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BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?

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breezy 05 Dec 02 - 08:07 AM
Bullfrog Jones 05 Dec 02 - 08:04 AM
sian, west wales 05 Dec 02 - 05:59 AM
Nigel Parsons 05 Dec 02 - 04:44 AM
Gareth 04 Dec 02 - 04:50 PM
Bert 04 Dec 02 - 04:16 PM
Cluin 04 Dec 02 - 03:43 PM
GUEST,Twickers 04 Dec 02 - 03:34 PM
GUEST,? 04 Dec 02 - 03:13 PM
GUEST,Better Late Than Not 04 Dec 02 - 02:12 PM
GUEST,Hugh Jamton 04 Dec 02 - 05:29 AM
songs2play 04 Dec 02 - 02:55 AM
GUEST 03 Dec 02 - 08:49 PM
GUEST 03 Dec 02 - 08:44 PM
Skipper Jack 03 Dec 02 - 02:44 PM
Crane Driver 02 Dec 02 - 05:22 PM
Gareth 02 Dec 02 - 04:01 PM
Skipper Jack 02 Dec 02 - 02:59 PM
Nigel Parsons 02 Dec 02 - 06:21 AM
Stu 02 Dec 02 - 05:48 AM
songs2play 02 Dec 02 - 05:41 AM
Bullfrog Jones 02 Dec 02 - 04:37 AM
GUEST,Dave Williams, USA 02 Dec 02 - 12:47 AM
Gareth 01 Dec 02 - 06:34 PM
GUEST,Bill 01 Dec 02 - 06:14 PM
GUEST,Gray D 30 Nov 02 - 07:27 PM
GUEST 30 Nov 02 - 07:15 PM
Gareth 30 Nov 02 - 04:53 PM
Skipper Jack 30 Nov 02 - 04:00 PM
Crane Driver 30 Nov 02 - 11:34 AM
Llanfair 29 Nov 02 - 04:37 PM
Bullfrog Jones 29 Nov 02 - 09:26 AM
HuwG 29 Nov 02 - 09:00 AM
Bullfrog Jones 29 Nov 02 - 08:41 AM
Gurney 28 Nov 02 - 08:08 PM
Penny S. 28 Nov 02 - 07:09 PM
Gareth 28 Nov 02 - 06:47 PM
Llanfair 28 Nov 02 - 05:53 PM
GUEST,Guest 28 Nov 02 - 05:34 PM
sian, west wales 28 Nov 02 - 09:58 AM
Skipper Jack 28 Nov 02 - 09:06 AM
GUEST,Bill 27 Nov 02 - 07:37 PM
GUEST,Blushing at the memory of it 27 Nov 02 - 04:14 PM
sian, west wales 27 Nov 02 - 03:37 PM
Gareth 27 Nov 02 - 02:21 PM
Skipper Jack 27 Nov 02 - 02:07 PM
GUEST,Milead 26 Nov 02 - 08:04 AM
Crane Driver 25 Nov 02 - 09:04 PM
CET 25 Nov 02 - 08:19 PM
Gareth 25 Nov 02 - 06:58 PM
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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: breezy
Date: 05 Dec 02 - 08:07 AM

organised th snorbens folk club


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Bullfrog Jones
Date: 05 Dec 02 - 08:04 AM

Portmeirion! Clough Williams Ellis's joyous, crazy fantasy village (home to The Prisoner TV series). If you haven't been -- go!

BJ


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: sian, west wales
Date: 05 Dec 02 - 05:59 AM

I see we mentioned Shirley Bassey, but not Iris Williams.

We also provided the scenery for a number of films, including Inn of the Sixth Happiness.

Didn't we provide the practice reservoirs for the Dambusters mission?

