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War Mongering Songs

Rabbi-Sol 23 Jun 04 - 11:03 PM
alanabit 24 Jun 04 - 03:19 AM
Flash Company 24 Jun 04 - 07:36 AM
greg stephens 24 Jun 04 - 08:30 AM
greg stephens 24 Jun 04 - 08:41 AM
Rapparee 24 Jun 04 - 09:14 AM
GUEST,JOHN of ELSIE`S BAND 24 Jun 04 - 10:44 AM
Flash Company 24 Jun 04 - 11:33 AM
saulgoldie 24 Jun 04 - 11:50 AM
Uncle_DaveO 24 Jun 04 - 12:18 PM
Rabbi-Sol 24 Jun 04 - 02:53 PM
Uncle_DaveO 24 Jun 04 - 05:06 PM
Rapparee 24 Jun 04 - 05:44 PM
Deda 24 Jun 04 - 05:51 PM
Rabbi-Sol 24 Jun 04 - 05:59 PM
GUEST,guest 24 Jun 04 - 06:17 PM
emjay 24 Jun 04 - 06:45 PM
Susanne (skw) 24 Jun 04 - 06:51 PM
Joe_F 24 Jun 04 - 07:05 PM
Rabbi-Sol 24 Jun 04 - 07:12 PM
Gareth 24 Jun 04 - 07:45 PM
GUEST,Paranoid Android 24 Jun 04 - 09:42 PM
LadyJean 25 Jun 04 - 01:24 AM
alanabit 25 Jun 04 - 03:39 AM
GUEST,Greycap 25 Jun 04 - 03:57 AM
GUEST,guest mick 25 Jun 04 - 10:28 AM
el ted 25 Jun 04 - 11:14 AM
GUEST,JOHN of ELSIE`S BAND 25 Jun 04 - 11:54 AM
Georgiansilver 25 Jun 04 - 01:30 PM
Rapparee 25 Jun 04 - 01:57 PM
Amos 25 Jun 04 - 02:21 PM
GUEST,Wotcha in Italia 25 Jun 04 - 03:32 PM
GUEST,Santa 25 Jun 04 - 05:17 PM
greg stephens 26 Jun 04 - 02:14 AM
rich-joy 26 Jun 04 - 03:50 AM
Susanne (skw) 26 Jun 04 - 05:10 PM
Gareth 26 Jun 04 - 07:25 PM
Rapparee 26 Jun 04 - 07:59 PM
GUEST,Barrie Roberts 26 Jun 04 - 10:18 PM
cobber 26 Jun 04 - 10:58 PM
Ferrara 27 Jun 04 - 01:56 AM
Charley Noble 27 Jun 04 - 01:10 PM
Ferrara 27 Jun 04 - 04:56 PM
Joe_F 27 Jun 04 - 07:16 PM
Bert 27 Jun 04 - 07:45 PM
Bert 27 Jun 04 - 08:01 PM
dick greenhaus 28 Jun 04 - 09:52 AM
Gareth 28 Jun 04 - 10:11 AM
Grab 28 Jun 04 - 01:51 PM
alanabit 28 Jun 04 - 02:17 PM
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Subject: War Mongering Songs
From: Rabbi-Sol
Date: 23 Jun 04 - 11:03 PM

My friend's grandmother used to sing this song when she was a child, to the tune of "There'll Be A Hot Time In The Old Town Tonight".

         Spain Spain Spain
         They ought to be ashamed
         For doing such a thing
         Like blowing up the Maine
         And when be war
         We'll sock them in the jaw
         There'll be a hot time in the old town tonight

This tune was obviously used to provoke the Spanish American War. Does anybody have similar songs such as this ? Please post them here. It does not have to be a war in which the USA was involved. It can relate to any other nation, being that this is an international forum. SOL ZELLER


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: alanabit
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 03:19 AM

Unfortunately there are plenty of songs urging war. I believe the term "jingoism" goes back to a broadsheet ditty which stirred up British passions as the Crimean War was getting under way. The song I am referring to may be called, "By Jingo", but I have no desire to dig it out or read its rabble rousing sentiments again.
I have always thought that "Four Green Fields" and "The Minstrel Boy" also glorify war. The English seem to like songs like "Rule Britannia" and "The British Grenadier". I always cringe when I hear that crass line in "Hearts of Oak" which goes, "For who are as free as the sons of the waves?" The truth was that those men were mainly brutally treated slaves.
I am sad to say that this could be a very long thread.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Flash Company
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 07:36 AM

My gran used to sing:-
Lord Roberts and Kitchener,
Baden Powell and White,
All went off to South Africa
To have a jolly good fight (or shite, depending on the mood she was in!)

