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Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor

GUEST 18 Oct 05 - 11:48 AM
Bee-dubya-ell 18 Oct 05 - 12:05 PM
greg stephens 18 Oct 05 - 01:10 PM
Bee-dubya-ell 18 Oct 05 - 02:27 PM
GUEST,wld 19 Oct 05 - 12:31 PM
Dave Hanson 20 Oct 05 - 04:54 AM
GUEST 20 Oct 05 - 10:49 AM
mooman 20 Oct 05 - 11:31 AM
GUEST 20 Oct 05 - 03:21 PM
McGrath of Harlow 20 Oct 05 - 03:42 PM
erinmaidin 20 Oct 05 - 04:29 PM
erinmaidin 20 Oct 05 - 04:31 PM
GUEST,wld 20 Oct 05 - 08:02 PM
GUEST,wld 21 Oct 05 - 08:34 AM
greg stephens 21 Oct 05 - 11:29 AM
GUEST,wld 21 Oct 05 - 08:18 PM
GUEST,wld 21 Oct 05 - 08:24 PM
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Subject: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chord
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Oct 05 - 11:48 AM

Chord Req: How can I play irish music with 9th chords?for example D9, or G9?


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 18 Oct 05 - 12:05 PM

The only way to use 9th chords in Irish sessions is while wearing a good crash-helmet. It will protect your cranium when the other session players start hitting you over the head with their instruments.

But seriously... It generally won't work unless the melody instruments stretch out a bit and get away from the traditional melody of the tune. A band I used to play with did "Paddy on the Turnpike" (the modal G version), with the fiddler starting out very straight and traditional but taking more liberties with the melody each time around. By the fourth repetition I was able to substitute 9th chords to good effect because we had essentially changed it from a trad tune to a swing tune.

It worked, but it depended on the entire band going in the same direction. Just subbing 9th chords out of the blue is dangerous territory.


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th
From: greg stephens
Date: 18 Oct 05 - 01:10 PM

Many hornpipes come out of a 19th century style of music in which the ninth chord is perfectly in keeping.For example, the last two bars of the most commonly played version of the Liverpool Hornpipe goes:
/DF#AF# BGEC#/D.D.D../.
Now, the first of those two bars is basically half a bar of D and half a bar of A9, just arpeggios on the chords. So why not play an A9 chord if you are the guitarist, fine and dandy. If you try with the average reel or jig though, you will rightly be thrown out of the pub. You will sound like one of those school music teachers who writes musicals on biblical subjects, and rather daringly "jazzes it up" a bit. You have to be rather careful about that sort of thing.
    If you are Ian Carr, by the way, you can use ninths whenever you like. Or major sevenths.. Ordinary rules do not apply in that case.


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 18 Oct 05 - 02:27 PM

By the way, in that version of "Paddy on the Turnpike" I was talking about, I didn't go straight from plain vanilla major chords to 9th chords. I first changed to major barre chords to establish a jazzier back-beat-heavy rhythm and then brought in the 9th chords.


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: GUEST,wld
Date: 19 Oct 05 - 12:31 PM

how about

mush a ringum doo wop! doo wop!

there is always room for innovation. the Irish will have to adapt. tell them its part of the peace process.


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 20 Oct 05 - 04:54 AM

Guest, why do you specifically want to play ninth chords ?

eric


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Oct 05 - 10:49 AM

eric, I would like to use this kind of chords,if is possible,to add other music styles(funky) in irish music


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: mooman
Date: 20 Oct 05 - 11:31 AM

Not a problem! I like to add a touch of jazz to selected Irish tunes (but not all or even the majority).

Peace

moo

P.S. Anyone for a minor11 ?


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: GUEST
Date: 20 Oct 05 - 03:21 PM

bit young for me


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 20 Oct 05 - 03:42 PM

I rather hope that this GUEST is on the other side of the Atlantic...

There's room for change and innovation, alterations in rhythms and melody lines and instrumentation and all. But too many chords for the sake of strange chords just aren't the way I'd like to see Irish music go. (I don't think it did Jazz much good either...)


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: erinmaidin
Date: 20 Oct 05 - 04:29 PM

As a "backer" and a "player" I would like to go out on a limb here and say.....backing is just that...shouldn't stand out..should "empathize". Flashy chords are just that...a lot of flash


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: erinmaidin
Date: 20 Oct 05 - 04:31 PM

ah...and lest someone should want to jump on (probably,again, not good terminology) the use of the word "player" ...it was meant entirely in the musical sense


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: GUEST,wld
Date: 20 Oct 05 - 08:02 PM

well thats the idea with many forms of rhthym guitar but in the csae of Irish music - there are entire DVDs devoted to how to make your guitar stand out ans sound more celtic - quite a bit of flash involved in the more competitive Irish sessions - woe betide the schmuck who expects to get taken seriously in standard tuning!


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: GUEST,wld
Date: 21 Oct 05 - 08:34 AM

i was just watching Eric Roche's dvd this morning(again). A pity that Eric won't be adding flash to Irish sessions any more - although his influence will be felt for centuries I'm sure.

I bet Eric played 9th chords in sessions, and god knows what else and it was nothing but an adornment.


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th
From: greg stephens
Date: 21 Oct 05 - 11:29 AM

What would be the difference between a guitar sounding "celtic" and a guitar sounding...whatever the opposite is? Anglo-Saxon? Latin? What sort of stylistic elements are we talking about here?


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: GUEST,wld
Date: 21 Oct 05 - 08:18 PM

I'm sorry Greg, I'm not really a great musical scholar - its phenomena you can see, in the best Irish music pubs. hard to describe for a schmuck like me. I've not had a formal music training, and I'm English, and its not a style I have insight into from playing myself - a treble disadvantage.

the best celtic style guitarists I have seen, play in DADGAD. the chord changes are fast and complex - sometimes shadowing, sometimes anticipating the 6/8 of the bodhran. the plectrum sometimes sort of swoops and cops into vigorous rhythms, other times it plays the grace note riffs.

Not i might add in an ordered way like Lester Flatt or Mike Seeger, its more like a vigorous attempt to rip into the tune.

does that make sense. I suspect not. Start a thread about it and some Irish people will explain it better than I could!


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Subject: RE: Chord Req: How can I play irish music wth 9th chor
From: GUEST,wld
Date: 21 Oct 05 - 08:24 PM

that should be swoops and chops


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