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When your group disagrees wth you...

cait 26 Mar 01 - 03:35 PM
Uncle_DaveO 26 Mar 01 - 03:28 PM
GUEST,Phil Cooper 26 Mar 01 - 03:23 PM
JeZeBeL 26 Mar 01 - 03:04 PM
MMario 26 Mar 01 - 02:33 PM
Mrrzy 26 Mar 01 - 02:23 PM
cait 26 Mar 01 - 02:22 PM
GUEST,Roll&Go-C 26 Mar 01 - 01:40 PM
mousethief 26 Mar 01 - 01:39 PM
GUEST,Midchuck upstairs 26 Mar 01 - 01:38 PM
Sorcha 26 Mar 01 - 01:37 PM
mousethief 26 Mar 01 - 01:37 PM
Eric the Viking 26 Mar 01 - 01:35 PM
mousethief 26 Mar 01 - 01:33 PM
Eric the Viking 26 Mar 01 - 01:33 PM
cait 26 Mar 01 - 01:10 PM
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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: cait
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 03:35 PM

thanks for the lesson in semantics. you're right, of course. any other thoughts?


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 03:28 PM

The word is "censured", not "censored", unless the gentle sould made you stop singing.

DAve Oesterreich


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: GUEST,Phil Cooper
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 03:23 PM

You can't please everybody. Because you sing a song about infanticide, doesn't mean you endorse it. The old ballads deal with a lot of uncomfortable subjects. I think a lot of our current problems stem from us sweeping these issues under the rug. I recall an article about Martin Carthy a few years ago in Folk Roots where he was discussing "Prince Heathen" and mentioned that it was not his job to do the audience's thinking for it. Also his liner notes on the same ballad recently said that he defied anyone to listen to the song and think that that was an OK way to behave. You should be able to sing what you want, if you want to preface the song with an introduction warning sensitive people, they can have the option of stepping out for a bathroom break.


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: JeZeBeL
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 03:04 PM

I don't think there's anything wrong with singing a song like that. I used to sing a long to it all the time when I was about 3 years old and my parents were listening to the dubliners....that's what put me off folk music for 16 years by the way!!


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: MMario
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 02:33 PM

Are we all suppossed to pretend that the murder of children never happens?

Or that singing a song about it advocates it?

The woman who censored you needs to wake up to reality!


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: Mrrzy
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 02:23 PM

I"m sure it was the babykilling song that got nixed, nothing so sweet as (what I have as) Waily Waily. I sing that song to kids allatime. Great song. But does it ever upset the parents! Who need a good dose of reality, or something, I think! (But I'm also with mousethief that more info would be helpful about this incident.)


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: cait
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 02:22 PM

to answer the question about what form the censorship took, the gentle soul assumed a worsening expression of horror until i stopped. i thought she was going to be ill. she then said to me that she thought there could be no reason to ever sing a song about the murder of a child.

i tried to explain that it's more about the consequences, to no avail, the head kept shaking. i felt as though i was being called an advocate to child killing.

it does meet an uproarious response in the audience, they love it when the woman gets hung at the end.

and no, i'm no advocate for the death penalty either. i'm a singer of the stories set to tunes...songs.

she censored me...for the evening. there's no recovery from that sort of accusation.

i suggest the proper response may be sadness, not repression, sadness for the ugliness in this world. sometimes we humans are compelled to write songs out of pain, often as otherwise, at least as often.

*caiti*


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: GUEST,Roll&Go-C
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 01:40 PM

What verses did you sing? I'm frankly puzzled what some gentle soul could find to object to in this song as I know it. I know the title as "Waillie, Waillie" and Gene Bonyun used to sing these verses:

When cockle shells turn silver bells,
Then will my love return to me.

Chorus:
Oh, waillie, waillie,
Oh, love is bonnie,
A little while when first it's new.

When roses grow 'neath winter snow,
Then will my love return to me. (CHO)

For when love grows old, it waxes cold,
And fades away like morning dew. (CHO)

Maybe you need to find a more mature group to sing with...Good luck and keep singing these songs.


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: mousethief
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 01:39 PM

Okay that answers my 2nd question. I can certainly understand that somebody might not want to hear that song. So I need to hear from Caiti what exactly happened before passing judgment on the "censorship."


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: GUEST,Midchuck upstairs
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 01:38 PM

Can't someone in authority revise this thing so it doesn't go ahead and post the message with no message if you forget and hit "enter" instead of "tab" after typing in the From line....

Anyway. There is only one good answer to people like that. And if you use it, they have a good answer back. Their answer is, "I can't! When it reaches, it won't bend, and when it bends, it won't reach!"

One time at a Farmers' market gig, Kris did the Berrymans' "A Chat With Your Mother," usually called "The F-word Song." A lady came up after and complained about singing such a thing where there were little children present. Kris says, "But, the whole point of the song is that there are no bad words used at all!" The lady says, "Yes, but what if my little boy asks what "the F-word" is, what will I tell him."

My wife is a better person than I am, praise be; and she's a public school teacher. She asked how old the kid was. The lady said he was in Kindergarten. Kris said "He knows. Take my word for it. He knows."

Peter.


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: Sorcha
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 01:37 PM

It's a variant of Child's Cruel Mother, lyrics are in this thread.


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: mousethief
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 01:37 PM

Ah, sort of an old-timey murder ballad type thing?


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: Eric the Viking
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 01:35 PM

It's about an old woman who lives in the wood, she has a baby 3 months old, she has a penknife long and sharp, she sticks the knife in the baby's head etc etc. (Not nice, but I believe true!)


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: mousethief
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 01:33 PM

Caiti, what exactly do you mean when you say you were "censored"? Someone told you to shut up? Or said they were offended by the song and asked you to stop?

What's the song about? Can you give us the lyrics?

curious and willing to discuss it once he knows more,
Alex


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Subject: RE: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: Eric the Viking
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 01:33 PM

I love to sing it to my kids in class-they think it's great! But then they are a mixture of muggers, buggers and thieves.

Eric


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Subject: When your group disagrees wth you...
From: cait
Date: 26 Mar 01 - 01:10 PM

i'm not sure of the spelling, but is anyone familiar with the 'Weela Wallia' song?

i attempted to perform this song (a clancy brothers favorite) at an after hours jam (public had gone home to beds) and was censored by a gently soul there.

to tell you the truth, i felt as though my rights had been violated. i shut up and was unable to contribute any more that night. censorship is very ugly.

songs are written from pain as often as not, and the way the irish deal (in song) with pain is legitimate in any form it needs to take.

try to understand that the way some people act may be EVEN MORE appropriate for them than the way you feel you should act or react out of your doctrines.

can i have your thoughts on this subject?

*caiti*


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