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BBC 4 folk program

s&r 03 Feb 06 - 06:39 AM
My guru always said 03 Feb 06 - 04:53 PM
GUEST,starfish 03 Feb 06 - 05:36 PM
GUEST,greg stephens 03 Feb 06 - 06:11 PM
Mrs.Duck 03 Feb 06 - 06:16 PM
GUEST 03 Feb 06 - 06:18 PM
Richard Bridge 03 Feb 06 - 06:30 PM
NormanD 03 Feb 06 - 06:32 PM
GUEST,Roland Shanks 03 Feb 06 - 07:28 PM
greg stephens 04 Feb 06 - 03:29 AM
Tradsinger 04 Feb 06 - 03:49 AM
Les in Chorlton 04 Feb 06 - 04:20 AM
Dave Hanson 04 Feb 06 - 05:11 AM
GUEST,Roland Shanks 04 Feb 06 - 05:12 AM
Les in Chorlton 04 Feb 06 - 05:20 AM
Les in Chorlton 04 Feb 06 - 06:08 AM
GUEST,Kasper 04 Feb 06 - 07:21 AM
NormanD 04 Feb 06 - 07:35 AM
greg stephens 04 Feb 06 - 10:16 AM
Les in Chorlton 04 Feb 06 - 12:35 PM
NormanD 04 Feb 06 - 01:24 PM
GUEST,Old Folky 04 Feb 06 - 02:32 PM
Tootler 04 Feb 06 - 02:35 PM
sian, west wales 04 Feb 06 - 03:17 PM
shepherdlass 04 Feb 06 - 04:14 PM
NormanD 04 Feb 06 - 05:23 PM
Geoff the Duck 04 Feb 06 - 05:32 PM
GUEST 04 Feb 06 - 05:32 PM
Richard Bridge 04 Feb 06 - 05:39 PM
Polly Squeezebox 04 Feb 06 - 07:24 PM
Tootler 04 Feb 06 - 07:30 PM
Andy Jackson 04 Feb 06 - 07:47 PM
GUEST 04 Feb 06 - 08:01 PM
Les in Chorlton 05 Feb 06 - 03:25 AM
Roger the Skiffler 05 Feb 06 - 03:31 AM
GUEST,Bill the Collie 05 Feb 06 - 03:33 AM
Big Al Whittle 05 Feb 06 - 04:25 AM
Sooz 05 Feb 06 - 04:30 AM
Dave Hanson 05 Feb 06 - 04:31 AM
Bonnie Shaljean 05 Feb 06 - 09:17 AM
GUEST,Julian 05 Feb 06 - 09:26 AM
danensis 05 Feb 06 - 10:29 AM
AggieD 05 Feb 06 - 10:58 AM
greg stephens 05 Feb 06 - 01:18 PM
Hawker 05 Feb 06 - 01:25 PM
GUEST,Keith 05 Feb 06 - 01:29 PM
Nigel Parsons 05 Feb 06 - 01:57 PM
shepherdlass 05 Feb 06 - 02:09 PM
GUEST 06 Feb 06 - 05:12 AM
Pete_Standing 06 Feb 06 - 05:32 AM
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Subject: BBC 4 folk program
From: s&r
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 06:39 AM

Tonight


Stu


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: My guru always said
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 04:53 PM

Am watching right now, it's excellent!! Some friends were filmed at a club night & may be somewhere in this series, so I'll try not to miss.

Trouble is, I haven't figured out how to record Freeview onto either DVD or Video yet, must be the wiring tangle..... Any hints?


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST,starfish
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 05:36 PM

We enjoyed the folk britannia programme, but so far (1/2 hour in) the following programme "Folk at the BBC" is just a rehashed repeat.
Let's hope for an improvemnet next week.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST,greg stephens
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 06:11 PM

You're maligning "Folk at the BBC". Alan Whicker at Newquay interviewing the beatniks and Wizz Jones was a classic. And wasnt Robin Hall cute?


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Mrs.Duck
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 06:16 PM

Hilary, you need to tune your recorder into the freeview on a spare channel. Play with it when you are not desperate to record something special.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 06:18 PM

My picture kept breaking up. Did this happen to anyone else or is it my stuff playing up? New to digital!


