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BS: Unpasteurized beer

SINSULL 06 Jan 05 - 12:34 PM
TheBigPinkLad 06 Jan 05 - 12:56 PM
Bill D 06 Jan 05 - 01:20 PM
Micca 06 Jan 05 - 01:31 PM
Jim Dixon 06 Jan 05 - 02:17 PM
Bert 06 Jan 05 - 02:33 PM
GUEST,Blind DRunk in Blind River 06 Jan 05 - 02:37 PM
Cluin 06 Jan 05 - 02:44 PM
TheBigPinkLad 06 Jan 05 - 03:07 PM
artbrooks 06 Jan 05 - 04:17 PM
Dave the Gnome 06 Jan 05 - 04:41 PM
GUEST,John O'Lennaine 06 Jan 05 - 04:46 PM
TheBigPinkLad 06 Jan 05 - 04:56 PM
SINSULL 06 Jan 05 - 04:57 PM
Big Mick 06 Jan 05 - 04:58 PM
Bill D 06 Jan 05 - 05:07 PM
Little Hawk 06 Jan 05 - 06:43 PM
The Fooles Troupe 06 Jan 05 - 07:28 PM
Jim Dixon 06 Jan 05 - 08:07 PM
Bill D 06 Jan 05 - 09:52 PM
SINSULL 06 Jan 05 - 09:57 PM
Gurney 07 Jan 05 - 12:52 AM
TheBigPinkLad 07 Jan 05 - 12:43 PM
GUEST,Peter from Essex 07 Jan 05 - 03:01 PM
SINSULL 07 Jan 05 - 03:07 PM
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Subject: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: SINSULL
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 12:34 PM

Someone left a six pack of beer on the counter at my New Years Eve party. Three days later I discovered the "Must Be Refrigerated; Not Pasteurized" on the label. So I refrigerated it. BUT...is the damage done? Is it too late to save it? Will the bottle explode if I try to open it? Will I be exposed to the wart version of Mad Cow Disease if I drink it? Didn't they make and drink beer long before there was a Louis Pasteur or refrigeration?

I leave my health in the hands of experts.
SINS


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 12:56 PM

Beer, no matter how 'off' it gets, will never harm you. And it does not require refridgeration. What brand is it?


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: Bill D
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 01:20 PM

"not pasteurized" means there is active yeast still alive in it, which 'could', if left in a spot TOO warm for TOO long, build up TOO much pressure. If you have it refrigerated now, it should be fine.


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: Micca
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 01:31 PM

Sins, if it has ANY sediment in it avoid ingesting it!!!!! for many people I know the effect is the same as stewed fruit through a short grandmother!!!!!


"Has the bottom fallen out of your World? well ingest yeast sediment and feel the World drop out of your bottom"


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 02:17 PM

I think the British prejudice against cloudy beer, or beer with a sediment, is unjustified. Belgian 'weiss' beer always has a sediment, and standard procedure, when serving it, is to pour 2/3 of the bottle into the glass, and then swirl the bottle so that the remaining third stirs up the sediment, then pour that into the glass, too. The glass of beer will then be cloudy.

I know there is probably a different type of yeast involved, but I doubt very much that there is THAT much difference, to produce the effect you describe.

There are several American breweries producing this type of beer, notably Blue Moon Belgian White, made by Coors, and Sunrye Ale by Redhook.

I'm not sure, but I think all beer in the US is pasteurized, by law. In the case of the Belgian-style beers, they don't pasteurize it until after the sediment forms.


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: Bert
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 02:33 PM

It's be OK, Hops are a strong antiseptic.


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: GUEST,Blind DRunk in Blind River
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 02:37 PM

Unpasturizedf beer? Forget it! I ain't drinkin' nothin' that has been poured anywhere on the ground where a cow has walked or...done somethin' else, know what I mean? Gross. I bet that's what's wrong with American beer, eh? It's been pasturized.