Re: Dafydd Iwan, I can't think which American singer he might parallel. He started out doing Welsh versions of Guthry, and a lot of the Burl Ives repetoir. I don't like comparing anyone with Seeger, but DI's songs have developed along the sames lines: some highly political, some on global issues, some just 'comfortable', some trad. etc. And, yes, his songs are very much sung by the Welsh-speaking 'folk' of Wales.

sian


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 05 Dec 02 - 04:44 AM

Heard on Radio 2 yesterday (whether jokingly or not) BBC are planning a spin-off from the soap 'Eastenders' showing 'Dot Cotton' as a wartime evacuee to the Welsh valleys.

Nigel


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Gareth
Date: 04 Dec 02 - 04:50 PM

Oh I don't know Bert, we still get aged Londoners, and Kentish People wandering in to see, and remind themselves where they spent part of their childhood.

Gareth


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Bert
Date: 04 Dec 02 - 04:16 PM

Thanks Sian.

...a folk song about the evacuee's... Now that would be one SAD song Gareth.

Perhaps a parody of The John B - "I wanna go ho-ome!"


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Cluin
Date: 04 Dec 02 - 03:43 PM

"Rough bands of sinewy men roaming the countryside, terrifying people with their close harmony singing."

---from Blackadder.

Also, from the same:

"You need a half-pint of phlegm in your throat just to pronounce the place-names. Never ask for directions in Wales... You'll be washing spit out of your hair for a fortnight!"


;)


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST,Twickers
Date: 04 Dec 02 - 03:34 PM

Wear red shirts and give us a laugh. What's the point of the saucepan song?


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST,?
Date: 04 Dec 02 - 03:13 PM

Who the hell is Daft Iwan. So long Frank LLoyd Wright. Lloyd George's daughter once kissed me but I was too young for it to turn me on. The Welsh are a great crowd to be in a bar with when they've lost a match


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST,Better Late Than Not
Date: 04 Dec 02 - 02:12 PM

1. Didn't anybody mention the greatest American architect, that huckster/genius, Frank Lloyd Wright? His home, Taliesen, in Wisconsin is rotting, but other Wright homes, such as the magnificent Falling Waters, are being restored. We need to overlook a few dozen character flaws, but who's perfect? When you come to Chicago, take the tour of his homes in Oak Park, and if you have time, go to Spring Green, Wisconsin.

2. What do you folks in Cymru think about Daffyd Iwan as a folk singer? Is he the Tom Paxton/Woody Guthrie of Wales, or what? Are his songs sung by the "folk" yng Nghymru?

Chris yn Chicago


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST,Hugh Jamton
Date: 04 Dec 02 - 05:29 AM

HughG Neil Kinnock! - the best PM we never had! Don't you remember his soubriquet "the Welsh Windbag" the pillock who made it possible to turn the Labour party from something Nye Bevan could be proud of into something Thatcher could feel at home in. On the other hand the Welsh have given us a rugby team that gives comfort to all the other 6 nation countries.


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: songs2play
Date: 04 Dec 02 - 02:55 AM

The Treorchy Male Voice Choir


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Dec 02 - 08:49 PM

St. Patrick


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Dec 02 - 08:44 PM

Merthyr West End Bowling Club


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Skipper Jack
Date: 03 Dec 02 - 02:44 PM

True, Gareth true!

Rowan will have to watch himself in Canterbury. They're renowned for slaying archbishops there!! Mind you that was quite a few years ago now!!


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Crane Driver
Date: 02 Dec 02 - 05:22 PM

Of COURSE you've got to pay to get into Wales. That's supply and demand. Getting into England is free. Otherwise, who'd bother?

BTW, Wossname Carey, the PREVIOUS Arch-thing of Canterbury, is retiring to Wales (Llanrhidian, on Gower, about 5 minutes from our folk club). We're thinking of inviting him round - I've heard he likes a bit of a sing-song on a Sunday night. Or perhaps he needs those cheap phone calls now he's a pensioner ...

Andrew


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Gareth
Date: 02 Dec 02 - 04:01 PM

Remember Skipper Jack - his phone bill will go up. After all from Llandaff to Heaven is only a local call.

