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BS: Germany 1 England 5

Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull 01 Sep 01 - 06:59 PM
Gareth 01 Sep 01 - 07:08 PM
Susanne (skw) 01 Sep 01 - 07:12 PM
Diva 01 Sep 01 - 07:24 PM
Micca 01 Sep 01 - 07:38 PM
Den 01 Sep 01 - 07:40 PM
Calach 01 Sep 01 - 08:10 PM
Dorrie 01 Sep 01 - 08:12 PM
The Shambles 01 Sep 01 - 08:17 PM
AliUK 01 Sep 01 - 08:48 PM
death by whisky 01 Sep 01 - 09:50 PM
AliUK 01 Sep 01 - 09:55 PM
sophocleese 01 Sep 01 - 10:57 PM
AliUK 01 Sep 01 - 11:36 PM
Shields Folk 02 Sep 01 - 03:12 AM
Gervase 02 Sep 01 - 05:01 AM
alanabit 02 Sep 01 - 08:32 AM
ard mhacha 02 Sep 01 - 08:48 AM
Jon Freeman 02 Sep 01 - 08:58 AM
Shields Folk 02 Sep 01 - 09:13 AM
Big Phil 02 Sep 01 - 09:14 AM
Wolfgang 02 Sep 01 - 09:18 AM
Gareth 02 Sep 01 - 09:26 AM
Shields Folk 02 Sep 01 - 09:33 AM
Jon Freeman 02 Sep 01 - 09:44 AM
GUEST,guest 02 Sep 01 - 09:48 AM
The Shambles 02 Sep 01 - 10:17 AM
Wolfgang 02 Sep 01 - 10:22 AM
Liz the Squeak 02 Sep 01 - 10:26 AM
Liz the Squeak 02 Sep 01 - 10:27 AM
GUEST,French guest 02 Sep 01 - 10:51 AM
Wolfgang 02 Sep 01 - 11:09 AM
GUEST,Ranks 02 Sep 01 - 01:17 PM
Shields Folk 02 Sep 01 - 01:20 PM
ard mhacha 02 Sep 01 - 01:38 PM
GUEST, Paul from Hull 02 Sep 01 - 01:40 PM
Shields Folk 02 Sep 01 - 01:55 PM
Big Tim 02 Sep 01 - 02:26 PM
The Shambles 02 Sep 01 - 03:14 PM
lady penelope 02 Sep 01 - 04:09 PM
Jon Freeman 02 Sep 01 - 04:12 PM
Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull 02 Sep 01 - 04:15 PM
beachcomber 02 Sep 01 - 04:56 PM
Thyme2dream 02 Sep 01 - 05:03 PM
Shields Folk 02 Sep 01 - 05:57 PM
Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull 02 Sep 01 - 06:32 PM
gnu 02 Sep 01 - 07:01 PM
Brakn 02 Sep 01 - 07:35 PM
Wolfgang 03 Sep 01 - 04:44 AM
Bagpuss 03 Sep 01 - 06:37 AM
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Subject: Germany 1 England 5
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 06:59 PM

(Football)


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Gareth
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 07:08 PM

Any true Welshman supports two teams, Wales, and whoever is plying England.

When England play The West Indies at Cricket we support the Windies.

When England play South Africa at Rugby we support South Africa.

And when England play anybody at Soccer we support the Police !

1 - 5 Dammn !!!

Garydd.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Susanne (skw)
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 07:12 PM

Congratulations, England!


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Diva
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 07:24 PM

Thats how the Scots do it too Gareth....... dammmmmm. we'll never hear the end of it


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Micca
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 07:38 PM

From Cobble to Suzanne Skw sorry off line for a few days more, be in touch soon!! 5-1!!!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Den
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 07:40 PM

They couldn't beat Holland but we did. Come on Ireland!!! Den


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Calach
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 08:10 PM

there were sixteen references to 1966 in the commentary on BBC1........
When will you Sasanachs LET GO???????????????


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Dorrie
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 08:12 PM

come on england i want to see more posh spice on tv


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: The Shambles
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 08:17 PM

NO, for we did win something.... Once.

Sorry, I had to listen to Archie Mac 'Bloody' Phearson for 12 years, so I have no sympathy..... Well I do actually.

But wasn't it nice to see poor old Harman being turned in circles three times by his Liverpool team mate?


