poem "My Diet"


20 Mar 20 - 03:51 PM (#4040985)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Stilly River Sage

You're like Trump, bending every conversation in a way to blow your own horn. Enough with the bad poetry.


20 Mar 20 - 03:56 PM (#4040987)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

It depends how much of this selfishly horded food gets thrown away uneaten in bins..

Semi fresh refrigerated foods easily catch up beyond use by dates before folks realise it..

I always go by what it looks and smells like, rather than dates..
and if in doubt boil suspect meat to buggery with plenty of garlic and curry sauce..

I hate chucking food away...


20 Mar 20 - 03:57 PM (#4040989)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

But I prefer rotten meat to rotten poetry...


20 Mar 20 - 04:14 PM (#4040992)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

hehe Trump is too inflexible to blow his own horn but he has this fiction that he has an image to protect.

Much like the fiction that he has a respondsibility to uphold which he then deflects onto Pense or others to blame but he is the first to say that he takes no respondsibility. I've never seen anything like it except among psychopaths.

When he can't blame the facts or media he lies outright.
Truth can not get a word in edgewise. But on rare full moons he can resemble a human being like the legendary Anglo Saxon Lucanfuerer


20 Mar 20 - 04:51 PM (#4040997)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

Vogon poetry is often accompanied with the aroma of spoiled hamburger and eggs. If you can survive that, there is dumpster diving which can net you great sealed cheese.


20 Mar 20 - 05:04 PM (#4040999)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: WalkaboutsVerse

...I'm sure that was a typo, folks - Donuel, being as sweet as a mango, was, rather, most likely referring to my vegan poetry just above.


20 Mar 20 - 05:14 PM (#4041001)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: gillymor

I haven't read food poetry that good since the last time I visited the Taco Bell drive-thru.


20 Mar 20 - 05:31 PM (#4041004)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: WalkaboutsVerse

...very sorry I don't have a poem about it but, as a kid going out with family and friends in Sydney, I recall hating Mexican food; however, when running low on cash during a visit to LA in 1996, I decided to go over the border and pay for a week in a Tijuana hotel, which served delicious Mexican food - bello.


20 Mar 20 - 05:35 PM (#4041006)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Stilly River Sage

But this is about grocery shopping.


20 Mar 20 - 05:51 PM (#4041013)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains

All the checkouts in my neck of the woods have perspex panels giving a modicum of protection for the cashier from the hungry hordes


20 Mar 20 - 05:58 PM (#4041014)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: gillymor

I guess you don't get sarcasm, WAV.

Back to groceries, I visited my Publix at opening time this morning and was happy to find an ample stock of TP (all gone by now, no doubt). They've instituted a policy of one package per family and did the same with water in larger containers so perhaps they'll get this hoarding and panic-buying under control. It's a shame that it has to be enforced.


20 Mar 20 - 08:27 PM (#4041044)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

The Restaurant at the end of the Universe is still open.

Walkies, surely you have dealt with Vogons.


20 Mar 20 - 09:01 PM (#4041048)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains

He should be so lucky! We have to deal with Corbyn-19.


20 Mar 20 - 10:00 PM (#4041055)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

"We have to deal with Corbyn-19."

No we don't.. that's made up inside your head..
there's no such thing in the real world as Corbyn-19...

My wife can help with this..
A regular part of her working life has been devoted to educating infants
how to distinguish between their imagination and reality..

We now have similar issues with my old mum...
For instance:
"No mum, the drawer in your freezer is not a bin for used incontinence pads.."

She's a constant source of entertainment.

But not to be relied on if we were panic buying hoarders,
and needed to make use of her freezer for our over stock...


21 Mar 20 - 03:39 AM (#4041072)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Dave the Gnome

I don't know how many times I need to repeat this. There should be only one thread for UK politics. Posting political comments on other threads makes them at risk of closure.


21 Mar 20 - 03:50 AM (#4041076)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains

Tyhere are only 2 culprits trying to score political points. Why not address Jim and shaw directly?