FC


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: greg stephens
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 08:30 AM

Alanabit: I'm sorry to do this, but the lyric you do not wish to hear (read no further, look away NOW) goes:
We dont want to fight
But by Jingo if we do
We've got the ships we've got the men
We've got the money too.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: greg stephens
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 08:41 AM

The Hitler war gave rise to a good lot of war-mongering songs.
"We'll hang out our washing on the Siegried Line
If the Siegried Line's still there" was a good one.
Particularly memorable was Spike Jones' classic:
"We'll(.....) right in the Fuehrer's face"
(not sure how to transliterate the relevant noise, Spaw is your man for that sort of thing).
    The finest recording from the English folk revival(IMHO) was the Watersons' "Brave Wolfe" . And there is no denying it is a touch on the warlike side.
"One Monday morning as we set sail
The wind did blow a pleasant gale
To fight the French it was our intent
Through smoke and fire
Through smoke and fire
And it was dark and a gloomy night"
etc etc.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Rapparee
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 09:14 AM

Awhile back I asked if anyone had the lyrics to a joingoistic song sung, I think, by "The Full Gospel Quartet" (or a name something like that). The chorus goes (and I'm sure only of the first two line and the last one):

The eagle is hurt her feathers are ruffled
Make no mistake she is coming for you
No matter what cave or hole you might hide in
(something) will find you
And America will do what she needs to do.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: GUEST,JOHN of ELSIE`S BAND
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 10:44 AM

Here are two very singable American songs that, no doubt, were heard and played very at the time of the second world war.
"You`re in the Army Mr. Jones"
          and
"Praise the Lord and Pass the Ammunition"
The sort of material to foster confidence and camaraderie amongst green, young men going into a very dangerous conflict and thank the Lord they did.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Flash Company
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 11:33 AM

This is the Army, Mr Jones, Written by Irving Berlin for his wartime show which actually came to Manchester,(England) complete with the man himself. He sang 'Oh how I hate to get up in the morning'.
I was too young to see this myself, but I have a friend who did. She confirms Benny Green's assessment of Berlin's singing 'To hear him , you had to hug him!@

FC


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: saulgoldie
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 11:50 AM

"Risin' of the Moon"
"When Johnny Comes Marching Home Again"


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 12:18 PM

Second World War:

They started something,
But we're going to end it
Right in their own back yard


and

Goodbye, Mama
I'm off to Yokohama!


Dave Oesterreich


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Rabbi-Sol
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 02:53 PM

Another one was "Remember Pearl Harbor", which I am looking for the words to. (If any one has them, please post them here). Also, my mother used to sing a song to me when I was a child, before the end of WWII. Only later on in life did I realize that it was anti- Japanese. The lyrics went like this:

               Jap-a-needle, Jap-a-needle
               I sew with my needle
               And when I get married
               I'll sew by machine

Did anyone ever hear this before ? I would like to trace the origins of this ditty. SOL ZELLER


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 05:06 PM

And there was a song about Colin Kelly, the deceased air hero at the beginning of the war. The tale was that he had singlehandedly (singleplanedly?) sunk a Japanese battleship by what we would later call Kamikazi tactics. Much later the naysayers said that he was not a hero but a damfool, that he hadn't sunk anything but killed himself foolishly. I don't remember the details.

Dave Oesterreich


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Rapparee
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 05:44 PM

Ballad of Rodger Young
Ballad of the Green Berets
Wha would ya nae fight for Charlie?
We Are Coming, Father Abraham
Riding a Raid
Flight of Doodles
La Marseille
Horst Wessel Lieder


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Deda
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 05:51 PM

Over There, or Johnny Get your Gun -- may have already been mentioned. The lyrics are downright chilling:

Johnnie get your gun, get you gun, get your gun,
Take it on the run, on the run, on the run,
Hear them calling you and me;
Every son of Liberty
Hurry right away, no delay, go today,
Make your daddy glad to have had such a lad
Tell your sweetheart not to pine,
To be proud her boy's in line.

