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Welsh language folk music

Lancashire Lad 22 Jan 04 - 08:24 PM
Phil Cooper 23 Jan 04 - 12:27 AM
Splott Man 23 Jan 04 - 07:54 AM
GUEST,Gareth 23 Jan 04 - 09:16 AM
sian, west wales 23 Jan 04 - 10:16 AM
Chris in Wheaton 23 Jan 04 - 10:28 AM
Bill D 23 Jan 04 - 03:59 PM
sian, west wales 23 Jan 04 - 04:20 PM
Mary Humphreys 23 Jan 04 - 05:13 PM
Chris in Wheaton 23 Jan 04 - 05:53 PM
CET 23 Jan 04 - 06:31 PM
sian, west wales 24 Jan 04 - 08:29 AM
Lancashire Lad 25 Jan 04 - 04:47 AM
sian, west wales 25 Jan 04 - 01:38 PM
Dead Horse 25 Jan 04 - 07:21 PM
Chris in Wheaton 25 Jan 04 - 09:26 PM
Lancashire Lad 26 Jan 04 - 08:48 PM
sian, west wales 27 Jan 04 - 05:43 AM
greg stephens 27 Jan 04 - 06:00 AM
sian, west wales 27 Jan 04 - 10:07 AM
Chris in Wheaton 27 Jan 04 - 11:05 AM
sian, west wales 27 Jan 04 - 01:16 PM
greg stephens 27 Jan 04 - 02:36 PM
Chris in Wheaton 27 Jan 04 - 04:50 PM
sian, west wales 28 Jan 04 - 04:36 AM
Mary Humphreys 28 Jan 04 - 05:46 PM
Gareth 28 Jan 04 - 07:18 PM
sian, west wales 29 Jan 04 - 04:31 AM
GUEST,Wildrose-Wally 07 Oct 07 - 08:32 PM
katlaughing 08 Oct 07 - 01:07 AM
Betsy 08 Oct 07 - 07:58 AM
Bryn Pugh 08 Oct 07 - 08:01 AM
sian, west wales 08 Oct 07 - 11:02 AM
GUEST,Nicholas Waller 08 Oct 07 - 01:01 PM
GUEST,heather 08 Oct 07 - 05:47 PM
Chris in Portland 08 Oct 07 - 06:07 PM
Splott Man 09 Oct 07 - 04:12 AM
Mick Tems 09 Oct 07 - 04:15 AM
Llanfair 09 Oct 07 - 04:37 AM
sian, west wales 09 Oct 07 - 04:45 AM
GUEST,Wildrose-Wally 09 Oct 07 - 07:02 AM
greg stephens 09 Oct 07 - 09:04 AM
greg stephens 09 Oct 07 - 09:06 AM
sian, west wales 09 Oct 07 - 09:44 AM
Chris in Portland 09 Oct 07 - 11:23 AM
sian, west wales 09 Oct 07 - 12:16 PM
Llanfair 09 Oct 07 - 01:25 PM
sian, west wales 09 Oct 07 - 02:28 PM
Chris in Portland 09 Oct 07 - 04:13 PM
sian, west wales 09 Oct 07 - 06:12 PM
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Subject: Welsh language folk music
From: Lancashire Lad
Date: 22 Jan 04 - 08:24 PM

Hi all
I am keen to discover more about Welsh folk music on LP or CD, but don't really know where to start. I am aware that there are many many albums available, but as I'm not a Welsh speaker cannot glean much info from sleeve notes etc.
I was wondering if anyone could make any recommendations for albums from the 1960s to present day

I am already aware and enjoy what I've heard by Fernhill / Julie Murphy

If there is an album you particularly like, could you post a little info here. Maybe you could liken it to other artists so I know what style it is in. Maybe also you could add the label it's on too.

Thanks


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Phil Cooper
Date: 23 Jan 04 - 12:27 AM

Check out the band Ar Log, they put out several albums in the early '80's. Don't know if they're still around or not.


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Splott Man
Date: 23 Jan 04 - 07:54 AM

Ar Log still around occasionally.
Try Calennig for Welsh songs in Welsh and English.
www.folkwales.org (Sorry can't do clickies).

Sain records, and Fflach records are both good sources.

regards


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: GUEST,Gareth
Date: 23 Jan 04 - 09:16 AM

Clicky ? Click 'Ere

Gareth


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 23 Jan 04 - 10:16 AM

Sain and Fflach are certainly good - there are also a lot of people working independently of these. Are you looking for instrumental or vocal? Both? Archival? Singer/songwriter?