Gareth


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Skipper Jack
Date: 02 Dec 02 - 02:59 PM

Let's get up to date with what the Welsh have ever done for us!

Well we Welsh boys have given you Rowan Williams!

No, he's not a rugby player and he's not a footballer in the Welsh International side. He's not a snooker player nor yet an M.P. or an up and coming actor or singer!

He is of course the new Archbishop of Canterbury.


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 02 Dec 02 - 06:21 AM

Isn't it clever the English are ? They build a bridge into our country and charge to cross it. But they put the tollgates on our side, look you!


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Stu
Date: 02 Dec 02 - 05:48 AM

Undermilk Wood. The greatest play ever written (in my opinion - I haven't read them all).

And my mum.

Diolch.


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: songs2play
Date: 02 Dec 02 - 05:41 AM

Famous Welsh - Website

Sir Geraint Evans

Shirley Bassey

Charlotte Church

Mary Hopkin

Tom Jones

Stereophonics

Andy Fairweather Low

Cerys Matthews

Shakin Stevens

Bonnie Tyler

'H' From Steps (NO - forget that one)


Cymru am byth


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Bullfrog Jones
Date: 02 Dec 02 - 04:37 AM

Specifically, Dave, my Auntie Mildred's Welsh Cakes! And Gareth, any fule kno it was Ivor Emmanuel who beat the Zulus at Rorke's Drift!

BJ


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST,Dave Williams, USA
Date: 02 Dec 02 - 12:47 AM

Dafydd ap Gwylim, 14th C poet - ranks right up there with Chaucer.

The Cymanfa Ganu

Hywl

Welsh cakes (Picau ar y Maen)

Tens of thousands of miles of steel rails used to build railroads all over the world.


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Gareth
Date: 01 Dec 02 - 06:34 PM

"And let the daughters of Rebbecca rise and destroy the gates".

Time that old tradition was revived at the Severn Bridges.

Which reminds me - What did the women of Camarthen do that the Zulu's failed to do at Roukes Drift

Answer Put the 24th of Foot to flight.

Historical Note - The 24th of Foot - South Wales Boarderes were sent into Camarthen to supress the "Rebbecca Riots" - An attempt to destroy the plethoria of tollgates around the town. For the best of reasons Ball Amunition was not issued, and the 24th were driven out by the jeers and stones of the Women of Camarthen.

Gareth


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST,Bill
Date: 01 Dec 02 - 06:14 PM

Note -you have to pay to come into Wales on the Severn Bridges.
That's because the English(or French now) don't trust the Welsh with the money.
Bill (the sound)


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST,Gray D
Date: 30 Nov 02 - 07:27 PM

Wait a minute . . . why am I a 'GUEST' now?

Have I missed something whilst I've been away?


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Nov 02 - 07:15 PM

But . . . no-one's mentioned Shadwell!


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Gareth
Date: 30 Nov 02 - 04:53 PM

If Wales was flattened out, it would be bigger than England !

Gareth


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Skipper Jack
Date: 30 Nov 02 - 04:00 PM

Author & playright Gwyn Thomas said that the Welsh Mountains are so steep that even the sheep have to change gear!


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Crane Driver
Date: 30 Nov 02 - 11:34 AM

And yes, Elvis is a Welsh name. The parish of St Elvis is near Solva, in Pembrokeshire. It's the smallest parish in Britain. St David was apparently baptised by St Elvis, so he's not been dead for longer than you think ...

Andrew


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Llanfair
Date: 29 Nov 02 - 04:37 PM

Well I didn't mention him by NAME, HuwG, but In didn't think I had to!!!
The other great poet, Taliesin, is supposed to have originated from here, and I use the term "originated" loosely. You'll know what I mean if you know the tale of the witch Ceridwen and Gwyn from Llanfair.
Cheers, Bron.


