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BS: Why Female conservatives?

GUEST,rarelamb 10 Oct 05 - 10:41 AM
Ebbie 10 Oct 05 - 10:54 AM
GUEST,rarelamb 10 Oct 05 - 10:58 AM
Bunnahabhain 10 Oct 05 - 11:16 AM
GUEST,Janine 10 Oct 05 - 11:18 AM
sian, west wales 10 Oct 05 - 11:24 AM
beardedbruce 10 Oct 05 - 11:39 AM
GUEST,rarelamb 10 Oct 05 - 11:44 AM
pdq 10 Oct 05 - 12:05 PM
Wolfgang 10 Oct 05 - 12:24 PM
Ebbie 10 Oct 05 - 12:30 PM
CarolC 10 Oct 05 - 12:36 PM
CarolC 10 Oct 05 - 12:44 PM
Amos 10 Oct 05 - 12:45 PM
pdq 10 Oct 05 - 01:04 PM
GUEST,rarelamb 10 Oct 05 - 01:04 PM
CarolC 10 Oct 05 - 01:18 PM
Ebbie 10 Oct 05 - 01:32 PM
Auggie 10 Oct 05 - 01:36 PM
Don Firth 10 Oct 05 - 01:40 PM
McGrath of Harlow 10 Oct 05 - 01:57 PM
pdq 10 Oct 05 - 02:14 PM
GUEST 10 Oct 05 - 02:27 PM
GUEST,rarelamb 10 Oct 05 - 02:35 PM
Judge Mental 10 Oct 05 - 02:40 PM
GUEST,rarelamb 10 Oct 05 - 02:43 PM
curmudgeon 10 Oct 05 - 02:47 PM
Ebbie 10 Oct 05 - 02:50 PM
GUEST,rarelamb 10 Oct 05 - 02:56 PM
CarolC 10 Oct 05 - 03:19 PM
Peace 10 Oct 05 - 03:20 PM
beardedbruce 10 Oct 05 - 03:28 PM
Peace 10 Oct 05 - 03:34 PM
pdq 10 Oct 05 - 03:43 PM
Peace 10 Oct 05 - 03:46 PM
CarolC 10 Oct 05 - 04:01 PM
Judge Mental 10 Oct 05 - 04:02 PM
Ebbie 10 Oct 05 - 04:13 PM
pdq 10 Oct 05 - 04:26 PM
Peace 10 Oct 05 - 04:37 PM
M.Ted 10 Oct 05 - 04:57 PM
pdq 10 Oct 05 - 05:24 PM
Peace 10 Oct 05 - 05:33 PM
Ebbie 10 Oct 05 - 05:47 PM
Greg F. 10 Oct 05 - 05:55 PM
Don Firth 10 Oct 05 - 06:16 PM
M.Ted 11 Oct 05 - 11:46 PM
GUEST,rarelamb 12 Oct 05 - 03:00 PM
Little Hawk 12 Oct 05 - 03:19 PM
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Subject: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: GUEST,rarelamb
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 10:41 AM

First Female Prime Minister in Britain - Conservative
First Female Chancellor in Germany - Conservative
First Female US Supreme Court Justice - Conservative
First Female President in US - Conservative?

It kinda makes one wonder.....


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Ebbie
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 10:54 AM

Just at a guess, I'd say it has something to do with 'big money'.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: GUEST,rarelamb
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 10:58 AM

LMAO!


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Bunnahabhain
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 11:16 AM

You might as well ask " Why conservatives". Why single out women on this issue?


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: GUEST,Janine
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 11:18 AM

In the UK most females vote conservative too - not me however!

Also best English monarch - female. Not conservative tho - Tudor.

Janine


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: sian, west wales
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 11:24 AM

Hmm. First Canadian Female Prime Minster: Conservative.

Not my fault, though.

She may also have been party leader when they had their biggest ever loss of seats (tho' I'm no historian). Didn't the Canadian Tories go from having a majority to 2 seats in Parliament under her?

Siân


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: beardedbruce
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 11:39 AM

Because women are more intelligent?