I've just started work as director of trac The website lists a number of artists, and some have links to websites.

PM me if you want to as well, although it would be good to keep the discussion 'up front and public' here.

My current favourites are Toreth and Mabon (both through Fflach I THINK) and Crasdant (Sain). Bragod is a bit unusual but I don't know who distributes them. Sain has put out a couple of good rereleases of archive stuff recently - Nancy Richards on the triple harp, and the Plygain/Stable Loft songs. They've also released a tribute album to Elfed Lewys (one of our 'Greats' who died a couple of years ago)and have promoted it very poorly; lovely album, and I think the title is something like Blas y Pridd ... or something. Will check.

Lots of great stuff out there. Ar Log is no longer recording, but the back-catalogue is good (and Dafydd Roberts is now Chief Exec. of Sain!). For 'old' groups, also see if you can get Mynediad am Ddim or Ac Eraill.

sian


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Chris in Wheaton
Date: 23 Jan 04 - 10:28 AM

Sian, congrats on the new job. What does TRAC do? Any plans to help promote Welsh folk music in the US and elsewhere --

Sain has the great goup Plethyn and Linda Healy.   I also have heard parts of the new Bob Delyn cd - what;s your opinion Sian?

Also, in English, listen to Frank Hennesy's Celtic Heartbeat on the BBC Wales archives.

Chris yn Wheaton


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Bill D
Date: 23 Jan 04 - 03:59 PM

Daffyd Iwan

more about Daffyd

(a search turns up LOTS)


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 23 Jan 04 - 04:20 PM

Yes, the job is great and yes, I'll be in the States twice over the summer - in July at the NAASWCH conference (W. Virginie) and then on Labour (hey, I'm Canadian) Day in Buffalo at the National Welsh Festival ... where Crasdant will be playing. I'm going as a groupie ...

Plethyn performs only rarely and it's lead singer, Linda Healey is performing solo these days - bit more lounge music kinda stuff but still drifting back to her folk roots from time to time. Talented woman. Boys of the Hill are a good, young Swansea folk-band-with-attitude. Bob Delyn is also very very good and ... manipulates? ... the tradition to great advantage. Lead singer Twm Morris won the National Eisteddfod Chair in 2003; great to see a different kind of 'voice' winning a top prize. His mother is the well-known author Jan Morris.

You should also try (for instrumental) The KilBride Brothers and (vocal) Carreg Llafar.

sian


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Mary Humphreys
Date: 23 Jan 04 - 05:13 PM

Bragod is available from one of the performers : Robert Evans email address: bob-evans@ntlworld.com. Very unusual CD - a reconstruction of mediaeval Welsh song and poetry set to music. Not for those who only want 'pop' folk. I love it.
Siwsann George made a superb CD on Saydisc ( CD-SDL 406)in 1994 - Caneuon Traddodiadol Cymru ( Traditional Songs of Wales )many of which I think come from the Welsh Folk Song Society collections in the books of the same name compiled & edited by Meredydd Evans & Phyllis Kinney. It has an excellent booklet - all the words in Welsh & English translation alongside. She is joined by such star performers as Robin Huw Bowen , Ceri Matthews, Julie Murphy & Nigel Eaton to name but 4.It is one of the best introductions to trad Welsh singing & music you will hear.
Mary


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Chris in Wheaton
Date: 23 Jan 04 - 05:53 PM

So, Sian - are there plans to promote Welsh folk music in the US? I think there is a great untapped market here.
Chris


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: CET
Date: 23 Jan 04 - 06:31 PM

Sian:

Your blue clicky didn't work for me. Can you write your web address?
The National Welsh Festival on Labour Day sounds like fun.

Edmund


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 24 Jan 04 - 08:29 AM

The website is www.trac-cymru.org Sorry if the above doesn't work.

Chris, there are quite a few groups touring in the States. Crasdant has just returned; I know that some or all of the KilBrides are over there quite often; Robin Huw Bowen and Sian James have both done solo tours. Mabon was out last year. One of Lynne Denman's groups has been. I guess what we need is more centralized promotion.

