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BS: What did GOD ever do for us?

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Mr Happy 22 Nov 02 - 04:08 AM
Boab 22 Nov 02 - 04:22 AM
Red and White Rabbit 22 Nov 02 - 04:25 AM
Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull 22 Nov 02 - 04:35 AM
Dead Horse 22 Nov 02 - 04:37 AM
Mr Happy 22 Nov 02 - 04:39 AM
Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull 22 Nov 02 - 04:44 AM
GUEST,Septic Sceptic 22 Nov 02 - 04:44 AM
Mr Happy 22 Nov 02 - 04:46 AM
gnomad 22 Nov 02 - 04:55 AM
Mr Happy 22 Nov 02 - 04:57 AM
Dave Bryant 22 Nov 02 - 04:58 AM
Mr Happy 22 Nov 02 - 05:33 AM
Mr Happy 22 Nov 02 - 05:34 AM
George Papavgeris 22 Nov 02 - 06:02 AM
Mr Happy 22 Nov 02 - 06:33 AM
Steve Parkes 22 Nov 02 - 06:51 AM
Mr Happy 22 Nov 02 - 06:56 AM
Schantieman 22 Nov 02 - 07:12 AM
Mr Happy 22 Nov 02 - 07:21 AM
Scabby Douglas 22 Nov 02 - 07:28 AM
Mr Happy 22 Nov 02 - 08:40 AM
Jerry Rasmussen 22 Nov 02 - 08:41 AM
53 22 Nov 02 - 08:48 AM
Jerry Rasmussen 22 Nov 02 - 08:58 AM
bernil 22 Nov 02 - 09:17 AM
Mr Happy 22 Nov 02 - 09:24 AM
sian, west wales 22 Nov 02 - 09:25 AM
Charley Noble 22 Nov 02 - 09:25 AM
Jerry Rasmussen 22 Nov 02 - 09:59 AM
Genie 22 Nov 02 - 10:08 AM
Bee-dubya-ell 22 Nov 02 - 10:56 AM
mack/misophist 22 Nov 02 - 11:24 AM
Jerry Rasmussen 22 Nov 02 - 11:33 AM
GUEST,Taliesn 22 Nov 02 - 11:39 AM
GUEST,Forum Lurker 22 Nov 02 - 11:44 AM
GUEST,bbc at work 22 Nov 02 - 11:47 AM
beadie 22 Nov 02 - 11:47 AM
Little Hawk 22 Nov 02 - 12:59 PM
greg stephens 22 Nov 02 - 01:30 PM
Clinton Hammond 22 Nov 02 - 01:37 PM
GUEST,Taliesn 22 Nov 02 - 01:56 PM
beadie 22 Nov 02 - 02:02 PM
GUEST 22 Nov 02 - 02:22 PM
beadie 22 Nov 02 - 02:39 PM
Bobert 22 Nov 02 - 02:40 PM
Jerry Rasmussen 22 Nov 02 - 02:51 PM
Jerry Rasmussen 22 Nov 02 - 03:04 PM
GUEST 22 Nov 02 - 03:11 PM
beadie 22 Nov 02 - 03:21 PM
Little Hawk 22 Nov 02 - 03:49 PM
Schantieman 22 Nov 02 - 03:51 PM
GUEST 22 Nov 02 - 03:57 PM
Schantieman 22 Nov 02 - 04:12 PM
GUEST,Bill D 22 Nov 02 - 04:16 PM
Little Hawk 22 Nov 02 - 04:30 PM
Schantieman 22 Nov 02 - 04:41 PM
Jerry Rasmussen 22 Nov 02 - 05:11 PM
Bill D 22 Nov 02 - 05:16 PM
Bill D 22 Nov 02 - 05:50 PM
Roughyed 22 Nov 02 - 06:04 PM
GUEST,Taliesn 22 Nov 02 - 06:25 PM
GUEST,Taliesn 22 Nov 02 - 06:31 PM
Little Hawk 22 Nov 02 - 08:32 PM
greg stephens 22 Nov 02 - 09:10 PM
Bill D 22 Nov 02 - 10:18 PM
Little Hawk 22 Nov 02 - 10:40 PM
Bert 23 Nov 02 - 12:57 AM
Joe Offer 23 Nov 02 - 02:58 AM
GUEST,Jim Clark..London..England 23 Nov 02 - 05:22 AM
Boab 23 Nov 02 - 05:23 AM
Little Hawk 23 Nov 02 - 04:32 PM
Boab 24 Nov 02 - 04:04 AM
GUEST,GOD 24 Nov 02 - 07:55 AM
GUEST,Taliesn 24 Nov 02 - 08:04 AM
Bill D 24 Nov 02 - 04:34 PM
GUEST,Different GOD 24 Nov 02 - 04:51 PM
Mr Happy 24 Nov 02 - 05:06 PM
Bill D 24 Nov 02 - 05:38 PM
GUEST,Tom Hamilton 24 Nov 02 - 11:32 PM
Steve Parkes 25 Nov 02 - 03:57 AM
Mr Red 25 Nov 02 - 06:24 AM
Mr Happy 25 Nov 02 - 06:56 AM
GUEST,noddy 25 Nov 02 - 07:16 AM
Mr Happy 25 Nov 02 - 07:25 AM
Amos 25 Nov 02 - 11:13 AM
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Subject: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:08 AM

apart from creating the world, the animals & the people.....?


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Boab
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:22 AM

Gave Charlton Heston the Ten Commandments


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Red and White Rabbit
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:25 AM

And Harry Secombe and Thora Hird a sunday job


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:35 AM

heloo, he sent us his son called jesus, 9allegidly)
this was at christmas time, in the olden days.john


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Dead Horse
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:37 AM

Which God are we talking about here?