21 Mar 20 - 04:26 AM (#4041082)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

This is about grocery shopping and the need for unselfishness and restraint due to the difficulty of balancing 'supply and demand'.
I agree that it shouldn't become a political boxing ring, which is both tedious and unpleasant.
On a more relevant note, I remember as a young girl the ubiquitous brown Ration Books just after WW2. One could only buy items for which one had the necessary sections of the book, which the shopkeeper tore out each time. I wonder if this system would work nowadays to stop selfish panicky people filling several trolleys at the crack of dawn with half the supermarket?
I expect nowadays it could all be done electronically in some way. But it shouldn't be up to the poor checkout staff to police proceedings.


21 Mar 20 - 04:29 AM (#4041083)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

Yes electronically would be good. Especially for stopping people coming back again and again buying the same items.


21 Mar 20 - 05:32 AM (#4041090)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Dave the Gnome

The infrastructure is already in place with various loyalty cards.


21 Mar 20 - 06:37 AM (#4041096)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Dave the Gnome

Is there a local home brew shop?


21 Mar 20 - 06:54 AM (#4041098)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Doug Chadwick

My local paper had pictures of empty shelves in the bread aisle, paper products aisle and pasta shelves in the town's Tesco Extra store. I was there that day and, yes, I saw those empty shelves. What the paper didn't show was the well stocked fresh produce area. There was a wide choice of fruit and vegetables, and plenty of it. The press have a duty not to stoke the fires of panic buying.

DC


21 Mar 20 - 07:07 AM (#4041099)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

NYC farmers market (Union Station) is open but Maryland has shut down its farmers mkt


21 Mar 20 - 07:09 AM (#4041101)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

Eyup, Dave, a homebrew shop in Bude? Not a chance! There MIGHT be one in Barnstaple (one hour), or Exeter (75 minutes), or Plymouth ((ditto), or Truro (ditto)... Haven't checked. But I've already scoured Barnstaple and Truro shops for bakers' yeast...not a chance! The health shop in Bude can't get any. I still have half a pot of old stuff that might still work, though I haven't used any for a month or three. I've been getting lazy and buying Sainsbury's sourdough pavé, which is rather good...

Apropos of so-called panic buying, I think it's transforming from "I must stock up in case it runs out" to "I must stock up because I suddenly might not be allowed out." The latter is a bit more understandable.


21 Mar 20 - 10:01 AM (#4041134)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

Wilkinsons sell home brew kit...???

Wilko Gervin English Ale Yeast 11g
£2.00


21 Mar 20 - 11:31 AM (#4041155)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains

A lot cheaper to order off amazon. Bakers yeast.brewing yeast ......
Let your fingers do the walking!


21 Mar 20 - 01:05 PM (#4041164)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

Just went to Asda to try and find some Scotch bonnet chillies. Husband very pleased to get a couple of small packets of them. I got spinach too. We were glad to see a rule being enforced - only three of any item. Many of the shelves were empty nonetheless, and the workers looked terribly tired and stressed.
I'm not keen on Asda anyway, but it's very multi-cultural with people of all races and types, which I do like. We scuttled out of there, after visiting the Western Union booth. The chap couldn't do a money transfer to Ivory Coast, as their whole system is down.
No need to buy anything else for quite a while, and the village shop will be perfectly adequate.


21 Mar 20 - 01:59 PM (#4041171)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

I grew up in a post war build council house [fit for heroes].
Sturdy construction, and big front and back gardens..

Throughout my childhood my dad grew all our vegetables..

Factory work all day, gardening for relaxation on the evenings and weekends..
His shed was his sanctuary..
Quite a stable lifestyle back then..

Now in a long term crisis, I'd have to break up concrete in our tiny town centre back yard,
and then haven't a clue how to do gardening.
Because I was more interested in rock music and girls,
than helping my dad out and learning from him in his garden..

But at least I know veg grows in the ground,
which is probably more than a lot of modern kids now understand...


21 Mar 20 - 02:03 PM (#4041172)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

I'm really sorry, moderator, but it's utterly outrageous that you allowed this to stand whilst deleting my civil response to it:

"Tyhere are only 2 culprits trying to score political points. Why not address Jim and shaw directly?"