Chorus:
Over There, Over There
Send the word, send the word,
Over There
That the Yanks are coming,
The Yanks are coming,
The drums rum tumming everywhere
So prepare,
Say a Prayer
Send the word,
Send the word to beware
We'll be over, we're coming over.
And we won't be back till it's over over there!

Johnnie get your gun, get you gun, get your gun,
Johnnie show the Hun, you're a Son-of-a-Gun,
Hoist the flag and let her fly
Like true heros do or die
Pack your little kit, show your grit, do your bit,
Soldiers to the ranks from the towns and the tanks,
Make your Mother proud of you and to Liberty be true.

Chorus:
Over There, Over There
Send the word, send the word,
Over There
That the Yanks are coming,
The Yanks are coming,
The drums rum tumming everywhere
So prepare,
Say a Prayer
Send the word,
Send the word to beware
We'll be over, we're coming over.
And we won't be back till it's over over there!


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Rabbi-Sol
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 05:59 PM

I remember another one. "Just Like Washington Crossed The Delaware, So Will Pershing Cross The Rhine". SOL ZELLER


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: GUEST,guest
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 06:17 PM

"Flower of Scotland"


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: emjay
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 06:45 PM

The song about Colin Kelly started like this:

   There's a star-spngled banner waving somewhere
    In a distant land of heroes brave and true
   Only God's great heroes get to go there
    That is where I want to go when I die.

I don't remember any more of it, but oh, I loved that song when I was small. Now I have to sing a verse or two of The Band Played Waltzing Matilda to get it out of my head. (Did anyone hear Garrison Keillor do a version of it, The Band Played the Star-Spnagled Banner?

Another one that has been mentioned was Rodger Young (I think it was spelled with the d).

I remember part of a verse of that, and I remember singing it in an assembly when I was in the 3rd or 4th grade.
   On the island of New Georgia in the Solomons
    Stands a simple wooden cross alone to tell...

and a line about "grenades against machine guns in the gloom."

At least as many of these as there are the anti-war songs.

And are there songs that are specifically pro-peace more than anti-war?


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 06:51 PM

Horst Wessel Lied is not a warmongering song, it's a straight (and utterly nauseating) incitement to mass murder!


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Joe_F
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 07:05 PM

"The Battle Hymn of the Republic" is surely the best of the lot.

There is also "The Star-Spangled Banner", which is at any rate a war song, tho as mongering "Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just" is rather tepid.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Rabbi-Sol
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 07:12 PM

I would consider the Civil War songs " Marching Through Georgia" and " We Are Coming Father Abraham" as being in this category.
SOL ZELLER


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Gareth
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 07:45 PM

Hmmm ! There are others, better historians than myself, who might wish to comment, but alanabit if I remember correctly "Hearts of Oak", etc. were music hall songs rather than "Shantys" or "Forebiters".

Lower deck songs were slightly more cynical- I'll give you this

"When we did bang, Monsewer Conflan,(SPX2)
You sent us bread and beer,
Now the French are beat, we've nothing to eat,
For you have nothing to fear."


Historically this must refer to Hawke's action against the French in what? The 1770's at Quiberon Bay ??

Never the less I think that your contention "The truth was that those men were mainly brutally treated slaves. is a little sweeping. By comparison to the working classes of England etc ashore, the disipline (SP?) and the rations were little diffrent than ashore, this was the age of the "Bloody Code".

It is also well recorded, and I take consideration to a "prest" man retrospectively volunteering for the volunteers bounty, a sizable proportion of the fleet were volunteers.

On that it must be pointed out that the "prest" men tended to end up in the recieving hulks, and were drafted by the "Port Admiral" into whatever ships were short of compliment.

A fair Captain, and a well known Captain, particullally if he had a reputation as a "prise taker" (not an SP!) could man his ship without resorting to the imprestment service.

Just a thought to toss into the pond of debate !

It is also worth noting that IIRC (and its to late at night to dig out and scan the sources) that something like 1% of the adult male population of GB was serving afloat in 1812.

