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BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1

SINSULL 27 Apr 06 - 02:02 PM
dianavan 25 Apr 06 - 10:27 PM
Don Firth 25 Apr 06 - 09:22 PM
dianavan 25 Apr 06 - 08:12 PM
Don Firth 25 Apr 06 - 07:35 PM
McGrath of Harlow 25 Apr 06 - 07:15 PM
LilyFestre 25 Apr 06 - 02:39 PM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 25 Apr 06 - 02:20 PM
Jack the Sailor 25 Apr 06 - 12:12 PM
LilyFestre 25 Apr 06 - 11:53 AM
GUEST 25 Apr 06 - 11:41 AM
McGrath of Harlow 25 Apr 06 - 08:45 AM
jacqui.c 25 Apr 06 - 08:36 AM
GUEST,Limony 25 Apr 06 - 08:29 AM
Once Famous 25 Apr 06 - 08:01 AM
folk1e 25 Apr 06 - 07:32 AM
folk1e 25 Apr 06 - 07:29 AM
Jack the Sailor 25 Apr 06 - 05:35 AM
GUEST,DG 25 Apr 06 - 04:24 AM
Folkiedave 25 Apr 06 - 02:50 AM
Jack the Sailor 24 Apr 06 - 06:57 PM
bobad 24 Apr 06 - 06:53 PM
Jack the Sailor 24 Apr 06 - 06:42 PM
Once Famous 24 Apr 06 - 06:29 PM
McGrath of Harlow 24 Apr 06 - 05:15 PM
Jack the Sailor 24 Apr 06 - 05:09 PM
bobad 24 Apr 06 - 04:13 PM
Jack the Sailor 24 Apr 06 - 03:52 PM
Jack the Sailor 24 Apr 06 - 03:50 PM
WFDU - Ron Olesko 24 Apr 06 - 03:42 PM
GUEST,DG 24 Apr 06 - 03:41 PM
Jack the Sailor 24 Apr 06 - 03:39 PM
Jack the Sailor 24 Apr 06 - 03:37 PM
GUEST,DG 24 Apr 06 - 03:32 PM
Jack the Sailor 24 Apr 06 - 03:31 PM
WFDU - Ron Olesko 24 Apr 06 - 03:17 PM
Jack the Sailor 24 Apr 06 - 03:08 PM
Jack the Sailor 24 Apr 06 - 03:07 PM
McGrath of Harlow 24 Apr 06 - 03:02 PM
Georgiansilver 24 Apr 06 - 02:30 PM
Jack the Sailor 24 Apr 06 - 01:44 PM
Don Firth 24 Apr 06 - 01:39 PM
folk1e 24 Apr 06 - 01:16 PM
CarolC 24 Apr 06 - 11:27 AM
Jack the Sailor 24 Apr 06 - 10:58 AM
WFDU - Ron Olesko 24 Apr 06 - 10:23 AM
Pied Piper 24 Apr 06 - 10:17 AM
Dave the Gnome 24 Apr 06 - 10:13 AM
Paco Rabanne 24 Apr 06 - 05:18 AM
alanabit 24 Apr 06 - 04:00 AM
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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: SINSULL
Date: 27 Apr 06 - 02:02 PM

re: Indian Food. The Jackson Diner in Jackson Heights, NY (about ten minutes from La Guardia Airport) has authentic Indian food that is nothing short of heaven.

The place is always filled with Indian families from different regions. It is fascinating to see the cultural differences.

Mention the Jackson Diner or Jackson Heights in any Indian restaurant in the States and you are going to hear "My brother (cousin, sister-in-law, etc) lives there/works there/owns it. They will prepare food "off the menu" if you don't see what you want.

It is the only thing I miss about NYC.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: dianavan
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 10:27 PM

Too, bad!

That was the best food I have ever tasted and I don't even remember what I ate. I know there were plenty of appetizers because we always had to tell us ourselves to 'slow down' and save room for the main entree. The food was always cooked to perfection and the service was excellent. It was actually the living room of a small house and the tables were small and close together (just like in France). Going for dinner was an event that lasted for hours but you usually had to wait in line to get in.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Don Firth
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 09:22 PM

Hi, dianavan,

It took a bit of googling to machete my way through a jungle of chain restaurant Skippers, but I finally managed to score. Unfortunately, I came up with THIS melancholy item. Looks like it's no longer in existence. Sorry.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: dianavan
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 08:12 PM

Don - Just curious. There used to be the greatest restaurant in West Seattle called Skippers. No, I don't mean the fish and chips joint, I mean a little restaurant that served five or six course meals. I still dream about it.