The North American Gymanfa Ganu has been pretty consistent about bringing groups out for the Labour Day gig, and most of them do a bit of touring. Crasdant will be playing in Longwood Gardens, Kennet Square, PA on 31 August and will be in Buffalo on the 3rd and 4th Sept.

I seem to remember that Siwsi George was out some years ago - in the Montreal Gymanfa Ganu - but she's been very unwell and hasn't been doing much. Fingers crossed that she'll get back to touring.

Of course, these guys do a lot of touring in Europe as well AND we kinda like to keep them around for home gigs too!

Oh - just saw the new Phil Tanner: the Gower Nightingale archive recording in town. That's an English language must-have. Thanks to the work of his 'followers', like Mick Tems Calennig, who've made it possible!

(Oh - and if you were doing a search for Dafydd Iwan, mind the spelling.)

sian
p.s. So what's become of Lancashire Lad? All this info, and no response?


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Lancashire Lad
Date: 25 Jan 04 - 04:47 AM

I'm still here and absorbing things!!
I've just ordered the Callening re-issue CD on Greenwich Village and also a Plethyn LP. I'll let you know what I think of them when they arrive next week.
Thanks to everyone for their input.

I've also had recommended the following who I think are more in folk rock territory. apparently original LPs are now quite rare / expensive. any thoughts on these?

Bran
Pererine
Meic Stevens

Thanks again
LL


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 25 Jan 04 - 01:38 PM

Bran originally included, if I'm correct. Dafydd and Gwyndaf Roberts who went on to form Ar Log. They left in the early days and I think the band went very 'rock' so if it's folk you want, the earlier the better. Pererin is defunct and included Arfon Wyn who has a number of groups now including Y Moniars.

Meic Stephens is pure classic; Sain put out a 3-disc tribute to him in 2002 which is worth having. He's one of the singer-songwriters - along with Dafydd Iwan, Tecwyn Ifan and one or two others - who've given us songs which are so popular they could very well qualify as 'folk' by some definitions. (And "no" I don't want to get into "what is folk")

Also worth having are real tradition-bearers like Meredydd Evans (Traditional Welsh Songs is one), Bob Roberts Tai'r Felin, Jac a Wil, Elfed Lewys.

If you're just into the continuum of folk/pop ... '40s, '50's and '60s smooth harmony stuff like Triawd y Bryn, Hogiau Llandegain, Triawd y Coleg, Bois y Blacbord, Hogiau'r Wyddfa, moving into the '60s and '70s 'youth' groups like Y Peledrau, Y Diliau, Perlau Taf, Y Cwiltiau, Y Triban, Y Derwyddion, folk/pop/rock blends like Bara Menyn (with Meic Stephens, Geraint Jarmain and Heather Jones) and bizaare combos like Y Dyniadon Ynfyd Hirfelyn Tesog, Trwynau Coch and Tebot Piws; solo artists like Huw Jones (now Chief Exec of S4C!), Dafydd Iwan, Tecwyn Ifan, Heather Jones, Meic Stephens , Rene Griffith, Leah Owen, Mary Hopkin, Endaf Emlyn; groups that haven't dates SO badly (yet?) like Ac Eraill, Mynediad Am Ddim, Edward H Dafis, Hergest, Cilmeri, Y Datguddiad, Sidan, Y Nhw, Yr Hennesseys, Josgin, Geraint Jarmain a'r Cynganeddwyr, Plethyn, Ar Log.

There's a lot more variety today – vocal and instrumental – with groups and individuals like Carreg Llafar, Crasdant, Fernhill, Boys of the Hill, Jac y Do, KilBride Bothers, Sian James, Sian Phillips, Llio Rhydderch, Ceri Rhys Matthews, Allan yn y Fan, Cusan Tan, Mabon ... And "yes" I've probably left lots out. Apologies!

Of the older stuff, I'd get something by Meredydd Evans (if you like 'song') and if you've been 'led' to Bran, may I suggest the iconic Edward H Dafis, some of whose songs have achieved 'anthem' status.

LPs can be quite rare, and expensive. Having said that, there's a second hand record stall on the market here in town where you can pick things up at a reasonable price. There's an old Meredydd Evans double-EP album which I hear is hot property in collector circles.

