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Request respectful Veterans Day Thread

mg 10 Nov 03 - 09:37 PM
Peace 10 Nov 03 - 09:43 PM
Tinker 10 Nov 03 - 09:45 PM
wysiwyg 10 Nov 03 - 09:46 PM
artbrooks 10 Nov 03 - 09:57 PM
mg 10 Nov 03 - 10:09 PM
Amos 10 Nov 03 - 10:16 PM
Sorcha 10 Nov 03 - 10:22 PM
Giac 10 Nov 03 - 10:38 PM
katlaughing 10 Nov 03 - 10:39 PM
Jerry Rasmussen 10 Nov 03 - 10:42 PM
freightdawg 10 Nov 03 - 10:45 PM
Dave Swan 10 Nov 03 - 10:50 PM
Kim C 10 Nov 03 - 10:52 PM
mg 10 Nov 03 - 10:57 PM
Amos 10 Nov 03 - 11:21 PM
Clinton Hammond 10 Nov 03 - 11:25 PM
Bobert 10 Nov 03 - 11:29 PM
Amos 10 Nov 03 - 11:48 PM
katlaughing 10 Nov 03 - 11:52 PM
Amos 11 Nov 03 - 12:19 AM
Chip2447 11 Nov 03 - 12:40 AM
Wolfgang 11 Nov 03 - 05:06 AM
smallpiper 11 Nov 03 - 05:10 AM
Liz the Squeak 11 Nov 03 - 06:00 AM
AllisonA(Animaterra) 11 Nov 03 - 06:00 AM
Shields Folk 11 Nov 03 - 06:23 AM
Amos 11 Nov 03 - 06:56 AM
Alba 11 Nov 03 - 07:07 AM
dwditty 11 Nov 03 - 08:03 AM
GUEST 11 Nov 03 - 08:04 AM
Micca 11 Nov 03 - 08:38 AM
Rapparee 11 Nov 03 - 09:02 AM
jimmyt 11 Nov 03 - 09:30 AM
McGrath of Harlow 11 Nov 03 - 09:36 AM
PeteBoom 11 Nov 03 - 09:55 AM
katlaughing 11 Nov 03 - 10:20 AM
Mickey191 11 Nov 03 - 11:41 AM
Mickey191 11 Nov 03 - 12:34 PM
kendall 11 Nov 03 - 01:03 PM
Keith A of Hertford 11 Nov 03 - 01:11 PM
Metchosin 11 Nov 03 - 01:17 PM
Rapparee 11 Nov 03 - 01:35 PM
Hawker 11 Nov 03 - 05:38 PM
Gareth 11 Nov 03 - 07:11 PM
katlaughing 11 Nov 03 - 07:16 PM
Gareth 11 Nov 03 - 07:17 PM
Peace 11 Nov 03 - 07:28 PM
MarkS 11 Nov 03 - 08:20 PM
Rapparee 11 Nov 03 - 09:29 PM
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Subject: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: mg
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 09:37 PM

Tomorrow is Veterans Day. Some of us are veterans. Some are family members, friends, co-workers. I would request that one thread be reserved for respectful, non-abusive, non-political posts, and that people wishing to express other types of opinions start as many other threads as they desire. I would ask that if possible the list administrators move posts to other threads if necessary. Last year was pretty brutal here; I have been bracing myself for a repeat, but instead I will ask for one thread that is only for the purpose of expressing condolances, best wishes etc. Or it can be totally empty. People could express themselves otherwise to the hearts' content on other threads. It is a shame that the day that was set aside to honor veterans should be a day that I personally fear the most, because they know what buttons to push and they do and they still might and they would have if I had kept my trap shut.

One day, one thread. It is not too much to ask. mg

Note:

Because of the presence of so many lyrics and poems, I believe this thread belongs in the music section of the Forum.
-Joe Offer-

Political discussion and debate moved toVeterans Day Politics on 12 Nov. This is a popular topic every year and folks who were honoring Mary Garvey's request, as well as other folks, now have a place to let loose. Thanks --JC


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Peace
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 09:43 PM

Dear Mary,

You have my heartfelt agreement. Much of my own family has served in one or other of the armed forces (myself included as a reservist), and we owe it to our vets to express our respect and thanks. They have only gone where civilians sent them.