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:39 AM

the omnipotent one


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:44 AM

send him some viagra then.


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,Septic Sceptic
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:44 AM

An imaginary mandate for war and atrocity - in his/her/it's name sake.


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:46 AM

agree- weapons of mass DISTRACTION!


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: gnomad
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:55 AM

TECH??

I have my doubts, but we shouldn't confuse what God did with what humankind did citing God as an authority.


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:57 AM

TECH?? - its about making & unmaking


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Dave Bryant
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:58 AM

Gave us Dubya and jOhn from Hull9.


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 05:33 AM

All things bright and beautiful, all creatures great and small,
All things wise and wonderful, the Lord God made them all.

Each little flow'r that opens, each little bird that sings,
He made their glowing colors, He made their tiny wings.

The purple-headed mountain, the river running by,
The sunset and the morning that brighten up the sky.

The cold wind in the winter, the pleasant summer sun,
The ripe fruits in the garden, He made them, every one.

He gave us eyes to see them, and lips that we might tell
How great is God Almighty, who has made all things well.


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Subject: Lyr Add: ALL THINGS DULL AND UGLY (Eric Idle)
From: Mr Happy
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 05:34 AM

All things dull and ugly, all creatures short and squat;
All things rude and nasty, the Lord God made the lot.

Each little snake that poisons, each little wasp that stings
He made their brutish venom, He made their horrid wings.

All things sick and cancerous, all evil great and small
All things foul and dangerous, the Lord God made them all.

Each nasty little hornet, each beastly little squid.
Who made the spiky urchin? Who made the shark? He did.

All things scabbed and ulcerous, all pox both great and small,
Putrid, foul and gangrenous, The Lord God made them all.


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 06:02 AM

Ask not what your God has done for you, but what you can do etc etc etc


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 06:33 AM

u mean i should start another thred about what has g never done 4 us?


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 06:51 AM

The rich man in his castle,
The poor man at his gate;
He made them high or lowly
And ordered their estate.


Proof, if proof were needed, that God wants us to vote Conservative.

Steve


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 06:56 AM

yes steve- when i checked the dt for 'All things bright and beautiful'- i wondered if it was sinisterly significant that your verse had been omitted.


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Schantieman
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 07:12 AM

Having been invented to explain things otherwise inexplicable (many of which are now explained), God provides a convenient authority to enable 'intermediaries' to tell us to do what they think we ought to.

On the other hand, religion has provided a generally useful moral framework - not killing or stealing for example (although I have been known to covet my neighbour's ass).

Steve


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 07:21 AM

not killing? so its ok to go to war if you've got g on your side?


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Scabby Douglas
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 07:28 AM

God's Song (Randy Newman)

Cain slew Abel Seth knew not why
For if the children of Israel were to multiply
Why must any of the children die?
So he asked the Lord
And the Lord said:

Man means nothing he means less to me
Than the lowliest cactus flower
Or the humblest Yucca tree
He chases round this desert
'Cause he thinks that's where I'll be
That's why I love mankind

I recoil in horror fro the foulness of thee
>From the squalor and the filth and the misery
How we laugh up here in heaven at the prayers you offer me
That's why I love mankind

The Christians and the Jews were having a jamboree
The Buddhists and the Hindus joined on satellite TV
They picked their four greatest priests
And they began to speak
They said, "Lord, a plague is on the world
Lord, no man is free
The temples that we built to you
Have tumbled into the sea
Lord, if you won't take care of us
Won't you please, please let us be?"
And the Lord said
And the Lord said

I burn down your cities-how blind you must be
I take from you your children and you say how blessed are we
You all must be crazy to put your faith in me
That's why I love mankind
You really need me
That's why I love mankind


Cheers


Steven


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 08:40 AM

My name it means nothing, my age it means less
And the country I come from is called the Midwest,
Was taught and I learned there the law to abide
And the people who live there have God on their side

The history book tells it, it tells it so well
The cavalry charged and the Indians fell
The cavalry charged and the Indians died
Our country was young then with God on our side

The Spanish American War had its day
And the Civil War too was soon laid away
The names of the heroes, I was made to memorize
With their guns in their hands and God on their side

Oh the First World War, boys, it came and it went
The reasons for fighting I never did get
But I learned to accept it, to accept it with pride
For you don't count the dead with god on your side

The Second World War, boys, it came to an end
We forgave the Germans and called them our friends
Though they killed six million, in the ovens they fried
The Germans now too have God on their side

For many long years I've thought about this
That Jesus Christ was betrayed by a kiss
I can't do it for you, you've got to decide
If Judas Iscariot had God on his side

I've learned to hate Russians all thru my whole life
If another war comes, it's them we must fight
To hate and to fear them, to run and to hide
And accept it all bravely with God on our side

But now we've got weapons of the chemical dust
If fire them we're forced to, then fire them we must
One push of the button and a shot the world wide
And you never ask questions with God on your side

So now as I'm leaving, I'm weary as hell
The confusion I'm feeling, ain't no tongue can tell
The words fill my head and fall to the floor
If God's on our side, He'll stop the next war


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 08:41 AM

He gave me every good thing that I have.

Jerry


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: 53
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 08:48 AM

Saved our souls from Hell if you are a born again Christian


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 08:58 AM

Amen, 53.

Jerry


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Subject: RE: Tech: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: bernil
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 09:17 AM

Sometimes he lets great miracles happen to us. But many seemingly small things he does in our every day lives are miracles too. We just have to open our eyes and our minds too discover them and be thankful for them!

