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BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)

Beccy 09 Apr 03 - 12:41 PM
GUEST,Nosediver 09 Apr 03 - 12:44 PM
DonMeixner 09 Apr 03 - 01:05 PM
bflat 09 Apr 03 - 01:08 PM
Keith A of Hertford 09 Apr 03 - 02:05 PM
katlaughing 09 Apr 03 - 02:18 PM
Stilly River Sage 09 Apr 03 - 02:20 PM
Ebbie 09 Apr 03 - 02:31 PM
Lepus Rex 09 Apr 03 - 02:45 PM
Steve in Idaho 09 Apr 03 - 02:46 PM
McGrath of Harlow 09 Apr 03 - 02:48 PM
Steve in Idaho 09 Apr 03 - 02:57 PM
Beccy 09 Apr 03 - 03:07 PM
Lepus Rex 09 Apr 03 - 03:11 PM
Wolfgang 09 Apr 03 - 03:14 PM
Penny S. 09 Apr 03 - 03:47 PM
Beccy 09 Apr 03 - 03:56 PM
Wolfgang 09 Apr 03 - 03:59 PM
Beccy 09 Apr 03 - 04:04 PM
Liz the Squeak 09 Apr 03 - 04:04 PM
Dead Horse 09 Apr 03 - 04:40 PM
Rapparee 09 Apr 03 - 04:48 PM
GUEST,Claymore 09 Apr 03 - 05:08 PM
Forum Lurker 09 Apr 03 - 05:12 PM
SINSULL 09 Apr 03 - 05:20 PM
Stilly River Sage 09 Apr 03 - 05:31 PM
mg 09 Apr 03 - 05:51 PM
Lepus Rex 09 Apr 03 - 06:12 PM
Forum Lurker 09 Apr 03 - 06:22 PM
GUEST,Claymore 09 Apr 03 - 06:41 PM
GUEST,Norton1 09 Apr 03 - 07:06 PM
Bobert 09 Apr 03 - 07:24 PM
Lepus Rex 09 Apr 03 - 07:34 PM
Forum Lurker 09 Apr 03 - 07:55 PM
Greg F. 09 Apr 03 - 08:27 PM
GUEST,Claymore 09 Apr 03 - 08:31 PM
robomatic 09 Apr 03 - 08:46 PM
Lepus Rex 09 Apr 03 - 09:01 PM
GUEST,petr 09 Apr 03 - 09:13 PM
Bobert 09 Apr 03 - 10:04 PM
mg 09 Apr 03 - 10:16 PM
Bobert 09 Apr 03 - 10:24 PM
Forum Lurker 09 Apr 03 - 10:28 PM
Bobert 09 Apr 03 - 10:45 PM
Peg 09 Apr 03 - 11:59 PM
Forum Lurker 10 Apr 03 - 12:04 AM
Peg 10 Apr 03 - 12:09 AM
Forum Lurker 10 Apr 03 - 12:40 AM
DougR 10 Apr 03 - 12:49 AM
Forum Lurker 10 Apr 03 - 12:54 AM
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Subject: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Beccy
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 12:41 PM

Did you all see the scene of the group of Iraqis beating on the statue in the square in the center of Baghdad? I wish I knew what the man who kept hitting it with a sledgehammer was saying. He turned and yelled something toward the journalists every single time he hit the base of the statue.

According to the Washington Post (linked to through Drudge), the man is a Baghdad Imam. I'd love to read more about him.

What do you think of the jubilation of those present when the Marines helped them by using a steel rope and a tank to pull it down?

Have you all heard the difference in the reports of those journalists who up until now had to vet their reports through Iraqi government handlers?

This is truly amazing stuff. What do you think?