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: AliUK
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 08:48 PM

YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERRRRRRR Go on England...just cos we stuff everyone in the 6 Nations hahahahahahahahaha


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: death by whisky
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 09:50 PM

ooohhh.Ireland on a roll.Lets face it. Soccer is boring outside a goal diffrence.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: AliUK
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 09:55 PM

Soccer?!!! are you North American?


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: sophocleese
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 10:57 PM

I missed the first half of the bloody game. Great fun for awhile in the second half and then it just got boring.....


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: AliUK
Date: 01 Sep 01 - 11:36 PM

but english football is boring. I was suprised how quickly I got fed up with it when I was back there earlier this year. You should watch a few local matches out here in Brazil and then you'll know the real meaning of "fast paced".


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Shields Folk
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 03:12 AM

I remember when I was so naive to support all of the teams from the UK . I couldn't understand why the scotch and welsh got such a kick out of English defeat. So I tried supporting whoever was playing against Scotland or Wales. The trouble is all of the gloating got so boring. Perhaps I would feel better revelling in the defeat of my celtic cousins if it wasn't so bloody predictable!

GO ON ENGLAND!


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Gervase
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 05:01 AM

Hang on, it's ONE game. The first won England have won on German soil since 1965.
And this was just a qualifier...the worst is yet to come.
But I'm being a curmudgeon. The boy Owen done brilliant!


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: alanabit
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 08:32 AM

I can't understand all the anti English malice either. Whenever Scotland, Ireland or Wales are playing, I want them to win. Bloody well done Ireland yesterday! But England, well... After over thirty years of near unbroken humiliation against Germany and the two dreadful matches last year, I was looking forward to the game with some trepidation. We are fast enough to moan when England fluff it, so let's give some credit where it's due. Last night was about as good as it gets. Let's enjoy it while it lasts!


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: ard mhacha
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 08:48 AM

Alanabit, Have you any idea what the rest of the Celts go through, we will bloody well gets this until they toss the sods on us. We are a captured audience between the BBC, SKY and ITV we dare not switch on as you own the bloody ball, and its England all the time. And as for the morons that follow them, hated throughout the World. So now you know why we Celts support every team that play England and we have had plenty to cheer about for the past few years. OOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHH, even our local Banshee is protesting. Slan Ard Mhacha.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 08:58 AM

But Gareth, Welsh players play cricket for England. I think Robert Croft is still on the selection list...

Jon


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Shields Folk
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 09:13 AM

Its not to long ago that Scottish fans had a terrible reputation ( or was it only when they were in England: Glasgow Rangers, Newcastle, 1969; Wembley, every year). Nowadays some mindless thugs give the major cities of Europe major headaches. But most English fans are sound lads (and lasses). A lot of trouble is unintentionally exacerbated by inefective policing, something that doesn't happen in England, and pure xenofobia from the English press. Take heart when England do well and English fans come home after having an entertaining and trouble free time abroad. I know from my own visits away with Newcastle that English fans can be good humoured and even entertaining away from home.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Big Phil
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 09:14 AM

Not realy interested in Pigs bladder kickers, but from a patriotic view point,well done England, I suppose...... Phil*


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Wolfgang
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 09:18 AM

There's no team in the whole world of football against which Germany has lost more often than England (runner ups: Sweden, Italy and Brasil). Of all games between the two after the last war, England has won 9 games, Germany has won 9 (counting as 'victories' two draws in which Germany was so lucky to win the penalty shootout). I really do wonder, alanabit, how the record should look like from your point of view not to feel humilated.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Gareth
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 09:26 AM

Here in South Wales foot ball means Rugby Union. Soccer is the round ball game.

And in cricket its MCC (Marylebone Cricket Club) V whoever -its the Chauvenistic Press who call it England.

Garydd.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Shields Folk
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 09:33 AM

Well anyway- good luck Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland, Isle of Man, all of the Channel Islands and especially the Republic of Ireland. But I'll have to draw the line at Sunderland.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 09:44 AM

You have a point there Gareth. It seems to me to get worse - I thought it was the England and Wales Cricket Board even though it is abbreviated the ECB. Try here. Wales seems to be missed out - presumably it is under the George Cross.