Berit


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 09:24 AM

Truth and Love Are Never Far Apart.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: sian, west wales
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 09:25 AM

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

That's good for starters.

sian


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Charley Noble
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 09:25 AM

My mother had some thoughts on this some 25 years ago:

THROUBLE IN HEAVEN

(Words by Dahlov Ipcar, Circa 1975
Tune: after "The Falcon" by Richard Farina)

The archangels we meet all carry spears
And have an angry look as if to say,
"Though God's been dead in Heaven these long years,
Don't be trying to put us away!"

Chorus:

The lessor angels form protective bands,
They dare not go out late at night;
They speak in whispers of "trouble" in this land,
They, no longer seek the light.

Our prophets say He was a God of Love,
And speak of a freedom we never knew;
But by their every action seem to prove
That God was a tyrant and a bigot too. (CHO)

Final:
Lucifer smiles as patiently he waits,
Until the day we open wide the gates.

Have a nice day!
Charley Noble


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 09:59 AM

As the song, His Eye Is On The Sparrow says, "I sing because I'm happy."

Or is that Mr. Happy? :-)

Jerry


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Genie
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 10:08 AM

What did GOD ever do for us? How 'bout "give us someone for conceited people to think they are"?


Seriously, folks, I think she's been pretty good to me! :-D

Genie


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 10:56 AM

Assuming that "God" can mean anything from the anthropomorphic deity of Judeo-Christain-Islamic tradition to the unspecified oneness of the Tao to just "The Universe" for those who espouse no spiritual beliefs, the only possible answer is "everything".

Bruce


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: mack/misophist
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 11:24 AM

Although the poet Blake considered himself a Christian, he called the god of the Bible "Old Nobodaddy" (Nobody's Daddy) and denounced him as a muderous, murdering, bigot. He must have been a fan of DIY.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 11:33 AM

Only goes to show... not everyone who calls themselves a Christian is...

Jerry


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,Taliesn
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 11:39 AM

God gaves us each a soul ,which is the part of us made in God's image ,without which we "are" just localized envalopes of purely biological "appetites" to be satisfied with nothing larger to aspire to but more complex systems designed for evermore intricate accommodations for satisfying those appetites.
That's what ultimately leads to man's "Art of War" with himself.
A "moral compass" is not a socially engineered "ethic" attempted to be reinforced by social contractual mechanisms. Sense of a higher being as being attainable is the truest from of "self-governance".
Without the soul's tuning fork, there is no North Star to navigate oneself by and measure from. The most direct way of which to acheive mastery of this self-navigation is the gift of its ability to ressonant to God's love and through practice of the expression of that love one enriches this otherwise karnal world of biological conventions.

All evil derives from diverting one's attention away from , or denying the existance of ,the gift of one's soul for it is from this gift that we are given our true sense of identity as individuak signatures and as part of a greater whole through which we can evolve beyond the merely biological existance.
I'm forever amused that the advocates of biological evolution completely miss the point that "conciousness" evolves as well and the that even the logical conclusion to a soul-imbued biological conciousness is to be able to evolve to were a biological "vehicle" or "media" is no longer necessary.
That's the part that never dies as Physicists themselves promote "their" discovery that energy can *not* be destroyed, it only changes the matrix it adheres to and expresses itself through.

In more practical applications I'm thankful for the gift of the soul as being the source of my artistic intution that allows me to experience the aesthetic , and not the base biologically "sensual" , thrill of music.
That is way I no longer bother with the harshly "enhanced" music that merely "feels good" because that music not only just goes for the groin and the ego, but is excrutingly precise in being desgned to "just" go for the groin and the ego.
It's just like not getting regularly drunk because it "feels good" as it also degenerates one's health.

Where does folk fit in. Why anything that has the sound of the ring of truth in its performance ,message , or artistry for that resonnates to that tuning fork and anything that excites that makes us more aware of "the gift".

I well remember Jerry Rassmussen's wonder song performed live here with the refrain " Just because it feels good, that don't make it right". Tht had the ring of truth to it to me.

Anyway, you asked and that's my story and iI'm sticking to it.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,Forum Lurker
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 11:44 AM

Well, if God exists as the christians say he does, he created just about everything. The only thing he didn't give us was knowledge of good and evil. Guess he didn't want to show his true colors.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,bbc at work
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 11:47 AM

What *hasn't* He done for us?

rhetorically,

bbc


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: beadie
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 11:47 AM

Personally, I think that the sterotypical "God" is overrated. I feel certain that there is some creative force in the universe (or beyond), but, hell, this guy doesn't even have an advanced degree!

. . . . . . Why didn't God get his degree, you ask? . . . . .

. . . . Regardez . . . .


1. He had only one major publication.
2. It was in Hebrew.
3. It had no references.
4. It wasn't published in a refereed journal.
5. Some even doubt he wrote it by himself.
6. It may be true that he created the world, but what has he done since then?
7. His cooperative efforts have been quite limited.
8. The scientific community has had a hard time replicating his results.
9. He never applied to the ethics board for permission to use human subjetcs.
10. When one experiment went awry he tried to cover it by drowning his subjects.
11. When subjects didn't behave as predicted, he deleted them from the sample.
12. He rarely came to class, just told students to read the book.
13. Some say he had his son teach the class.
14. He expelled his first two students for learning.
15. Although there were only 10 requirements, most of his students failed his tests.
16. His office hours were infrequent and usually held on a mountaintop.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 12:59 PM

Not true, beadie! God has put out more "major publications" than you could ever count, and is STILL doing so. I can't help it if you haven't bothered to give them credence, and have chosen to fixate on just one that is 2,000+ years old...