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: GUEST,Nosediver
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 12:44 PM

Oh, yes, the televised war! Did you see the boy with his limbs blown off - I believe he is an orphan now. truly amazing stuff indeed.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: DonMeixner
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 01:05 PM

Nosediver,

Did you see the people cheering and hugging the marines. Did you see the car loads of people who blew themselves up as suicides. Did you see the truck loads of water and rice. Did you see the Iraqi soldiers keeping people from the food. Did you see the boat loads of food in the harbor and the once burning oil wells being put out? Did you see the pictures of the tug boats with mines for the harbor entrances and the explosives wired to the well heads. Did you hear of the people who risked their own lives to save from torture a wounded GI. Did you see the towns people accidently killed by GIs.   Did you see bombs exploding in precisely targeted military sites. Did you see the people taking back their own lives from an evil man.

Enough irony to go around don't you think?

Don


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: bflat
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 01:08 PM

I don't have any answers but the unleashing of all that anger is indeed powerful.

Ellen


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 02:05 PM

Good news at last.
Today was a good day.
If the Iraquis themselves are relieved to see us, who will tell them that they are wrong?
Keith.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: katlaughing
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 02:18 PM

NPR had a specialist on who said the reception was not as jubilant as was shown on tv, around other parts of the country. She also said, even in Baghdad, there was not as much welcoming among the people as the *liberators* expected. This is still all so up in the air.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 02:20 PM

This morning we saw what amounts to what one glimpses through a keyhole; cameras happened to be available in that one square because it was across the street from the hotel where hundreds of journalists have been staying.

Anyone see The English Patient? Statues were booby trapped because it was known that revellers would approach them to tear them down.

No argument that Saddam was a bad guy. A lot of improvement can be seen for the future if his family goes missing. Some other things folks were unaware of might improve also, like this. But it wasn't our war to fight, and a heckuva lot of people have already died, and many more are going to die. The worst is yet to come, as looting and revenge killing sets in.

Don't get carried away by that man beside the fallen statue. He is the manifestation of wishful thinking, but it's not "real." It's "reel."

SRS


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Ebbie
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 02:31 PM

There are disaffected people in every country, people who would be overjoyed at the promise of the betterment of their lives. There are some even in the USA, people who have always fallen through the cracks, people who feel, rightly or wrongly, that they have never been given a chance. If another administration came into US government promising a radical life change for these people, they too would be dancing in the streets.

The same thing is true in Syria, Iran, North Korea - in fact, all over the world.

I agree with those who see this as a narrow slice in a small pie. I just hope that 10 years, 5 years, 5 months, from now they will be happy with where their country has gone. I even more fervently hope that the USA can be happy with what we have wrought.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 02:45 PM

A couple hundred people, out of FIVE MILLION in Baghdad, show up to cheer the demolition of a Saddam statue. Fucking wow. Put a 40-foot piñata in downtown Chicago, and you'll get a similar response. People like parties, and people like parades. Next week, those same people will be pelting those same marines with rocks. The fall of the Berlin wall, it wasn't.

It was entertaining, though. Especially the part where some redneck marine tried to wrap Saddamstatues's head in a US flag, then when ordered to remove it, balled it up like trash and tossed it down.

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Steve in Idaho
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 02:46 PM

"Don't get carried away by that man beside the fallen statue. He is the manifestation of wishful thinking, but it's not "real." It's "reel.""

I saw a similar thing when the Berlin wall came down. That was real. I'd prefer to think that this is too. If you look for the negative you'll find it - I'm hopeful that this is indeed an opportunity for the Iraqi people to find their own voice.

I'm also hopeful that this will give other despots, who are less tolerant, a window to look out of for the possibility of change for them also. It was a nice picture of the statue going away.

Steve


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 02:48 PM

When the British Soldiers arrived in Belfast back in 1969 they were sincerely welcomed by people from the Nationalist community as a kind of liberation and protection. Cups of tea and cakes.

They think they've got their country back. If it turns out they haven't they are not going to be best pleased. I hope it turns out they won't feel betrayed. Think of the Russians who believed that things were going to get so much better, and they got incomparably worse for most of them.