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: GUEST,rarelamb
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 11:44 AM

I was thinking more along the lines that conservatives are philosophically more apt to produce capable female candidates. When you prefer equality of opportunity over equality of outcome, I think you get better and more qualified people.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: pdq
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 12:05 PM

Although not a classic conservative, everyone should know who this Republican was:



Jeannette Rankin

One of the most famous names in congressional history is that of Jeannette Rankin. The Montana Republican carries the distinction of being the first woman elected to the U.S. Congress.  That singular event occurred in 1916.  A year later, she earned a second distinction by joining forty-nine of her House colleagues in voting against U.S. entry into World War I.  That vote destroyed her prospects for reelection in 1918.  

Over the next twenty years, Rankin tirelessly campaigned for world peace.  In 1940, riding a tide of isolationism, she won her second term in the House.  The December 1941 Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor put an end to isolationism, but Rankin remained true to her anti-war beliefs, becoming the only member of Congress to vote against declaring war with Japan.

What is less well known about Jeannette Rankin is that she is the first woman to organize a major campaign for a seat in the U.S. Senate.  After her 1917 vote opposing World War I, she knew she stood no chance of winning a seat in a congressional district that the state legislature had recently reshaped with a Democratic majority.  Instead, she placed her hopes for continuing her congressional career on being able to run state-wide as a candidate for the Senate.  Narrowly defeated in the Republican primary, she launched a third-party campaign for the general election.

Although unsuccessful in her 1918 Senate race, Rankin helped destroy negative public attitudes about women as members of Congress.  During her second House term in 1941, she served with six other women members, including Maine's Margaret Chase Smith.  Those members carefully avoided making an issue of their gender.  Rankin agreed with a colleague's famous comment, "I'm no lady.  I'm a member of Congress."


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Wolfgang
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 12:24 PM

It is a good question. My response:

Because the liberal (in the American sense of the word) opposition does not use the 'only a woman' argument that the conservative opposition would use in the other case.

That's what makes it a tiny bit easier for a conservative woman to be a first. She would not have to fight against additional stupid arguments.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Ebbie
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 12:30 PM

"Because women are more intelligent? " beardedbruce That, too. *G*

But truly I think it IS because of big money interests. It takes a lot of money to make one's way up the ladder - man or woman - so if you have the backing and financial support of wealthy politicians you will most definitely have an opportunity to go farther.

And we all know where most of the money is.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: CarolC
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 12:36 PM

Back in Rankin's day, wasn't the Republican party the liberal one and the Democrat party the more conservative one? The Republican party was, after all, the one that went to war to take power away from the states.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: CarolC
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 12:44 PM

And even now, we see that the Republican party really isn't such a "conservative" party after all...

BS: Republicans now 'Big Government' party?


So if the Republicans do succeed in getting the first female US president elected, the chances are pretty slim that she will be a "conservative". She'll probably be just another "big government" Republican.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Amos
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 12:45 PM

I think they would have argued it was to preserve the Union, not to disempower the States, Carol. Granted, they are linked.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: pdq
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 01:04 PM

Ending slavery, ending child labor and giving women the right to vote were all simply "the right thing to do". The Republican Party led the way on all of these issues and won. Calling that 'liberal' is a self-serving game that modern liberals can play when they have run out of good ideas. Again, what was 'right' 100 years ago, in most cases, is still right today.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: GUEST,rarelamb
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 01:04 PM

Ha Carol!!!! YOU, are a hoot. You're spouse had better be one sharp cookie!

Ok, kidding aside, yes I suspect that they would be big government republicans. Since Nixon, Reagan was the only one to try to shrink government, and he failed.

But of course liberal and conservative are relative things. I don't vote libertarian because I think I would be throwing away my vote. I also don't pay attention to all the local races. I don't need to. I vote strait republican because I know that broadly speaking, the republicans are 'more conservative' or 'less liberal' than the democrats.

Think of the beach example. If you want to sell ice cream on a beach and you have one other competitor, where do you sell? To the left middle or right? Now let's say your competitor sells in the middle, where do you sell now? The answer of course is in the middle either way.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: CarolC
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 01:18 PM

Ending slavery, ending child labor and giving women the right to vote were all simply "the right thing to do". \

Yes indeed, they were! But if a politician today were to campaign on such a platform, YOU would call him/her a "liberal"!