With regard to those who wore a Redcoat there was no impresment, General poverty was sufficient a recruiting seargent.

If you take the nominal roll of a Battalion of the Line in the Peninsular War at 400 bodies, this roughly equates to the crew of a 38 Frigate, or Half the Compliment of a ship of the line.

I think some perspective should be allowed.

Gareth

" So roll on the Nelson, Rodney, Renown,
This three funnel b*****d(*) is getting me down!"


(*) Believed to be a reference to the County Class Heavy Cruisers.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: GUEST,Paranoid Android
Date: 24 Jun 04 - 09:42 PM

Amhran na bFiann (The Soldiers Song - Irish National Anthem)
"Soldiers are we whose lives are pledged to Ireland"


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: LadyJean
Date: 25 Jun 04 - 01:24 AM

My mother, who was born in 1917, would sing a song from The Great War, "Good bye ma, good bye Pa, good bye mule with your old Hee Haw, and fare you well my sweet heart dear, I'll bring you a king for a souvenir. I'll bring you a king and a kaiser too, and that's about all one feller can do."
There's another ditty from that era called the "Indianola" that ends with, "Me just love to kill, gonna go and scalpum Kaiser Bill."

For some reason I always sang "Rally Round the Flag Boys", when driving home from Howard Dean meetups. It's from an older war, but it still suggests fighting is a good idea.

Hollowfox and I were serenading two reenactors, who do the 42nd Highlanders in the French and Indian war with "Twa Recruiting Sergeants".


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: alanabit
Date: 25 Jun 04 - 03:39 AM

I shall have to look up the Horst Wessels Lied. There was a very good documentary about the song on German TV a year or so ago. It turned out that Horst Wessels was no more than yob (gay as it happened - although that bit was not so talked up by the NS) - who died as the result of a brawl. From what I can remember the song was crap. It is interesting just what tedious drivel some of these pro war ditties are. I guess it's the songwriting equivalent of McGonagall's poetry.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: GUEST,Greycap
Date: 25 Jun 04 - 03:57 AM

Colin Kelly was shot down by Japanese fighter ace Saburo Sakai - before he did any damage to Japanese shipping whatsoever. The US propaganda machine popularized the song ( words on request).
Some others from that era ( they were refererred to as "flags") included:
Smoke on the water ( Roy Acuff)
Won't you send my dog home, Uncle Sam? ( Hank Snow )
Ballad of Rodger Young ( the Country Gentlemen - I think )


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: GUEST,guest mick
Date: 25 Jun 04 - 10:28 AM

O me uncle Dick he had a stick and decided to make a slaughter;
he swore he killed a thousand men at the battle of the Boyne Water.
One fell here and one fell there and one in every quarter,
but one poor soul got a bullet up his hole at the battle of the Boyne Water


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: el ted
Date: 25 Jun 04 - 11:14 AM

Anybody know any fishmongering songs?


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: GUEST,JOHN of ELSIE`S BAND
Date: 25 Jun 04 - 11:54 AM

Fishmongering songs? Yes!
Our version of the west country parody, "Oh, Them Golden Kippers"
and
"Cockles & Mussels Alive Alive-O"

John


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 25 Jun 04 - 01:30 PM

When anyone talks of war songs I always think of those lines in the Skye Boat song, which when sung quietly can have such an effect. The Corries version particularly...The lines are...."Manys the lad, fought on the day, well the claymore did wield. When the night came, silently lay, dead, on Cullodens field" For me those words fire the imagination and are quite graphic in their own way.
Be Blessed.


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Subject: Lyr Add: GOD SAVE THE KING / ...QUEEN
From: Rapparee
Date: 25 Jun 04 - 01:57 PM

God Save The King (Queen):

1. God save our gracious Queen,
Long live our noble Queen,
God save the Queen!
Send her victorious,
Happy and glorious,
Long to reign over us;
God save the Queen!

2. O Lord our God arise,
Scatter her enemies
And make them fall;
Confound their politics,
Frustrate their knavish tricks,
On Thee our hopes we fix,
God save us all!

3. Thy choicest gifts in store
On her be pleased to pour;
Long may she reign;
May she defend our laws,
And ever give us cause
To sing with heart and voice,
God save the Queen!