Bruce


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Tinker
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 09:45 PM

Mary I was thiking of you today. In fact I sent a package to Mick, cause I know he can't get up on the 'cat right now. Last year seemed endless, I was afraid for awhile that you and/or Mick might just walk away from the 'cat, but well for the most part folks here learn from each other. I've learnt form you. ( and been surprised a time or two). Thanks for all you've done and still do...


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: wysiwyg
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 09:46 PM

Boy on a sub, still, us.

~S~


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: artbrooks
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 09:57 PM

Good idea, Mary. Unfortunately, I have classes tomorrow, but I will be wearing my boonie hat, red poppy, and Womens Veterans Memorial t-shirt.

Art


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: mg
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 10:09 PM

Thanks. I think I will wear my River Rat t shirt and look for my poppy right now. mg


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Amos
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 10:16 PM

Wear them proudly, folks. That's how they were earned. I completely support Mary's request.


A


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Sorcha
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 10:22 PM

Yes, I agree. I don't really agree with the politics of gov't or war, but I do indeed respect those who go forth and fight....thank you, mary garvey....


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Giac
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 10:38 PM

What Sorcha said!

My dad was in WWI, my brother in WWII. A beloved cousin, a bomber pilot, was shot down during WWII, and several cousins served in Korea. Won't be going out tomorrow, but I'll wear a poppy here at home and think of them all.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: katlaughing
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 10:39 PM

In memory of my Uncle Howard, I hope he has found some peace; and, for my Uncle Courtney and the rest of them who have served and are serving.

Thanks, mary, you've got my support re' this thread.

Blessed Be,

kat


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 10:42 PM

Let me raise my voice in praise, too. I've just been watching the Young Lions, and it reminds me that war is complex and the service men
are often conflicted, themselves. I kinda skinned between wars... too young for the Korean War and too old for the Vietnam War. My Father was too young for the first World War, and too old for the Second. My oldest son served in the Air Force, but was never in combat, so it looks like another generation has been spared the internal conflict of armed conflict. But, I had a beloved cousin who was at Pearl Harbor when it was attacked, and pieces of shrapnel kept working their way to the surface in his body for many years, like stones in a New England field. His brother had both feet frozen, and suffered for the rest of his life, and another cousin lost her husband in the Navy in the second world war, with a new born baby at home.

War is never declared by soldiers.

Jerry


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: freightdawg
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 10:45 PM

Most of my uncles and several other friends have served my country in the armed services. I cherish the freedom they risked their lives for (and some lost their lives for) every day. They were not fighting for politicians. They were fighting to protect our freedom, for their wives and girlfriends and mothers and fathers. They fought so others could breathe the air of freedom. Thousands try to come to this country because of their sacrifice and devotion. Thank you for this thread. As "the greatest generation" goes to meet their reward, who will follow in their steps? I honor all who have served, who are serving, and who will serve their country. Ours is such a blessed land. May we never forget.

Freightdawg.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Dave Swan
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 10:50 PM

My gratitude and respect to those who have served in the armed forces.
D


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Kim C
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 10:52 PM

Here's to my dad, Mister's Uncle Paul, and my friends Howard, Steve, Chris, Randy, Kathy, and all of you who have served. Thanks.


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Subject: Lyr Add: GETHSEMANE (R Kipling)
From: mg
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 10:57 PM

Here is a song that sums it up...words by Kipling, tune is the verse part to Auld Lang Syne...words are probably not exact..

1914-18

The Garden called Gethsemane
In Picardy it was,
And there the people came to see
The English soldiers pass.

We used to pass - we used to pass
Or halt, as it might be,
And ship our masks in case of gas
Beyond Gethsemane.

The Garden called Gethsemane,
It held a pretty lass,
But all the time she talked to me
I prayed my cup might pass.

The officer sat on the chair,
The men lay on the grass,
And all the time we halted there
I prayed my cup might pass.

It didn't pass - it didn't pass -
It didn't pass from me.
I drank it when we met the gas
Beyond Gethsemane!


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Amos
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 11:21 PM

Katlaughing's Uncle Howard (link was relative & broke above).

