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BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved

wysiwyg 07 Jan 06 - 11:01 AM
Clinton Hammond 07 Jan 06 - 11:07 AM
Bill D 07 Jan 06 - 11:12 AM
wysiwyg 07 Jan 06 - 11:39 AM
Hardiman the Fiddler 07 Jan 06 - 01:59 PM
My guru always said 07 Jan 06 - 05:36 PM
michaelr 08 Jan 06 - 12:44 AM
Bat Goddess 08 Jan 06 - 09:32 AM
Jeri 08 Jan 06 - 10:51 AM
wysiwyg 08 Jan 06 - 10:52 AM
Skipjack K8 08 Jan 06 - 04:03 PM
GUEST 08 Jan 06 - 05:38 PM
wysiwyg 08 Jan 06 - 07:11 PM
GUEST 08 Jan 06 - 11:21 PM
wysiwyg 08 Jan 06 - 11:52 PM
Helen 09 Jan 06 - 12:17 AM
PoppaGator 09 Jan 06 - 12:45 AM
bet 09 Jan 06 - 06:38 PM
Bill D 09 Jan 06 - 10:07 PM
Helen 14 Jan 06 - 09:33 PM
GUEST,.gargoyle 14 Jan 06 - 10:09 PM
wysiwyg 08 Feb 07 - 10:50 AM
JudyB 09 Feb 07 - 06:53 PM
GUEST,JTT 09 Feb 07 - 07:02 PM
Metchosin 10 Feb 07 - 12:57 AM
wysiwyg 10 Feb 07 - 09:56 AM
Metchosin 10 Feb 07 - 12:17 PM
wysiwyg 10 Feb 07 - 12:32 PM
The Villan 10 Feb 07 - 12:40 PM
Metchosin 10 Feb 07 - 12:58 PM
Bill D 10 Feb 07 - 01:07 PM
Metchosin 10 Feb 07 - 01:30 PM
wysiwyg 10 Feb 07 - 01:32 PM
Metchosin 10 Feb 07 - 01:53 PM
The Fooles Troupe 10 Feb 07 - 06:19 PM
My guru always said 11 Feb 07 - 05:34 AM
JohnInKansas 11 Feb 07 - 08:09 AM
Bagpuss 11 Feb 07 - 02:17 PM
wysiwyg 11 Feb 07 - 03:26 PM
Jack Campin 11 Feb 07 - 05:42 PM
IWTATBM 12 Feb 07 - 02:44 PM
wysiwyg 12 Feb 07 - 03:05 PM
IWTATBM 12 Feb 07 - 03:24 PM
wysiwyg 12 Nov 07 - 10:35 AM
wysiwyg 29 Nov 07 - 09:28 AM
mg 30 Nov 07 - 12:20 AM
wysiwyg 30 Nov 07 - 12:12 PM
Donuel 30 Nov 07 - 12:23 PM
Uncle_DaveO 30 Nov 07 - 12:51 PM
dick greenhaus 30 Nov 07 - 05:57 PM
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Subject: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 11:01 AM

This is to people who live with (or care about) someone who seems to become someone else in the wintertime. I'm addressing this to you because once the SAD hits, the sufferer is not likely to be able to take the steps outlined below. But if you do what Hardi did for me yesterday, you may see your old springtime pal return early.

We now have an old chrome mic stand with a cheap 4' fluorescent fixture cable-tied to it, with a pair of full-spectrum bulbs. It's been a grim and hard pull these last few months. Today I am ALIVE. I'll ask Hardi to post the specs on what bulbs to get, later.

The light-stand is stashed so I have to walk around it to get to my recliner and wake-up cup of tea. Even the gloom and confusion of months didn't make me walk past the switch without hitting it. The light was irritating for about 10 minutes, and then I began to yawn and yawn as my body relaxed in the knowledge it was getting what it needed. I sat by this light for about an hour and then I got restless.

There's a bounce in my step for the first time I can recall in a long time. I'm creative, focused, and able to DO the things I know I need to do. And certain other, um.... "spously activities" seem suddenly interesting. :~) (Oh, yeah.... Yes! I remember THAT!)

We may go to a bank of 4 bulbs, or we may put a second 2-bulb unit upstairs in my spa-furnished dressing room-- or both.

I believe, since we had already the heavy-bottomed mic stand, we have spent less than 30 bucks.