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 06:30 PM

Pile of arrogant ill-informed poo


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk programme
From: NormanD
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 06:32 PM

Two excellent hours. Folk Brittania was a great overview; it put the music in its rightful social context and gave good emphasis to previously under-recognised musical sources: Irish and travellers. The following weeks are boding well.

It'll all get criticised, of course: too much of this -- nothing on that -- not him again! -- etc. But the best I've seen for a long time.

The second hour was the usual mixed bag, but there were some amazingly good gems - Andy Irvine for one. The old Tonight piece on the Newquay beatniks of 1960 was wonderful. As Greg says above - Wizz Jones was classic. Where did he learn "Penny's Farm" from (rewritten to take the piss out of the Newquay Burgermeisters)??

Norman


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST,Roland Shanks
Date: 03 Feb 06 - 07:28 PM

"Pile of arrogant ill-informed poo"

Do you really think that it was ill informed? - its an honest question but I find it hard to see how anyone could come to that conclusion. I also can't understand how you can find the tone of the programme arrogant.

I thought it was hard to find fault with anything in the programme and I found it superb viewing.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: greg stephens
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 03:29 AM

Excellent to see Reg Hall being consulted. Now, if they let him control an hour or two of folk on TV we might see a bit of real folk, instead of innovatora" with guitars and stuff.Not that I dont play guitar myself, but there is a wonderful folk tradition in England which is largely ignored(especially by "folk" TV programmes, "folk" festivals, and "folk" clubs). Long live Reg Hall and folk enthusiasts.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Tradsinger
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 03:49 AM

I found it very interesting to hear from those like Reg, Peter Kennedy, Karl Dallas, etc who have seen this folk thing evolve over the last 50+ years and who understand the various drivers behind it. I thought the programme was excellent in drawing together all the threads that are behind what we do today and why. The follow-up was good and I especially enjoyed the Coppers and Harry Cox - how brave of the BBC to actually play a whole song by a source singer! I enjoyed the beatnik bit too as context setting (changing world, challenging old values etc) but thought it went on a bit and could have done with another song. Hopefully a lot of people will have seen the prog and thought "I didn't realise that - that's interesting - how can I find out more?"

It will be interesting to see whether the programmes have any impact on the great British public and the media.

Gwilym


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 04:20 AM

So, are we at the start of the third folk revival? What should we do? Will it all be over by the time I finish this post?


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 05:11 AM

It was all good except the White Heather Club, which was appalling, it illustrated the very worst of Scottish folk music, it's what Billy Connolly used to call ' biscuit tin music,' and who were that awful band
whose only instruments were 3 guitars ?

eric


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST,Roland Shanks
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 05:12 AM

"So, are we at the start of the third folk revival?"

Yes

"What should we do?"

Nothing different from what you're doing now.

"Will it all be over by the time I finish this post?"

No, but if you weren't aware it was happening in the first place don't expect to be invited to the party.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 05:20 AM

Party, party? I am still at the last one that started for me in about 1963.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 06:08 AM

Is it true that if you remember the folk revival you probably weren't their?


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST,Kasper
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 07:21 AM

Weren't their what, Les?


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: NormanD
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 07:35 AM

eric the red wrote: "It was all good except the White Heather Club, which was appalling..."

Appalling is too good a word to use. It was like watching a car crash of a previous life. Truth is, though, it was mainstream entertainment that used trad. music - and that's the closest TV got to broadcasting folk music in 1960.

The "Tonight" prog. was great, though, with its regulars like Jimmie & Robin, and Cy Grant (?), and, occasionally, visiting American singers. I well remember seeing and hearing for the first time, blues players. One blues pianist, whose name I can't remember, did a song called "West Texas Woman". Not bad for early evening TV.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: greg stephens
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 10:16 AM

Yes, who were the guitar singers on the "White Heather Club"? Thought I recognised a couple, but I cant put names to them. That programme was rather like the "Black and White Minstrel Show". Terrible at the time, and now unbelievably, terribly terrible.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 12:35 PM

sorry I would have sworn I was there


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: NormanD
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 01:24 PM

BBC info on The White Heater Club: http://tinyurl.com/a2e76

"Burns Night: From 1960, a celebration of the poet's work, with ballads and reels. Featuring Andy Stewart, Jimmy Shand, The Joe Gordon Folk Four and The City of Glasgow Police Male Voice Choir."

