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BS: Germany 1 England 5

alanabit 26 Jun 02 - 04:03 PM
ard mhacha 26 Jun 02 - 03:11 PM
Wolfgang 26 Jun 02 - 05:00 AM
sophocleese 28 Sep 01 - 07:56 AM
Paddy Plastique 28 Sep 01 - 06:47 AM
Wolfgang 28 Sep 01 - 05:29 AM
GUEST,chrisj 24 Sep 01 - 03:47 AM
Linda Kelly 06 Sep 01 - 04:02 PM
Mr Red 06 Sep 01 - 03:39 PM
GeorgeH 06 Sep 01 - 11:18 AM
Paul from Hull 06 Sep 01 - 10:49 AM
McGrath of Harlow 05 Sep 01 - 08:39 PM
Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull 05 Sep 01 - 05:58 PM
Shields Folk 05 Sep 01 - 05:49 PM
GUEST,AliUK@workscomputer.com 05 Sep 01 - 01:22 PM
Shields Folk 05 Sep 01 - 01:12 PM
McGrath of Harlow 05 Sep 01 - 10:53 AM
Wolfgang 05 Sep 01 - 07:25 AM
Jim Cheydi 05 Sep 01 - 06:18 AM
MudGuard 05 Sep 01 - 04:23 AM
AliUK 04 Sep 01 - 08:27 PM
GUEST,Joerg 04 Sep 01 - 08:18 PM
ard mhacha 04 Sep 01 - 04:18 PM
The Shambles 04 Sep 01 - 03:34 PM
Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull 04 Sep 01 - 03:15 PM
The Shambles 04 Sep 01 - 02:59 PM
Arnie 04 Sep 01 - 02:42 PM
Jon Freeman 04 Sep 01 - 02:32 PM
The Shambles 04 Sep 01 - 02:24 PM
Jim Cheydi 04 Sep 01 - 11:23 AM
Wolfgang 04 Sep 01 - 09:10 AM
Jon Freeman 04 Sep 01 - 08:08 AM
The_one_and_only_Dai 04 Sep 01 - 06:49 AM
Wolfgang 04 Sep 01 - 06:43 AM
The Shambles 04 Sep 01 - 05:02 AM
Wolfgang 04 Sep 01 - 04:54 AM
Jon Freeman 03 Sep 01 - 09:27 PM
McGrath of Harlow 03 Sep 01 - 08:27 PM
alanabit 03 Sep 01 - 04:17 PM
John MacKenzie 03 Sep 01 - 03:48 PM
The Shambles 03 Sep 01 - 01:49 PM
GUEST 03 Sep 01 - 12:50 PM
Airto 03 Sep 01 - 12:40 PM
GUEST,Brian 03 Sep 01 - 09:05 AM
Bagpuss 03 Sep 01 - 07:11 AM
GUEST,ritchie 03 Sep 01 - 06:52 AM
Bagpuss 03 Sep 01 - 06:37 AM
Wolfgang 03 Sep 01 - 04:44 AM
Brakn 02 Sep 01 - 07:35 PM
gnu 02 Sep 01 - 07:01 PM
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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: alanabit
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 04:03 PM

Well, good luck Wolfgang. As German teams go, I think it is a mediocre one. The only player I can imagine the Dutch, English, Argentines or Portuguese would drop a player to make room for is Oliver Kahn. Having said that, it is far more of an achievement to get so far with mediocre players than it is to fade away with some very good ones. Germany are a real team, with good concentration and discipline and the whole is greater than the sum of the parts. If you fancy coming down for a Kölsch with me and my best mate on Sunday, you are more than welcome. Alan.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: ard mhacha
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 03:11 PM

World Cup Final BRAZIL V GERMANY, nothing strange or startling, after all, these two sides are miles ahead when it comes to the World Cup.Ard Mhacha.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Wolfgang
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 05:00 AM

Once upon a time...