Gratefully,

~Susan


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 11:07 AM

It's amazing what the power of positive thinking can do eh


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Bill D
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 11:12 AM

Indeed it is, Clinton.....but in this case there are sound bio-technical explanations for part of the phenomenon. Many of the 'lower' animals have clear responses to variations in light...but we 'advanced' humans can't easily migrate OR hibernate.

(Thanks, Susan)


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 11:39 AM

That's right, Bill. It's part of our circadian rhythm. It affects all light-sensing species I know of. Chickens (and other birds) depend on light of a certain number of hours in order to lay eggs. In fact our flock was put into an artificial winter laying season several years running, using a timer to control their lighting.

Hm-- CH!!! ;~)

~Susan


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Hardiman the Fiddler
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 01:59 PM

I've done a fair amount of research on this topic and have used full-spectrum lighting in my office for the last 5+ years. Daylight when passed through a prism reveals that it is made up of the variety of colors found in the rainbow. Full spectrum light emulates this quality of light. Typical incandescent lighting--the normal lightbulb spikes as yellow--with none of the other parts of the spectrum. That's why on a winter night if you stand outside the house the light looks yellow coming through the windows. Halogen, also popular also spikes in the yellow range.

It was suggested that I post the specs on the lighting. Not all bulbs that claim to be natural sunlight meet these specs. Specifically, the CRI needs to be above 90. The CRI is a measure of how the light compares to actual sunlight on a vibrantlly sunny day in the summer. The closer to 100, the better--and also the more expensive.

Another way of measuring light is in degrees Kelvin, which I do not fully understand, but full spectrum is considered to be 5000K.

The specs on the light that WYSIWYG is using are:
Philips T 12 40 Watts, with an output of 2200 lumens with a CRI (the package says of 92 and 5000K. Prices vary, but these were about $7 each at the local Home Depot.

Greg


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: My guru always said
Date: 07 Jan 06 - 05:36 PM

I've had what's called a 'daylight bulb' in my angle-poise lamp for years now as it used to help me with my embroidery before my eyesight got a bit too iffy. Don't know the tech stuff, but maybe it's been helping me without my knowledge?


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: michaelr
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 12:44 AM

Please say what SAD is the acronym for. It's driving me crazy!

Cheers,
Michael


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 09:32 AM

Seasonal Affective Disorder

I don't have the problem, but I know for a fact it's very very real.

Linn


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Jeri
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 10:51 AM

I worked for a commander/flight surgeon who studied circadian rhythm. Mostly, he was interested in sleep cycles since that was more pertinent to pilots, and full spectrum light was a possible way to keep night shift workers awake and alert.

Please note that UV light can damage your eyes, whether it's from the sun or from a bulb.

I wonder how SAD affects people who can't see: if it DOES affect them and whether light works for them. I wonder if the light has an effect other than the visual and we just notice the visual component because we CAN see.


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 10:52 AM

Seasonal
Affective
Disorder

~S~


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Skipjack K8
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 04:03 PM

I've got a massive dose right now. We did a 13 day flit to Oz for Christmas and New Year, and stayed in a sub tropical paradise. I've been back in dark, dank, cold, drizzly Britain for 6 days now, and the combination of very debilitating jet lag and what feels like SAD just makes me want to repack my bags and head for the airport.


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 05:38 PM

Remember its the pituitary and several other centers in the brain that need to be "tricked" into a new season.

Like forcing flowering you need to pay attention to the timing of the lights and not just the lights themselves.
Early morning lights around the time mid Spring sunrise would be highly advised.

The optic nerve is what triggers the other centers and not merely the skin so don't wear goggles - on the other hand - (if the ultraviolet is strong you never want to just stare at the lights).

The wavelenghths that help reset the bio clock are toward the ultra violet but the warm infra reds sure feel nice.

I use a little floor model verilux with a flexible arm very close to the face. Its not powerful but its true color sunshine right out of the box for about $60 to $90.


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 07:11 PM

Some bulbs (more properly called "lamps") are of a lower CRI AND emit no UV. The tradeoff is the loss of the FULL spectrum, but these BROAD spectrum lights are brighter, to compensate. Some experts think that's the better tradeoff, and that the brightness is more important the the blue color lost in most lighting that is not full-spectrum.

Some SAD lightboxes come with a UV-blocking diffuser. My glasses already have UV coating, so I'm going with what I have for now, but we are going to also get a pair of the type mentioned above and see what the difference actually is.

Some folks also say there are two types of SAD, which require different timing. One type needs early-morning light, and the other needs 3-7PM light. Some folks find a mix of the two works best for them; you have to see what's working and refine it for yourself.

