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British Monarchy question

The Shambles 04 Sep 06 - 05:06 AM
Paul Burke 04 Sep 06 - 05:15 AM
GUEST,padgett 04 Sep 06 - 05:16 AM
Haruo 04 Sep 06 - 06:06 AM
GUEST,Dazbo 04 Sep 06 - 06:09 AM
Paul Burke 04 Sep 06 - 06:19 AM
Leadfingers 04 Sep 06 - 06:21 AM
GUEST 04 Sep 06 - 07:41 AM
Scrump 04 Sep 06 - 08:21 AM
Tannywheeler 04 Sep 06 - 10:12 AM
Les from Hull 04 Sep 06 - 10:36 AM
Richard Bridge 04 Sep 06 - 10:40 AM
Tannywheeler 04 Sep 06 - 10:49 AM
GUEST 04 Sep 06 - 10:55 AM
Snuffy 04 Sep 06 - 11:07 AM
GUEST,Jim Ward 04 Sep 06 - 11:09 AM
Snuffy 04 Sep 06 - 11:13 AM
The Shambles 04 Sep 06 - 11:47 AM
Paul Burke 04 Sep 06 - 11:49 AM
GUEST 04 Sep 06 - 12:14 PM
GUEST,Auldtimer 04 Sep 06 - 12:33 PM
The Villan 04 Sep 06 - 12:41 PM
The Walrus 04 Sep 06 - 01:55 PM
Peace 04 Sep 06 - 01:56 PM
GUEST,Auldtimer 04 Sep 06 - 02:37 PM
Bunnahabhain 04 Sep 06 - 04:35 PM
The Shambles 04 Sep 06 - 08:14 PM
Big Al Whittle 04 Sep 06 - 11:56 PM
Dave Hanson 05 Sep 06 - 12:05 AM
InOBU 05 Sep 06 - 08:07 AM
Dave (the ancient mariner) 05 Sep 06 - 09:44 AM
Bunnahabhain 05 Sep 06 - 09:53 AM
Les from Hull 05 Sep 06 - 10:27 AM
The Shambles 05 Sep 06 - 10:32 AM
The Shambles 05 Sep 06 - 10:33 AM
SINSULL 05 Sep 06 - 10:51 AM
Paul Burke 05 Sep 06 - 11:40 AM
GUEST,Ooh-Aah2 05 Sep 06 - 11:38 PM
catspaw49 05 Sep 06 - 11:44 PM
JennieG 06 Sep 06 - 04:12 AM
Michael in Swansea 06 Sep 06 - 12:45 PM
Kaleea 06 Sep 06 - 04:47 PM
GUEST 06 Sep 06 - 10:30 PM
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Subject: British Monarchy question
From: The Shambles
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 05:06 AM

I am not sure that this matters a great deal but perhaps someone can answer these questions and settle an argument?

When the current Queen dies, would Prince William still become King if his father, Prince Charles had died and never became King himself?

If Prince Charles had died before the Queen - would his brother Prince Andrew become King on her death?


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Paul Burke
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 05:15 AM

The Royal Succession.

Poor old Andy is a measly 4th. Miss Zenouska Mowatt has a lot of killing to do, it might get noticed.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: GUEST,padgett
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 05:16 AM

Good question
Are we assuming The Duke of Edinbrough outlives the Queen too

Ray


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Haruo
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 06:06 AM

Is there a song about this so it doesn't have to go below?

Haruo


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: GUEST,Dazbo
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 06:09 AM

And so many of them are Miss, Mr or Master, hardly royal at all!


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Paul Burke
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 06:19 AM

Course there's a song about it:

God save our gracious Queen
Slap her in the belly with a Wall's ice cream
And make her scream.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Leadfingers
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 06:21 AM

Perhaps I should post the lyric for Leon Rosselson's 'Procreation' then !


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 07:41 AM

Anyone with a name like Columbus or Cassius instead of a proper royal name ought to be excluded automatically.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Scrump
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 08:21 AM

When the current Queen dies, would Prince William still become King if his father, Prince Charles had died and never became King himself?

Yes, assuming he outlives his dad - he's still next in line when Charlie goes to that great palace in the sky.

If Prince Charles had died before the Queen - would his brother Prince Andrew become King on her death?