Thanks, rarelamb. He is indeed a sharp cookie. That's one of the reasons I married him.

;-)

(P.S... I don't vote along any party lines. I only vote according to the dictates of my conscience.)


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Ebbie
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 01:32 PM

"But if a politician today were to campaign on such a platform, YOU would call him/her a "liberal"! Carol C.

That's an astute observation, Carol.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Auggie
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 01:36 PM

"First Female President in US - Conservative?"

Hillary as a conservative?


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Don Firth
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 01:40 PM

Wolfgang, Carol, Amos, Ebbie . . . .

Yeah, I'd say this thread is in good hands, so I'll move on.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 01:57 PM

I would think that most politicians would at least claim that the policies they support are "the right thing to do". Which makes it strange that the term "do gooder" is an insult.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: pdq
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 02:14 PM

Nope, Carol C. I dislike the use labels to describe people. I would say that the Republicans had things 'right' 100 years ago and, in most cases, have things right today.

If we are going to move past the 'name-calling' stage, whether on Mudcat or on the national political stage, we must get back to issues and phase-out most of the labels. Please note that Jeannette Rankin was 'right' on some issues, but as for her pro-prohabition stance, she made a big mistake. As to her anti-war position, she was consistent. She was the only member of Congress to vote against out entry into WW II.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 02:27 PM

I love the American idea that people who want to liberalise things are conservatives.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: GUEST,rarelamb
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 02:35 PM

It's easy when you look at it from this perspective.

Government is not the solution to our problems it is the problem. (my variation to a speech by Ronald Reagon)

Government is not reason it is not eloquence it is force. (George Washington)


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Judge Mental
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 02:40 PM

So far the only woman to be on the presidential/vice-presidential ticket for a major American party has been Geraldine Ferraro, a liberal Democrat.

I believe the only state with two women in the U.S. Senate is California. Both Senators, Feinstein and Boxer, are liberal democrats.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: GUEST,rarelamb
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 02:43 PM

Like I said, republicans are for winners :)

Also, Maine has 2 female republicans.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: curmudgeon
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 02:47 PM

Susan Collins and Olympia Snow of Maine are liberal/moderate Republicans.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Ebbie
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 02:50 PM

"As to her anti-war position, she was consistent. She was the only member of Congress to vote against out entry into WW II." pdq

Oh- so conservtives are anti-war?


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: GUEST,rarelamb
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 02:56 PM

"Susan Collins and Olympia Snow of Maine are liberal/moderate Republicans."

I know :(


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: CarolC
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 03:19 PM

If we are going to move past the 'name-calling' stage, whether on Mudcat or on the national political stage, we must get back to issues and phase-out most of the labels.

Oh, really? Is that what you were doing? Well, in that case I agree. So I expect you will begin phasing out your use of such labels right away.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Peace
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 03:20 PM

Why Female conservatives?

Because women aren't any smarter than men.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: beardedbruce
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 03:28 PM

Peace,

Are you SURE you want to base an argument on

"Because women aren't any smarter than men" ?


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Peace
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 03:34 PM

You bet! Men conservatives, women conservatives. Ya gotta be daft or rich to vote that way. Seems like a logical explanation to me. Hell, vote for a party that wants to keep poor people poor, make the middle class disappear? Sounds like stupidity to me, and stupidity is not the prerogative of a sex/gender. It's a human thing, and both males and females are human. Howzat, bb?


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: pdq
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 03:43 PM

Dear Peace (in our time),

I suggest you run.

Ebbie, SRS and CarolC are all on their way to Hinton, Alberta.

When they converge on you, expect to have you eyes gouged out and be castrated. Worse, you will be annoyed by endless accordion playing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Peace
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 03:46 PM

I love those gals. Life can have its hidden joyous surprises.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: CarolC
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 04:01 PM

Ebbie, SRS and CarolC are all on their way to Hinton, Alberta.

When they converge on you, expect to have you eyes gouged out and be castrated. Worse, you will be annoyed by endless accordion playing.