Every one of my posts in this thread has been on-topic and non-political, and Jim hasn't even posted to this thread at all. It's a downright lie to state that the two of us are "trying to score political points." I could also have pointed to another one of his that you've kept in place, the one containing a nasty slur against the Labour leader calling him "Corbyn-19." I really don't understand what you think you're doing, and would ask that you review and rectify your actions in this thread. Thank you.


21 Mar 20 - 02:20 PM (#4041175)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains

Bring back ration cards I say. It's been a few years since I last saw mine. Haven't needed it since about 1954. It would be an easy thing to accomplish as it could all be computerised and linked to Nat Ins. No, passport, car reg, marital status and census data, and any gaps in the knowledge of government as to who and what you are could easily be filled in by google and probably your internet linked TV and computer.
If you keep schtum Alexa could easily be persuaded to betray you.
"Turn on, tune in, drop out" may be a counterculture-era phrase popularized by Timothy Leary but today society is permanently turnedon and tuned in, Sadly dropping out is no longer an option available.


21 Mar 20 - 03:11 PM (#4041182)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Dave the Gnome

I'll repeat my deleted post by copying the two that have been allowed to remain as well

Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains - PM
Date: 20 Mar 20 - 09:01 PM

He should be so lucky! We have to deal with Corbyn-19.

Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains - PM
Date: 21 Mar 20 - 03:50 AM

Tyhere are only 2 culprits trying to score political points. Why not address Jim and shaw directly?


If this post is deleted again while the source is allowed to stand there is something decidedly odd.


21 Mar 20 - 03:23 PM (#4041184)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

Perhaps we have some emergency volunteer mods flexing their muscles,
while the usual ones who know us better
hunker down safe somewhere;
or are far more preoccupied driving around hunting for toilet rolls...???


21 Mar 20 - 03:54 PM (#4041188)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

pfr, you can grow veges and herbs in pots.

I'm not an expert. Our veges sink or swim with very little help from us.

At present we have some rectangular self watering pots with lots of oregano and in our raised vege beds we have an overrun of mint - not a bad thing. It's always touch and go with my attempts on growing thyme.

We recently bought some Japanese eggplant seedlings and they have already yielded about four long thin eggplants the size of large zucchinis.

A pumpkin vine has escaped from the compost bin and so far we have two large ones sitting in the sun waiting to ripen and two medium ones still on the vine. They can take a long time to ripen but when ripe the pumpkin can be baked or steamed and then frozen for future use. I wouldn't recommend pumpkin vines because they take up too much space but there might be smaller plant varieties which could be grown in a big pot. Zucchinis can be good but I've had no luck recently partly because of the drought, and partly because I'm a forgetful gardener.

Onions take too long to mature, but spring onions etc are quicker.

Hubby discovered a trick for growing basil. Buy one of those pots of basil in the supermarket and chop the tops off, strip all but the topmost leaves and put the cuttings in water, making sure that there is a leaf node on each stem under water. After a while some rootlets form and then you can plant them into pots to grow more basil. Repeat ad infinitum.

I took the seeds out of a chili and planted them a couple of weeks ago and now there are lots of seedlings. I'll plant them in a bigger pot, socially distanced of course, to give them room to grow.

I'm thinking about getting some cos lettuce seedlings. We've had problems before with tomatoes and capsicums because something eats them but I have a little section on the front verandah with pots of this and that including the chili seedlings so I'll probably try some there. There is mesh on the verandah to stop the cats taking a flying leap but it should also prevent those annoying Indian mynah pest-birds from getting at the chilies, capsicums and tomatoes.

We have a blueberry bush but it doesn't yield much. A raspberry plant has popped up thanks to the pest-birds and their poop, I'm guessing. The last one yielded enough to make it fun so we'll see how this one goes. It's in a big pot. Strawberries are good too.


21 Mar 20 - 06:46 PM (#4041205)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

Also, I've probably said this on Mudcat before, possibly in the recipe thread, but do you know you can use the bean water from a can of chickpeas or butter beans or white beans etc as a substitute for egg white? It's known as aquafaba i.e. bean water, if you want to look up recipes.

I made some very yummy meringues with them, took them to a family lunch and no one could tell the difference. The possibilities are amazing.