This thread is not intended to replace one's own research and medical consulation. There are a lot of things to learn about all this. But-- if you live with a sufferer, try lighting them up for a day or two before asking them to read all the stuff available. :~) So they can comprehend it. :~)

~Susan


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: GUEST
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 11:21 PM

just a couple light bulbs, huh? yer a cheap date...


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 08 Jan 06 - 11:52 PM

:~) Ah, cheap supplies,. yes.... but the LABOR! :~)

~S~


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Helen
Date: 09 Jan 06 - 12:17 AM

I don't know if this is relevant but I was reading about Vitamin D deficiency recently and the effect of sunlight on the skin can help the body to manufacture Vit D. So, if you were Vit D deficient and sat in the sun for a while it would have a positive effect without you having to actually see the sunlight if you were visually impaired.

Helen


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: PoppaGator
Date: 09 Jan 06 - 12:45 AM

Longer days with more sunlight are definitely something I need in order to maintain optimum mental health.

If you are a victim of SAD, consider doing for yourself what I did thirty-odd years ago: MOVE TO NEW ORLEANS!

Sure, the summer can be long and hot, sometimes even unbearable, but spring and fall (however brief) are absolutely delightful, and our subtropical winter features long days, usually sunny and mild.

Property will never be cheaper than it is right now; I know for a fact that lots right in my own neighborhood are now, or will soon be, available for a song. Rebuilding one of the world's great centers of commerce and culture will be quite an adventure. You'll learn things you never before imagined about how the human soul expresses itself in music, and the food's not bad either.


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: bet
Date: 09 Jan 06 - 06:38 PM

Glad to read the discussion on SAD. When I moved to Alaska I wondered how the dark winters would effect me. Thank goodness I don't seen to be affected. I am told that if you go to the doc because you're feeling down or just not right they put you under the light first thing. We gained 13 minutes of day light today! We now have just over 4 hour of light, the long days are coming!!! bet


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Jan 06 - 10:07 PM

gee, PoppaGator...last time I was in New Orleans, I waded out...and lost all my comic books. I see they haven't 'quite' solved the problem yet.....call me when they've spent that 40 billion on the RIGHT levee system. (And for those who are brave and staying, I sincerely hope the next few storm seasons are gentle.)


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Helen
Date: 14 Jan 06 - 09:33 PM

Saturday, January 14, 2006. 9:33pm (AEDT)
SAD Londoners offered enlightening cure
Sun-deprived Londoners are flocking to a new cafe offering free light

By Kerri Ritchie in London

It seems that people in Britain are finally seeing the light.

Doctors there are recognising that people feel miserable at this time of year because of the shortage of sunlight.

It is estimated around five million people are suffering from some form of Seasonal Affective Disorder (SAD) during winter.

The recognised mental condition can cause a range of symptoms from lethargy to severe depression.

It is caused by a biochemical imbalance in the area of the brain which controls mood, appetite and sleep; 80 per cent of cases can be treated by exposure to bright light.

Now a new cafe in London claims to offer a cure for the wintertime blues.

At London's Science Museum the cafe has just opened where, along with their latte, customers receive a free, 20-minute light treatment.

Specially designed boxes on the wall make the room about half as bright as Bondi Beach on a summer's day.

"I definitely feel better, a lot more on the ball, a lot more with it," said one visitor after a session.

Many of those battling SAD say light therapy has transformed their lives.

"The light deals with the whole syndrome, the slow-downness," said SAD Association founder, Jennifer Eastwood.

Doctors are divided as to whether SAD is an actual condition or just a severe form of winter blues.

But for Australians in London, more used to sunshine and swimwear in January, the light lounge is a much cheaper option than a flight home.

"In Australia, even in winter people have a smile on their face, it's just really bad," said one Australian tourist.

Seasonal Affective Disorder is at its peak in February; not surprisingly, the cafe is already booked out.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200601/s1547656.htm


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: GUEST,.gargoyle
Date: 14 Jan 06 - 10:09 PM

Not until the recent ten years have I acknoweldged SAD.

Yes....it it real....tried "light theropy" and it was useless.

Saint John's Wort, capsules 900mg for a total 1,800 mg twice a day helps. Teaspoon of herbal SJW bloosum tea twice at day is a good starter and ender.