Can you give me an address if its still happening?


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Don Firth
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 07:35 PM

Not much in the way of grits and okra in my neck of the woods—Pacific Northwest—Seattle, to be exact. Considering the variety of restaurants around here, or specialty food stores, I suppose you could find them—if you really wanted to. I didn't encounter grits and okra until I took a trip to Denver (which is hardly the Deep South, but the place where I was staying had to cater to a lot of people from down that-a-way). Grits: tasted like a cross between Cream of Wheat and boiled mothballs. Okra: looked like green garden slugs swimming in a bowl of slime. [URP!!] Okra is best as an ingredient in something else. I do like barbeque, but I can't say I'm all that wild about it, given the wide variety of cuisine that's available here.

And, no, I don't think the frankfurter is the American national food. Isn't Frankfurt in Germany? I do believe so. And "weiner" or "weenie" is a sort of anglicized corruption for Vienna sausage (for the geographically bewildered, Vienna is in Austria). Hardly the American national food.

I don't know if you could nail down an "American national food." Within ten minutes' walk (or in my case, roll), I can come upon a couple of standard meat-and-potatoes "family food" restaurants, a couple of very good seafood restaurants (Seattle is a great place if you like seafood—all kinds of seafood!), Thai, Indian, Mexican, Chinese (real Chinese, not just chop suey joints), Vietnamese, Japanese, Italian (not counting about four Pizza emporia), Ethiopian, a whole variety of fast-food joints like McDonald's, Jack-in-the-Box, Burger King, Dick's Drive-In, Spud Fish & Chips (very good, by the way), Taco Bell, Subway, a couple of delis, places where you can get gyros and wraps, and a really good Greek restaurant. Starbucks everywhere!! We also have a couple of Trader Joe's food markets close by, and if you can't find it there, it probably isn't edible. And TJ's sells some outrageously good wines! I could add more to the list, but I'm getting hungry, so I'm gonna go raid the fridge.

Oh, by the way, there is a Frankfurter (franchise) cart nearby (any kind of hot-dog thingy you could want, including Chicago red-hots, which I am told by someone who knows—she lives in Chicago and was visiting—says measure up quite well to those at home).

There is also a boozatorium or three close by where one can get standard American mouse pee should one lack taste buds, but they tend to specialize in local—and "imported"—microbrews. I'm rather partial to dark ales, myself. Some folks (mostly normal people) drink beer for flavor and conviviality, not just to "get drunk," which is decidedly immature.

I think most major cities in the U. S. and A. probably offer pretty much the same variety of fare. And I would imagine that London does too. Provided one actually wants to find out what's really there rather than just piss, moan, and complain and brag about how great the swill is back home.

Don't let my talk about the great eateries around Seattle encourage you to come here, Marty. There are some real downsides. You'll have to stay in either a log cabin or an igloo, it rains twenty-six hours a day, we all have webbed feet, and you can't be here for more that an hour or two before moss starts growing on your north side. Fungus everywhere! You can tell people whose families have been here for a few generations because they begin to look like the Gill Man (for example, here's a shot of me pursuing one of my many hobbies).

No, you don't want to come here, Marty. You really won't like it. No! Definitely not!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 07:15 PM

Generally speaking the best food tends to be food brought in by immigrant communities. I suppose in the USA that would mean all the food, apart from that of the Native Americans. With that kind of range there must be some pretty good food there.

But I can't imagine seeing food as the main thing about any visit to a foreign countrty, That would apply to England more than some place, but the same would be true of some other fascinating parts of the world where people probably tend to think of food as fuel to get you by, while you enjoy yourself in other ways; for example the Netherlands and the Czech Republic. Interestingly enough, three places where the beer can be outstanding.

And no, you don't need to stick to the micro-breweries to get good beer in England, though there are a lot of them now making great beer. Nothing wrong with a number of medium and small breweries, such as Adnams and Ridleys and a fair number more. Not as many as there were one time, but that's how it goes.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: LilyFestre
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 02:39 PM

Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: yrlancslad - PM
Date: 22 Apr 06 - 09:17 PM

Yanks who visit (a small part of) London and then proceed to tell us about what the UK is like really piss me off. Plus denigrating the food from somebody whose national dish is the Frnkfurter is really rich!


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: yrlancslad - PM
Date: 22 Apr 06 - 09:21 PM

Not to mention grits and okra!