21 Mar 20 - 06:56 PM (#4041206)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

I had a bad year on me veg plot last year. I had massive and often surprising issues with birds, rabbits and deer. I got no crops of beans or spuds or greens. The tomatoes were OK but by the time they were coming in I'd sort of lost heart. My raspberries succumbed big time to grey mould too, in contrast to the year before, when I got stones of the things. So this year I'm going go be a damn sight more vigilant. I have Foremost and Nicola spuds well sprouted and they're going in next week. I avoid mains because I nearly always get blight, and they cop it far worse than earlies and second-earlies. I'm sowing Sungold and San Marzano tomatoes, along with broad beans, French beans and runner beans. I always get a good crop of wild rocket and chives without sowing. The parsnips will go in next week too. The all-female cucumbers can wait until May. Next month I'll sow my summer and early purple broccoli. And parsley, lots of that. I've probably forgotten something...


21 Mar 20 - 06:58 PM (#4041207)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

Aqua faba is fab (sorry....) I try to never chuck it away. Just don't buy cans of beans that have added salt or other flavourings, that's all.


22 Mar 20 - 03:59 AM (#4041241)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains

Went to the local farm center yesterday for a few seed trays to replace come broken ones. The counter was barrier taped off about a metre back and chequered markings on the floor to keep people separated. It tested your agility to actually place the goods on the counter to be scanned.
A notice also requested cashless payments if possible. It will be interesting to see how the local supermarkets are reacting, I have not been in one for over a week.


22 Mar 20 - 11:13 AM (#4041300)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Charmion

In Ontario, supermarkets are installing plexiglass screens to separate cashiers from customers. Credit and debit cards only, and just the tap-and-go kind.

I wonder how the oldest-school Mennonites will manage the new order; the horse-and-carriage folks are strictly cash.


22 Mar 20 - 11:18 AM (#4041302)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

Schmart. Grocery clerks are now first responders and our front line of defense.


22 Mar 20 - 11:28 AM (#4041305)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Stilly River Sage

Grocery clerks and shelf stockers are in the public consciousness and being lauded as essential workers, but the delivery drivers who bring things from stores, the warehouse workers and the shipping companies are in a different situation; those companies often don't offer paid sick leave. I'm thinking that it might be better to wait till a quiet time of day and try to find what I need instead of setting the delivery process in motion for those overworked warehouse and delivery employees. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/21/business/coronavirus-ups-fedex-xpo-workers.html


22 Mar 20 - 12:40 PM (#4041321)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains

With 1.4 million being instructed to self isolate in the uk groceries are going to be a challenge for them in days to come.


22 Mar 20 - 01:30 PM (#4041335)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

Life is always a challenge. Life is overcoming the challenges. Death is giving up.


22 Mar 20 - 02:17 PM (#4041344)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains

Donuel chewing on the odd household cockroache may do wonders for the obesity epidemic, but is hardly a long term solution for a balanced diet.


22 Mar 20 - 02:52 PM (#4041357)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

Some States are declaring Liquor stores the same as grocery stores.


22 Mar 20 - 02:54 PM (#4041358)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

There's a bug farm shop in west Wales..

We wondered if they have experienced panic buying...???


22 Mar 20 - 03:00 PM (#4041362)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

.. Info here: but no longer available on iplayer..

BBC Wales bug farm shop


22 Mar 20 - 03:02 PM (#4041364)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

Went into Bude Sainsbury's this affie and came out with paracetamol, milk, oranges, toms, organic carrots and a bag of fine beans. The veg section was a bit sparse, but apart from that it was all quiet, civil, friendly and non-panicky.


22 Mar 20 - 03:07 PM (#4041368)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

The panic re: bug farms comes when you actually have to eat them, not when you are hoping they still have some to sell to you.


22 Mar 20 - 03:13 PM (#4041371)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

From what I've heard about big scary Aussie bugs..

They're more likely to eat us...!!!???