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Bullfrog Jones
Date: 29 Nov 02 - 09:26 AM

Huw -- Laver Break? Have that for breadfast do you, butty? BTW Bron mentioned Dylan Thomas, but not his name.

BJ


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: HuwG
Date: 29 Nov 02 - 09:00 AM

Penny S, be careful about mentioning the Taffia too loudly, you might wake up to find a sheep's head in your bed ... and would the court ever believe that excuse ?

The term "Taffia" has on occasion been used to describe the galaxy of acting talent from Port Talbot and nearby (Hopkins from Aberavon, Burton from Pontrhydyfen etc.), or the political figures of widely differing party affiliations but very similar interests, also from the same area (Geoffrey Howe, Clive Jenkins etc.)

It has also been widely used to describe the way in which some local authorities, or other bodies with minor tin-god powers, were allegedly sewn up by local petty oligarchs or families (bear it in mind that in some parts of the Principality, you suspect corruption when the man that gets the contract is NOT related to someone on the committee ...)



Some other Welsh worthies:

Giraldus Cambrensis (Gerald of Wales), twelfth-century chronicler and also made several attempts to make the Bishopric of St. David a metropolitan see, independent of Cambridge;

Major-General Sir Thomas Picton, one of Wellington's best officers, killed at Waterloo (he may not have been Welsh himself, but had large estates in Carmarthenshire, and the family name "Picton" is still quite common there and in Cardiganshire);

Man (anybody remember that pop group from the late seventies ?)

Gren (cartoonist for the South Wales echo, some of his images have travelled world-wide);

Incredibly, I haven't seen Dylan Thomas mentioned in this thread yet.


From the kitchens:
Bara Brith (like a currant loaf, but before you bake it, you soak the dough in cold tea overnight);
Laver Break (yes, when Snowdon erupts, we gather it in buckets)


Some other BTW's:

When Henry Tudor landed in Milford Sound in 1485, Richard III's chief lieutenant in Wales was Rhys ap Thomas. He quickly changed sides and supported Henry. There is a story that he had sworn an oath that Henry would enter Wales only across his belly (this allows a bit more latitude than, "over my dead body"). When the time came to switch sides, it was suggested that Rhys lie down and Henry step over him, but this was turned down as being too undignified. Eventually, Rhys stood under a bridge, while Henry walked or rode across it.

A figure from the Anglo-American War of 1812 was the US Brigadier-General Morgan Lewis. He was permanently a staff-officer or second-in-command to someone else, so didn't have a chance to shine. The only link I can find for him, here suggests that his parents were both native New Yorkers; but surely he could not have been Christened with so Welsh a set of names by chance ? Any US 'Catters know any more ?


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Bullfrog Jones
Date: 29 Nov 02 - 08:41 AM

The Holy Trinity --- Gareth Edwards, Phil Bennett and JPR Williams.

BJ


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Gurney
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 08:08 PM

Not many folkies mentioned... John James. Dave Bennett. Wish I could play the guitar like them.


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Penny S.
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 07:09 PM

Times change - only a little while back, and in the school holidays in England, the whole island would tilt to the west as the teachers went home to the valleys, and then back again as term began. Where are the brilliant Welsh teachers who were in every school when I started my career - or their replacements? And not Welsh myself, I owe that career to the local Taffia in my town, who decided I needed support, and got me started securely after a bad beginning - the vicar, the Education Officer and the Headteacher. I owe them.

Penny


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Gareth
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 06:47 PM

Ahhh! - GUEST, Guest

Gloucester born and Gloucester bred,
Thick in the Arm and thick in the head !


Note, on the Severn Bridges they charge you to enter Wales. Personally if I have the time to spare I deviate via Gloucester then frighten the sheep through the "Forrest". Yup !, window down and shout "Mint Sauce ! Mint Sauce !" or possibly "Welly Boots !"

And talking about deviation remember - "Wales, where men are men, and sheep are frightened."

Gareth - just lowering the tone.