No, William would still be king assuming he's alive when the Queen died after Charlie.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Tannywheeler
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 10:12 AM

Well,----
"...And this is law that I'll maintain
Until my dying day, sir--
That whatsoever king may reign,
I'll be the Vicar of Bray, sir!!!"

("The illustrius House of Hanover
And Protestant succession,
To these I do allegiance swear--
While they can keep possession.
For in my faith and loyalty
I never more will falter
And Geo-{um, Cha--um, Wills??} my lawful king shall be--
Until the times do alter.")

I think it's called "Primogeniture": the oldest son of the oldest son--"legitimate" marriage issue.

What was that Alec Guinness movie? Kind Hearts & Coronets?? or something else?               Tw


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Les from Hull
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 10:36 AM

Here's a longer list


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 10:40 AM

Prince Philip is not in the line of succession.

There is a school of thought that in theory female siblings are coparceners, as would have been the case for real property pre-1925, but since in practice the Queen and Princess Margaret did not hold as coparceners others argue that as a matter of constitutional law the position has been determined against the theory.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Tannywheeler
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 10:49 AM

Wow, Richard. That last paragraph is clear as mud. Coparcener?? Who's he when he's at home?      Tw


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 10:55 AM

hey. I'm in at 59862 !!!!!!!!!


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Snuffy
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 11:07 AM

But in India it appears that coparceners can/could only be male: - The right to property of Hindu women under law


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: GUEST,Jim Ward
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 11:09 AM

I think you will find, Richard, that Prince Phillip, The Duke of Edinburgh is around 500th in the line of succession through his mother, Princess Alice of Battenberg. She was a great-granddaughter of Queen Victoria.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Snuffy
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 11:13 AM

According to the Wikipedia list Les linked to the Duke of Edinburgh actually is in the line of succession, but a long way down:

"HRH Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh, the husband of the reigning monarch Queen Elizabeth II, is himself in the line of succession as a great-great grandson of Queen Victoria through his mother, Princess Alice of Battenberg. He is currently positioned at 469th."


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: The Shambles
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 11:47 AM

So had Prince Charles died without producing any sons - on the the Queen's death - would Prince Andrew have then become king?

Or if Prince Charles's current 'heirs' were shown not to be his sons?


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Paul Burke
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 11:49 AM

Think of the commercial opportunities they are missing! Split the succession into divisions, say 20 in the Premier division, then into suitable sized chunks all the way down. Then have them play off against each other at polo or croquet or show jumping or whist or whatever royals are into these days. With promotion and relegation at the end of each season. the papers would be full of it.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 12:14 PM

I understand that Helen Mirren is now the bookmakers' favourite to succeed ER11. That's assuming that Nick the Greek doesn't bump her off.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: GUEST,Auldtimer
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 12:33 PM

Suggest checking out Pete Coe's song, King & Queens of England, from his Long Company CD. Time we were rid of the lot of them.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: The Villan
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 12:41 PM

A song indeed

She's a Killer Queen
Gunpowder, gelatine
Dynamite with a laserbeam
Guaranteed to blow your mind (anytime)


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: The Walrus
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 01:55 PM

GUEST,Auldtimer,

"...Suggest checking out Pete Coe's song, King & Queens of England, from his Long Company CD. Time we were rid of the lot of them..."

You would prefer President Thatcher or President Bliar?

That's your alternative.

W


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Peace
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 01:56 PM

"British Monarchy question"

British Monarchy answer: get rid of it.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: GUEST,Auldtimer
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 02:37 PM

Well "The Walrus", how does Queen Camilla and King Tampax/Charles grab you.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 04:35 PM

How about the common sense line of thinking?

How much trouble has the Monarchy caused in the last century. You know, starting wars etc?
And how much much has the Prime Minister caused?

How much does the Monachy cost to run, and how much tourist money do they bring in?
And how much would a President cost?

The desire to change things, even though it will be positivly unhelpful is not good.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: The Shambles
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 08:14 PM

What place is Mr M. Al Fayed on the list?


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 04 Sep 06 - 11:56 PM

Yes but the existence of The Royal Family legitimises inequality within our society. Rubber stamps it.