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 02:20 PM

"If you want the good stuff, you have to get it from the micro-breweries."

Basically the same in England. With the exception of Guinness, the very best beers are almost exclusively from the smaller, independent, breweries, many of them still family owned.

Fish and Chips from a pub? Strictly a no-no! Hardly any pubs have deep fryers, which are essential to good F & C.

London, where I was born and grew up, is certainly not representative of the best in cuisine, nor is it representative of the best in culture or hospitality. I suspect it shares that failing with many other large cities all over the world.

What the package tourist never seems to be told is that "England" (the real McCoy) starts about twenty miles out of the centre of London, in the direction of your choice.

If you stay within the London area, you will see some magnificent buildings, and can learn a great deal about English history, but you will know little more about "England" than you did before.

Hope you enjoy the rest of your trip, Martin, but judging by your sour comments, I doubt it. Maybe Chicago is the best place for you.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 12:12 PM

I find it funny how some are jumping up and down screaming about how MG has stereo-typed things and then turn around to say that the main dish in the US is hotdogs, grits and okra...just adding to the stereotyping.

I haven't seen any of that, particularly the jumping or the screaming.

When I was in Yorkshire I had a local dish, Yorkshire pudding. I do the same when visiting, Chicago, Atlanta or wherever. I can get regular meat and potatoes at home. When I travel I don't look for the things that are the same so that I can compare that to home and complain where the place I'm visiting falls short. I look for the things that are different so that I can learn something.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: LilyFestre
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 11:53 AM

Personally, I think everyplace in the world has it's positives and negatives, it just depends on each individual's preferences. I'm enjoying the thread and reading about the differences between here and where Martin visited.

I find it funny how some are jumping up and down screaming about how MG has stereo-typed things and then turn around to say that the main dish in the US is hotdogs, grits and okra...just adding to the stereotyping.

I lived in Europe for a time and sure, there are definately differences and I found that to make my stay much more interesting. It also made me thankful for the simple things I missed when I returned back in the US.

Michelle


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 11:41 AM

Glad you liked the museum, whichever one it may be. You're right London has marvellous museums and galleries.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 08:45 AM

That's a shame - back to normal service I see.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: jacqui.c
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 08:36 AM

London really isn't representative of England. It is now a very cosmopolitan city with a very diverse population. I was born and brought up in and around London but would not now live there.

Unfortunately, because of its popularity as a tourist attraction it has become very expensive and the food, on the whole, is not of the best, unless you are prepared to spend a lot of money and then you will be unlikely to get a meal that is representative of English cuisine. (OK - that can be considered to be an oxymoron!). Alot of the cheaper places know that they have a fairly transient clientelle and so do not seem to see the need to produce anything more than a passable meal. They also tend to cater for large numbers and it is difficult to really produce quality with quantity for the prices they charge. The UK as a whole is an expensive place to be in!

Fish and chips, one of the original finger foods, is not as good as it was due to the different method used these days to cook it. I would never order this in a pub - they do not have the correct equipment to cook it properly. I have been told that Harry Ramsdens is one of the best places in the south of England to get good fish and chips but have never tried it there. Our local chippy in Hertford turned out a good meal though and, as has been said before, the choice of fish is always shown on the board in the shop.

Unfortunately a lot of Americans have only ever had cold beer and so I guess that it is difficult to get past the cultural gap that allows you to appreciate the many good ales to be found in English pubs. There are some good light beers, which have to be drunk cold to get the best from them, but, particularly in a real ale pub, some of the bitters have so much more flavour! My son ran a pub at one time - even got a cask marque from CAMRA for the quality of his beers, and I was able to sample the various guest ales he would get in. I'm not a beer drinker but could appreciate the flavours nevertheless.

There are, at certain times in large towns and cities, too many drunks rolling out of the pubs. Fact of life I'm afraid, but not just in England. There have been complaints even here in Maine of young people getting almost paraletic by closing time in the major city in the state. Seems to be a fact of life these days.

Just as elsewhere you get waht you pay for (only you always pay more in the UK due to the high cost of living). If you pay more for meat you will get better quality. Martin - did you try a real English delicacy - steak and kidney pudding - made with a suet crust, not the crap they sell in take-aways? I served that up to my American husband, family and friends and, although there was a certain reluctance to try it, once they had tasted it I was told that I would have to make it again, they enjoyed it so much.