For myself, the period is from Halloween to Valentine's Day. When the joy-juices begin flowing after the equinox....I could put a Satyr to shame....before.....just let me sleep....and sleep....and sleep.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 08 Feb 07 - 10:50 AM

A refinement this year is the re-arrangement of the living room furniture. I had to use the electric light approach for several days before I thought of it.... But one day, sitting in front of that in my recliner, I was looking at the pretty sun pattern on the wall across from me. And I remembered years ago, when we first moved into this house, the time when I first started playing my autoharp.

Those days, the furniture was arranged in a different way. I had my autoharp stand, then, in the very spot where I was now seeing the sun moving across the wall and the furniture in front of it. Now, I understood why I had so loved playing every morning! I didn't realize it then, but that had been the only spot in the house to catch full sun for an hour every morning. And yes.... it had been winter time when I took up the habit. For me, soaking up the full, rich autoharp sound I get by playing it tabletop, tilted up to me, came along with soaking up badly-needed sunlight. These two memories are tied together in my brain's synapses.

Needless to say I have now gotten the furniture moved so that I can once again sit in that spot. It has organized my whole day-- the sun splash there is brief, and I have to be there on time. I make sure to dish up the oatmeal from the crockpot, change into my un-tinted glasses, and get comfy to start the day listening to old radio shows the computer is kind enough to play for me. Faulkner curls up next to me in his own sunpool, on the floor. Even on a cloudy day, it is bright enough for that hour to get a good handle on starting the day. I consider it preventive maintenance.

This week's sitting time has gone to crocheting myself a colorful, warm neck scarf.

I've moved the electric faux sunligh onto the computer stand, beside the monitor and closer to my face, and I have changed my computer hour to later in the day, around sunset. This adds another hour or so of full-spectrum light to my day, at the very time of day I would more commonly get the dark-too-early heebie-jeebies.

Oddly enough, the hours between these two daily appointments I make with myself are going better than they were before! :~)

Thanks are due to Hardi for the electrics, the help moving furniture, and the willingness to have a winter room arrangement that looks like the sitting room at a run-down old-folks home.

~Susan


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: JudyB
Date: 09 Feb 07 - 06:53 PM

Thanks for refreshing and updating this thread, Susan! I've had a bug I just couldn't shake, and hadn't thought about the fact that lack of sunlight may be a factor. It's been very cold so I dash to the car fully bundled; the sun's the wrong angle to come into the house in early morning or the car on the drive to work; my little office has no windows; and it's dark when I get out of work.

I spent today at home in the sunny room, and feel better than I have all week. I was planning to stay home today if I wasn't feeling better - but if I hadn't read your thread, I'd probably have slept most of the day - and I think the hours I spent on the window seat reading and playing guitar may do more to help in the long run.

It's supposed to be at least partly sunny the next couple of days - we'll see what happens by Monday.

Thanks again,
JudyB


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: GUEST,JTT
Date: 09 Feb 07 - 07:02 PM

It's not just light, though, it's also night work that wrecks your circadian rhythms.

All kinds of jobs that require night work - folk singer, journalist, firefighter, pilot, doctor, actor - have low life expectancies. Working at times we're not designed to work makes us pee and eat and sleep at times our body isn't designed for, and wrecks the bod.


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Metchosin
Date: 10 Feb 07 - 12:57 AM

While I believe that light therapy is beneficial, I'm also an advocate of good old vitamin D, in conjuction with it. According to the Mayo Clinic the following, so I am heartened to see I'm not entirely out to lunch:

"Seasonal affective disorder (SAD) is a form of depression that occurs during the winter months, possibly due to reduced exposure to sunlight. This condition is often treated with photo (light) therapy. In one study, a dose of 100,000 IU of vitamin D was found to be superior to light therapy in the treatment of SAD after one month. Further studies are necessary to confirm these findings."


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 10 Feb 07 - 09:56 AM

Good for you, Judy!

I'm finding that now that I've remeditaed the accumulating lack of sun of the last few weeks, when the electrics were just not bright enough, about a half hour is plenty to spark off quite the zippy day.

I also discovered that some insurance may pay for a therapeutic light box as durable medical equipment. The diagnostic manual that supplies the correct code number for SAD is hard to find, but it can be done. If the policy specifies durable medical equipment, some further checking may turn up the detail that a prescribed lightbox can be included on physician statement of medical necessity.

In everything I have read, phototherapy is still the first recommended line of treatment, with anti-depressants way down on the list of things to try.

Mets, some of us would need the sunlight even to get the idea we need to see the doc for him/her to tell us about the study. Sure, both have their place. But if D in those doses is artificial sunlight, why would one not try to go the natural method first? I get free sun. That much D-- I'd have to give up one of the pets we feed.