Some of the better known ones are the Baghavad Gita, the Bible, the Q'ran, the Upanishads, the Book of Mormon, the Torah, the Vedas, the "Conversations With God" series, the Bahai writings, the Taoist writings, the Buddhist scriptures, the Medicine teachings of the Amerindians, and on, and on, and on, and on, and on....

There will probably be several new ones out this year. Keepa you eyes and ears open!

You will note that there are some interesting differences to be found in these scriptures...one to another. Yes! That is because they were given to different people in different societies at different times...and that required a somewhat different approach, different wording, putting things in terms that were understandable to the listener and applicable to his/her life at the time. Capiche?

It's also because the scriptures were filtered through the consciousness of the people who wrote them down or memorized them (in societies with an oral tradition), and those people's own state of awareness colored the teachings accordingly, in line with what they were capable of expressing and understanding.

In other words, if you are living amongst a tribal people on the veldt, and must contend with lions, locusts, and immediate physical dangers...then you may need a different instruction booklet than does a philosopher in Shanghai during the reign of the Yellow Emperor or an accountant in present day Schenectady!

Interestingly enough, however, there is a sort of central theme that runs through all of the above teachings...and the wise seek it out carefully. This is why the wise also honour ALL the holy scriptures, not just the one common to the tiny little cultural milieu that they were born and brought up in.

But, hey! Your post had some amusing stuff in it. That's always handy, cos people can get way too solemn when discussing God. :-) God is not always solemn.

Now, regarding the ten so-called "requirements"...

They weren't requirements at all. They were promises of what would begin to happen within YOU as you approach closer to God in your own conscious awareness. In other words...when you begin to achieve godliness you will find that you tend:

Not to kill wantonly...

Not to lie...

Not to steal...

Not to bear false witness...

Not to speak of sacred things in a profane (a negative) way...

Not to covet things which don't belong to you (such as your neighbour's spouse, possessions, land, etc...), given the fact that strong "coveting" of that sort usually leads to some sort of harmful outward activity eventually (or at least creates a harmful inward emotional condition)

Not to "adulterize" (meaning, not to defile what is pure...as in not to defile love with deceitfullness and manipulation)

And so on.

As you become more enlightened, you tend to become more loving (of God, Self, and others), more generous, less fearful, more respectful, less violent, more kindly. All of that leads toward realizing the Ten Promises which were given.

To expect any living human being to always and perfectly meet ten "COMMANDMENTS" of that sort would be so unlikely as to be ridiculous! No one has done that. Everyone must kill, for example, killing some other form of life from time to time in order to simply survive as a biological being.

Yet the enlightened are far less inclined to kill thoughtlessly and wantonly. They are less inclined to murder. This is obvious.

God does not give Commandments. If He/She did, they would be unbreakable...and what we know as free will would cease to exist, and you would have no further need OF holy scriptures to advise you, cos you would be an obedient robot.

- LH


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: greg stephens
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 01:30 PM

God moves in such mysterious ways, it's a little tricky to answer this question. If he's so clever, why didnt he make pi equal 3, for example? But he got gravity spot on, it holds you down for convenience, but doesn't pull your feet right into the ground.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Clinton Hammond
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 01:37 PM

There is no god... never has been... never will be...

So I guess the answer is dilluded a whole lot of people into believing he exists...


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,Taliesn
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 01:56 PM

(quote)
"There is no god... never has been... never will be..."

Or so you "believe" ;-)

(quote)
"So I guess the answer is dilluded a whole lot of people into believing he exists... "

You are, ofcourse ,"presuming" that you're not self-deluded .
To each their own.

We are what we believe and....
we all ultimately find out exactly what's what in the end. ;-)

Guess then you'd feel your plum outta luck if you can't afford to clone yourself. Otherwise all you came from, all you were , and all you became just ceases to exist as if you'd never existed at all save what ever artifacts you left behind.
It's a little like the thrill you "don't" get if someone , while you're alive , would perform ,for example , a song you wrote somewhere in the world and you're not there to even be aware of it.

Do you really belive that your individualized energy pattern disintegrates upon death. Well if you "beleive" this hard enough the strength of your belief just might make it so.
Nothing like geting what you wish for ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: beadie
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 02:02 PM

Hawk:

    Just a couple of responses . . . .

Are you saying that the differences within the Taoist screeds, the Gita, the Q'ran, the Torah, the Bible et al are merely semantic variations on the same theme, written by the same hand? Then, perhaps, we are not so different as you might surmise. A central core of my belief is that the deity (or deities) does not "choose" one particular group to favor with blessings. It would make sense for different cultures within different environments to have differing views of (and names for) a perceived "God."

Secondly, as to the "requirements." When I was a lad (sounds like the beginning of a good song), there was no "positive" reward for acheiving compliance, only the avoidance of a negative one. It was "follow these or else." Hence, . . . "required" behavior was the way in which it was presented, and I think it still is for many folk. Your analysis that no one can ever fully comply is, again, contrary to the mantra that I hear from many of the more fundamental believers that I encounter at work or on the street. I think you're on the right track (hence, my scepticism about the origin of the decalogue and the role of the deity in its writing), but there are a whole lot of literalist interpretations that will disagree most emphatically.

Finally, I didn't compose the previous post, but I don't know who did, so I can't give credit where its due. I do presume from the tone of the piece, though, that it may have been written by the guy who drives around with the bumper sticker on his car that says he's "doing his part to piss off the religious right."


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 02:22 PM

Just to be contrary and oppositional...

What did GOD ever do for the religious right?