I love the London Eye - been up in it three times so far, once at night, which was a real experience. What else did you get to see? That part of London holds so may tourist attractions that it would be difficult to see much in a short time.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: GUEST,Limony
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 08:29 AM

The London eye is a huge rip-off. It looks great, but anyone worth their salt knows that the best views of London can be found from Primrose Hill for free!

The best fish and chips I've ever had were from a chippy in Stoke on Trent called 'Ye Olde Chippy' - they were incredible. Mushy peas and everything. Fantastic. Anyone else ever been there?

Perhaps it is right that fish & chips are better up north.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Once Famous
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 08:01 AM

No, I don't watch that trash on TV.

And Jack, I am very nice to people. People who deserve it. Others, not always. don't try to make yourself out as some pure girlie-man. You're not.

I met some nice people in London. Glad you enjoyed some great food while you were in Chicago, Jack. We also have a reputation for great music and sports.

In London, I also saw the world class museum where my son works his internship and the London Eye, which was a great way to view the city.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: folk1e
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 07:32 AM

MG, I know this may sound strange, but have you ever heard of Karma?
If not then there is a TV show (Call Me Earl) that should give the general idea!


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: folk1e
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 07:29 AM

"No, accept the fact that fish and chips sucks.
Not so sure about that, but a few years ago I paddled up (and back down) Windermere and had some chips that were so good I could have sucked them!


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 05:35 AM

FolkieDave,

It just means the meat is pulled appart to make it more tender. And that's not the official name, just my description.

I'm sure in the UK when you want a rib plate you say I'll have "The meaty bist between the bones of ribs which is eaten alonf with the bones themselves which I can use for handles." But in Georgia they just say "Bring me a plate of ribs." and assume that the waiter knows the rest.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: GUEST,DG
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 04:24 AM

"No, accept the fact that fish and chips sucks.

Meat in england is made from rodents.

Beer is for idiot drunks for the most part and there were plenty on the streets.

Whine all you want, but my true observation was that most restaurant food that I tried in London was fairly crappy.

Except the Coca-cola was great, being the American icon that it is.

but your subway is nice, too."

Posts like this make me lose faith in people!
As an American, the only positive things you can comment about London are coca-cola and the subway! By the subway, I hope you mean the London Underground and NOT the fast-food sandwich place.

Beer is only for drunks! That's like saying food is just for fat people. Get a grip!

I'm sure with sober reflection, you can find some positives about your trip over here. I understand that the level of customer service in the UK may not be the level it is in the US, but this doesn't mean that everything is worse!
I've got quite a few American friends and have never known any of them to have such a closed-minded attitude when travelling abroad, perhaps its an age thing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Folkiedave
Date: 25 Apr 06 - 02:50 AM

In Georgia, Barbeque restaurants have pulled pork, Beef ribs, spare ribs and chicken. with 4 different "heats" of mustard sauce.

The things you Americans do and eat. Here in the UK "pull" is common slang for "meeting a member of the opposite sex" generally with some success, one way or another). So one could "go out on the pull" or "pull a bloke", We´d certainly never use it in conjunction with "pork"!!. Except maybe the odd farmer, but sheep are generally more compliant.

It seems in America you eat the ribs. We prefer to stick to the meaty bits not the bones. Is this where Martin is going wrong?

If you have already eaten the beef ribs how come there are some that are spare?

And is the chicken not tasty enough on its own?


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 06:57 PM

"* the male's scrotum is in front of the penis;"

Then how are they so prolific? Doesn't it get in the way? ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: bobad
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 06:53 PM

You are correct in that JtS.

Lagomorphs (loģ o-moŕ fs)(Gr. lagos, hare: + morphē, form) differ from rodents in that:

    * they have four (not two as in rodents) incisors in the upper jaw;
    * they will only eat vegetation (unlike rodents, who will eat meat and vegetation)
    * the male's scrotum is in front of the penis;
    * the penis has no bone (baculum) as does the rodents'; and
    * they will re-digest first time feces (called cecotropes) to obtain the most from their plant diet.

They resemble rodents, however, in that their teeth grow throughout their life, thus necessitating constant chewing to keep them from growing too long.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagomorph


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 06:42 PM

When I was in Chicago a few years ago I had deep dish pizza, a hotdog and chips under the el, corned beef and cabbage at an Irish pub. Chicago was a wonderful experience, almost as nice as London.

The opinion that you don't like the one order of fish and chips you had a pub has been noted.

The English do sometimes eat rabbits and hares which are technically not rodents, but the beef comes from cattle the mutton comes from sheep and the fish comes from fish.