(I know it's mean but I didn't even pretend to fight to resist the temptation)

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: sophocleese
Date: 28 Sep 01 - 07:56 AM

I missed it. I'm out in the boonies as far as news of soccer events is considered. Was it a good game then?


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Paddy Plastique
Date: 28 Sep 01 - 06:47 AM

CHRIS J: I think you mean 'Viduka', mercenary git that he is - and as a French mate of mine says (Go wan Saint Etienne!) youse are currently the World Champions of the Friendly (having beaten them in Korea...). Good job you don't have time to convert some of those Aussie Rulers to normal-shaped balls between now and the summer or the blood'd be flowing at the Finals, otherwise.. WOLFGANG: Thanks for the info. above about Drumcondra having beaten Bayern - something of which I was ignorant. And I certainly didn't say 'only' - youse won the one that mattered....


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Wolfgang
Date: 28 Sep 01 - 05:29 AM

Have you seen the great game last night when Germany did beat England 3:1 in the qualification for the football (soccer) world championship? Could easily have been higher. What do you mean I left out a vital detail? Yes, it was the women national teams. Do I hear someone saying 'only'?

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: GUEST,chrisj
Date: 24 Sep 01 - 03:47 AM

For God's sake, you people, its only soccer! Now that the Aussie Rules season is almost finished (Go Brisbane Lions!) I expect that we will turn our attention to World Cup qualification by picking up Vidmar and Kewell and going on to add that trophy to the other world championships we currently hold.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Linda Kelly
Date: 06 Sep 01 - 04:02 PM

I've always found the chants of various football supporters rather amusing-I particularly like 'who ate all the pies' but my personal favourite was at coventry city games when there was a televised game and the strains of 'Gary Newbon, what a **ker, what a **nker could be heard echoing around the ground -ah happy days.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Mr Red
Date: 06 Sep 01 - 03:39 PM

My first exposure to fussball was to see Aston Vanilla (easily licked) play against (oh! who cares?). I was only four and bored out of my folkie cranium and when the pitch emptied I asked to go home immediately.
Uncle assured me they would come back because they had left the ball in the centre spot.
Now I offer no prizes but how long ago was it that a ball could be left in the middle of the field AND stay there 20 minutes?
There is a case to be made for the folk nature of the singing on the terraces and the wide appeal amongst the latter day plebs but.....
IT AIN'T FOLK


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: GeorgeH
Date: 06 Sep 01 - 11:18 AM

It's only a bloody game, for heaven's sake!

I can (just) remember when Internationals (of all sorts) were about bringing nations together, and the result was of secondary importance. Altogether preferable, IMO!

Cheers!

George


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Paul from Hull
Date: 06 Sep 01 - 10:49 AM

Found this on the net, & just HAD to post it........*G*

Hollywood to make film of Munich Victory

Universal Pictures announced today they plan to make a film of the momentous football match that took place on Saturday. "Five-One" is the tentative title of what could be next year's big summer hit, depicting the American national soccer team's stunning victory over Germany. Nicholas Cage heads an all star cast as the captain of the brave US Soccer team haunted by the trauma of losing in the 2000 World Cup final on penalties and the death of his wife in a riot caused by English football hooligans, and finds love in the arms of a female sports journalist played by Julia Roberts. Mel Gibson is the no-nonsense Swedish coach who leads them to glory, with Keanu Reeves, Ben Affleck, Matt Damon and Will Smith playing some of Cage's heroic team mates. Jeremy Irons is set to star as Sir Nigel Villiers-Smythe, the dastardly Englishman who coaches the German team and forces them to play with poisoned-tipped studs to try and cheat the heroic American team out of victory.

Director Steven Spielberg defended the film-makers' decision to focus on the American contribution to the victory over Germany and inaccurate and even imagined events in the story, saying, "Obviously we've had to take some artistic licence to make the story work on film, but I hope that what we produce will be true to the spirit of what happened on that famous night."

*GRINS*


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 05 Sep 01 - 08:39 PM

But definitely not a walkover. (No sessions tonight so I watched it.)