22 Mar 20 - 03:16 PM (#4041372)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

.. it's bad enough worrying about running out of bog roll,
without the added anxiety of what deadly spiders might be hiding under the seat...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


22 Mar 20 - 03:19 PM (#4041373)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

You get used to it. The majority of our scary critters only attack you if you annoy them. That includes looking at them to see if they would be a delicious meal.


22 Mar 20 - 03:29 PM (#4041375)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

Off topic - that Aussie TV series about the snake woman, and her Scots bloke and dog team..

Found it on random channel hopping, and got addicted for every episode...


22 Mar 20 - 03:29 PM (#4041376)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

Waaaaah! Spider under the seat!!! Excellent cure for constipation!!

We visited a huge Morrisons and an enormous Tesco this morning in Norwich. Both almost deserted, it was very weird. Skeleton staff of very old ladies and young teenagers, only about five checkouts in action. Spotlessly clean, with people constantly swabbing down all the surfaces.
Like you Steve we managed to get small amounts of vegetables, tomatoes, fruit juice, and packets of grapes, cherries, dates and stoned prunes.
But the atmosphere was so strange.
Washed our hands religiously when we got home.


22 Mar 20 - 03:31 PM (#4041378)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Mrrzy

Going to store tomorrow when I have to go somewhere anyway... Salt, almonds. Grapefruit juice.


22 Mar 20 - 03:34 PM (#4041379)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

My mrs found 2 unsold packs of the really expensive quilted Andrex bogrolls in the nearby Tesco Express yesterday...

I could get used to such luxury..

But it still tears, and fingers poke through, just like any common folks cheap bogrolls...


22 Mar 20 - 03:41 PM (#4041381)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Iains

That never happened with Bronco


22 Mar 20 - 03:51 PM (#4041382)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

pfr, Magda Szubanski, Dog Woman. She's the funniest, cleverest, and most interesting person on our screens. She's the best!!

She was also in Babe, but she hit our screens in the '80's in a TV skit show called Fast Forward.

While in lockdown watching everything you can find with Magda in it would be the best therapy in the world. IMHO.


22 Mar 20 - 04:05 PM (#4041386)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: MudGuard

Here in Germany (Munich) supermarkets don't have
- toilet paper
- rice (at least the cheap varieties, of Uncle Ben's is still a bit available)
- pasta (same here, cheap ones sold out, high price pasta still available in small amounts)
- tomatoes in any conserved form (tomato mark, canned tomatoes, strained(?) tomatoes))
- flour
- yeast (dry powder or in cubes)

All other stuff is available in close to normal quantities.

At the checkouts in some markets acrylic shields are there to protect the cashiers from accidental spittle drops.

People queueing at the checkouts keep about 2m distance from each other. And they avoid entering aisles where already someone else is in.

About the increased toilet paper usage due to home office (since Tuesday): in my case, there is no increased need - I always tried to avoid going to the office toilets for "big business", I usually s(h)it at home ...

I wish good health to everyone!


22 Mar 20 - 04:46 PM (#4041390)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Dave the Gnome

Stoned prunes?

Weren't they a 60s acid rock band?


22 Mar 20 - 04:58 PM (#4041393)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

Hahaha Dave! I just knew someone would say that!

I too am not keen on modern toilet paper. It does seem too flimsy, and I always did like Izal. (At school we used it for comb-and-paper kazoo-type instruments!)But there's nothing worse than old ladies harping on about how things were so much better in the old days.

All his life my husband has never ever used toilet paper! I quite admire that.


22 Mar 20 - 05:02 PM (#4041394)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

Dead or alive no one wins unless everyone wins. There is a chance that we close the inequity gap a bit after centuries of expansion or we make it larger by being cattle to the slaughter. There is a great equalizer at our back like a gale blowing all of us into the future.

Take ADVANTAGE. You are going to have to give it much thought in the months to come and take action in ways you haven't yet imagined.

Or would you rather die silenty for your Ceasar.


22 Mar 20 - 05:27 PM (#4041400)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Helen

I've been thinking that the people addicted to fast food are going to be floundering, out of their depth, while the people who prefer wholefoods and home cooking will probably have an advantage.

Just imagine having to go cold turkey on fast foods if you are used to having it once or more per day.