4. Not in this land alone,
But be God's mercies known,
From shore to shore!
Lord make the nations see,
That men should brothers be,
And form one family,
The wide world over.

5. From every latent foe,
From the assassins blow,
God save the Queen!
O'er her thine arm extend,
For Britain's sake defend,
Our mother, prince, and friend,
God save the Queen!

6. Lord grant that Marshal Wade
May by thy mighty aid
Victory bring.
May he sedition hush,
And like a torrent rush,
Rebellious Scots to crush.
God save the King!


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Amos
Date: 25 Jun 04 - 02:21 PM

Onward, Christian soldiers!
Marching, as to war!!
With the cross of Jeeeesus
Going on before!!


The Protestant hymnal is chock full of warmongering tunes justifying violent advance in the name of the Price of Peace. Funny stuff, huh?


A


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: GUEST,Wotcha in Italia
Date: 25 Jun 04 - 03:32 PM

And don't forget "Over the Hills and Far Away ..." from the Beggars' Opera.


"Come Enlist and March I say

And go over the hills and far away ..." (I know I am ...)

Ciao,

Brian


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: GUEST,Santa
Date: 25 Jun 04 - 05:17 PM

Unless I have missed it, no-one has mentioned any of the Irish rebel songs...

For English ones, may I recommend a short course of Strawhead? Over the Hills and Far Away will do for a start. Vive Le Roi?


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: greg stephens
Date: 26 Jun 04 - 02:14 AM

Please dont blame the Beggar's Opera for a warmongering "over the hills and far away". John Gay's words to the tune, written specifically for the show, are quite innocuous lovey-dovey stuff. The soldiers-off-to-war version is not from the Beggar's Opera.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: rich-joy
Date: 26 Jun 04 - 03:50 AM

Don't forget that rousing little British number "Soldiers of the Queen" - offset perhaps, by "Here's to the Last to Die" ...

Cheers! R-J


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 26 Jun 04 - 05:10 PM

Alan, Wessel was a pimp as far as I know, murdered by a rival in a brawl. Roehm and his cronies were the gay ones. And the HWS has nothing at all to do with war, it talks about killing Jews. As far as warmongering songs go, I prefer the Internationale ...


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Gareth
Date: 26 Jun 04 - 07:25 PM

rich-joy Hmmm ! Soldiers of the Queen was a Kipling Poem. Not neccessarily a "Barack room ballad"

The ballad "And here's to the next man to die" well Click 'Ere Certainly sung in the services - I Learnt my version from me father (see previous threads) But was its origin "Warfare" or the depletion of battalions stationed in India or the like, 'cos it is also known as the "Cholora (SP) song".

Still as the old toast went "Bloody War, or Sickly Season", or for the really cynical -

" Beware Oh Beware of the Bight of Benin,
One comes out, for Twenty go in !"


Susanne (SKW) Modern history (apart from the neo nazi's) defines 'Horst Wessel' as a pimp killed in a brawl in a brothel. I concur your defenition.

And if any 'Catters want the ULR's of the Neo-Nazi's Websites whch still promote the "Horst Wessel Lied" PM me, with good reasons why I should supply them. I have to refer to them for research puposes, and I find it nauseating to dig through those sites.

Gareth


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Rapparee
Date: 26 Jun 04 - 07:59 PM

Gareth, I've been to those sites too and I quite agree with your assessment. It's like researching in a filthy sewer -- it might be necessary, but it's certainly neither pleasant nor nice. As for the HWL, I was thinking more of how it was used than the words.

It has always seemed to me that the real warmongering songs were written by those who weren't at in the fight.

"An' ye had been whaur I hae been
Ye wadna been sae cantie-o
An' ye had seen what I hae seen
On the braes o' Killiecrankie-o."