Now ... if you happen to have an original Hwntws LP, don't bother keeping it. I'll take it off your hands; I'll even cover the postage. Wouldn't want it cluttering up your place ...

sian


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Dead Horse
Date: 25 Jan 04 - 07:21 PM

Sea-Shanties? Then try
http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Stage/9351/


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Chris in Wheaton
Date: 25 Jan 04 - 09:26 PM

see Meic Steven's web site - and there is a good tribute album on Sain. Radio Cymru plays a lot of Meic's stuff.
LL - Which Plethyn did you buy? The Best is excellent, but so are the others.
Are you thinking about learning Welsh? Great songs to sing, but probably have to watch where you do it in that part of Great Britain that is not Welsh.
Have you heard Cerys Matthews' new CD - not folk but most of it is a good Welsh Nashville sound.
Llongyfarchiadau, Chris


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Lancashire Lad
Date: 26 Jan 04 - 08:48 PM

Hi again
Thanks to Sian and Chris
In answer to you Sian. I actually have a copy of the album by Yr Hwntas on CDR. I'll happily copy it for you if it helps

In answer to Chris. I've ordered the Plethyn album called Teulu'r Tir. The same record shop also has a copy of Blas Y Prid in stock too.
Yes I am considering learning to speak Welsh. I've just begun to investigate a few on line sites. I made inquiries with my local college, then through Learn Direct. However it seems that there are no courses being run in Lancashire...unless anyone knows different??

LL


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 27 Jan 04 - 05:43 AM

Do a start-off course somewhere like Nant Gwrtheyrn - or the language centre in Denbigh. It helps get you going. PM me!

sian
who learnt


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: greg stephens
Date: 27 Jan 04 - 06:00 AM

Bragod has been mentioned a couple of times already, so here is another plug. Seriously weird, seriously wonderful. And unusually(to say the least) for a Welsh language group: the singer is black and originally from Trinidad, as far as I know.


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 27 Jan 04 - 10:07 AM

True, greg. Also worth remembering, however, that the singer Iris Williams got her first tv appearance by singing Pererin Wyf (ie. in Welsh) on a BBC Wales folk programme. Tune: Amazing Grace. Still considered a classic.

And about as far from Bragod as you can get. The other in Bragod is Bob Evans who is a specialist in Medeavil (how do you spell that?) Welsh music and plays the crwth.

I find the crwth excellent for clearing blocked sinuses ...

sian


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Chris in Wheaton
Date: 27 Jan 04 - 11:05 AM

LL -- The Sain site shows that Teulu'r Tir is only on tape - I've just been getting the cd's - but it does have the great song, "Yn dewach na dwr." Myrddin ap Dafydd's story (I think) of the soldier from Wales who meets a Patagonian Welsh nurse during the Falklands kertuffle - I still haven't figured out all the words - I think their best song is Seidr Ddoe.
You can hear Plethyn and other Welsh music on the radio Acen site - an mp3 recorder would let you hear it at your leisure.
Hope that you enjoy the music. For the St. David's Day Dinner, myself and two others are doing some Welsh numbers, including Lleucu Llwyd, Y Chwarelwr, and the Welsh version of Red Rose Cafe. We are also singing all 3 verses of Mae Hen Wlad in Welsh - the practice in the past was for them to sing it in English - there'll be no more of that on my watch!!
Sian - I hope that more Welsh groups can get to all parts of the US - especially Chicago. We get the rock groups here, but not the folk groups, although Ffynnon was here last year for the Celtic Fest - you could contact the City of Chicago and help them pick more great Welsh groups for that annual event.
Hwyl, Chris yn Wheaton


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 27 Jan 04 - 01:16 PM

You get me an address and we'll start lobbying, Chris!

sian


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: greg stephens
Date: 27 Jan 04 - 02:36 PM


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Chris in Wheaton
Date: 27 Jan 04 - 04:50 PM

Sian -
contact Colleen Miller at the Old Town School of Folk Music re their July Roots fest at http://www.oldtownschool.org/contact/admin_list.html
and the City of Chicago at http://egov.cityofchicago.org
re their Celtic Fest in September
Search on Celtic Fest to find the info
I hope they will book some of your TRAC folk.
Pob lwc, Chris


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 28 Jan 04 - 04:36 AM

Well, trac isn't a booking agency, but we'll certainly get them on our mailing list! Keep the pressure up at that end too!

sian


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Mary Humphreys
Date: 28 Jan 04 - 05:46 PM