A


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Subject: Lyr Add: 11:11 (Garnet Rogers)
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 11:25 PM

For Rememberance Day

11:11

Ah the glorious few are all the fewer here
In the cold November air
The crowd draws silent
Their collars raised
To the edges of the square
The children's choir sings "In Flander's Fields"
The band plays "Over There"
The old heroes still try to dress the line
As the chaplain reads the prayer

For the glorious few no longer stand so straight
As they did long years before
When they faced a hard and cruel fate
On a far and distant shore
Their tunics faded green and blue
Poor shelter from the cold
The memories made yet raw and new
At the calling of the roll

The heads are bowed in silence now
At the tolling of the hour
The first few falling flakes of snow
Drift gently on the flowers
All piled and stacked against the stones
Petals fluttering in the air
The eyes that stare down through the years
At the ones no longer there

The taste of lost and wasted years
So bitter on the tongue
White breath in clouds in the autumn cold
Frail chests with medals hung
In battle ribbons red and gold
In the pale November sun
The hands and faces grown so old
While the heart stays ever young

For the glorious few are all the fewer here
The old soldiers form the square
The wind blows hard and shakes the leaves
And stirs the thin white hair
Of these fading brave and fragile souls
As the bugler plays "Last Post"
The snow falls thick and faster still
And turns them white as ghosts


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Bobert
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 11:29 PM

Where have all the flowers gone...
Long time passin'...

Yeah, I graduated from Massanutten Military Academy in the height of thew Vietnam War and lots of my classmates went right into the Army and on to Vietnam. Eight of my class died. My cousin, Peter, came back without a leg. My 8th grade lab partner in junior high school, so messed up from killin' civilians that his life is a string of rehab programs....

And herer we are creatin' yet another generation of folks who will suffer from the effects of "depleted uranium" who won't get good treatment in their local VA hospitals... And we read that vets of this current war are holed up in camps without heat and not being treated for their ailments...

So, yeah, tomorrow, I'll reflect on the friends I've lost but I'll also reflect on the "Masters of War" who have sent my brothers ans sisters to the killing fields, only to turn their backs on them once the shootin' time is done...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Amos
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 11:48 PM

Translated from the Chinese by Ezra Pound, and offered with honor to those who lived it, by one who was not there:

 

      

RIHAKU
         
         8th century

          
         Lament of the Frontier Guard
          
         By the North Gate, the wind blows full of sand,
         Lonely from the beginning of time until now!
         Trees fall, the grass goes yellow with autumn.
         I climb the towers and towers
                     to   watch out the barbarous land:
         Desolate castle, the sky, the wide desert.
         There is no wall left to this village.
         Bones white with a thousand frosts,
         High heaps, covered with trees and grass;
         Who brought this to pass?
         Who has brought the flaming imperial anger?
         Who has brought the army with drums and with kettle-drums?
         Barbarous kings.
         A gracious spring, turned to blood-ravenous autumn,
         A turmoil of wars' men, spread over the middle kingdom,
         Three hundred and sixty thousand,
         And sorrow, sorrow like rain.
         Sorrow to go, and sorrow, sorrow returning.
         Desolate, desolate fields,
         And no children of warfare upon them,
               No longer the men for offence and defence.         
         Ah, how shall you know the dreary sorrow at the North Gate,
         With Rihaku's name forgotten,
         And we guardsmen fed to the tigers.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: katlaughing
Date: 10 Nov 03 - 11:52 PM

Thanks, Amos, but my link worked fine for me.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Amos
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 12:19 AM

Sorry, Kat -- see other thread.

A


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Chip2447
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 12:40 AM

My heartfelt thanks to all who wore the uniform; family and friends, those who served in war or in peace, those who served or are serving, those who came back and those who didn't.

May we never lose another son, daughter, father, mother, sister, brother, husband, wife, friend or lover.

Chip2447(from one vet to All the others}


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Wolfgang
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 05:06 AM

Amos,

Lament of the frontier guard is a poem I guess, not a song? I have learned it as a German song when I was young (with a to my ears very strange tune):

Die Pferde lahmen längst
doch wir marschieren
das Gras ist gelb
der erste Raureif fiel...