Jon


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: GUEST,guest
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 09:48 AM

I find it really sad that on a group devoted to diverse cultures manifested through music we get the same old Celtic racism of the downtrodden underdog whenever football comes up.Racism is racism in sport or politics.We also find racism in the Celtic folk world, songs used for nationalistic ends the same as Nazi propaganda ruined german folk music by taking it over. What is "Flower of Scotland" if not an anti English rabble rouser. I took to folk music back in the 60's when it had a positive message of co-operation and understanding..this flag waving nonsense is just depressing. May the best team win, be they Scot, Welsh, Irish or English..it's only a game.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: The Shambles
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 10:17 AM

I have this 'orrible feeling that I am going to walk out of the shower (al a Dallas), to find it has all just been a dream?

I'll just stay in the shower and enjoy it, in that case.

Wolfgang you may be right about the statistics but it always seems to be that we lose the important ones?

I keep pinching myself.........five - one?


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Wolfgang
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 10:22 AM

The last game between England and Germany in an international championship final round was last year and England won.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 10:26 AM

Don't mention the score - I did just now but I think I got away with it!!!!

Even my non football following friends were stunned!!

But still,

LTS


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 10:27 AM

IT'S ONLY A GAME!!!

(*BG*)


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: GUEST,French guest
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 10:51 AM

Congratulations England!!!

A French supporter


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Wolfgang
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 11:09 AM

Statistics: 29 games altogether, 14 wins for England, 11 wins for Germany, 4 draws, 63:34 goals for England.

And the statistical basis for Shambles feelings (big games): 4 all or none games (K.O. system) in championships, one final (England won), one quarterfinal (Germany won), two semifinals (draws after the game, both times Germany won the penalty shooting)

All in all, even before last nights one-sided great game, there was hardly a basis for feelings of 'humilation'.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: GUEST,Ranks
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 01:17 PM

Listen to me,

I think we banned a pornography discussion from Mudcat, so we should ban this one as well.

England beating Germany 5:1 is more perverted than any pornography in the whole wild World.

The reason the English celebrate this one off success is their inferiority complex becaus we bashed them about so many times. This complex has been caused by the fact, that the 1966 Match was won because of the greatest swindle and hoax in football history. The English know this and deep in their heart they have a bad conscience, so that they celebrate each real victory ten times more.

Wait till Wednesday when Albania comes, or at least Otto Rehagel with the Greek team. We will laugh last.

Ranks


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Shields Folk
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 01:20 PM

Ranks, Haddaway and SHITE!


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: ard mhacha
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 01:38 PM

Shields Folk,You in the North-East lead the thugs table, I seen it published last week. Newcasle lead from Sunderland in arrests, at and during matches , and that is all you will lead at. Slan Ard Mhacha.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: GUEST, Paul from Hull
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 01:40 PM

Well I agree that it needs closing now...

Football IS only a game (& not one I'm particularly into) but one I cant understand all the rabid animosity about... ESPECIALLY not when its used as an excuse for being offensive, either physically, verbally, or over the web.

Ranks, you can take your Anglophobia elsewhere......


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Shields Folk
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 01:55 PM

Just to reply to ard, I witnessed last week the policing at the Newcastle Sunderland game, from the safety of a hospitality suite (It was someones Birthday), not a quarter was given by the police, anyone with the slightest intention of violence or even provication was removed from the ground and any potential of violence was expertly stewarded. The high statistics could be account for by the zero tolerance of the Northumbria Police Force. Obviously from your Irish Accent you are a Man Utd fan, or is it Arsenal.... or perhaps Liverpool.....

HOWAY THE LADS


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Big Tim
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 02:26 PM

Congrats England, well done, great performance, great result: shame about the fans and the media, especially the media. One question tho: what's all this got to do with music?


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: The Shambles
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 03:14 PM

It made me sing.........


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: lady penelope
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 04:09 PM

You're all mad!

TTFN M'Lady P.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 04:12 PM

music... we had to wait for the game to finish before the evening's sing-around could start in the pub at the Reedham Folk Festival last night.

I suppose congratulations to England are in order but I'm afraid I've lost nearly all my interest in football (although maybe one day it will come back) and would have much preferred an earlier start to the music.