What did GOD ever do for the radical left?

Discuss.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: beadie
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 02:39 PM

Guest:

   I guess He did for them whatever they think He did for them.


hmmmmmmmmmm . . . . I wonder if that's anything more than a grammatical simile to "I Am Who Am."


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Bobert
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 02:40 PM

If ya' gotta ask then chances are you ain't gonna get the answer.

Thank you, Lord, and I ask that You speak loudly in the hearts and minds of folks who are at least making the attempts to get to know You.

Praise be to God.

Bobert


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 02:51 PM

Guest: God doesn't read labels.

Jerry


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 03:04 PM

Everyone belives in something, Clinton. You believe there is no God. You can't prove God doesn't exist, any more than I can (or have any desire to) prove he does. Faith is the evidence of things not seen.

Jerry


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 03:11 PM

Does God read?

Discuss.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: beadie
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 03:21 PM

Jerry: You may be right in saying that everybody believes in something, but what about folks like Crash Davis (Bull Durham)?

"I believe in the soul, the small of a woman's back, the hanging curve ball, high fiber, good scotch, that the novels of Susan Sontag are self-indulgent, overrated crap. I believe Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone. I believe there ought to be a constitutional amendment outlawing Astroturf and the designated hitter. I believe in the sweet spot, soft-core pornography, opening your presents Christmas
morning rather than Christmas Eve and I believe in long, slow, deep,
soft, wet kisses that last three days. Goodnight."

. . . Is this sufficiently organized to be called a belief SYSTEM (if not a religion)?


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 03:49 PM

Clinton - I think the "God" you are referring to (the one that doesn't exist, I mean) is the primitive anthropomorphic god that has been made up by various people since time immemorial in their own human image. That is, a god who is demanding, judgemental, vengeful, insecure, jealous, punishing, etc... He's "all-powerful", but he can't prevent Satan from leading souls astray into eternal damnation. This is a mighty peculiar way of being "all-powerful", isn't it?

That is the god of human invention, and that is the God you are objecting to (and rightly so!).

However, that is not...God. The God which you imagine, in other words, when you hear someone say the word "God"...does not exist. Agreed. I don't think that god exists either.

There is, however, a much larger God than that which does exist, it encompasses everything you are aware of, and everything you also are not aware of, and you are a part of that God. You can deny this too, if it makes you feel "right", clever, and realistic. No problem. But you are only denying a word...a word which you may have an incomplete definition of in the first place.

You've got free will to do anything you want to do in this system of reality. God will not punish you or anyone else for using it...(but watch out for other people...they WILL punish you, given half a chance!). And they will write scary scriptures all about it, in order to terrify you into seeing it their way. Such scriptures are a misinterpretation of the nature of reality.

- LH


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Schantieman
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 03:51 PM

"Otherwise all you came from, all you were , and all you became just ceases to exist" says Taliesn.

Well, yes. That's what death's like. Are you saying all other living organisms also live on after death? If so where do you draw the line? Primates? Mammals? Vertebrates? Animals? Eukaryotes?

The whole idea that there's something qualitatively different about humans is fundamentally flawed. We are quantitatively different from, say, gorillas in that we have bigger brains with more connections, less hair etc. but there is no evidence of a 'spirit' or 'soul' that sets humans apart from the other animals.   The idea of God and all the associated gubbins is a human invention. The fact that it's been invented more than once and continues to attract large numbers of people means that it's a powerful idea - but that alone doesn't make it right.

Where did the Earth come from?
Don't know - it must have been God.

Now we know where it came from, Genesis is apparently allegorical rather than literal. Moving the goalposts ever so slightly?

For people that believe in God - well, Christians I have talked to about this, anyway, and I am quite prepared to be gainsaid on this - the act of faith seems to be believing IN SPITE OF the evidence to the contrary! This doesn't seem very rational to me.

OK I've said my piece. Now tear it to bits!

Steve ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 03:57 PM

How many GODs does it take to screw in a light bulb?


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Schantieman
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:12 PM

We don't know, Guest, how many Gods does it take to screw in a light bulb?


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,Bill D
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:16 PM

we had mostly gotten away from threads where the truth about God & religion was debated and/or assumed. I suggest we return to that status.

The point about God IS that one needs to 'believe'. Thus, not believing is just as easy for many. It is not a point that can be settled, and it can lead to some VERY awkward debates.

Please, folks....lets deal with each other in here by what we are as people, not what we believe in.

This sort of thread incites many to wear their beliefs on their sleeves, and clouds many other issues. WYSIWYG has provided forums for discussing religion, and I'd love to see it stay there.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:30 PM

How many Gods does it take to screw in a light bulb? That depends whether they can agree on screwing it in...if so, just one can do it with ease...if not, it may not happen at all.

If I may quote Dylan (twice):

"Disillusioned words like bullets bark, as human gods aim for their mark, make everything from toy guns that spark, to flesh-colored Christs that glow in the dark, it's easy to see without looking too far not much is really sacred!"

"And though the Rules of the Road have been lodged...it's only people's games that you've got to dodge"

Shantieman - Religious faith is frequently held in spite of evidence to the contrary, as you suggest. This is obviously what could be called blind faith. Spiritual faith, on the other hand, (like faith in other individuals one has encountered and dealt with) is generally based on direct experience of a very compelling nature. One does not need a holy book or a religion to have such experience, but they can sometimes shed useful light on it in retrospect.

Regarding "death"...all that is physical changes, then appears (if it's a biological organism) to die, and passes away. Spirit never dies, but it changes its outward forms of expression, some of which are what we perceive as physical forms, and some not. Spirit also expresses as emotion, thought, love, fear, ideals, concepts, and so on...all of which we have dealt with and made use of. Those aspects do not die, but the body does, when the other more conscious aspects leave it.