The guitar singers must have been the Polis Mail Boys Choir.

norman


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST,Old Folky
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 02:32 PM

The White Heather Club certainly wasn't a true representation of a Folk Club, Far too may people were smiling and enjoying themselves, not enough death and disasters, come on BBC get your act together!


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Tootler
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 02:35 PM

An excellent programme and very enlightening. I am looking forward to part 2, especially as it is about the period when I first became interested in folk music.

The material on Ewan McColl was very interesting. He was a fine singer and songwriter, but he made the same mistake as Cecil Sharp and his generation of imposing on the music what they thought it should be rather than accepting it for what it was.

I enjoyed the follow up programme with its wide diversity of items. I thought the monitor extract about guitars went on too long, though it did highlight the all too common patronising attitudes of the time.

However, I thought there was a huge gap. Plenty about songs and singers, but what about the Instrumental side? To me, there are two strands to traditional music, the songs and the tunes. Recording traditional tunes and styles of playing is every bit as important as recording the songs, yet it got barely a mention. A brief soundclip of Scan Tester and A couple of clips of an Irish Session certainly did not do that side of traditional music justice at all.

As a player rather than a singer, this was a glaring omission to me.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: sian, west wales
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 03:17 PM

I missed it. I switched to BBC4 and got a black screen. What's that about??? I get the other Freeview channels.

So can someone tell me - was there any Welsh on it? The advertising blurbs all sound like it is really a look at folk in the English context with a nod in the direction of Scotland (and Ireland?)

Folk and protest music were very important in Welsh social history at this point (as previously).

siân


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: shepherdlass
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 04:14 PM

eric the red wrote: "It was all good except the White Heather Club, which was appalling..."

The White Heather Club wasn't to my taste either, but it's not a good idea to dismiss the inclusion of this show on a BBC folk night dedicated to those years - the fact that it drew large audiences means it must have represented some kind of folk-ish music to a significant number of people in Britain at the time. Imagine mainstream terrestial TV of today broadcasting a regular show that focused on any kind of folk music, no matter how diluted. The fact that it was desperately, cringeworthily mainstream means it may have found its way into the homes that folk clubs didn't reach and perhaps encouraged some people to dip their toes into the revival when they wouldn't otherwise have got involved. And NormanD, to liken it to the deeply offensive Black and White Minstrels is surely a bit extreme. Yes, they were Scottish showbiz-lite performances that weren't exactly 'traditional' (and that word's a minefield it's probably best not to get into when you consider that most of the "folk" in Scotland of the time were more likely to attend showbizzy events than folk clubs), but they weren't non-Scots uncle-Tomming it up in an outright racist and demeaning way.

Sorry, I just worry when our concepts of good or bad taste affect how we view past cultural output. We should be glad there's at least some archive stuff still available. And some of those less controversial clips in the main Folk Britannia programme were fantastic!


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: NormanD
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 05:23 PM

shepherdlass:"And NormanD, to liken it to the deeply offensive Black and White Minstrels is surely a bit extreme..."

Not guilty, I never said that. I said: "It was like watching a car crash of a previous life. Truth is, though, it was mainstream entertainment that used trad. music - and that's the closest TV got to broadcasting folk music in 1960."

The Black & White Minstrels analogy said "Terrible at the time, worse now". I agree with that completely. I couldn't watch it - I squirmed for 10 minutes, it was even beyond mockery. I presumed the programmers put it on as a piece of high-camp piss-taking. 46 years later, we're oh so much more sophisticated....

norman


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Geoff the Duck
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 05:32 PM

The White Heather Club never pretended to be anything other than what it was. It was not a "Folk Club", it was a TV "Entertainment". It did, however have an incredibly large following quoted as 10 million viewers (BLICKY)
Not bad for a "car crash".

Actually, my Grandad was a big fan of Andy Stewart, so I grew up listening to his records. Yes, he was a "professional kilted Scot", but he did more which got Scottish Traditional music heard than most Scots. He was a decent singer who alongside novelty stuff such as Donald Where's Your Troosers he did "straight" songs as well.