Final comment from Gary Lineker on BBC TV: "Goes to show that there are no easy wins in modern international fotball. Except maybe against Germany." Ouch...


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 05 Sep 01 - 05:58 PM

England 2 Albania O !


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Shields Folk
Date: 05 Sep 01 - 05:49 PM

Lyr Add:

Oh it's all gone quiet over there,
oh it's all gone quiet over there,
oh it's all gone quiet, all gone quiet,
all gone quiet over there.

A song familiar the length and breadth of the Britain.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: GUEST,AliUK@workscomputer.com
Date: 05 Sep 01 - 01:22 PM

JC "than'yoo verrr'mush" Oh those balmy days down the Oka Road cowering from the Millwall supporters.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Shields Folk
Date: 05 Sep 01 - 01:12 PM

McGrath your just a sad bastard!


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 05 Sep 01 - 10:53 AM

And tonight Albania, in Newcastle. I imagine there will be a lot of Scots down there to back the visitors.

Here is the Albanian National Anthem anyway:

Rreth flamurit tė pėrbashkuar,
Me njė dėshirė dhe njė qėllim,
Tė gjithė Atij duke iu betuar,
Tė lidhim besėn pėr shpėtim.

CHORUS

Prej lufte veē ay largohet,
Qė ėshtė lindur tradhėtor,
Kush ėshtė burrė nuk friksohet,
Po vdes, po vdes si njė dėshmor.


For a translation, and a rousing version of the tune,click here.

That looks a lot like Klingon to me. I somehow don't think it'll be a walkover.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Wolfgang
Date: 05 Sep 01 - 07:25 AM

As an atheist, born protestant, I'm not a good choice for a saint. And don't forget that it is much easier to behave generous, fair, and objective after a night's sleep than immediately after a game.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Jim Cheydi
Date: 05 Sep 01 - 06:18 AM

AliUK,

At last someone with taste and finesse!!

THERE'S ONLY ONE MICKEY HARFORD!!!!

Les Sealey RIP.

JC


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: MudGuard
Date: 05 Sep 01 - 04:23 AM

Ard Mhacha, I hope you do not propose the Sainthood too soon - one of the requirements for becoming a saint is that you must not be alive any longer. Please let us have Wolfgang some more years...

About the game - I did not see it, at the time I was in the air flying from England to Germany (Munich), so I can't really say anything about it. But I don't think it is a shame to Germany that the game was lost, it is a shame to the players (overpaid professionals not doing well their job) - it can't be a shame to me, as I was not involved in any way.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: AliUK
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 08:27 PM

Well seeing as Brazil aren't likely to be in the next world cup ( they seem to have caught the England disease, as their international players are too damned precious now) I shall be rooting all the way for England, who have a really excellent side with excellent players. Now if only Luton Town can get out of the 3rd division and into the Premier where they deserve to be COME ON YOU HATTERS!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: GUEST,Joerg
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 08:18 PM

heh heh heh heh :-D

I like your initial message, john in hull.

No further comment.

Cheers

Joerg


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: ard mhacha
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 04:18 PM

Wolfgang, If you are a Catholic I will nominate you to the Pope for Sainthood, I cannot imagine any of the drunken louts wrapped in their buthers aprons being one millionth as sporting as you. I am not sure did Ireland beat Holland?. Slan Ard Mhacha.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: The Shambles
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 03:34 PM

I have PM'd JON to explain the reference, he did not understand. If you do not understand it and wish to, you can PM me and I will explain.

Back to the football.

"Jumpers for goalposts" reminds me of something.

A few years ago I remember seeing a collection of German students in the UK, deciding to have a game of football.

I was amazed when they started to pace out the pitch, halfway lines and the goals. They then picked out two teams of eleven players only and appointed a ref and linespersons. They did use jumpers for goal post however.

Informal games I was used to, only used jumpers for goal posts, or "jackets doon" as they say in Scotland. That however, was the extent of the organisation required.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 03:15 PM

jumpers for goalposts


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: The Shambles
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 02:59 PM

Do you live in Leeds, by any chance?