Noone is denying that Saddam's was a really nasty regime. But the priocess by which he has (touch wood) been disposed of is likely to turn outr to have some terrible longterm consequences. And thousands of decent people have had ther lives torn to pieces. Well over one thousand civilians killed already - that's lower than was predicted, but it's a horrible price that's been paid. And more to come.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Steve in Idaho
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 02:57 PM

Maybe McGrath - but we were being held hostage by the terorists anyway I believe. And to appease that mentality does nothing but embolden them. I'm hopeful that the Iraqis will get their country back and go on to great things. It could be the centerpiece of change that reverbrates throughout the region in a good way.

Just my .02 worth

Steve


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Beccy
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 03:07 PM

No one was denying he was a bad guy, but you're all stupid for being moved by several people being glad that his regime is toppling...

Whether it was 500 or 5 million, what I saw was a group of people tasting some freedom for the first time in 30 years and whether or not you like it, it moves me. Small slice or not, that was genuine.

"Don't get carried away by that man beside the fallen statue. He is the manifestation of wishful thinking, but it's not "real." It's "reel.""

I see. I cannot be moved by some genuine human drama. So does that mean I cannot be moved by the sacrifice made by "Mohammad", the man who risked his life to save the life of PFC Lynch? Was he a product of wishful thinking?

Nice touch of drama about throwing the flag down, Lepus, but he didn't throw it down. He stowed it on his gear. Big difference.

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 03:11 PM

No, Beccy, the guy who he tossed it down to "stowed it on his gear," if that's what you want to call stuffing a balled-up US flag in his belt. I though that sort of thing bothered "you people?"

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Wolfgang
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 03:14 PM

A couple hundred people, out of FIVE MILLION in Baghdad

And I thought this type of argumentation comes only from politicians trying to play down some demonstration that doesn't fit in their frame of mind, like for instance a demonstration for peace during the last weeks.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Penny S.
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 03:47 PM

Actually, when I heard this on the radio, I thought I was listening to something completely different. Just before 6 pm, BBC R4 played it as if it were live. I turned it on while I was in the car, and heard something like "They've got the rope round Saddam's neck", and the rest of the report referring to the staue as Saddam. It was chilling.

Penny


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Beccy
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 03:56 PM

"You people"?????? Wow, Lepus. Your tolerance of diversity is astonishing. Actually, the flag is a piece of cloth to me. While it is symbolic, I do not believe it should be afforded more care than a human being. Let's see... let the soldier fall because he's trying to properly fold a flag or let him keep his footing and stuff the flag into his belt. I'm going for stuffing the flag into his belt. You're awfully bitter about this.

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Wolfgang
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 03:59 PM

I can tell that many of the Iraqis living in Germany are very pleased and they show it on the streets with car ralleys and so on. They have no incentive like a parade for showing up they just want to show and share their joy.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Beccy
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 04:04 PM

Wolfgang- The same phenomenon is occuring in Detroit and its suburbs where there is a large Iraqi exile population. One man who was interviewed chose to be fired from his job rather than miss the celebrations.

Tag,

Beccy


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 04:04 PM

They were shouting 'Infidel', 'blasphemer', 'Murderer' and other such things that have been forbidden since he came to power.

LTS


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Dead Horse
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 04:40 PM

AND they did it spontaneously, out of sight of camera for the most part. They also exhibited displays of religeous freedom denied by Saddam. The most important thing is that other arab countries also saw it, and are now not so sure that we in the west are hell bent on their destruction.
I fleetingly wished that the "human shield" were beneath that statue as it fell, then I realised that would make me as bad as the despot himself. But I hope THEY saw, and thought, and then felt as stupid and misguided as I believe them to be.
"The Berlin Wall it is not" It is to those citizens of Baghdad.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Rapparee
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 04:48 PM

Look here.

And the Iraqi embassy in Brazil is reportedly burning its papers.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: GUEST,Claymore
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 05:08 PM

Like the Japanese after Pearl Harbor...

And Bush may always have problems with his nouns, but he is spot on with his verbs.

And the man of the hour is Blair, who led his people out of the darkness into the sun. He will go down in history as one of the great Prime Ministers of Britain.