I was interested to see Chris yn Wheaton's recommendation about singing in Welsh : ' probably have to watch where you do it in that part of Great Britain that is not Welsh.'
I always used to be a bit wary of singing in Welsh anywhere in England, but having taken the plunge a few years ago in Yorkshire ( at the Ryburn 3-step club )I had a very favourable reception. Now I often get asked to sing at least one song in Welsh when I do gigs. Breezy at St Albans even got Anahata and me to do the club on St David's eve knowing I would sing in Welsh for some of the evening.
I have been to many a club where a Scots or Irish artist has sung in their native language and rejoiced in it. It's about time we Welsh did the same!
Mary


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Gareth
Date: 28 Jan 04 - 07:18 PM

Mmmm ! It's a year or three since I enjoyed a "Welsh Night" at the "Black Horse" at Chislet, or the "Bull" at Adisham or any of the pubs and clubs on the Kent Coalfield - But there was enthusiasm for the Tounge of Heaven then.

My only dislike of traditional Welsh singing is the way it has been hijacked by the linguistic purists. - For "Cosher Bailey" is as much of tradition as any other Folk Ballad.

Gareth


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 29 Jan 04 - 04:31 AM

Right on, Mary. There's never been any questioning of singing in Welsh anywhere in North America (OK "in my limited experience").

Gareth, I think your point is basically true, but needs some refining. As in most things, sometimes you need a dog in the manger before anyone else will pay the manger any attention.

I dislike the way it's been hijacked by the musical purists, ie. you have to sing in a vaguely Western-Art-Song / Eisteddfodic way or you shouldn't open yer gob. B*ll*cks.

sian


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: GUEST,Wildrose-Wally
Date: 07 Oct 07 - 08:32 PM

Hallo,

I'm trying to find the Welsh version of "The Red Rose Cafe", can anybody help me out?

Is it on a CD? If so, could you tell me wich one?

I know it has been a while since anybody wrote in this thread, but please, give me a hand.

Walter Mulder
Lethbridge, Alberta
Canada


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: katlaughing
Date: 08 Oct 07 - 01:07 AM

If anyone will knot, Wally, this lot will. They are great ones for finding such stuff! Keep checking back.


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Betsy
Date: 08 Oct 07 - 07:58 AM

I had always understood that because of it Wesleyan / Calvinist / Methodist history that the Welsh do not have a folk music tradition –in that they have a choral / hymns tradition.

Singing for pleasure ( and certainly not songs of love / politics and other subjects which might arouse the unrest in the soul), were not encouraged – only singing in chapel - in praise of things Holy.

Recently written Folkie–type Songs in the Welsh language maybe .


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Bryn Pugh
Date: 08 Oct 07 - 08:01 AM

It might be an idea, Lancashire Lad, to have a look at Manchester's Central Library. Certainly in the late 1960s and early 1970s an annexe of the Library did 'Linguaphone' type language courses, which is where I learned yn siarad Cymraeg.

There might still be Cymdeithes yn Ddraig Goch at Manchester Met. There certainly was at Liverpool JMU.

No, I am not a native Welsh speaker, as I know Mary Humphreys to be (sut mae, gyfeill ?) but with a name like mine I couldn't really not speak Welsh ; and I had to make some effort for the number of times I was asked 'fedrwych chi'n siarad Cymraeg ?'

Go for it - you will, I promise, never regret it.


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 08 Oct 07 - 11:02 AM

Good grief, Betsy, that is WAY off base. There is a choral/hymn singing tradition AND huge body of secular folk song.

Wally, re: Red Rose Cafe ... I can hear it in my head but can't think who did it. Either Ar Log or the Hennessys. Send an email to Sain records and ask. The Chief Exec is an Ar Log member and will know - and if it's on CD it's likely to be a Sain CD.

Sian


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: GUEST,Nicholas Waller
Date: 08 Oct 07 - 01:01 PM

According to this thread http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=1931 it is done by Plethyn.

Several of their CDs are listed amazon.co.uk but which track is the one you are after I don't know...

One entry from "Chris in Wheaton" starts off:

"Welsh words by Hywel Emrys - sung by Plethyn -
It's Anchor and Boat, rather than Red Rose Cafe
Hwyl, Chris

Am
Daw'r bobl yn llu o'u cartrefi i gyd
    E
I eistedd ar fainc ger y tan"

and goes on to provide all the lyrics in Welsh


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: GUEST,heather
Date: 08 Oct 07 - 05:47 PM

Just a note to say The Boys from the Hill are playing their last ever gig ever ever in the Gwachel in Pontardawe on Saturday Night coming.
We won't forget them.