Of course, the British Folk world is based on ridiculing the people who have made what we do possible. We are not allowed to admit we grew up listening to the White Heather Club, The Spinners, Robin Hall & Jimmy McGregor or The Dubliners, because they are "old". Strange for a Folk Movement which prides itself on revering tradition and the past.

All in all, the BBC did more to promote Folk in them days than it does now. A couple of documentaries on an obscure digital channel, which will never be shown on the mainstream non-digital channels. Not really something to applaud, is it? Better than nothing? Maybe, but not enough. They used to do better.

Quack!
Geoff the Duck.

p.s. Full Scedule.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 05:32 PM

Sain said "I missed it. I switched to BBC4 and got a black screen. What's that about??? I get the other Freeview channels."

Now there's a funy thing.

I bought a freeview box specially. Spent all of thurday and friday working out how to record to VCR, and checking that all was working fine. But come show time I had the same problem! All other channels working, but BBC3 and BBC4 were black!

So I went up to my daughter's room. She has freeview and it shares the same aerial as the TV downstairs. And it was working fine! Check downstairs: Ctill black whatever I do.

(This morning the darn thing had forgotten all the channels, so I swapped it for another model - and which seems ok so far).

Can anyone explain?

Tom Bliss


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 05:39 PM

You had the '60s revival one, that said "Yeah, like when you really get down to it, what's it all about, man?"


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Polly Squeezebox
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 07:24 PM

Coppersongs just starting, and I'm looking forward to enjoying it for the THIRD time. Husband's gone to bed, having recently readjusted how to record to both video and DVD and I haven't a clue (and the Cointreau's not helping, hic).

Oh ------ - hopefully they'll show it again when he's back in the land of the conscious.

Polly


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Tootler
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 07:30 PM

Geoff the Duck wrote

Of course, the British Folk world is based on ridiculing the people who have made what we do possible. We are not allowed to admit we grew up listening to the White Heather Club, The Spinners, Robin Hall & Jimmy McGregor or The Dubliners, because they are "old". Strange for a Folk Movement which prides itself on revering tradition and the past.

Yes, anyone who gets popular or is seen on a mainstream entertainment seems to get accused of having "sold out". I have a fondness for Robin Hall and Jimmy McGregor and still have a couple of LPs somewhere. Likewise the spinners. I saw the Spinners live on several occasions and always enjoyed their shows.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Andy Jackson
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 07:47 PM

What a grand evenings entertainment. Split up in my case by several recordings at various times, interspersed with live viewing. Not to mention another set of recordings on the Isle of Wight!! The Beeb has a last pleased some of the people some of the time. Sorry you missed it Sian, but I hope you have caught up with one of the many re-runs. No mention that I could detect of Welsh tradition unfortunately. Three programmes to go yet though (I think) so lets hope.
Looking forward to next week but the following weekend is the Anchor Middle Bar Sidmouth Reunion so have to put lots of trust in remote technology....Hmmmmm
I have often wondered and sometimes even gone to print about the daft idea of repaeating programmes intensively very close together, a week at least apart and we might get to watch them without frantic hair-tearing planning meetings!! Ho Hum..

I suppose while I'm chatting I'd better mention Miskin at Easter or some will think I'm slipping. " MISKIN AT EASTER "

Tarra each

Andy


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST
Date: 04 Feb 06 - 08:01 PM

Missed last night's programme but thoroughly enjoyed the start of Folk Britannia and look forwatd to the rest of the series on folk.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 03:25 AM

The Spinners - the most influencial English folk group?


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Roger the Skiffler
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 03:31 AM

I thought the second programme of old & new performances could have done more than just expand clips from the preceding one. I felt they were padding it out, the old black & white documentary on the rise of the guitar was amusing ina "Chumley Warner" way but wasn't specifically about folk music. I was disappointed that the clip of Ramblin' Jack in the old days was then followed by hwta must have been the worst ever rendition of San Francisco Bay Blues I've heard (apart from my own dreadful version). I love Jack's work, this didn't do him justice. Nice to hear Peggy Seeger, Bob Davenport etc as well as the archive clips, though many of the later seem to be chosen for their amusement value. At least the talking heads were people with experience, not just a bunch of soap stars and standups that usually appear in these programmes.