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: GUEST,Barrie Roberts
Date: 26 Jun 04 - 10:18 PM

'Soldiers of the Queen' is not by Kipling, but by (I think) Leslie Stuart. 'Here's to the Next One to Die' was written by an Army Padre during the epidemic which swept British barracks in India after the Mutiny. So far from being a warmongering song, its about the virtually inevitable fate of those who are forced to fight wars. For that reason it became a great favourite of the Royal Flying Corps pilots during WWI.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: cobber
Date: 26 Jun 04 - 10:58 PM

I guess the reason why there have always been songs glorifying war is because they work so well in getting up the "patriotic fervour". The one that always offended me was the beautiful antiwar song, "Johnny, I hardly knew ye" being bastardised into "When Johnny comes marching home" to give it a completely opposite meaning.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Ferrara
Date: 27 Jun 04 - 01:56 AM

Cobber, I've heard there's strong evidence that When Johnny Comes Marching Home actually came first.

IMHO the reasons there are songs glorifying war are manifold. Patriotic fervor is actually already there, for many or most people; the songs express it, they don't just rouse it up. It doesn't have to be stirred up, it's a relic of our evolution (see The Territorial Imperative, by Desmond Morris, etc.) Not saying this is a good thing, just that I believe it's what IS. And many people, especially young people (again IMHO) see fighting an enemy as righteous as well as exciting. Patriotic songs echo their feelings. Then, once you're in a war, no matter who is/was the aggressor, patriotic and other songs about fighting are an important morale booster. They have a lot of value to the people who sing 'em.

Also -- another reason there are so many songs glorifying war is -- they sell! But then, so do the other kind.... When Walter Kittredge wrote "Tenting Tonight," (American Civil War),he was turned down by several publishers on the grounds that the song was unpatriotic and seditious. (good heavens above....). It was finally published by The Hutchinson Family, who were abolitionists as well as musicians. I believe it was the single most popular song among the soldiers on both sides. Guess they didn't think it was "unpatriotic."

I think of "warmongering" as something that people in power do, to further their own political/financial/emotional agendas. It's spiritually bankrupt, pure sleaze. Some of the songs listed above seem truly ugly and "warmongering" but I would simply characterize some of the others, such as The Minstrel Boy, as expressing positive aspects of the fighting spirit that is one element of the human heart & mind.

Oh Lord I should stay away from Mudcat late at night! Ah well.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Charley Noble
Date: 27 Jun 04 - 01:10 PM

This old chant about sums it up:

THE FOUR HORSEMEN

(Chanted Sermon by Rev. Rubin Lacy
Bakersfield, California - 1967
Adapted by Dahlov Ipcar © 1974
Further adapted by Charlie Ipcar, 1993)

They tell me in the morning,
When the horses come out the door,
They'll be standing there a-waiting,
To see the generals they been fighting for.

First come a rider on a red horse,
His armor shining in the sun,
A flaming sword in his hand,
His helmet a Gatling-gun ?
The face of War.

Under his horse's hoofs,
The dead and dying,
Trampled in the sand,
Bodies torn by grenades,
Shattered by shrapnel,
Rot in no man?s land ?
But with visions of victory in their eyes.

Refrain:

And I hear a voice a-crying,
"Is that the general we been fighting for?"
And I hear a voice answer,
"Yes, that's the general you been fighting for."

Next come a rider on a black horse,
His body all covered with sores,
Reeking of gangrene,
From his nose and ears blood pours ?
The face of Pestilence.

Under his horse's hoofs,
The sick and the dying,
People too weak to crawl,
Bodies wracked with pain,
Vomiting black blood,
For mercy they do call ?
The madness of fever in their eyes.

Refrain:
Then, out come a rider on a white horse,
His body all covered with flies,
Thin and gaunt and haggard,
Rotting teeth and bloodshot eyes ?
The face of Famine.

Under his horse's hoofs,
Children with swollen bellies,
Pipestem arms and legs;
Across the blackened fields,
Mothers with outstretched hands,
For bread and water beg ?
The madness of starvation in their eyes.

Refrain:

At last, come a rider on a pale horse,
His body but a rack of bone,
Slashing a scythe left and right,
Eyes like balls of fire in a head of stone ?
The face of Death.

And under his horse's hoofs,
Desolation and destruction,
On the face of the earth;
Gravestones and dry bones crackling,
Black ashes swept up in the wind,
None left to mourn or curse ?
The madness of another great victory.

Refrain:

And I hear a voice a-crying,
"Is that the general we been fighting for?"
And I hear another voice answer,
"Yes, that's the general you been fighting for."

Oh, Lord, let me go!
I can't make war no more;
Oh, Lord, let me go home in peace!
I seen the generals we been fighting for.