And that does cause a lot of our nation's ills. Next time you're being treated like a piece of shit by the national health service, social services or your kid's attending a sump school, or some politician calling you the scum of the planet, because of what you think, where you come from, or what business you're in - well we all know who the cream of the crop is.

who bloody cares who comes next - they won't be inviting anybody I know round for tea.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 12:05 AM

Who the feck are all these people called Taylor ? Cassius and Columbus for fecks sake, you dont get many people called Columbus round here.

eric


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: InOBU
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 08:07 AM

Well, if you look at British history, one notes that there are a few wild card situations, such as if Scotland returns to its own monarchy, places Sean Connery on the throne of Scotland, and after the death of the English monarch, the Scots come pouring over the boarder to reclaim their rightful claim to the throne of Britan, to make up for all the tartan jokes on BBC... As the loyal toast goes in Ireland... "I give you the Queen.... you can have 'er". The big question of the day, is how we are going to get by with poor Steve Irwin gone... ? Oh my, one last "Dainjah Dainjah Danjah to you ol'skin. I hope there are aligators in heaven for ya.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Dave (the ancient mariner)
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 09:44 AM

Before advocating change, try discovering something that works better than a Constitutional Monarchy. There are precious few here who could claim a Republic as being better. England had it's Civil War and eventually reinstated the Monarchy. As for petty jealousy over their rich lifestyles, get over it people. Without a rich living history and traditions, there are few examples of decent government anywhere.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 09:53 AM

Next time you're being treated like a piece of shit by the national health service, social services or your kid's attending a sump school, or some politician calling you the scum of the planet, because of what you think, where you come from, or what business you're in - well we all know who the cream of the crop is.

Yes, those who can afford to buy their way out of the system. Do those overpaid Football players have titles? No, but they have money.

Look at Europe. Do the Republics of France and Germany have things so much better that the Constituional Monachies of Scandanavia?


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Les from Hull
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 10:27 AM

The English Civil War was all about who rules the country, the Monarch or Parliament. Having established that it was Parliament, we could invite the Monarchy back to do what it's good at, waving!

I'd be happy to get rid of all the rest of the hangers-on, though.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: The Shambles
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 10:32 AM

I am glad that the art of waving correctly has been finally appreciated.

The trick is to hold up and use your hand as if it was caressing an imaginary buttock.

Not everone can master this - it requires breeding.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: The Shambles
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 10:33 AM

Did you try this?


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: SINSULL
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 10:51 AM

Time to dig out "Kind Hearts and Coronets".


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Paul Burke
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 11:40 AM

There's no particular reason why we have to change to an ACTIVE president. We could just have a figurehead, in the same way that Brenda is one at the moment. But we'd get rid of the residual powers, which aren't used but theoretically could be- Constantine of Greece pulled that trick with the military coup back in 1967. Ireland seems to get by well enough with some ex popstar or time-expired politician. Elect them for say 10 years, even Royals could stand. And a simple ballot system with write-ins could be fun.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: GUEST,Ooh-Aah2
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 11:38 PM

Republics are either boring, or too exciting (murderous) by half.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: catspaw49
Date: 05 Sep 06 - 11:44 PM

359. Berengar Patterson (b. 1948), great-grandson of Emperor William II


FAR OUT!!!!

IF the first 358 score a plague or some other disgusting disease, then Micca and I might have a shot at getting a room with a view at the palace.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: JennieG
Date: 06 Sep 06 - 04:12 AM

My grandfather had a look about him of King George VI. And what's more he was born in England, he emigrated to Oz in about 1912. That's good enough for me.

Just curtsey when you address me as Queen Jennie.

Cheers
JennieG


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Michael in Swansea
Date: 06 Sep 06 - 12:45 PM

I am a Welsh Catholic Royalist.
Sean Connery, King of Scotland? No way, Isla St Clair should be Queen though.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: Kaleea
Date: 06 Sep 06 - 04:47 PM

Rummy bit of work, what, getting rid of all those pesky royals! Wouldn't be more fun to do the "Sword in the Stone" contest? They could even put it on TV.


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Subject: RE: British Monarchy question
From: GUEST
Date: 06 Sep 06 - 10:30 PM

As an American, I just don't get the whole royal/monarchy thing.

Not just the English throne, but the whole lot of them.

Or had you not heard that Princess Kiko hath spawned an heir?

A large sigh of relief was heard all about those islands, as they didn't have to change the constitution to allow for a female heir to the Chrysanthemum Throne.

Now that's progress.


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