Beer is wonderful and if you just have a couple, you don't get drunk.

If you go to London again, why don't you try being nice to people? Maybe then they'll tell you where the good restaurants are and the cooks won't spit in your food.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Once Famous
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 06:29 PM

No, accept the fact that fish and chips sucks.

Meat in england is made from rodents.

Beer is for idiot drunks for the most part and there were plenty on the streets.

Whine all you want, but my true observation was that most restaurant food that I tried in London was fairly crappy.

Except the Coca-cola was great, being the American icon that it is.

but your subway is nice, too.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 2!!
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 05:15 PM

Pedantic quibble: Why is this thread headed as "part 1", when in fact it is "part 2"?

(See here for the real "part 1")


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 05:09 PM

I really like the Honey Brown too.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: bobad
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 04:13 PM

Sleeman has just put out an India Pale Ale which is worth a taste, even better than their Cream Ale IMO.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:52 PM

The Indian food is good in Toronto, a few hundred thousand South Asians tend to make the curry restaurants work hard for the business.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:50 PM

IceHouse is a very good beer for the money. A little drier than most US brews. Is as good as any massed produced beer here and its only 12.97 for 24 cans. Its what I usually drink.

DG
If you are looking for a good beer in Canada check out Creemore Springs (Carol's favorite) and Sleeman's Cream Ale (My favorite) they are crafted in relatively small batches in Ontario breweries.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:42 PM

You are right about the Indian food DG, it has yet to catch on in a big way over here. Curry is no where near as popular over here as it is in the UK.   

As for beer, you are right - the big name brewers are cheap and it is nothing to write home about.   Check out the microbrews and brewpubs. You will find different styles and very flavorful brews.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: GUEST,DG
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:41 PM

They both sound great. I'll be sure to check out the Pad Thai... with the doughnuts and coffee for afterwards!


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:39 PM

If you want to live like the natives, you can't go wrong with a Tim Hortons Doughnut and a cup of fresh "double double" (2 cream 2 sugar they put it in for you.)


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:37 PM

I don't live near Toronto anymore but if it hasn't changed too much, For a vegitarian, I'd go either Indian, Carribean, or Southeast Asian. There was a place called "the bamboo" on Queen street that had fantastic pad thai. I loved the Jamacian food when I was there and there is a huge South Asian community.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: GUEST,DG
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:32 PM

I completely agree with the comment above;

"The idea of tourism is to enjoy what the new country has to offer, not to piss and moan about what is better about your home."

I lived in the States for a year and am heading back in a couple of weeks for a holiday - I always try new things out there and try and embrace the local cuisine... While the beer is completely different to that of the UK, it's twice as cheap, and that fact should be celebrated!!

Two points though, tea and Indian food aren't very good in the US compared to the UK.

You're right about my idea of BBQ food... I've only ever had the fast food stuff and now I'm vegetarian, it's unlikely I'll have the proper slow cooked stuff.

Off topic slightly, but what type of food would you recommend me eat in Toronto?


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:31 PM

In Georgia, Barbeque restaurants have pulled pork, Beef ribs, spare ribs and chicken. with 4 different "heats" of mustard sauce.

KC, it mostly beef and pork ribs.

Cincinati is a big pork town.

Canadian BBQ is usually a variation on the KC and Texas style, red sauce or rubbed spices or marinated meat. The recipes are probably from the US but the food is good!


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:17 PM

" "Has London ever heard what BBQ is?" What is it? B There's B & Q, but those are DIY stores."

Barbeque. True BBQ is a slow cooking process that involves smoking meat over an indirect fire.   Cooking over coals is grilling. BBQ is a regional favorite in the Southern U.S., and as Jack pointed out there are other regional styles. You can find BBQ all across the U.S., but they usually follow a certain style.   In Texas, brisket is king. Kansas City has their ribs. North Carolina has pork. Some places use sauce - some tomato based, some mustard based. In North Carolina a sauce from vinegar and spice is popular. In Texas you do not use sauce, just a "rub" which is dry spices. The "fixins" are also popular.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:08 PM

Correction, Middlesbrough


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:07 PM

MacGrath,

I had fish and chips at a chip stand in Middlesboro and at a restaurant in Hartlepool near the old docks. Quite excellent. I also had curry in middesboro with papadoms and Yorkshire pudding in York. I enjoyed every morsel tremendously.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 03:02 PM

"Has London ever heard what BBQ is?" What is it? B There's B & Q, but those are DIY stores.