Now I understand the wording of this phrase: bright idea.

~Susan


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Metchosin
Date: 10 Feb 07 - 12:17 PM

Just remember WYSIWYG, that window glass only permits about 5% of the UV in sunlight through and it is UV light that triggers the natural production of Vitamin D through the skin. Sitting in a window, if you are seeking all the benefits of natural sunlight, will do bugger all to increase levels of Vitamin D.

Another reason why, in earlier times, people of the very nothern extremes of our world, survived and thrived eating only fish and blubber during the long dark winter months, without falling into suicidal depressions.


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 10 Feb 07 - 12:32 PM

Yes, adding D if the sunlight is not from being outside would make sense. But the AM sun does makes me go outside.

~Susan


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: The Villan
Date: 10 Feb 07 - 12:40 PM

Is this the same sort of light used for people with impaired vision. They need special lighting to help them see better when reading or doing close work.


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Metchosin
Date: 10 Feb 07 - 12:58 PM

WYSIWYG re excercise outdoors:

to quote one expert on northern living............"Good idea....".


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Bill D
Date: 10 Feb 07 - 01:07 PM

Interesting timing.....Just this morning I put a 60 watt full-spectrum bulb above the computer desk. My wife (Ferrara) got 2 of them when she got a fancy desk model for her writing desk. She had borrowed one last year and thought it helped.
(I am notoriously hard to convince, and usually don't 'feel' the differences when taking vitamins and using light therapy, etc....but there are many studies showing why it should make a difference, so I will pop my pills and turn on the light.....*smile*...we shall see.)


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Metchosin
Date: 10 Feb 07 - 01:30 PM

It should also be noted that with the increase in the use of sunscreens, which effectuvely block UVB, hence, the natural production of vitamin D, our bodies require even more vitamin D from other sources, than we did in the past.


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 10 Feb 07 - 01:32 PM

[shaking head]

Bill, Bill, BILL! Hang the bulb over the LATHE! Wherever you put it, there you shall find yourself spending more and more time.

But it's not like misteltoe. Or maybe it is.......

~Susan


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Metchosin
Date: 10 Feb 07 - 01:53 PM

Villan, I have read that people with impaired vision or previous damage to their eyes, should be particularly wary of blue spectrum light. Perhaps the lights to which you refer, would not be full spectrum.


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 10 Feb 07 - 06:19 PM

If I only had seal to eat, I'd blubber too!


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: My guru always said
Date: 11 Feb 07 - 05:34 AM

Thanks for bringing this thread back into the light Susan, it's clearly a help to us all!


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 11 Feb 07 - 08:09 AM

Now if there's more understanding of the other syndrome known as "yuppie flu" would someone also explain that one as well?

John


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Bagpuss
Date: 11 Feb 07 - 02:17 PM

Just to note that the lights used for SAD are not just ordinary full spectrum bulbs - which are not bright enough to help for SAD. They need to be high intensity lights in order to mimic the effects of natural daylight. I have had one for a few years and they really help. I also have a dawn simulation alarm clock which was also really helpful until I had kids who wake me up at an hour I would never consider setting my alarm for...


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 11 Feb 07 - 03:26 PM

Just to note that the lights used for SAD are not just ordinary full spectrum bulbs - which are not bright enough to help for SAD. They need to be high intensity lights in order to mimic the effects of natural daylight.

Yesssss.......... But it's the total light that affects SAD, not the intensity specifically, and it also depends on how much sun you're already getting. If I lived in a cave I might need espcially high brightness. But if you need only a certain amount to supplement the natural light that is almost enough-- full-spectrum bulbs of reasonable brightness can and do work. Not as FAST as a very-bright SAD lightbox, but if you can add them in such a way that you can have their use for several hours a day, the total light you get works out just fine.

Yes, when one gets a SAD lightbox, it is real, real bright. But it is not the only approach, just the quickest.

Think of it like this. I'm short on vitamin C-- I can take it in pill form and make it real convenient, or I can eat enough fruits and vegetables.

The natural approach can certainly be a workable option, if not a downright preference. It would not be the option of choice to reverse an emergency, but it can be a way of preventing one.

~Susan


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Jack Campin
Date: 11 Feb 07 - 05:42 PM

I made a lightbox for my gf, who has SAD to some extent; it used five compact fluorescent tubes in a housing lined with reflective foil. She later found a commercial product was easier to use - about the size of an iron, with a few dozen white LEDs. She could sit that beside her on the pillow, where my light box wouldn't safely fit.