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Llanfair
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 05:53 PM

"Do not go gentle into that goodnight,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light"
From memory, so probably wrong, but don't forget the poet.
Oh yes, and my Quaker ancestors who colonised Pennsylvania!!!

Cheers, Bron.


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST,Guest
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 05:34 PM

Speaking as a Goucestershire man born and bred

Free passage back across the bridge to get back to civilisation as fast as possible!

Only joking


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: sian, west wales
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 09:58 AM

Bert ...

Robert Recorde
Born: 1510 in Tenby, Wales
Died: 1558 in London, England

"Recorde virtually established the English school of mathematics and first introduced algebra into England. Recorde is best known for inventing the 'equals' symbol which appears in his book The Whetstone of Witte (1557)."

And while looking for that, I was reminded that the artists, Gwen and August John were also born in Tenby.

sian


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Skipper Jack
Date: 28 Nov 02 - 09:06 AM

Thank you Gareth!

It seems that I've got my Henry's mixed up. Of course it was Henry V11.

Skipper.


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST,Bill
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 07:37 PM

I think you'll find that Rolf Harris was originally Welsh.
Bill (the sound)


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST,Blushing at the memory of it
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 04:14 PM

What have the Welsh ever done for us?! Well, speaking only for myself, provided the setting for one of the wildest, most passionate nights of my life. It was many years ago and we were so in love. Turns out we were only in lust and eventually parted. Can't remember what he looks like but I can still remember the night. Sigh


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: sian, west wales
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 03:37 PM

TE Lawrence was born in Tremadog. Another Monmouth lad was Rolls, as in Rolls Royce (saw the statue to him and another to Henry V on the town square yesterday). Re "=", I am happy to say that I can't give you chapter and verse, not being a maths nerd, but there's a plaque up to whoever it is in Tenby. I'll see if I can find out more.

sian


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Gareth
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 02:21 PM

Skipper !

Henry V (Monmouth Hal') born in Monmouth Castle - Welsh speaking, freed the South Welsh from the Tyrany of Glendwr, and his french allies.

Henry VII ( Henry Tudwr )landed in Wales, raised local forces in South and Central Wales, and yes ended the wars of the Roses at Bosworth Field.

Gareth


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Skipper Jack
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 02:07 PM

Didn't Henry 1V bring his armies from Wales to fight Richard 111 and wasn't it the Battle of Bosworth Field that Dick 111 lost his horse and his crown? Thus, the Tudor dynasty began.
Or have I got it all wrong?


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: GUEST,Milead
Date: 26 Nov 02 - 08:04 AM

Henry V?

Geoffrey of Monmouth; without him, King Arthur would only be a rude dirty hairy British chieftain.


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Crane Driver
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 09:04 PM

Michael Hesseltine is from Swansea, Michael Howard is from Llanelli and Neil Hamilton is from Ammanford. So we can claim the downfall of the last Conservative government as a Welsh achievement, even if the replacement is a debateable improvement.

Andrew


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: CET
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 08:19 PM

Sian:

Wasn't T.E. Lawrence Irish?

Edmund


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Subject: RE: BS: What have the Welsh ever done for us ?
From: Gareth
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 06:58 PM

Bugger ! I forgot the Merthyr rising. And yes Hugill was a sailing instructor at an outeward bound school. On that theme I hasten to mentiuon the Royal National Lifeboat Institution's "Atlantic" Class RIB Inshore rescue boat. Desingned and prototype built at Atlantic College, in the Vale of Glamorgan

And with regard to America - well Click 'Ere Sian, Shame on you, forgetting this thread.

Oh, Yes, and the USA built Hospitals in South Wales, parts of the Caerphilly Miners Hospital are still housed in the brick built wards the US of A errected. And yes many Kids fron London and the Medway Towns were evacuated to South Wales 1939/40.

Hmmmn! Now there's a thought - Is there, should there, be a folk son about the evacuee's. Something for another thread I think.

Gareth

Gareth


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