Jon


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 04:15 PM

Only a game, My arse.
Big Tim-I'ts got nowt to do wi music, thats why it sez BS.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: beachcomber
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 04:56 PM

It was quite a result, without doubt. England proved that when they are properly led by someone who knows his job and has the respect of his players they can be a match for anyone. It is usually the British media, putting on the pressure, who cause the players , sometimes, to doubt their own qualities. Fans should not allow these people to speak for them so freely. But the achievement of the Republic of Ireland team in holding on for victory over the silkily skilled Nederlands is, to my mind(Luck of the Irish included, if you must begrudge us) even more astonishing. Consider that our team is drawn from a collection of players who, generally, ply their trade in a foreign country, some have only a tenuous connection to our nation, none, presently, play in Ireland, where Gaelic Football is the supremely dominant football code, our population is barely 3 million and , unlike England, we have absolutely no hope of ultimate victory, ever, in any major tournament. Now, dos'nt that say something about the qualities of Mick McCarthy's men? (Please Shieldsfolk, do not make any obvious cracks, could'nt you be a little more gracious in victory over an old "enemy"?)


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Thyme2dream
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 05:03 PM

GO ALBANIA!!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Shields Folk
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 05:57 PM

I dont begrudge the Irish anything. Their victory over Holland was the begining of an almost perfect evening. Although you must admit it took a Geordie to turn Irish footy around (Wor Jackie). See you in the Final. (actually I thought the others were being ungracious to England)And if Albania win I'll show my arse in Fenwicks window.


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Rt Revd Sir jOhn from Hull
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 06:32 PM

Wheres Fenwicks? !!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: gnu
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 07:01 PM

Forget who praised Owen... is that Mike Owen from the Liverpool club ? That boy can travel !!! We don't get much footy of any kind here in Atlantic Canada. Most we can hope for is a taped game a few days later. Today, I cheered Australia to the Tri-Nations Cup in a rousing test of rugby. As for soccer, we are inundated by the US Open in tennis and most don't even know that soccer is being played at this time of year. PMO !!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Brakn
Date: 02 Sep 01 - 07:35 PM

The most enjoyable part for me was John Motson's commentary. The man's a comic genius.....every cliche in the book. What d'yer mean he was serious?


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Wolfgang
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 04:44 AM

I love the game but I have never loved the nationalistic undertones of some supporters. When I still went to live games I often felt alone in a crowd of supporters when I applauded a fine goal or save of the 'wrong' team. I always have prefered 'our team' to 'we' and never did like expressions as 'humilation', 'inferiority complex' in sport competitions.

As for the qualification, a blunder can happen all the time, but with a high probability England will qualify directly and deservedly so, for all in all it was the better team. Germany hasn't had a good team since about 1992 and the recent English teams are getting better and better both due to the individual players and the team tactic (since Eriksson).

Take two players as example. The German goalie, Oliver Kahn, has been elected as the best European Goalie of the year in 1999 and 2000 and not without reason. Not a bad man and he is especially feared when a player alone runs toward him. He denies more than two out of three possible goals in this situation, an impressive record. Michael Owen is both very fast and very sure when coming alone towards a goalie. He succeded each single time on Saturday. That was one of the duells that made the difference.

As for "hoaxes" (Ranks actually means the word the word 'fraud' and the correct term would be 'referee error'), my memory is less selective and I can also easily recall a quarter final in 1986 with a hand goal that was wrongly granted and a final in 1974 with a very dubious penalty....

I can see the games both in British and German TV and that is a very sobering experience if you ever had believed in impartial reporting. The making of legends begins right during the game. Imagine a wrong linesman decision of offside. The reporter of the lucky team will say 'a close call but lets follow now the game' and never mention the scene again, the reporter of the unlucky team will ponder about the lost chance for the next five minutes and you'll see the slow motion at half time.

The selection of scenes at halftime (or after the game) is completely biased. Well, both TVs show all goals and a red card and a denied goal would also be shown. But that's about all that is common. Both TV crews have the bias not to show good chances of the opponent and to complain only about wrong decisions if the own team was wronged. A good chance denied by a wrong offside call would be seen only in one TV and the close-up showing that the there was no foul before the freekick that led to a goal would only be seen in the other TV.

Once a reporter even said 'they were so lucky, they only had one single chance in the second half and that was a goal' and neither mentioned nor showed after the game the kick hitting the goalpost. You'd not want to know who made this blunder, would you?

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: BS: Germany 1 England 5
From: Bagpuss
Date: 03 Sep 01 - 06:37 AM

Just for the record, not all Scots want England to do badly. My scottish husband always wants England to do well in the qualifying matches anyway. This is because he knows if England do not qualify, the tv coverage of the World Cup will be dismal and he will get to see fewer Scottish matches.

He still wants them to get thrashed once they are in the finals of course.......

Bagpuss


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Mudcat time: 28 October 10:51 PM EDT

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