This got me thinking about maybe a better way. Opaque spectacles to act as diffusers with a few battery-powered white LEDs attached to the front of each - less power but much closer to the eyes, so by the inverse square law the same effect. This would be far lighter and use less energy.


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: IWTATBM
Date: 12 Feb 07 - 02:44 PM

Can anyone supply a direct link to a website selling the bulbs Hardiman was referring to i.e. Philips T 12 40 Watts, with an output of 2200 lumens with a CRI (the package says of 92 and 5000K)?.

Or an equivalent bulb will do. Preferably a UK link but I'll take a look at anywhere to get an idea!

Thanks v. much


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 12 Feb 07 - 03:05 PM

If you print the specs and take them to a lighting supplier, they should be able to get what you need. Some years we've gotten them cheap and easy; other years it's been harder to find (and pay for) them. But check with your local suppliers and you should find they can get them for you.

~Susan


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: IWTATBM
Date: 12 Feb 07 - 03:24 PM

Thanks - will do.


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 12 Nov 07 - 10:35 AM

Just a reminder to those of you who need to supplement natural light-- it's that time again, so get your gear out and make sure it's ready for your blah-days, before they get you. If your computer screen and TV are looking WAY too attractive these days, you too may be seeking the blue light-- which indoor lighting usually doesn't include-- which newer research says is useful in smaller doeses than orignally thought.

For us it's gotten simpler-- at the start of hockey season it's easy to remember that it's time to rearrange the living room furniture, with the recliners closer to the heaters and TV screen and farther from the big, drafty window. That room arrangement also puts a comfy chair right in line with the fall/winter blazing AM sun, and last year's black recliner has been replaced by a velour, salmon-toned wing chair. When the light hits it, it's so pretty that it calls to me, and I have a magazine supply handy to keep me in that chair for the right amount of time. Across from that chair is the full-spectrum fluoro tower, for gray days.

Next to the puder is a desk lamp with full-spectrum bulbs, aimed at my face. There's about 600 watts of kitchen light reflecting off the white enamel island. The whole downstairs is BRIGHT.

Out in our picking/play/classroom that is seldom used in the colder months, this week we'll move our treadmill and Hardi's bike trainer (facing the west window), with another full-spectrum fluoro tower standing in that window sill. It will get enough heat to keep the parts from freezing, and be nice and cool for hard exercise.

I've also found a caffeine approach that works for me-- smooth-roast coffee iced in very small quantities into milk, so it's all-day sips adding up to one cup equivalent total spaced out over the whole day.

A home-designed spa down the hall from our bedroom is already loaded with soothing winter goodies and the thick, fluffy bathrobe. (I also replaced the white shower-curtain liner with a clear one, because the upstairs tub is not lit well.) Exercise that makes me happily tired and relaxed, plus a tiny dose of sleep-help at bedtime, completes the picture.

That's my plan. At least, those are the parts that are "mentionable." :~)

~Susan


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 29 Nov 07 - 09:28 AM

Hey, from a local surplus-everything store I got a pair of aluminum clamp-lamps with porcelain sockets-- they were rated for 250 watt heat bulbs. The domed and aimable thingies.

Well, I put a fluorescent near-full-spectrum bulb in each and stuck 'em on the treadmill aimed at a user's face, and they're on an outlet strip that also runs the treadmill. One-click health! Wow, I wish I'd known about this option years ago! I guess the bulbs are just now becoming affordable, but wow!

~S~


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: mg
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 12:20 AM

It sounds good but can you get outside for part of the day? I know it can be cold there but bundled up and outdoors is the best not just for the light but Vitamin D etc. mg


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: wysiwyg
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 12:12 PM

Yes, I do get out every day, but this part of the country is light-lacking. Anyway it's not a help-me thread but a resource for others with SAD.

~S~


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Donuel
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 12:23 PM

Hey thats cheating. Why should you be fully alive while the rest of us are in semi hibernation mode?


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 12:51 PM

Poppagator, in praise of N.O., said:

Property will never be cheaper than it is right now; I know for a fact that lots right in my own neighborhood are now, or will soon be, available for a song.

In what key?

Dave Oesterreich


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Subject: RE: BS: SAD/Winter Blues/Sun Shortage: Solved
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 30 Nov 07 - 05:57 PM

Well, with sufficient intensity of full-spectrum light, you can always grow toatoes. Or recreational weeds.


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