So, to answer your question. Nothing that has/is consciousness ever dies...but it does change form.

If you think physicality is all there is, well then, everything you believe in eventually dies. That is a faith-based system which depends on very limited forms of observation.

And yes, the God that you are objecting to is indeed a human invention, generally speaking. But Spirit preceded humanity themselves. In fact Spirit preceeded this whole Universe as we know it.

Ultimately, you are more than just human. This human experience is a temporary (and very neat) adventure in a chosen field of limitation.

- LH


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Schantieman
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 04:41 PM

LH:

I think I can appreciate this idea of sprituality, but I don't agree that there's anything more than the physical basis of it. It seems to me that what people think of as their spirit must happen in the brain. When it dies it stops thinking so this feeling of 'spirit'must go too.

Are you suggesting that the spirit passes to another organism? A widely-held belief.

Everyboby gotta believe in something. I believe I'll have another drink.

Steve


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Jerry Rasmussen
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 05:11 PM

I kinda agree with Bill D. I don't think these threads accomplish a lot... and sometimes get too heated for me. Because we're talking faith here, anything even vaguely resembling an argument seems foolish. I try to respect everyone, whatever their belief... including people who believe God is a fig newton of the imagination..

Think I'll lay this one to rest, meself..


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 05:16 PM

Little Hawk...re: " Spirit never dies, but it changes its outward forms of expression"

'stating' that there is (a) spirit is just as much a problem as stating that there is a God, or ghosts,or elves, or telepathy, or pre-cognition etc....the burden of proof is on the assertor!

passing it off by saying that it "just changes form" solves nothing if those other posited 'forms' are not accessible to us...ALL of us...equally.

and...*sigh* "..In fact Spirit preceeded this whole Universe as we know it." ...there simply is no way this statement can have meaning, other than some in sort of subjective, verbal construction. You can't explain, either to me or even yourself, if you are totally honest, what it might mean to "preceed the universe"

The discussion can certainly become a focus for shared attitudes and behavior among those who accept a basic formulation of concepts. But this is exactly what 'religion' does!.....and...

"If you think physicality is all there is, well then, everything you believe in eventually dies. That is a faith-based system which depends on very limited forms of observation."..........

indeed..*grin*.. I intend to limit my beliefs to what I can observe...and when I 'observe' things which not everyone else can, *I* believe that they just probably originate from within ME...memories, wishes, associations...etc...triggered by who knows what. I would LOVE to discover that certain imagined entities and/or relationships that we posit could be explained and 'seen' by everyone, but I doubt that is even theoretically possible.

We humans are a strange beast...with brains large enough to imagine things that never were, but NOT large enough to explain to ourselves exactly why it happens.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 05:50 PM

and there I am...adding to a thread I suggested ignoring...see how it goes? So easy to let yer guard down...

I am with Jerry...I think I will retire from this....if anyone needs to debate me, we can do it in PMs or email....


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Roughyed
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 06:04 PM

God is a projection of people's desire to be told what to do and to be taken care of. It's O.K. if that's what you need but don't bother the rest of us with it please.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,Taliesn
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 06:25 PM

(quote)
"How many GODs does it take to screw in a light bulb? "

Silly man. There's only One and creates pure light the moment there is a purpose to do so.

Light bulb indeed. How thoroughly convention-enslaved. ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,Taliesn
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 06:31 PM

Swan is a self-projection of his desire to not be told told what to do and to take care of himself. It's OK if that's what you need,but why do you bother the rest of us with this?

Swan song ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 08:32 PM

Ha! Ha! Ha! Swan, taliesn has a good point there. You ARE your own creation. So am I my own creation, on an ongoing basis. So is everyone else. That's what is so creative about life.

Now explain this: I, like you, absolutely do NOT want anyone telling me "what to do" or "taking care of me". I'd rather handle those matters myself. Yet I believe in my definition of what I call God. Where does this place your theory about "people who believe in God"? And why would their belief bother you? Simply because it is different from yours? Or because it is "foolish"? Maybe it is not so foolish as you assume.

Bill D - Hey, man... You want PROOF??? The only things that are provable to the physical senses are physical things and physical events (including some forms of "energy" events). Forms of energy that are too subtle for the physical senses to pick up exist. Some of them can be read by machines, such as a radio, a radar set, an electron microscope, etc. Those forms of energy were not believed in by most rationalists prior to the invention of said machines, but now the rationalist has machine-based PROOF, so now he is content to believe in what he did not believe in before. This will continue to happen, and science will prove what it regarded as unreal at an earlier stage...and so it goes.

Now, there are almost certainly numerous other forms of energy that cannot yet be read effectively by the machines which we have invented, yet they exist. Among those are forms of thought, emotion, moral ideals, ethical concepts about life, fear, love, jealousy, compassion, generosity, and other spiritual concepts about life.

Despite the fact that you cannot weigh, photograph, see, or observe these forms of energy (which are all forms of purposeful intelligence), you KNOW from your own direct experience that they DO exist, that they are powerful motivators, that they give MEANING to life, and that they in fact are the essential crux of what life is about as a conscious being in a world of limitations. Life is not finally about survival, because nobody physically survives in the end. It's about working with ethics and consciousness DURING one's period of survival.

And while you cannot observe these intelligent energies in and of themselves, you can FEEL them at work, and you can see the RESULTS of their working in the behaviour, wise or unwise, of those around you.

And from that springs the human desire for spiritual and philosophical understanding of himself and his/her place in existence.