Charley Noble


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Ferrara
Date: 27 Jun 04 - 04:56 PM

Yes!


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Joe_F
Date: 27 Jun 04 - 07:16 PM

I do not know the song "Soldiers of the Queen", but there *is* a Kipling song "The Young British Soldier" in which "So-oldier _of_ the Queen!" is the last line of the refrain; perhaps there is some confusion with that. "The Young British Soldier", however, does not monger war; it takes war for granted & gives sage advice on how to survive it where possible. It last stanza was much quoted on Usenet a couple of years ago, in no very jingoistic spirit:

When you're wounded and left on Afghanistan's plains,
And the women come out to cut up what remains,
Jest roll to your rifle and blow out your brains
An' go to your Gawd like a soldier.
Go, go, go like a soldier,...


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Subject: Lyr Add: LADDIES WHO FOUGHT AND WON (Harry Lauder)
From: Bert
Date: 27 Jun 04 - 07:45 PM

Harry Lauder sang



D
There's a dear old lady, Mother Britain is her name,
                G                   A7
And she's all the world to me.

She's a dear old soul, always the same,
      D          G       A7
With a heart as big as three.
                D
And when troubles and trials are knocking at her door,
       G                     A7
And the day seems dark and long,

Her sons on the land and her sons on the sea,
         D       G    A7
They all march to this song,

Chorus

D                                                
When the fighting is over, and the war is won,
                           G       A7
And the flags are waving free,
When the bells are ringing, and the boys are singing
D             G   A7
songs of victory
               D
When we all gather 'round the old fireside,
                                             A7
And the old mother kisses her son,
D                              G                  D
A' the lassies will be loving all the laddies,
                         A7          D
The laddies who fought and won.

Verse 2

We can all look back to the history of the past,
That made us what we are.
We have pledged our word we all shall hold fast,
Be the day away so far.
And till that time comes, let us fight and fight,
Let us fight till victory is won.
we will never give in, we are out to win,
To the very last man and gun.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Bert
Date: 27 Jun 04 - 08:01 PM

Acourse Warmongering is good or bad depending on which side you are on.

William Morris in 'March of the Workers' sings...

Is it war then will ye perish as the dry wood in the fire
is it peace then be ye of us let your hope be our desire
come and live for life awaketh and the world shall never tire
and the host comes marching on.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 28 Jun 04 - 09:52 AM

There's a bit of confusion here. If you're talking about songs that support an existing war, there are hundreds of thousands of them; songs promoting a war that isn't presently existing are rarer (and, IMO, more interesting).
            I've noticed that, quite often, the same people sang songs on both sides of the pro- and anti-war line.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Gareth
Date: 28 Jun 04 - 10:11 AM

Ooops ! I stand corrected over "Soldiers of the Queen". Appologies !

Gareth


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: Grab
Date: 28 Jun 04 - 01:51 PM

Alanabit, that would be "seemed to like". Those songs are all very Victorian parlour songs, and of their time. Rather like the nasty little C&W song that came out not long after 9/11 promoting stomping the Ayrabs was very much of its social class (ie. dumb rednecks) and of its time. Thank God, I've not wasted brain cells remembering who wrote it or how it went.

Most English people today aren't fond of war and would rather not get dragged into any more. Incidentally, "Rule Britannia" is one of the rare songs glorifying a country *without* mentioning war.

My personal unfavourites are ones promoting bigotry against another country/race/whatever. "Come out you Black and Tans" is about as unpleasant as they come, but typical of the genre.

Graham.


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Subject: RE: War Mongering Songs
From: alanabit
Date: 28 Jun 04 - 02:17 PM

Good point Graham, but I think it's a bit of a moot point as to whether "Rule Britannia" doesn't mention war. At the very least I would call it an anthem to Britain's naval power in a bygone age. The line about it being, "the dread and envy of them all," can be read as a hint of the consequences of taking too many liberties with the Royal Navy! Strangely enough, I like the song, though that may have something to do with my formative years at The Royal Hospital School, Holbrook and origins in a naval family. It has got a thumping good tune. I just find it a little embarrassing to hear it sung by football crowds, who usually seem unaware that the tide of history has turned a little!


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