RtS


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST,Bill the Collie
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 03:33 AM

Two of the Spinners could sing. Or was it only one?
It was all so long ago.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 04:25 AM

I hated the white Heather Club at the time, but I thought it looked quite fun now, in a sort of surrealist way.

I wish they'd show the whole series. The footage of Irish pubs in the 1950's and Bobby Casey was great.

the trouble was, that every item and artist was worth a programme at least and some of them a series!

we should have our own tv channel.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Sooz
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 04:30 AM

When is the next episode on? There are so many re-runs its hard to know which one is new!


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 04:31 AM

Perhaps I was a bit unfair about thw White Heather Club, at least they were showing some er ' folk music '.

Hughie Jones of the Spinners still is a fine singer.

eric


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 09:17 AM

I enjoyed it hugely, but wish quite so much airtime hadn't been spent showing the same archive clips of the early American blues/folk scene that crop up over and over and over again on these history-of-the-people's-music programmes. I know it was a strong influence in the UK, but it wasn't the only one. I'd rather have watched less of it (NOT none) and more about what was happening in Britain, which has not been given the same media exposure. Woody Guthrie & Pete Seeger & Co, while groundbreakers, have been seen and seen and seen.

And Tootler's right: Why were there so few instrumentalists? I wish they'd devote some time to William Kimber (among others) but am not betting huge amounts on it.

Apart from that, there were a lot of treats. I loved hearing Harry Cox and seeing Shirley Collins again (doesn't she look great, and didn't she speak the truth); and the high point of the second hour – something of a curate's egg – was a very young Davey Graham playing Cry Me A River to an enraptured but very diverse audience. There are too many good artists from that era to ever do justice to them, so all the more reason to give recognition to some of the lesser-known names who don't appear in the usual archive clips which always get trotted out.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST,Julian
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 09:26 AM

I admit to entering the realms of "folk" via the Spinners.

I helped promote them at one concert and whilst chatting over a meal with them after the show Tony said that they always included two unaccompanied songs and those were invariably the ones the audience were humming on their way out.

So I applauded their evangelical method of getting more "public" into folk song and music.

I thoroughly enjoyed Folk Brittania (part one), the follow on on Friday and the repeat and Coppersongs on Saturday. Can't wait for next episodes.

It is nice to see "folk" being treated seriously, and although on a minority channel. At least there is the possiblity of it being shown on the mainstream channels at a later date has as happened with other BBC3 and BBC4 programmes.

Cheers

Julian


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: danensis
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 10:29 AM

To those having trouble with their digibox, if its a while since you tuned it in, they rearranged all the channels recently. It took me ages to work out what was happening, I just had to set the digibox to autotune and it found out where they'd hidden them,

John


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: AggieD
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 10:58 AM

Missed the programme on Friday night as I was at the Barbican watching 'Daughters of Albion' which I have to say was absolutely superb, although I think some 'traditionalists' may bemoan the fact that it wasn't all about what many of them would expect.
Did however catch the repeat last night & was not surprised by the BBC take on it, which was much the same as has been trotted out before. I will however watch the next 2 & look forward to seeing the couple of concerts that the Beeb recorded from the Barbican, provided one of there fancy young editors doesn't get hold of them & make a total mess of them by making them too trendy.
And don't anyone dare put the Spinners down. Like Julian I came into traditional folk music through hearing them. They were always great ambassadors for the genre as well as being very committed to EFDSS, without whom much of the archive stuff would not exist & just because they were out in the mainstream doesn't make them awful. In fact many folkies would just love to get there stuff out there in the same way.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: greg stephens
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 01:18 PM

Earlier in this thread there is a comment about Ewan McColl taking from the tradition and doing what he liked with it, like Cecil Sharp.(Wich is not illegal, by the way, it's free to all). Keen watchers of the programme will have noticed Peggy Seeger coming out with some very ancient McColl-think: I havent got a recording, so I cant quote her exist words, but qas I recall it she made much of the fact that(at that time, 50/60s) English traditional culture had dried up to such an extent that there was nobody left to pass on the true style to the youngsters.
   Now, you might think this is a statement that,even if true, the average folkie would avoid making publicly: you would expect her more to be praising and admiring such vestiges as could still be found. But you'd be wrong: this is the authentic bit of McColl's plan, preserved by Peggy Seeger lovingly down to the present day. What he was saying was simple: folk music is wonderful. But unfortunately, the poor old folk have forgotten how to do it properly. So I, Ewan McColl(plus a few youngsters who I have trained in the True Path) will Show the Poor Sods How to Do It. Which is why you got sounds and sights like McColl with that rather bizarre band doing his best at a Geordie accent for a bit of Hewing Ma Coal type "North East folksong". Sure the man was a genius, and the Radio Ballads were stunning, but some of his doings, sayings, and singings, were just laughable. And damagingly bullying to more sensitive souls.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Hawker
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 01:25 PM