And that, I submit, is more important than any physical proof you can provide about anything, because physical stuff is just temporary. It doesn't last.

And our brain is not the originator of thought. It is the transmitter of thought through the mechanism of a physical body, allowing that body to function in much the way a very sophisticated machine would function.

The Spirit is the intelligent driver of the machine. The brain is the computer & keyboard through which the driver issues his commands to the rest of the mechanism. Without the driver, ain't nuthin' gonna happen, except maybe to lie there in a coma for awhile.

Science, BTW, refers to the period prior to the existence of our Universe as prior to "the Big Bang", and they know little or nothing about it, but can only theorize about it. They are onto something there. What I speak of as Spirit is that which caused the Bang, not by accident, but with a definite purpose in mind. There are most likely numerous other Universes as well, but we are simply working in this one for the time being.

What you and Swan believe is absolutely fine for you & Swan. I only talk about this stuff because I genuinely enjoy talking about it. The happy situation of belonging to no specific religion leaves me free of the imagined responsibility or need to convert you or anyone else. I figure that everyone will eventually get to where they want to go, and that is as it should be.

- LH


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: greg stephens
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 09:10 PM

I've never figured out how God planned it that when you smoke a lot of dope it all becomes a lot clearer and then the next day youre not so sure and then you drink a lot and suddenly it's all there, and a bit of fasting in the desert and wow youve got the lot and it's all worth laying down your life for. personally I'd be a bit more convinced if it all came to me while drinking a cup of hot chocolate wearing my slippers and watching Blind Date.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Bill D
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 10:18 PM

greg...*giggle*...yup!.(now I WOULD accept having all the clouds in the daytime and the stars at night form letters with the 'answer'!)

reply sent to Little Hawk by PM...


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 22 Nov 02 - 10:40 PM

Greg - God didn't plan it that way, people did! And I have not received one single vital spiritual realization through the effects of alcohol, drugs, or fasting in the desert yet, although some people seem to favor such methods. :-) I suspect they are under certain cultural influences in so doing.

In your case it could easily come while "while drinking a cup of hot chocolate wearing (your) slippers and watching Blind Date." Why not? Sounds more sensible than getting drunk or stoned to me, and fasting doesn't seem to suit most people too well.

On the other hand, you could safely get through this life with less spiritual awareness than the average potatoe and still have a great time! I know people who have managed to do that. Again, why not? It's a free universe.

- LH


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Bert
Date: 23 Nov 02 - 12:57 AM

Well for starters he gave us alcohol. For many millenia it was the only anaesthetic that we had. Also it is a mind altering drug that makes us (or some of us) mellow and happy.

Unfortunately some of his misguided and zealous followers think that it is a sin that alcohol should be available on a Sunday. So THEY prevent ME from accessing one his first gifts when I need a glass of wine with my Sunday meal.

So all you proseletysing gits can fuck off and don't even think of talking to me about God until I can buy a drink on Sunday.

(Note: I'm not talking about my darlin' WYSIWIG here, she can talk to me about anything, ANYTIME)


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 23 Nov 02 - 02:58 AM

Was it God who gave us all these goddamn copycat threads?
Or did God simply create the idiots who created this ugly lack of creativity?
I hate 'em
I hate 'em
I hate 'em

Well...actually, this one is kind of interesting...
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,Jim Clark..London..England
Date: 23 Nov 02 - 05:22 AM

on the subject of God heres a rather well known poem I recorded for my website the other week....you can hear it at the following page..
God moves in mysterious ways by William Cowper 1731 - 1800 (musical sound poem)

It is surely qiute strange that the man who wrote one of the most popularly quoted poems of all time William Cowper (pronounced "Cooper") born in Hertfordshire England in 1731 had denounced all his religious beliefs after repeated bouts of mental illness resulting in hallucinations that shattered his faith by the time of his death in 1800.......

Regards..

Jim Clark....

All rights are reserved on this sound recording/copyright/patent Jim Clark 2002

God moves in a mysterious way,
His wonders to perform;
He plants his footsteps in the sea,
And rides upon the storm.

Deep in unfathomable mines
Of never failing skill,
He treasures up his bright designs,
And works his sovereign will.

Ye fearful saints, fresh courage take,
The clouds ye so much dread
are big with mercy, and shall break
In blessings on your head.

Judge not the Lord by feeble sense,
But trust him for his grace;
Behind a frowning providence,
He hides a smiling face.

His purposes will ripen fast,
Unfolding every hour;
The bud may have a better taste,
But sweet will be the flower.

Blind unbelief is sure to err,
And scan his work in vain;
God is his own interpreter,
And he will make it plain.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Boab
Date: 23 Nov 02 - 05:23 AM

Every individual, according to this thread, has his/her own "God".
Bear with me--I want to tell a true story. In the year 1950, September,in the coal mine adjacent to the one in which I was at the time employed, a disaster occurred. A road being "driven" up toward the surface broke through into a peat basin, and this proceeded to empty a vile black "porridge' into the mine workings. 129 miners were trapped---every escape route filled with black sludge.There seemed to be no hope, and the Coal Board officials were on the point of announcing this to the public, when the old overman in our mine recalled an abandoned working of years past which just might be fairly close to the trapped men underground. A check of the old survey maps showed this to be so---if, indeed, the old maps could be relied on. So the rescue effort was now revived, and refocused on our mine. I was one of many who stumbled down that abandoned mine carrying a breathing apparatus on my back, and about a mile down-slope I came to a long, fungus coated steel girder support, which I had passed many times in the course of my work. This time, however, the faded chalk scrawl which had been there ever since I could remember---right across that twisted ten-inch girder, some long-ago would-be lay preacher had chalked six-inch high letters---"God Is Love". I was not a particularly religious person [still not--], but that old message slapped me right between the eyes. Without halting in my stride, I thought---"Aye---not much doubt who the bumbling bastards are who got the guys stuck down here; nor is there much doubt about Who may yet get them out!' It took two days and a lot of gambling with lives, plus a change in the barometric pressure [gas in the roadways], but we got all but thirteen of the men out . One hundred and sixteen men. Makes you think---not the same "god" who adorned the belt buckles of the S.S. troopers, or the one who always seems to be on the side of the victors in war, no matter how much atrocious cruelty and slaughter their victory involved. As I say---to each his own "god".