- BDiBR


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: Cluin
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 02:44 PM

I always pass my beer before my eyes before I drink it. Not gonna find a dead mouse in the bottom of the bottle after I've finished again, even if they give me a free case for it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 03:07 PM

Bill, 'not pasteurized' does not necessarily mean there's yeast in the beer. It could be micro-filtered.

Bert - hops do have antiseptic properties but they are weak at best.

Yeast sediment will not make you shit yourself. I have offed literally litres of lees without adverse effects. (touch wood)

Pasteurization of beer in the US is not mandatory. Belgian beer comes in dozens of nuances that may or may not be pasteurized.

Beer is wonderous.


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: artbrooks
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 04:17 PM

Back before Coors went nationwide (and went way downhill at the same time), it was not pasturized. They would only ship it within one day's truck travel from Golden, Colorado. If I remember correctly, it then had a label on it that said something like drink within 14 days after[date]. However, a member of my unit in Vietnam had a 6-pack mailed to him and we drank it...warm...about 3 weeks after it left Denver. I haven't died yet, so I think you're ok.


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 04:41 PM

All that pasteurising does in this instance is kill the yeast. As someone else said it may or may not have sediment. The refrigiration thing is as mentioned earlier to stop the yeasy converting any more sugar to alcohol and CO2. If it had already converted it there would be no effect at all anyway. A recent test showed that it is dead yeasts that can cause more allergic and other unfavourable side effects anyway. Stick to unpasteurised and you should, in theory, suffer less from the (unwanted) effects of beer:-)

Here endeth the first lesson from Dr Boozer...

Cheers

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: GUEST,John O'Lennaine
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 04:46 PM

There are lots of different varieties of brewing yeast, some are palatable while others taste disgusting. None will do you any physical harm.

The Belgian beer Jim Dixon spoke of would have a palatable variety used as finishing yeast, but if you drink beer with some primary fermenting yeast still in it you will spit it out before you swallow it anyway.

The beer you mention sounds like it's not home brew, so it would need to be left in the sun for a long time before it built up enough pressure to explode, and even then it probably wouldn't.

You've got nothing to worry about, chill it and drink it.

John


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 04:56 PM

The Belgian beer Jim Dixon spoke of would have a palatable variety used as finishing yeast, but if you drink beer with some primary fermenting yeast still in it you will spit it out before you swallow it anyway.

Unless the beer is pitched with a second yeast (called 'guiling' or 'kreusening') the yeast will be the primary strain even in the finished beer.


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: SINSULL
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 04:57 PM

Chilled and drunk. Tasted pretty good and so far no evil side effects. I am due for a colon cleansing anyway so...


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: Big Mick
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 04:58 PM

That setup is sooooooooooooo tempting, but in the interest of staying healthy I shall let it pass.

Mick


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: Bill D
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 05:07 PM

TBPL...right--yeast may indeed be removed by filtering. I was hasty...
In any case, the message got to SINSULL that it was probably fine...and I am happy to hear the results...*grin*

(I have two Belgian Ales I am saving for 'the proper moment' downstairs right now...sediment is no impediment!)


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: Little Hawk
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 06:43 PM

Ha! Ha! Ha! Thanks for the laugh, Big Mick!


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 07:28 PM

Remember Sinsull - "All things shall pass"


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 08:07 PM

I've done a bit of research. I was wrong; most, but not all, US beer is pasteurized. However, this leaves me a bit confused. If beer isn't pasteurized, then it contains live yeast, right? (Maybe not much, if it's been filtered, but there must be some traces.) If it contains live yeast, then fermentation can continue, right? If fermentation continues, then the alcohol content increases. But alcohol content is the basis for taxation in the US. It is also the basis for certain laws. For example, in Minnesota, you can buy beer in a supermarket or convenience store only if it has less than 3.2% alcohol. "Strong" beer can be sold only in licensed liquor stores. How do you collect tax fairly, or enforce laws fairly, if the alcohol content of beer is continually changing, or has the potential to change, after it leaves the brewery?