Australia is going into shutdown mode from this afternoon. Not lockdown - yet! But non-essential shops have to shut.

Does Macca's (McDonalds) count as essential or non-essential?


22 Mar 20 - 07:30 PM (#4041428)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

UK McD 'restaurants' to close ... [BBC news]


22 Mar 20 - 07:31 PM (#4041430)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

When I started teaching in east London in 1973, the gents in my school had only that Izal-style bog paper. Every sheet had "Property of London County Council" printed on it, and the toilet roll holder had a lock on one end to prevent theft of the roll. I understood that only the schoolkeeper and head teacher had a key to it...


22 Mar 20 - 07:34 PM (#4041433)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

"UK McD 'restaurants' to close ... [BBC news]"

Oh no! That means we can no longer furtively nip in to have a McShit...


22 Mar 20 - 07:42 PM (#4041437)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: punkfolkrocker

I just realised one of the packs of lavish premium Andrex bogrolls
my mrs reluctantly paid top price for,
is "enriched with extracts of Coconut Oil for extra indulgence"..

..crikey.. my bum is going to smell/taste like a Piña colada...!!!

..aren't fancy posh folks weird...???


22 Mar 20 - 08:08 PM (#4041447)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Steve Shaw

We're not offering to sample it any time soon, mate...


23 Mar 20 - 08:42 AM (#4041541)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Donuel

Does anyone remember rationing coupon books?


23 Mar 20 - 09:22 AM (#4041546)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Senoufou

Yes I do Donuel, as I've said on here. They were in use until 1954. I well remember accompanying my mother to the grocer's with the Ration Book at the ready. The system was very strict. I think it could be done electronically nowadays while this Corona virus lasts.


23 Mar 20 - 10:48 PM (#4041709)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: robomatic

As I'm typing I'm near the television listening to a State government press conference state-wide call-in with the Governor of Alaska, a gentlemen well hated by people I used to have coffee with, when Starbucks had an indoor venue. But right this moment the Governor is handling himself well, with State experts clearly knowledgeable and call-ins from newspapers all round the State. It's what I've come to expect from the practicality of Alaskans. And we are a small enough society that I recognized one of the call-in voices, someone I've met at Starbucks and know from my religious community. The Governor is dressed casually, he's a lot younger than the national leaders who get on TV with their ponderous pronouncements. He speaks well and his people speak well on this issue. His medical expert is even younger; she speaks extremely well and like an adult explaining things to adults. Next to her is a guy in a black shirt with a pale blue tie, the best dressed guy up there, and he's the ASL translator. A maximum of efficiency and coherence and night and day better than listening to the U.S. President's toxic pontificating.

I went walking earlier outside down the nearby roads. We have tons of snow on the ground, but the sun is giving us heat today, 5 minutes more per day as we're just past the equinox. There are few cars on the roads, but there are some other walkers, some on the slippery sidewalks, others on the mostly melted out roadway. The sun is making the difference today. I had time to get to know a neighbor I've never exchanged a word with before.

It's reminiscent of when I was waiting for a plane on a business trip, and having a vigorous discussion where I was giving my opinion of a well known conservative broadcaster, and my co-workers were in extreme disagreement. As we boarded the smallish commuter craft it turned out I didn't have my hearing protection, and without a hesitation one of my 'opponents' handed me his spares. And I would've done the same for him.


25 Mar 20 - 04:45 AM (#4041962)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Mr Red

Some States are declaring Liquor stores the same as grocery stores.

for self-medicating obviously.


25 Mar 20 - 05:43 AM (#4041974)
Subject: RE: BS: New rules for Grocery shopping
From: Doug Chadwick

The Tesco Extra store near to me is operating a limit of three items per customer to stop people stockpiling. This is a sensible precaution on non-perishable items but it has been extended to all items in the store. The fruit and veg section has been well stocked throughout the crisis. I tried to buy a small punnet of raspberries, the same size of blueberries and one each of black and green grapes. I was told that I would have to put one back. The raspberries and blueberries went back with the many others with a best-before date of either that day or the following day. This blinkered approach is completely wasteful and serves no purpose other than pushing people to stockpile preerved and frozen goods.

DC