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 23 Nov 02 - 04:32 PM

It was the regular Wermacht who had "God Is With Us" on their belt buckles. The SS had a different slogan which translated as "My Duty Is My Honour", if I remember correctly.

Hey, Bert. Whaddya mean they're preventing you from having a drink on Sunday? It's simple. Ya just buy yourself a bottle on Saturday, and open it on Sunday. What are they gonna do, storm into your house, grab the drink from your hand, and burn you at the stake?

Where do you live? Slinkville, Alabama? I thought you were in Pennsylvania. I don't think you can buy alcohol in Ontario on Sunday either, except at the restaurants and bars, of course. You can always sneak the altar wine if you're desperate, though...it is rumoured to not be very good.

- LH


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Boab
Date: 24 Nov 02 - 04:04 AM

I stand corrected, Little Hawk. Not that the sightly skewed aim was important!
Some quotes from 'Gruiess Gott und Heil Hitler"--[Stephan Moritz]
"Adherents of Aryan thought ---should see God's word in Adolf Hitler's historic mission---the Jewish question has remained unresolved. Now it is being resolved by our Fuehrer",. Father Sigismund Brettle, Catholic Action Movement, April 1938
"Lord God, guide our Fuehrer"!
"Lord God bless our Fuehrer"
"Lord God bless----our great German Reich"! Prelate Johann Moerzinger, editor of Vienna Church Newspaper, March 1938

As I suggest, every body has their own god---mainly created in their own image----


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,GOD
Date: 24 Nov 02 - 07:55 AM

You are all "works in progress" I have not finished with you yet.

All things bright and beautiful, all creatures great and small,
All things wise and wonderful, Napalm kills them all.


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,Taliesn
Date: 24 Nov 02 - 08:04 AM

(quote)
"All things bright and beautiful, all creatures great and small,
All things wise and wonderful, Napalm kills them all. "

Oh my word, seems anywhere you step you happen aupon yet another false demigod pipsqweaking for attention.
Kind of like the palgue of toads ,really .
Messy as much as noisey too ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Bill D
Date: 24 Nov 02 - 04:34 PM

".. then one old graybeard of a God got up and said:
Thou shalt not have any other Gods before me.....and all of the other gods died laughing"

paraphrased from..Nietzsche- "Also Sprache Zarathustra

so, if God is posting here, this must be the one with the 'attitude' who survived? Or maybe, if we are continuously 'creating Gods in our own image', this is a newly minted wannabe? Enquiring minds want to know...don't give a hoot...


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,Different GOD
Date: 24 Nov 02 - 04:51 PM

I gave you lightbulbs, didn't I?


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 24 Nov 02 - 05:06 PM

'god is dead'[Nietzsche]

'Nietzsche is dead' [GOD]


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Bill D
Date: 24 Nov 02 - 05:38 PM

"I gave you lightbulbs, didn't I?"

Thomas Edison is God? wow!..Is there a shrine in Menlo Park?(wonder why it took him hundreds of tries of different filaments before he got it right?)


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,Tom Hamilton
Date: 24 Nov 02 - 11:32 PM

I'm a born again Christian, And I'm Glad that God gave me life, and made me free from Sin. God gave us everything


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Steve Parkes
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 03:57 AM

Bill D: the light bulb was invented by Joseph Swann, an Englishman; Edison had the better marketing department.

Steve


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Red
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 06:24 AM

being omnipitent she has written all the wit and otherwise we read in this very thread, except of course the advocate's from another place


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 06:56 AM

all seeing, all singing , all dancing!


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,noddy
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 07:16 AM

but he gave us the plague of all mankind..... computers


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 07:25 AM

wasn't that santa?


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Amos
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 11:13 AM

What unmitigated tommyrot!

A


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: GUEST,mdilbeck@leapit.com
Date: 25 Nov 02 - 11:31 AM

Nothing that's distinguishable from random chance, the perceptible interaction of insensate matter and energy, and the activities of deluded human beings. Which leads one to believe that the question concerns a null category.
A more pertinent question might be, "What has religion ever done for us?"


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 06:26 AM

guest m dilbeck,

'A more pertinent question might be, "What has religion ever done for us?" '

surely, isn't 'religion' is the specific definition of belief in and worship of a supernatural deity?


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Subject: RE: BS: What did GOD ever do for us?
From: *daylia*
Date: 27 Nov 02 - 10:28 AM

To guest m dilbeck - prove to me that there is such a thing as 'random chance', that matter and energy are indeed 'insensate', and that human beings are in fact 'deluded', and I'll concede that you're correct in asserting that 'God' is a 'null category'. Good luck!!!

In the meantime I'm content to know that whatever anyone believes about 'God' is the truth, for them. That includes everyone from religious fanatics to atheists! Happy trails to you all ...


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This Thread Is Closed.


Mudcat time: 14 August 7:11 PM EDT

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