Missed all of the programmes so far, but from what I have read here I will try to catch next week. It seems to me that there is a lot of unhappiness about what was shown, if it was representative and whether it was 'good' folk music. as a non watcher, sitting firmly on the fence, I say at least they are showing some folk music on the BBc now, let this be the beginning of something, dont complain, or if you do, do it in wrtiting to the BBC with suggestions of how they can better it, if they at least know they are reaching an audience - and that there is a need by some of us for this type of show, then it can only get better? Just my humble opinion, for what it's worth!
Cheeors, Lucy


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST,Keith
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 01:29 PM

As previously said the first programme was ok but dwelled a little too long on American influences. It also fostered the BBC misconception that the folk revival in Britain can be traced back to Ewan McColl & Bert Lloyd in London with the creation of the Ballads & Blues club. They neglected to mention that at the same time there were other people in other regions doing exactly the same for example Blue Bell club in Hull and the famous Folksong and Ballad club in Newcastle upon tyne.

I found the follow up programme puzzling! With the vast archive at the BBC's disposal why did they feature exactly the same songs as they had shownin the previous programme, in some cases only minutes earlier? In addition the inclusion of a lengthy study of the emergence of the guitar as a popular musical instrument in post war Britain was plain daft! If that had been cut then we could have included Irish, Welsh and Scottish contributions and still had room for one or two more source singers. My verdict Ok but could try harder!


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 01:57 PM

For Siân & Guest who had problems finding the station, as mentioned above, try a new autosearch of the channels.
To quote the BBC site:
Re-tuning/re-scanning your box/IDTV

The continued growth in the number of Freeview services available has meant that a change to some of the channel numbers was required to ensure a logical and user friendly channel list.

Many boxes/IDTVs will have updated automatically and if you can access BBC News 24 on channel 80 you need do nothing further; if however BBC News 24 is still on channel 40 then you will need to manually re-tune/re-scan your equipment to ensure it recognises the updated channel numbers.

Your instruction manual tells you how to do this, but if you have trouble you will need to call your manufacturer's helpline (see our link below). We've put together this basic information to help you:


Found Here

CHEERS

Nigel


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: shepherdlass
Date: 05 Feb 06 - 02:09 PM

First of all, Norman D - apologies for misquoting you. It's a long thread and I must have cut and pasted from the wrong place. Sorry.

Second - anyone want to take a bet that Davy Graham, Swarb et al will feature much more heavily in part 2 of the series? The first part seemed weighted towards folk song but they're surely going to have to deal more with instrumentalists before they get into folk-rock and so on. Hoping so, anyway.

Now I have to go and rewind the tape to try and find that shot of one R. Thompson behind a guitar shop counter.


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: GUEST
Date: 06 Feb 06 - 05:12 AM

Nice to see Anne Briggs being interviewed, and she seemed pretty cheerful and nothing like the haunted recluse I'd somehow been led to expect. And yes indeed, Shirley Collins was deadly accurate in her comments on MacColl


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Subject: RE: BBC 4 folk program
From: Pete_Standing
Date: 06 Feb 06 - 05:32 AM

Sian

I thought the programme was quite Anglo-centric. There was precious little serious coverage of the Scottish scene, Irish fared a little better, but as far as I recall, the Welsh were ignored. So really, the title with respect to the first programme is a bit misleading. I agree about the scant regard to the instrumental side of things and dance fared even worse, althought the snippet of step dancing was nice. The beginning was strange, I wondered if I might be watching a programme about the American revival. OK so the context was important, but the immediate relevance was a mite obscure and the time given to it was excessive given the ommissions.

All in all, a brave attempt, but the programme makers were attempting too much for just that one hour.


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