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: smallpiper
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 05:10 AM

Respect.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 06:00 AM

I learned this year that of the 16 names on one WWI war memorial, I'm 'related' to a full quarter of them. 88 years ago this May, two brothers, a cousin and a father-in-law were lost in 24 hours. 3 years later a great great uncle was KIA in France. None of them have a known grave.

At the going down of the sun, and in the morning,

We WILL remember them.

LTS


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: AllisonA(Animaterra)
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 06:00 AM

Byron worked for 30 years as a civilian in the Air Force. He had tremendous respect for the military, as much as he and I didn't like the political machine that made it. He taught me greater respect for the individuals who serve their country in this way. May all vets feel honored today.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Shields Folk
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 06:23 AM

Squire nagged and bullied till I went to fight,
(Under Lord Derby's scheme). I died in hell -

(They called it Passchendaele). My wound was slight,
And I was hobbling back; and then a shell
Burst slick upon the duckboards: so I fell
Into the bottomless mud, and lost the light

At sermon-time, while Squire is in his pew,
He gives my gilded name a thoughtful stare;
For, though low down upon the list, I'm there;
"In proud and glorious memory" ... that's my due.
Two bleeding years I fought in France, for Squire:
I suffered anguish that he's never guessed.
I came home on leave: and then went west...
What greater glory could a man desire?


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Amos
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 06:56 AM

Wolfgang:

How unusual! Yes, I believe it is aChinese poem from the 8th Century, translated by Ezra Pound.

A


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Subject: Lyr Add: THE SCOTTISH SOLDIER
From: Alba
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 07:07 AM

For my Father and for the all the Men and Women who are willing to put their lives in danger in order to protect ours. THANK YOU
While we may disagree with the Goverments and the reasons that send them off to War. We cannot ignore the willingness of the few to protect the many or forget the Ones that don't come back.
This song is my Father's favorite and still makes him cry at 84 years old for his two Brothers who didn't get back.

THE SCOTTISH SOLDIER

There was a soldier,
A Scottish soldier
Who wandered far away
And soldiered far away
There was none bolder,
With good broad shoulder
He's fought in many a fray,
And fought and won.
He'd seen the glory
And told the story
Of battles glorious
And deeds neforious
But now he's sighing,
His heart is crying
To leave these green hills of Tyrol.

Chorus
Because these green hills
Are not highland hills
Or the island hills,
The're not my land's hills
And fair as these green foreign hills may be
They are not the hills of home
JD


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: dwditty
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 08:03 AM

To all my sisters and brothers...Peace/


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 08:04 AM

To the scared young man who grew up dirt poor on a farm in Indiana, joined the Marines before the Army got a chance to draft him, and went to Viet Nam because he thought it was he was supposed to do - thank you.

To the same man who spent the next 30 years of his life working in the special kind of hell they call a steel mill, is now on disability because of an accident at that steel mill, and hated every minute of it but stayed there because he had a family to support - thank you.

From the luckiest daughter in the world, to the dad who has told her every day of her life that he loves her, even when she was acting like an ungrateful punk and had no idea of what real hardship was - thank you. I love you too.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Micca
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 08:38 AM

"and now here on the West Front again its all so quiet
the dead and missing do not make a sound
drifting faintly from the German line a ghostly "Silent Night"
but the trenches have returned into the ground "


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Rapparee
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 09:02 AM

1942. My father enlisted, taking the place of his brother, who was about to be drafted and whose work was still needed at home (and who, when the work was done, enlisted himself).

1950. My father is killed while building a house, leaving three sons and a daughter, and a wife who never remarried.

May 13, 1968. Two brothers, members of the National Guard, are sworn into "up to two years active Federal Service." By September, one would be at Chu Lai, South Vietnam. By January, 1969, the other would be be in Korea.

May 14, 1968. The two older brother obtain passes to see the youngest off to the US Air Force for Basic Training. Eventually the young airman would also serve in Vietnam -- and in Thailand, the Phillipines, Okinawa -- as an Airborne Voice Intercept Specialist.

The household went from five to two in 48 hours. No service stars went up in the window.

All came home. One hid his Purple Heart from his mother, all were changed. Even the daughter who stayed home.

My family, according to tradition, left Germany and arrived in the US just in time to serve in the Blackhawk War. We haven't missed one since; I have cousins in Iraq.