And as the old Arab saying goes; "While mangey dogs bark, the caravan moves on..."


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 05:12 PM

Claymore-Tell me exactly how Britain's involvement in this war will benefit the nation, seeing as how they aren't going to get any of the money involved in rebuilding Iraq once we've finished blowing it up? All I see is soldiers killed by their allies and by accident in a war they had no reason to fight. What possible good could Britain realize from this?


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: SINSULL
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 05:20 PM

American soldiers have been repeatedly reprimanded for displaying American flags. The fear is that it will be seen as the symbol of a conquering army. Thanks for clearing that up Beccy. I had a hard time understanding why he would have thrown it on the ground.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 05:31 PM

    I see. I cannot be moved by some genuine human drama. So does that mean I cannot be moved by the sacrifice made by "Mohammad", the man who risked his life to save the life of PFC Lynch? Was he a product of wishful thinking?


Your words, Beccy. I said don't get carried away with it, you're only seeing a tiny percentage of what is going on there, and that is still the case. It's "reel" because it's all a media show right now, what they can get to, what they choose to show, what they're allowed to show.

The drama and extreme focus on Private Lynch is so much simulacra, hyper-real in the hands of the speculating media and salivating screenwriters. She's lucky to be alive, it's too bad she was there in the first place, and a lot of stereotypes are going to be hoist up the pole along with the American flag when that dog-and-pony show makes it to the silver screen.

Considering you asked "what do you think?" in your opening salvo, I think you should be able to accept the responses posted without arguing with them. Otherwise it's just trolling.

SRS


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: mg
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 05:51 PM

I would hope that people can rejoice with the people of Iraq, even if they sincerely feel that the Iraqi good fortune in being relieved of a tyrant who bathes his torturees in acid is a byproduct of our stealing their land for oil, fulfilling Bush's father psychodrama and/or his destiny in Biblical prophecies etc. It's a good day for them, a good day for us, a good day for the world. The world is cranking and cranking toward more peace and stability. Awful things can still happen, but with more people lurching toward freedom fewer and fewer we can hope.

Be happy for them.

mg


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 06:12 PM

I personally don't care what he did with the stupid flag, Beccy. I just found it amusing that one of these "patriots" would not only insultingly use our beloved flag as some sort of head-dress for a filthy outdoor statue, but would also discard it like used kleenex when told to take it down. I'm no expert on flag etiquette, but I always thought things like this were no-nos...

And trust me, I'm very tolerant of diversity. Honestly, I wouldn't trade you for a dozen of the usual Mudcat liberals. :)

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 06:22 PM

mary garvey-We can hope that they have not traded in one dictator for a longer-lived and more powerful one. I am glad that Saddam is gone, but can't help but wonder whether it will actually benefit the Iraqi people in the long run.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: GUEST,Claymore
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 06:41 PM

Forum L, I am obviously not a diplomat, but it's my belief that Britain is now the number two nation in the world, and may just be number one in moral standing, for the very reasons you have stated in your question; it had little to gain but it's soul. While it was Bush that made the decision to go, it was Blair who provided the compelling and heart-felt language that gave purpose to this endeavor, to both Britons and Americans.

As most politicians know, political capital must be spent to do any good. Clinton wasted his at every turn, but Bush used what little he had to turn the last elections into the bare mandate he needed. All of Europe and most of the world must bend a knee to Blair in order to get anything done on the world's stage. The French, Germans and Russians will never admit it, but they will not see Bush except through Blair. And while Thatcher made Britain a major player, on par with Reagan and Gorbachov, Blair has given moral force to the British view of things.

The UN has no credibility except through Blair. There will be conflicts resolved, economies changed and regions elevated through Blair's policies. He is far more liberal than Bush, but he has earned his place at the table, somtimes following, sometimes leading, but tested in the same furnace as Bush. And unlike Clinton, the Bushes value loyalty above all else.

The eternal shame is, that like Thatcher, (and Churchill) the Brits may be the only people not know what they have. The rest of the world does...