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Chris in Portland
Date: 08 Oct 07 - 06:07 PM

Sian and others in Wales - my wife and I are planning a trip to Wales next October - we'll be entirely in North Wales, where the family roots are. Can anyone recommend good folk music venues to visit - in addition to the Folk Center in Dolgellau? Rather than go to a fest in the summer, I'd rather go to a nice warm pub in October!!
Diolch yn fawr, Chris


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Splott Man
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 04:12 AM

Chris in Portland

here's a couple of links to be going on with...

folkwales
Trac

Splott Man


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Mick Tems
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 04:15 AM

It's surprising that nobody - apart from you, Chris - has mentioned Ty Siamas in Dolgellau, which, after 10 years of campaigning, has won £1 million of Euromoney in its bid to become the Wales national folk centre. Ty Siamas opened this year and has a website. The committee has worked to realise this dream - hats off to them!


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Llanfair
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 04:37 AM

Although Manchester born, I have lived here in Mid-Wales for 10 years. 40% of the population are Welsh speaking and, although I went to night school for two years, I failed to become fluent, and only understand a little, enough to know that people talking in shops aren't being rude about me, but discussing the weather!

I'm close to the border, here, and on the tourist route from Birmingham to the coast. I get to hear very little welsh folk music, as country and western is the most popular. I love the choral singing, and can hear the chapel congregation from my garden on a Sunday.

There's not a lot of choir singing in the pubs, because most choirs have copyrighted their arrangements, and don't do them for fun.

We do, however, have a session every Saturday afternoon in Welshpool market hall, mostly english at the moment, but Welsh very welcome.


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 04:45 AM

Chris, we'll be organizing a one-day conference - possibly in Machynlleth and probably a Saturday in October - next year. It'll be set up to compare and discuss discovering historic music manuscripts and republishing them for use today. Cass Meurig will be the Welsh speaker and Mike O'Connor ("Crowthercref" on Mudcat) will come from Cornwall. We're looking for someone from Brittany as well. It will be part academic and part 'practical' and should be interesting.

As Splotty pointed out, there's a list of sessions on the trac website. Sessions being what they are, it isn't easy to say that they'll be in the same place/time by Oct 2008 but I'm sure there will be something of interest somewhere. (And you couldn't have said that 10 years ago; the scene has 'revived' considerably.) Another possibility is sitting in on rehearsals of folk dance teams.

BTW, I took a photo of the side street off Eldon Square, Dolgellau, for you on my mobile camera ... but now I don't know how to get it from there! It's a level of technology which avoids my comprehension ...

sian


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: GUEST,Wildrose-Wally
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 07:02 AM

Hi,

Thank you all, I've found the song and the CD it is on.

The order will be shipped from Sain records tomorrow.

Looking forward to hearing it, as I've never heard Welsh music before.

Have a great day.

Walter


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: greg stephens
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 09:04 AM

Sian.west Walwes:
don't you think you might be getting a little hung up on the "pan-Celtic" thing?

"Chris, we'll be organizing a one-day conference - possibly in Machynlleth and probably a Saturday in October - next year. It'll be set up to compare and discuss discovering historic music manuscripts and republishing them for use today. Cass Meurig will be the Welsh speaker and Mike O'Connor ("Crowthercref" on Mudcat) will come from Cornwall. We're looking for someone from Brittany as well. It will be part academic and part 'practical' and should be interesting."

I wouldn't fault your choice of speakers as far as they go, but how about the considerable experience in matters of fiddle MSS just over the border in England. The Hughes and Owen MSS from the Whitchurch area, for example, extremely interesting, and Whitchurch is all of two miles from Wales. And the surnames Hughes and Owen are suggestive as well. I think if you are looking at fiddle tunes from the 1800ish period, for example, as Cass Meurig has, for instance: I think the cultural links were stronger between Wrexham and Oswestry than they were between Wrexham and Brittany, or Wrexham and Truro. research is better directed at what is, or what was, rather than what you vaguely hope might have been. Of course there are linguistic connections between Wales, Cornwall and Brittany, we all know that. There are also, to state the blindingly obvious, connections acroos the English/Welsh border.Don't forget that Llanyblodwel and Trefonen or in England, but Higehr Kinnerton and Queensferry are in Wales.
   All I am saying is, if you are interested in sharing experience of the use of traditional tune MSS, take a glance to your east.The border is quite porous to music, and many of cross it regularly without to much discomfort.