This morning, in just about two hours, I have to give a short speech. The American Legion has given the Library a flagpole and today is the dedication. Speeches are for politicians, the deeds are for those the the politicians send in harm's way.

Respect is due to those who do, and only rarely to those who only talk.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: jimmyt
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 09:30 AM

My father flew out of Norfolk 32 missions during WW2. He was 17 lied about his age. Oldest man on the B17 was 21.
My Uncle was shot down on Easter Sunday 1943 over Denmark. A young man rode his bike out to the wreck, pulled 2 wounded AMerican Flyers out of the burning wreckage, hid them in a haystack, and eventually got them in the Danish resistance, to have them rescued through NOrway. Unfortunately, my uncle was not one of the rescued.

I had a chance to meet this young boy, now in his 80s a couple years ago, and it is still fresh in his mind, the entire horrible incident. He told us every detail, took us to the very site the plane went down, then brought flowers and 2 flags, a Danish one and an American one, for us to place on the memorial there in that little village in the Danish countryside. It was a terrible memory for him and still a terrible thing, war. I will say a prayer today for all those men, on both sides of the lines, who gave their lives following orders


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 09:36 AM

Isn't it "The Green Hills of Tyree", not Tyrol?

The respect is for the ones who faced death and the people who lost them. Never as a reason to justify the mistakes that led to the wars, or as a foundation for new wars.

We call it Remembrance Day.

Remembrance Day

I remember the day when first we marched away,
And so gaily they cheered us in the crowd,
And it all seemed so clear, we were here and they were there,
"Do and Dare, go on out and make us proud"
But it wasn't quite the same
When we came to where we came.
It was plain there was nothing we could do,
But were here for the show,
We'll be here until we go,
Don't we know it won't be long before we're through.

And we're down in the dark as our world is blown apart,
With our hearts in teh bottom of our boots.
And we're tired and we're sore,
And we just can't take much more,
And at times it seems we're treated worse than brutes.
But hear us joke, hear us sing,
Hear us say "God Save the King",
Why you'd think we were happy here in hell,
And we'll stand side by side,
And we'll mever say goodbye,
And we'll die, and thye'll say that we done well.

Well it's past and it's gone,
And it's over, right or wrong.
We were young and we answered to the call.
And it's all far away,
but it seems like yesterday,
Though they say it all meant nothing after all.

And each November once again we will gather in the rain,
We still remain, though we're ading fast away,
And God knows it's getting late,
As we drink to long lost mates,
And to the day we'll be together once again.
So hear us joke, hear us sing,
Hear us say "God Save the King",
Why you'd think we were happy here in hell,
And we'll stand side by side,
And we'll mever say goodbye,
And we'll die, and they'll say that we done well.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: PeteBoom
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 09:55 AM

Green Hills of Tyrol is a Retreat March dating from the later 1800's. The lyrics above were set to it by Andy Stewart. Green Hills of Tyree is another tune altogether.

Played the Remembrance Day ceremonies on Sunday in Windsor.

Regards -

Pete


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: katlaughing
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 10:20 AM

Alba, our own Art Thieme does a beautiful rendition of that song; it's how I learned it.

Rapaire and jimmyt, I can barely see for the tears, but am so grateful for your sharing.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Mickey191
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 11:41 AM

In honor of Eddie Brown who was a POW in an unknown Stalag for 3 years. He came home, looking as death warmed over. He was the sweetest young man who gave me rides in a rumble seat car. He lived a year but succumbed to the TB he aquired whilst a prisoner. God Bless You Eddie.

In honor of Etzel Stone, who also was a POW in Germany. He too came home, but was so far gone, whiskey was his only solace. Despite his beautiful young wife, he could not forget. Was found frozen to death in a railroad shack.

In honor of John Stein, one lovely Sunday in December, sitting under a tree at Schofield Barracks.
He was wounded badly, and was in a coma for 2 months.He carried with him forever, a terrible stutter, as a result of his injuries.

In honor of William Hennings, 18 years old and burried in Belgium. Left a Mother & Sister to grieve forever for the unfulfilled promise of his life.

In honor of Henry McDermott, a POW in Korea. Imprisoned in an underground cage for 3 months. Nearly died from starvation & disease, he too aquired a stutter. Came back & raised a lovely family. Died too young.