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Arnie
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 02:42 PM

It'll now be entirely in keeping to lose 1-0 to Albania!! However, Alan Smith up front, Batty in midfield and Nigel Martyn in goal (even with a slight injury) will ensure another great victory!! Now if only I can convince Sven to see my point of view.....


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 02:32 PM

I must admit I don't even understand Jim Cyedi's reference.

Back to football, I was watching "Look East" on TV while having my tea. They had a news story about a publican from Sulfolk (I think). He had promised to reduce the price of a pint by 50p for each England goal. Apparently his final reduction made the beer 50p a pint (he wouldn't go any lower).

Oh and thanks for the correction Wolfgang.

Jon


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: The Shambles
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 02:24 PM

To their lasting shame, if that were so.

Can show a little respect and just try and follow Wolfgang's excellent example, and keep the subject on football please?


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Jim Cheydi
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 11:23 AM

That'll be the same Norwich fans that were singing 'There's only one Bomber Harris' will it then Jon?


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Wolfgang
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 09:10 AM

3. 11. 1970: Coventry City beats Bayern Munich 2:1

as for other English speaking teams: Drumcondra Dublin was first to beat Munich in 1962, Glasgow Rangers followed in 1972, Aston Villa beat them in 1982 in the final, Aberdeen in 1983, Everton in 1985, Hearts of Midlothian in 1989.

Norwich was only the first english team to beat them at home.

The finest victory of Munich on english soil was beat Nottingham Forest at theri ground 5:1 in 1996.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 08:08 AM

Anyway Wolfgang, the best victory on German soil took place in the Olympic Stadium on Tuesday October 19th 1993 when Norwich City beat Bayern Munich 2-1 in the 2nd round of the UEFA Cup. Apparently the first English team to beat them - 6 years before Manchester United.

It may not sound a lot but to supporters of a small and unfashionable club it was a major achievement and one I think every Norwich supporter will always treasure.

We had a great side in those days. Better stop now before I start writing a load of things about a certain Robert Chase...

Jon


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: The_one_and_only_Dai
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 06:49 AM

I always thought the Ashes were the bails used in the match? But then I'm Welsh and a victim of centuries of Anglo propaganda @8-)===


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Wolfgang
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 06:43 AM

Yes, I enjoy it, but I still refrain myself from posting all those tidbits like what was the highest ever defeat of the German team (9:0 against, drum roll, England of course, 16. 3. 1909).

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: The Shambles
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 05:02 AM

Is your full name now Wolfgang MacHell? A bit of Scottish blood, in there somewhere, perhaps?

They have never stopped mentioning that one...*smiles*

Do I detect that you are rather enjoying stirring this one Wolfgang?


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Wolfgang
Date: 04 Sep 01 - 04:54 AM

I wouldn't mind a Kölsch at all at the right time.

Well, the press (part of, I mean) goes for the lowest of feelings and I wouldn't like to be made responsible for what BILD writes in such situations.

One of my favourite sports headlines in BILD was in 1974, the day we played the bad Germans from the GDR: TEN REASONS WHY WE WILL WIN TODAY. Our team lost and until today the GDR is the only team of the world against which (West)Germany never even scored a single goal. By the way, which team was the only team that went home unbeaten in the 1974 world championship? Scotland, of course.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 09:27 PM

Drifting futher...

"Aussies have the best version of fooball"

I wonder why we see so little of it or why it doesn't seem to have taken off elsewhere. From what I have seen it is a superb sport to watch, so fast and so hard...

Jon


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 08:27 PM

I tend to support any team who is playing England or Germany.

When they play each other I suppose I'd sooner see England win. I think being hammered is good for the soul, but England's had its turn at that.

As a game, it's not a patch on Hurling. Up Tipp!

But it's a lot better than that American version of rugger where they all dress up as spacemen.

Of course the Aussies have the best version of fooball. Even better then Gaelic.