If brewers were allowed to sell unpasteurized beer, it seems to me they could avoid all tax by selling unfermented beer—that is, beer that would ferment in the bottle (or keg) after you buy it. Why don't they do that?

I've heard that, in Britain, beer actually does continue to ferment after it leaves the brewery, while it sits in the pub cellar. That's why the alcohol content is not used as a basis for taxation. (It also explains why British pubs smell like yeast, which is a bit like the smell of fresh-baked bread.) Instead, British tax is based on "original gravity," which is roughly a measure how much alcohol the beer can potentially develop, but the actual amount of alcohol depends on when you measure it!

Is my reasoning wrong somewhere?


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: Bill D
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 09:52 PM

MICRO-filtration removes yeast spores

"Micro filtration

Membranes with a pore size of 0.1 – 10 µm perform micro filtration. Microfiltration membranes remove all bacteria. Only part of the viral contamination is caught up in the process, even though viruses are smaller than the pores of a micro filtration membrane. This is because viruses can attach themselves to bacterial biofilm.
Micro filtration can be implemented in many different water treatment processes when particles with a diameter greater than 0.1 mm need to be removed from a liquid."

very fine filters can clear a beer of yeast, but can also remove some of the solids which give beer it's flavor...so it is a mixed blessing, unless you LIKE "Miller Genuine Draft"...


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: SINSULL
Date: 06 Jan 05 - 09:57 PM

Niagara Brewing, Canada
Olde Jack
Strong Ale


YUM!

And Mick, comment or no comment, you are in trouble...AGAIN!


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: Gurney
Date: 07 Jan 05 - 12:52 AM

Jim Dixon, I brew my own sometimes, and this is what I understand the case to be.
Yeast brews until the alcohol content renders it inactive or dead. This point is reached at between 7 and 10 percent with most yeasts, and the sugar content of the brew supports that alcohol level.
Some yeasts are tougher and will live up to 12% and are used for strong ales like Newcastle Brown. Champagne yeast is used for 'double brewing' where the beer is resugared and rebrewed to make a very strong ale like Barley Wine.

We all have tales about bottles exploding, but this usually happens when the yeast stops working for some reason,-like cold weather,- and the brewer bottles the beer thinking it is brewed out. When bottled the beer is given a little more sugar so that the product has life/fizz/head/Co2. If it isn't brewed out, there is too much sugar in the bottle, which will turn into alcohol, giving off Co2 in the process. It is this excess Co2 which bursts the bottle. I would think it unlikely any commercially brewed product would explode, but accidents do happen.
As a matter of interest, alcohol has a higher expansion rate than water, so that is why there has to be a space in alcohol bottles.
A contract bottler I worked for overfilled toilet water bottles once, and I had '4711' all over my store...smelled like Granny's sideboard.


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: TheBigPinkLad
Date: 07 Jan 05 - 12:43 PM

Newcastle Brown is a 4.7% alcohol-by-volume beer. The North American standard is 5% and premium Euro lagers weigh in at a standard of 6%, so Dog is not particularly 'strong' comparitively speaking.

Commercial brewers don't use champagne yeast for barley wines, just a regular saccromyces cerevisiae with the legs to get a high-gravity wort down to within 20% or less of its Original Gravity.

I have never know a commercial beer to explode, although I have heard tales. Neophite home brewers sometimes have that happen if they bottle before quarter gravity. Anyone not using a hydrometer should beware: wet granades are dangerous.

I had the 'pleasure' of tasting recently Samuel Adams Utopias MMIII … touted at 25% abv to be the world's strongest bottled beer. My benefactor paid ... US$100 for it!!! All I can say is, why? The bottle is a marvel to behold BTW, looks like a miniature brew kettle.


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: GUEST,Peter from Essex
Date: 07 Jan 05 - 03:01 PM

I remember bottles from the offie exploding occasionally back in the 60s, but never since.


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Subject: RE: BS: Unpasteurized beer
From: SINSULL
Date: 07 Jan 05 - 03:07 PM

5.7% alcohol in this. Quite nice, really.


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