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: GUEST,Norton1
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 07:06 PM

"Our beloved flag" - Hmm - did not know you assigned that to yourself Lepus Rex. Your prior postings had to do with your support of Iraq. Are you just angry that your regime fell?

And in my experience you have zero tolerance for diversity Will. You're just an a-hole - but I'm tolerant of that with you. As usual you are off tangent and trolling to your delight!

Not bad for a chubby skinhead! And I just loooovveee You too -

:)

Steve


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Bobert
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 07:24 PM

The only things that are being shown on western television are scenes that are *approved*. There is an entire war that is not being shown. Just 5 minutes of uncut, uneditied in any hospital in Baghdad would prove to be very sobering, indeed. Or a ride on the highway to Syria where one burned out civilian auto after another litters the highway with burned corpses, most of whom were civilians trying to escape the carnage.

Yeah, the US media will pump this up with images of a dumb statue falling over but won't dare show one danged civilian corpse or hospital ward.

But, hey, we got God on our side. Right?

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 07:34 PM

You're right, Norton1. How can I call myself a tolerant man when I have no tolerance for violent stalkers who hang out on fascist/racist/sexist/homophobic forums? Thanks for opening my eyes, "Steve!"

Oh, and Beccy, I looked around for a photo of the marine wadding the flag up, but all I could find was a photo or two of the rub-down he gave Saddam. Inspiring!

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 07:55 PM

Claymore-the UN has no credibility through Blair or Bush. The two of them have decided that they need not pay attention to the rest of the Security Council, the General Council, or world opinion. Blair's "moral standing" is presently that of a leader who ignores international law and the will of the people to support an illegal war that his country gains nothing for, save the friendship of the world's largest rogue state.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Greg F.
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 08:27 PM

He's Back Again!!! #2

Ex-Corporal Snortin' Norton Whitefeather Neff, fearless, rugged leatherneck; the man who never walked away from a fight, the man who threatens people of opposing viewpoints with assault, the man who decries 'cowards' and 'wimps' and 'wusses' and 'bottom feeders' and dares them to goat it toe-to-toe...

The red-blooded, two-fisted American Hero who felt so personally threatened by a couple of posts to an internet web-site that he had to run whining and crying for help to a mouth-breather & knuckle-dragger's cyber clubhouse to recruit a lynch mob of cyber-louts with ridiculous junior-high school "macho"[sic] screen names to come galloping to his rescue??? One sick puppy!- simper, fido.

Hail the conquering hero! A regular Profile in Courage. Welcome back.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: GUEST,Claymore
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 08:31 PM

Why thank you...


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: robomatic
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 08:46 PM

It was very good to see the statue come down. Now we've got the real work. Making sure that what the statue REPRESENTED is vanquished.

Congratulations to the U.S., British, and Australian soldiers who brought this first part of the challenge off so well (I think I heard there are even some Poles out there).

Robo


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 09:01 PM

Yes, congratulations, heroic troops!

---Lepus Rex


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: GUEST,petr
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 09:13 PM

there were also slovaks, czech, germans, danes, hungarians, and morocco
contributed a herd of monkeys for mine clearing
-
and Mcgrath of Harlow, regarding Russia, perhaps in recent years they may be worse off, but they bankrupted themselves after years of military spending.
and Im pretty sure theyre better off then under Stalins purges of the 30's or the millions sent to the gulag.

under the Czech communists people werent even allowed to have vegetable gardens at one point - because they might just grow vegetables and sell them in capitalistic markets.
what the fuck do you know.
or leper rex , how many of you actually lived under a dictatorship?
petr


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Bobert
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 10:04 PM

Geeeze, deja vu......

Ahhh, we were talkin' about symbols and got hyjacked with microscopic sybolism. Can we get back to the subject at hand or have we come to a point where all discussions end up in same place.

Well, the news ,made a big thing about the statue coming down. Heck, they pulled one down yesterday, too. Does that one count?