I missed the game, after the equaliser, because I was at Fylde Folk Festival, and the music of the Pierre Schryer Band from Ontario and Chouchenn from Lancaster promised to be better than any football match. And was.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: alanabit
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 04:17 PM

I've bided my time a bit, but I think you deserve a reply Wolfgang. I anticipated Saturday's game with some trepidation. The statistics you gave were impeccable of course, but since the first time I watched England play Germany (on black and white TV as a small boy in the sixties) I had not seen England win a game of any consequence. There was a win in a friendly at Wembely in 1974, a win in the eighties ('83 I think, when some disinterested and jet lagged Germans had hardly emerged from a plane in South America) and the dreadful game in Charleroi when (untypically) the German forwards missed everything except the bus home. In short, an England win seemed the least likely outcome. (Hindsight is easy). I have no complaints about Germany's semi final wins against England. Penalties are never a satisfying way to win, but I felt that justice was done on both occasions. I live in Cologne. My girlfriend and wonderful children are German and my German friends responded with the sportsmanship shown by you Wolfgang. If you are in Cologne for the next one, you are more than welcome to join me and Gerd (my best mate for over twenty years) for a few Kölsch and a good long chat. Excuse me for being on cloud nine at the moment. It's just that this is about as good as it gets for us Brits! Germany still has a good side and one bad evening will not bury them. I hate all that jingoistic crap that our press turns out. I will be cheering them on against Finland.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 03:48 PM

In years gone by a king had a court jester,or fool, this jester had an inflated pig's bladder on a stick, nowadays thanks to progress[sic] and human evolution, every inflated bladder has 22 fools. BLADDERS RULE OK!!! Jock


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: The Shambles
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 01:49 PM

Please never think that the UK Press reflects any view, widely held by the rest of the population.

Nor that those co-called 'fans', seen throwing chairs, getting drunk and falling over, are representive of anything other than their own stupidity.

Most of us just like watching good football being played by the best players, what ever their nationality.

However it is nice to see world-class, home-grown players like Beckham and Owen, who are skilled and have a refreshingly professional (for English players) approach to their sport.

Due in part, I think to the influence of the many overseas professionals, who have had a great part to play in this. Add this to a manager, who shows the same good example and I think we now do have an England team that could do very well and be proud of.

No matter how many we lose by on Wednesday....


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 12:50 PM

It would've been five - nil if Marvin Johnson had been playing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Airto
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 12:40 PM

Well done Michael Owen, Stephen Gerrard et al. England are emerging as a nice team which deserves to do well. Can the same be said of their camp followers? Look at the drivel below and surely it is easy to understand why their neighbours usually prefer to see English teams lose.

From today's Daily Mirror, complete with photo of burning gloves taking up the entire front page:

[GERMAN FOOTBALL R.I.P.

THE ashes of German football will be proudly presented to the FA by The Mirror today.

In the wake of England's sensational 5-1 victory, we cremated a pair of Adidas gloves as worn by bungling German keeper Oliver Kahn.

They went up on the same ground at Munich's Olympic stadium that Kahn thumped in despair. Then, after being flown back to Britain, the ashes were laid to rest in a simple white clay urn adorned with English lions.

The ceremony recalled the original cricket Ashes which marked England's first defeat by Australia, at the Oval in 1882.

In a mock obituary at the time The Sporting Times mourned the death of English cricket, and said gloomily: "The body will be cremated and the ashes taken to Australia."

Legend says the ashes are those of one of the bails used in the match.

Yesterday, tearful German fan Horst Brandlemeier watched the gloves go up in smoke. He said: "It's a tragic symbol of an unforgettable day." ]


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: GUEST,Brian
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 09:05 AM

I missed the match because I was at Wareham, but watched the highlights last night. Great result. Brilliant up front, and in mid-field, but the defence? What defence? If it hadn't been for rank bad German finishing, it might have been a rugby score. The opposition won't always be so generous. There's still work to be done.

Ranks. I always found German wine to be sickly sweet. Where did you find your stock of sour grapes? West Germany lost in '66 and Germany lost on Saturday, In between you've had a lot of success. If you want to really enjoy the good times, accept the bad ones.