There never was a good war, or a bad peace.
Ben Franklin


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Mickey191
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 12:34 PM

I graduated from High School with Robert. He was a nice, quiet young man.

Daily Argus-Sep't. 30, 1970

A serviceman who returned unscathed from war service and who was killed in an auto accident last Friday in Sonoma,California, was buried with full military honors today at Pine Lawn National Cemetery.

CPO Robert Edward Hanks 33, a veteran of the Vietnam War was a chief petty officer of communications with the Navy on Skaggs Island, California.
During his two years of service in Vietnam he received a Presidential Unit Citation,a Navy Unit Commendation Medal with one Bronze Star, a Meritorious Unit Commendation Medal, Good Conduct Medal with Two Bronze Stars, the Vietnam Service Medal with Four Bronze Stars and the Republic of Vietnam Campaign Medal. He also was the recipient of the National Defense Service Medal.

While in Vietnam he served on patrol ships and earned his Gold Wings on rescue helicopters. He returned to the states last February, after having been in Vietnam four times.

We never know where our heroes come from.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: kendall
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 01:03 PM

I have had a medal for many years, and have never worn it until today. I never got shot at, and I never shot anyone. I wear it to honor the veterans who DID get shot at, and who had to shoot others.
War is the ultimate failure.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 01:11 PM

I met up with old friends still in my old Reserve unit last Sunday, which we call remembrance Sunday. They were mobilised and were with 3Para in Iraq. They were in the thick of it and OK but two others were badly wounded in the Chinook that was shot up. Call up of reserves is still going on and I might yet be called by my present unit.
Both my parents were in the RAF from 1940 right through.

We call today Armistice Day. A new memorial was unveiled in Hyde Park to honour Australian dead of both wars. Also this week a WW1 trench with several British dead was uncovered in Flanders. Dozens of remains get turned up by farming there every year.

Mary, I sing Gethsemane to the tune of Derwent Water Farewell. I will sing it tonight at our monthly sing at Benington, putting on an old gas cape and helmet for the occasion. Also Home Lads Home.

Rest for horse and man,
Keith.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Metchosin
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 01:17 PM

Lest we forget...thank you Bob.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Rapparee
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 01:35 PM

My friend, Bob, enlisted back in '65. Since he had been working as a hospital orderly the Army sent him to school to become a medic. In 1966 he was at Qua Non, South Vietnam. In 1967 he was home and we'd sometimes talk about things he'd seen and done over a beer or six. I can tell what he told me, but you wouldn't understand it. If you've been a combat medic you *know*.

By the time I'd gotten back from my own stint overseas I hardly saw Bob at all. He was back in school, studying horology (it's not what you think, you have dirty mind). Eventually he moved West, got married, came back to Illinois. I phoned him a couple of times over the years and we would always make plans to have a beer together and catch up.

We never did, and three years ago he died. Stomach cancer. Brought on by the cigarettes he couldn't stop smoking, the doctor said. Cigarettes he once told me he was sure would kill him. His lighter said, "Though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death I will fear no evil, for I am the meanest bastard in the valley." Bob got the lighter in 'Nam. He left a widow and two sons.

Last year I visited his grave, poked a hole deep in the soil, and dropped two twenty-two caliber cartridges in. Bob would have understood, and I think that he appreciated the gesture.

Visit The Wall in Washington DC sometime. Remember that Vietnam, like every war, continues to kill even when the fighting is long over.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Hawker
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 05:38 PM

My Grandfather, John Blakey, served in the Northumberland Fusileers in WWI and was at Passcendale, he lied about his age to go to war, being 1 year too young. He was one of the few who came home, shellshocked and a different man to the boy who went to war. He lived the rest of his life with a stammer. He wrote fantastic poems, one of which is called 'The PBI' about the Poor Bloody Infantry.
I sing it to the star of the county down, as I feel, as a half Irish fiddle player he would have proably set it to something familiar. I also have his and his brother's fiddles, which also went to the front, one has been repaired with a piece of shell case!