Not me. I don't disagree with what he said.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Judge Mental
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 04:02 PM

I stand corrected about California being the only state with two women in the U.S. Senate.

Of course, California is the only state with a population bigger than Canada with two women in the U.S. Senate.

Probably the best known U.S. Senator is Hillary Rodham Clinton, another female liberal Democrat.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Ebbie
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 04:13 PM

Good lord. If you don't understand that we agree with what Peace said, pdq, you don't understand us at all. Got problems with the women in your life, mate?


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: pdq
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 04:26 PM

Outstanding, Ebbie. Since you admit that you are no smarter (and for that matter, no more knowledgeable) than anyone else, we will all take your opinions as they should be taken: ordinary opinions from an ordinary person.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Peace
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 04:37 PM

Gotta disagree with you there, pdq. Ebbie is an extraordinary person with well-considered opinions.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: M.Ted
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 04:57 PM

For a conservative republican, rarelamb, you're not much of a business person--by the time you get your ice cream out into the middle of the beach, it will have melted--and all that will be left is a sticky, dirty, mess--oh, never mind-


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: pdq
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 05:24 PM

Sorry, Peace (with dignity), but I must disagree with you again. We are ALL ordinary people and we ALL have ordinary opinions, at least most of the time. We may have an occasional extra-ordinary flashes or have extra-ordinay knowledge in one small area. But overall, in most ways, we are plain, average and ordinary. Nothing to be ashamed of, either.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Peace
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 05:33 PM

I agree with THAT, pdq. Simply put, I have great respect for many folks here regardless of their sex/gender. The three gals menntioned above are amongst those I admire for their intelligence. Any one of 'em is lots smarter than I'm ever gonna be.

I disagree that all opinions are created equal. I suppose that's why we actually have discussions on this site--discussions that deal with the substance and not the person. In fact, when any of those ladies addresses a serious political issue, I read closely and pay attention. I don't necessarily always agree, but I listen and learn. I love intelligence, wit, tenacity and so many more of the qualities that these gals exemplify. That is also one of the things I like about you.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Ebbie
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 05:47 PM

pdq, were you in any doubt about that? *G*

Thank 'ee, Peace. As to extraordinary, you're way up there yourself.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Greg F.
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 05:55 PM

As Peace says, Its about power and privilege: rich white wommen getting to the same place as rich white men. More rich white women of privilege
getting into positions of power who will do absolutely ANYTHING to keep their privilege and be part of the status quo.

It should come as a surprise which political philosophy (Pull up the ladder, I'm aboard!) they subscribe to?

Please. Next question.


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Don Firth
Date: 10 Oct 05 - 06:16 PM

Both senators from Washington State are women: Patty Murray and Maria Cantwell. Both are liberal Democrats. Leading up to the vote to give Bush carte blanche to go to war, Murray delivered such an impassioned speech to Congress opposing the action that the Right retaliated by labeling her "Taliban Patty," and Ann Coulter put her on her "traitors list." Patty really stuck a burr under their saddle.

I like Patty. Maria (the junior senator) ain't no slouch either.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: M.Ted
Date: 11 Oct 05 - 11:46 PM

Just a a point of information, there was quite a substantial feeling against the going to war against Germany--and remember, Isolationists have had quite a long history in the Grand Old Party(though Republicans, and even Conservative Republicans, often are not Isolationists)--Even "W" talked like an isolationist in the beginning--In retrospect, we were wrong to encourage him to move away from that position;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: GUEST,rarelamb
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 03:00 PM

"W" talked like an isolationist in the beginning"

Ah, those were the good ole days. When Condi wrote in Foreign Affairs about a more limited government. When it was declared we wouldn't nation build....It brings a tear to my eye.

To be fair though in wwii we were forced into it by Japan attackng pearl Harbor. Then the Germans declared war on the US.

The first World War was kinda hard in that the Germans did talk to mexicans about going to war with the US.

But why can't we just agree that it was the French fault for creating Germany in the Franco-Prussian war?

When in doubt, blame the French :)


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Subject: RE: BS: Why Female conservatives?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 Oct 05 - 03:19 PM

Pfui!


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