Wolfgang, thanks for your sporting attitude.

The reason that the Scots enjoy England being beaten by the opposition, is because Scotland usually shoot themselves in the foot. They don't need oppostion.

Brian (Mostly English, partly Scots)


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Bagpuss
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 07:11 AM

John in Hull : Fenwick's in in Newcastle city centre (Northumberland Street). It is famous in the area for its window displays at christmas.

Bagpuss (also from Gateshead originally)


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: GUEST,ritchie
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 06:52 AM

As I was reading thro' this thread I was wondering what Wolfgang thought .. Well done it's interesting to read a German view point so eloquently done. I wonder how many of us could reply in his native tongue.

The sad thing was the death of Brian Moore on the same day. Brian was a well respected commentator for ITV.

Tempus Fugit.

Richie from Gateshead.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Bagpuss
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 06:37 AM

Just for the record, not all Scots want England to do badly. My scottish husband always wants England to do well in the qualifying matches anyway. This is because he knows if England do not qualify, the tv coverage of the World Cup will be dismal and he will get to see fewer Scottish matches.

He still wants them to get thrashed once they are in the finals of course.......

Bagpuss


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Wolfgang
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 04:44 AM

I love the game but I have never loved the nationalistic undertones of some supporters. When I still went to live games I often felt alone in a crowd of supporters when I applauded a fine goal or save of the 'wrong' team. I always have prefered 'our team' to 'we' and never did like expressions as 'humilation', 'inferiority complex' in sport competitions.

As for the qualification, a blunder can happen all the time, but with a high probability England will qualify directly and deservedly so, for all in all it was the better team. Germany hasn't had a good team since about 1992 and the recent English teams are getting better and better both due to the individual players and the team tactic (since Eriksson).

Take two players as example. The German goalie, Oliver Kahn, has been elected as the best European Goalie of the year in 1999 and 2000 and not without reason. Not a bad man and he is especially feared when a player alone runs toward him. He denies more than two out of three possible goals in this situation, an impressive record. Michael Owen is both very fast and very sure when coming alone towards a goalie. He succeded each single time on Saturday. That was one of the duells that made the difference.

As for "hoaxes" (Ranks actually means the word the word 'fraud' and the correct term would be 'referee error'), my memory is less selective and I can also easily recall a quarter final in 1986 with a hand goal that was wrongly granted and a final in 1974 with a very dubious penalty....

I can see the games both in British and German TV and that is a very sobering experience if you ever had believed in impartial reporting. The making of legends begins right during the game. Imagine a wrong linesman decision of offside. The reporter of the lucky team will say 'a close call but lets follow now the game' and never mention the scene again, the reporter of the unlucky team will ponder about the lost chance for the next five minutes and you'll see the slow motion at half time.

The selection of scenes at halftime (or after the game) is completely biased. Well, both TVs show all goals and a red card and a denied goal would also be shown. But that's about all that is common. Both TV crews have the bias not to show good chances of the opponent and to complain only about wrong decisions if the own team was wronged. A good chance denied by a wrong offside call would be seen only in one TV and the close-up showing that the there was no foul before the freekick that led to a goal would only be seen in the other TV.

Once a reporter even said 'they were so lucky, they only had one single chance in the second half and that was a goal' and neither mentioned nor showed after the game the kick hitting the goalpost. You'd not want to know who made this blunder, would you?

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Brakn
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 07:35 PM

The most enjoyable part for me was John Motson's commentary. The man's a comic genius.....every cliche in the book. What d'yer mean he was serious?


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: gnu
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 07:01 PM

Forget who praised Owen... is that Mike Owen from the Liverpool club ? That boy can travel !!! We don't get much footy of any kind here in Atlantic Canada. Most we can hope for is a taped game a few days later. Today, I cheered Australia to the Tri-Nations Cup in a rousing test of rugby. As for soccer, we are inundated by the US Open in tennis and most don't even know that soccer is being played at this time of year. PMO !!!


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