I heard the announcer making some rediculous statement about how in years to come we would all remember just where we were when we say this! Ha! Waht a joke. This ain't the Kennedy assasination here folks. Yeah, if you wanta pick you favorite moment of this sterilized coverage of an event where l.ots of folks have been hurt and killed as being one of those monments that defines your life, fine. Knock your self out.

This was an aviodable war that will most likely haunt the US for decades to come and I'm having trouble finding something suitable for framing from it.

Hey, I might be more excited about it if it weren't for the folks who have been planning it for years.

And, BTW, anyone want to go on record here of saying exactly why it was fought?

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: mg
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 10:16 PM

I will go on record. Pretty much for the reasons we were given. Of course I could be wrong and the Trilateral Commission might be behind it all. But there was a sadistic torturer with an itch for more blood on his hands. I have no idea whether he was involved in 9/11 or has ties to Osama. He stands on his own merits. He failed to comply with the terms of his capitulation in the last war, starved his people (in addition to the torture), spit in the face of the world and needed to go before he spread his abuses, or people taking courage from him spread theirs.

mg


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Bobert
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 10:24 PM

Like I asked, what was this war fought for? No offense, mary, but I don't have a clue what you have answered. " the reasons that were given" leaves a vast number of choices...

Meanwhile, we turn on out televisions and watch Isrealis shooting civilian Palestinians in one corner of the screen, the US shooting Iraqi civilians in another and the Oakland Police shooting American civilians in another...

Is it too much to ask why this is happening when the US was attacked by Sauidi's?

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 10:28 PM

mary garvey-Saddam is all of those things. So are many other dictators, and some of them, such as Kim Jong-Il, pose a greater threat to us. I don't know why we chose Saddam as our target, or possibly first target, but I can't think of any answers that make me feel better about the policy.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Bobert
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 10:45 PM

If I'm a Black kid who's just been arrested, beaten into confessing to a crime I didn't commit in Texas, appointed incomepent defense cousel who fall asleep during thr trial, and my appeal is turned down by George Bush the night before I'm killed, then I couldn't care less what your definitions of bad folks is?.....

Sorry, I drifted...

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Peg
Date: 09 Apr 03 - 11:59 PM

wow, Greg F, my thoughts exactly!

I think that anyone who goes into a completely unrelated forum and goads the thugs who generally hang out there to come onto the Mudcat as anonymous GUESTS to stir up trouble, and furthermore goads these latent homosexual wanna-be-tough-but-I'm-not wife-beating flag-waving gun-toting RETARDS to go cyber-stalking after the folks on Mudcat, ought to be BANNED from the Mudcat.

Anyone?

If you really want a fight, go enlist, for fuck's sake.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 10 Apr 03 - 12:04 AM

Peg-While I can't disagree with most of your classification of this particular set of characters, I have to wonder where you got the idea that they were closeted gays. It seems an unnecessary and inflammatory addendum.


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Peg
Date: 10 Apr 03 - 12:09 AM

Lurker:

I did not say "closeted gays."
I said "latent homosexuals."
There is a VERY BIG difference...


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 10 Apr 03 - 12:40 AM

Peg-What is the difference, and how did you draw your conclusions?


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: DougR
Date: 10 Apr 03 - 12:49 AM

kat: sad. You dont' believe your own eyes. You have to rely on a NPR "specialist" to tell you what you are seeing. The live video images of the people in that park could not be faked. Why are you so upset that the Iraqi people may, at last, have a shot at a decent life?

Perhaps you would be rejoicing if Slick Willy or Ralphie Nader or Al boy were president. However, it never would have happend had any of those jokers been president.

DougR


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Subject: RE: BS: The statue took a nose dive (literally!)
From: Forum Lurker
Date: 10 Apr 03 - 12:54 AM

DougR-Of course "live video" cannot be faked. It would be absolutely impossible to falsify a timestamp, dress a number of Iraqi immigrants to look like Baghdad natives, and film them. Also, while it might be true that none of the aforementioned politicians wouldn't have gotten us into this war, some of think that would be a good thing.


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