Fish and Chip aren't that good in London anyway - much better up in the North of England.

Though there's a great chippy in Leigh-on-Sea, Southend. In fact one of the highlights of the excellent little Leigh-on-Sea Folk Festival which takes place in June is the chance to sample the fish and chips at the Mayflower in Old Leigh.

But I'd definitely advise visitors to steer clear of burger on a trip to England. Best stick to what the locals eat - Indian and Chinese or Italian. A high proportion of the chippies tend to fall into that category anyway - curry and chips, for example.

But did Martin get into any music while he was over?


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 02:30 PM

Hey a lot of clever people come from Hull...................the not so clever ones always go back...........just joking Ted...I like Hull actually and I have been there and would go again.
Best wishes, Mike. Ps How is the gorgeous daughter these days?


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 01:44 PM

I had fantastic beer when I was in England. I expecially like the Tetley's Bitter, and the Guiness and Murphy's Stout which are much better there than here. But my favourite was the Molson's Canadian brewed in Manchester. It is much much better than the Canadian brewed in St. John's, NL and Toronto, Ont for local comsumption and better than the Canadian I can buy in the stores here in the US Southeast.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Don Firth
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 01:39 PM

"Do I contradict myself?
Very well, I contradict myself
(I am large; I contain multitudes)"
                      —Walt Whitman

Not all American beer tastes like gerbil urine. If you want the good stuff, you have to get it from the micro-breweries. Most well stocked grocery stores have it. There are some pretty good beers from Red Hook and Pyramid. The trick is to look for the off-brand beers, usually with whimsical names. One of my favorites is "Moose Drool," from a Montana micro-brewery.

As for judging a country's cuisine by one order of fish and chips—well, let me put it this way:   all Indians walk in single file. At least the one I saw did.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: folk1e
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 01:16 PM

I went to Hull......... but I'm alright now :-D


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: CarolC
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 11:27 AM

Not necessarily in any order and rather indifferent, as usual who is offended

Pied Piper, I think it translates this way...

"These are not necessarily in order, and I am rather indifferent, as I usually am, about who will be offended by what I say."

( ...hope this helps ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Jack the Sailor
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 10:58 AM

Yes, Of course, the only possible comment about English food, saying that BBQ is better.

I've had Canadian BBQ, Cincinnati BBQ, Georgia BBQ, North Carolina BBQ, Texas BBQ and the King of all BBQ, Kansas City BBQ. They are all great in their own way but none are better than the Fish n'Chips I had in England. The idea of tourism is to enjoy what the new country has to offer, not to piss and moan about what is better about your home.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 10:23 AM

"Has London ever heard what BBQ is?

Why would they? It's rubbish."

Sorry, but I could not let that comment slip by. My guess is that if this guest was exposed to BBQ, they probably had something that was served up as fast food - just like the way the fish & chips were apparently served to Martin. For our friends in the UK, you need to try BBQ that is done right - cooked at low temperaturs in a smoker, not something burned to a crisp over a grill. Lightly spiced, maybe some sauce on the side. Give me a nice brisket that has been tenderized in a smoker for 8 to 10 hours. Or some "dry" ribs that fall off the bone. No need for drenching in some sickly sweet sauce. Mmmmm...   damn, I'm hungry already.


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Pied Piper
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 10:17 AM

I'm still trying to work out what this strange combination of words means.
"Not necessarily in any order and rather indifferent, as usual who is offended"
Is it a question?

PP


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 10:13 AM

Lots of people go to Hull, Ted. Just that most of 'em won't admit it;-)

Cheers

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: Paco Rabanne
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 05:18 AM

Why doesn't anyone ever come to Hull?


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Subject: RE: BS: Europe: observations/comments part 1
From: alanabit
Date: 24 Apr 06 - 04:00 AM

The trouble with whistle stop tours, is that although they get you around quickly enough to take a few snapshots of famous buildings, they don't teach you much about the local culture! I could take you out every day for a month in Cologne and you would barely scratch the surface of the history and culture in this city.
You could wander into a pub and drink a glass of Kölsch and then think you know what Kölsch tastes like. There are literally dozens of different types of Kölsch beer. Some of them I drink with relish, others I would not use to wash the mud off my boots.
I hope you had a good time in London Martin. Your best chance of seeing something good there - let alone drinking and eating well at a reasonable price - is to spend a few days with your son, if he really knows his way around.
Local knowledge is everything when you are travelling. Unless you get to know a few of the local people, all you really find is the same stuff you find in every other city.


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