PBI
We sing a song as we swing along
An' a bit of a rude one too
From spit and shine it's back to the line,
Back for another do
We know for some it's Kingdom come
'Cos some of us will die
But there ain't no fuss for the likes of us
For we are the PBI

We've played our pranks, we've spent our francs
We've boozed and gambled too
We've tried our wiles with airs and smiles
On demoiselles beaucoup
But for all our swank we've drawn a blank
We didn't get the eye
For Madamoiselle, she knows full well
The ways of the PBI

We've shared our jokes we've shared our smokes
Swapped snaps of wives and gals
Told tales of woe and borrowed dough
And always we were pals
For the blokes what fight on your left and right
When the gaff is raging high
They play the game dedspite the name
Of 'scruffy PBI'

We went on the binge at Popperhinge
We toasted Kaiser Bill
We raised a storm at Ouderdom
They talk about it still
In the estaminet at Aubignay
We left the cellar dry
Did the froggies care? 'Non! c'est la guerre!'
And C'est la PBI'

We've written home, we've made it known
That everything is bon
We've got olf fritz licked into fits
And the war is nearly won
We're full o' the joys, like all the boys
An' our leave is drawing nigh
We'll stand or fall, liars all!
The shameless PBI

So we're off again to the old refrain
Of the naughty Mademoiselle
We singf away although we may
Be marching straight to hell
For you can bet Old Jerry's set
To blow us all sky high
An' we bless the day that we went away
To join the PBI

We sing a song as we swing along
An' it may sound rude to you
But things ain't nice and men ain't mice
In the place we're going to
We're for the top, a special op
An' some of us will die
But there ain't no fuss for the likes of us
For we are the PBI.

I PENNED THIS REPLY TO HIS AND ALL THE OTHER MEN WHO HAVE GONE TO WAR

You sang your song as you swung along
An' though I wasn't there to hear
Two minutes silence make for remembrance sake
On the 11th day, 11th month each year
Wearing poppies red, for the mass bloodshed
Passchendale, where the Gaff raged high!
There's nearly none left at all to answer the call
Of Brave old PBI



If anybody does use it, our of respect to my Grandfather please state that he wrote it, whilst at the front.

God bless,
Lucy


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Gareth
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 07:11 PM

" And the endless North Atlantic,
With the Convoys to and fro."


My late father, who went from Normandy to Kiel, at the sharp end of XXX Corp would still wake up on the odd night screaming, as the memories overtook him.

He survived, his father, my grandfather, a merchant seaman did not, Benjamin Williams, (DSM - Galipoli.)

In 1939 his ship was "fished" running into Norway - The survivors, he was mate, were picked up by a German merchant ship, fortunately running north to Norway.

I only have this second hand, but the German Skipper was only to pleased to discharge the survivors to the Norwegians - Post 1945 the German Captain and my Grandmother exchanged correspondance on many occasions up until the German Captains death in the early 50's.

No malice there, as it should be at sea.

Grandfather was repatiated. Further sinkings happened, including being picked out of the water by a US of A Coast Gaurd vessel.

In my wardrobe, about 3 feet away from this computer, hangs a US of A Coast Guard Jacket - given to him as survivors clothing.

He went master, then came PQ17.

No now is a time to reflect, and honour the dead and thier ways of passing, by land, sea, or air, and also reflect upon the wounded, physically, or mentally.

Gareth


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: katlaughing
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 07:16 PM

Lucy, well-penned, thank you so much for sharing your grandfather's poem.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Gareth
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 07:17 PM

I think it might be appropriate to draw this(Click 'Ere) to 'Catter's attention.


Gareth


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Peace
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 07:28 PM

My grandfather fought at Mons and Ypres. He got some gas there, too. My dad fought with the Canadians in Italy, and he took part in the Normandy invasion. My step-dad fought in France, also. Today I remember two young men, friends of mine, who didn't come back from Vietnam. All five of these people are gone from my life, but please know you will never be gone from my memory. I hope the day will come when we truly turn our swords into ploughshares. Yes, it's time we did that.


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: MarkS
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 08:20 PM

Thank you all
A veteran is a great thing to be, but maybe not such a great thing to become.
MarkS
Vietnam 68-69


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Subject: RE: Request respectful Veterans Day Thread
From: Rapparee
Date: 11 Nov 03 - 09:29 PM

Sgt., Infantry, Korea, 1969.


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