"


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: greg stephens
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 09:06 AM

That should, of cousre, be Higher Kinnerton.Sorry.


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 09:44 AM

I'll look forward to your conference.

sian


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Chris in Portland
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 11:23 AM

Thanks for the comments - my grandparents came from Dollgellau - great-grandpa ran a pub across from where Ty Siamas is now. To take advantage of the music and location, we plan to use Dolgellau as a base and spend at least 5 days there and then go further north for as long as our shrinking dollars can last. The event listings for this October are really great - even old friends John Prine and Buddy Mondlock from Chicago!!
But it is hard to tell which towns listed are in the north. Any suggestions for a town along the north coast with a folk music scene that we could use as a second base? Lots of great places to stay for the scenery, but would also like to find a music tie-in.
Sian, I'll keep a look-out for your event and hope we can make that too.
Diolch eto, Chris
ps I'm doing Pererin Wyf at the Welsh church here on Sunday, and also that and other Welsh songs for a Welsh Society Xmas program. We're also working on Ar Gyfer Heddiw'r Bore for our Lessons and Carols service. So no skimping on yr heniaith yn Portland!


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 12:16 PM

I understand that Ty Siamas has a session every other Wednesday and it's doing so well they're thinking about doing it weekly. There are also things happening in Machynlleth, and there might be the occasional opportunity in the Harlech area as well. The Llanberis stuff (fiddle) might not be too far flung, although the drive might be a bit 'hairy' in the dark if you're not attuned to mountain driving. Aberystwyth too has some 'challenging' sections of road. As does Dolannog, although all three are 'do-able' for an evening out. Nearer the time, maybe we could put you in touch with some 'locals' who would meet up with you for a private session.

Which tune are you using for Ar Gyfer Heddiw Bore? This one? Or the older one made famous by Parti Fronheulog? I like them both very much.

sian


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Llanfair
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 01:25 PM

Are you talking about the Dolanog near us, Sian? I know there's a Welsh singing group there, but my lack of Welsh language has made me reluctant to go.

From Dolgellau, my family comes from there, too, you will find going south to the places Sian has mentioned probably more productive than north, Chris in Portland.

Beware Aberystwyth!!! I can never find my way out of there by car!!!So I go by train instead!!


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 02:28 PM

Yes, Llanfair. The group I'm talking about is the Tune Club that Gary Northeast runs (details on the trac site, above). It isn't a Welsh speaking group. Gary teaches (I think) one tune a night. A real mix of abilities and instruments.

There's a good session (Friday night I think) in the Nelson in Bangor. It started out there, then had to relocate to Menai Bridge for a while, but I hear it's back in the Nelson now. Welsh once a month and the rest is mixed. I think there are various things happening in Caernarfon as well, some at Galeri (the arts centre) but I don't have any details. Neil and Meg Browning are involved (the groups, Never Mind the Box, Cajuns Dembo, et al)

sian


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: Chris in Portland
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 04:13 PM

Thanks for the ideas - hoping to find someone in Dolgellau who we can hire to do some evening driving. I met the Brownings in Chicago two years ago, so I'm sure they will help if they can. A bit early to do a lot of specific planning, but I'm trying to see what's going on this October to get some ideas.

Sian - We're using the Hen Garolau Cymru book, which has the old, Mentra Gwen melody, but thanks for the other version - we might like using those English words.

Thanks again, Chris


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Subject: RE: Welsh language folk music
From: sian, west wales
Date: 09 Oct 07 - 06:12 PM

Yikes. I never noticed the English words. They're pretty dire. Stick to the Welsh, yeh?

I've got Hen Garolau too. You might also get the new collection published by Cwmni Gwynn last Christmas; excellent collection.

Re: Mentra Gwen, just to be pedantic 'Mentra Gwen' is a measure so (strictly speaking) they're both 'a' Mentra Gwen melody. There's some stuff about it on the 'Cat somewhere, all tied up with other songs on the same measure, like "Admiral Benbow" and "Captain Kidd". Apparently it was a favourite measure of the military in the 1600s.

I have some English words which are pretty decent to "Roedd yn y Wlad Honno" if you want to expand your repertoire with another Plygain carol.

sian


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