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American National Anthem

DigiTrad:
ANACREONTIC SONG (2)
THE STAR SPANGLED BANNER
TO ANACREON IN HEAVEN


Related threads:
US Natl Anthem: Other lyrics to tune? (39)
The Anacreontic Song (10)
Lyr Add: Star Spangled Banner (25)
Lyr Req: Star Spangle(d) Heaven (2)
(origins) Origins: Star Spangled Banner - Folk/Sea Shanty? (13)
US Nat'l Anthem in Spanish? (71)
eo:Pretty Little Horses / Star-Spangled -esperanto (6)
BS: Did They Change the National Anthem? (55)
BS: Between You and the National Anthem (2)


McGrath of Harlow 28 Aug 11 - 06:38 PM
Stringsinger 28 Aug 11 - 06:14 PM
Joe_F 28 Aug 11 - 06:09 PM
McGrath of Harlow 28 Aug 11 - 10:23 AM
kendall 27 Aug 11 - 03:55 PM
Desert Dancer 27 Aug 11 - 03:17 PM
CapriUni 04 Jul 06 - 01:37 PM
Shields Folk 12 Jun 01 - 06:54 PM
toadfrog 12 Jun 01 - 01:02 AM
Dicho (Frank Staplin) 12 Jun 01 - 12:03 AM
Joe Offer 11 Jun 01 - 08:35 PM
Joe Offer 11 Jun 01 - 08:15 PM
Joe Offer 11 Jun 01 - 08:03 PM
TamthebamfraeScotland 01 May 01 - 01:01 PM
TamthebamfraeScotland 01 May 01 - 12:59 PM
GUEST,Sailor Dan 30 Apr 01 - 09:25 PM
TamthebamfraeScotland 30 Apr 01 - 05:43 PM
CarolC 29 Apr 01 - 04:06 PM
Fiolar 29 Apr 01 - 11:39 AM
TamthebamfraeScotland 29 Apr 01 - 08:40 AM
CarolC 26 Apr 01 - 05:53 AM
Chanteyranger 26 Apr 01 - 04:16 AM
Dunc 25 Apr 01 - 02:44 PM
TamthebamfraeScotland 25 Apr 01 - 08:16 AM
TamthebamfraeScotland 16 Mar 01 - 02:06 PM
GUEST,Pete Peterson at work 12 Mar 01 - 01:37 PM
Sarah2 12 Mar 01 - 01:04 AM
Lonesome EJ 11 Mar 01 - 01:35 PM
CRANKY YANKEE 10 Mar 01 - 06:05 AM
catspaw49 09 Mar 01 - 11:45 PM
Amos 09 Mar 01 - 11:26 PM
catspaw49 09 Mar 01 - 11:14 PM
CRANKY YANKEE 09 Mar 01 - 10:59 PM
GUEST,Bruce O. 09 Mar 01 - 10:58 PM
catspaw49 09 Mar 01 - 10:21 PM
CRANKY YANKEE 09 Mar 01 - 10:16 PM
CRANKY YANKEE 09 Mar 01 - 10:07 PM
catspaw49 09 Mar 01 - 10:00 PM
Lonesome EJ 09 Mar 01 - 09:34 PM
CRANKY YANKEE 09 Mar 01 - 09:03 PM
CRANKY YANKEE 09 Mar 01 - 07:02 PM
Lonesome EJ 09 Mar 01 - 04:51 PM
CRANKY YANKEE 09 Mar 01 - 03:38 PM
Fiolar 09 Mar 01 - 08:30 AM
mousethief 08 Mar 01 - 01:44 PM
Lonesome EJ 08 Mar 01 - 12:52 PM
Jon Freeman 08 Mar 01 - 08:13 AM
GUEST,Sarah at work 08 Mar 01 - 07:57 AM
Amos 07 Mar 01 - 11:47 PM
Spud Murphy 07 Mar 01 - 10:13 PM
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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Aug 11 - 06:38 PM

I can't imagine anyone in Britain having the least concern about anything in anybody's national anthem. Dom peolle anywhere worry about that kind of thing?


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Stringsinger
Date: 28 Aug 11 - 06:14 PM

Joe, good for you! I am a pacifist and democratic socialist too and I feel as American as any other in this country. I second your emotion.

Our tradition of folk music grew up in the time of Popular Front in the U.S., folklorists,
musicians, getting interested in "people's"music, songs of the working-class, labor movement, agrarian music from Appalachia, African-America, pockets of ethnic communities from other countries and it all came of interest because of the Left wing, who endorsed it, nurtured it and gave it credence so that it could finally become used by institutions such as Mudcat.

The academics in music departments began to see its value as a result. The historians, anthropologists, ethnomusicologists and folklorists were made aware of the value of this expression of music principally because it was nurtured by the Left.

Alan Lomax, Pete Seeger, Ken Goldstein, Archie Green, Woody Guthrie, Bess Lomax Hawes, Josh White, Burl Ives, Leadbelly, Florence Reese, Hazel Dickens, and others regardless of how they ended up politically, they all got their start in the Left Wing Movement's embrace of American folk music.

And they weren't all Marxists or Communists, either.

Today, much of the Left has been co-opted by a gauzy "liberalism" and the songs that have content have been forsaken for a safe singer/songwriter genre, in mho. The "protest singer" has become corporatized, commercialized and trivialized.

A national anthem should be powerful enough to bring tears to the eyes when being sung as it is in other countries that have had to overcome oppression and dictatorship.
I think America the Beautiful, the other verses that are not generally sung, come close. It's significant that every school child all over the world pretty much knows
"This Land is Your Land".

Woody wrote "This Land" in reaction to Irving Berlin's "God Bless America". Berlin called his song at the time of its creation, a peace song. I don't think Berlin would have liked how it's being used today by these pseudo-patriotic political hacks.

A national anthem should show the struggle of America to achieve democracy through Civil Rights, Labor Unions, Women's Rights, Child labor rights, Free speech, Anti-war demonstrations and not a paean to military violence, munitions, and big monied corporate interests.

We don't need a contrived pop song such as "I'm proud to be an American" by Lee Greenwood. When I hear that song, I feel violated as an American.

Without bombs bursting in air which will keep the US from becoming the land of the free and the home of the brave, I hope that a national anthem will some day emerge and be sung by Americans as an authentic anthemic expression of true American values mentioned above.

There are a lot of songwriters out there today to make it happen.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Joe_F
Date: 28 Aug 11 - 06:09 PM

The action of Congress in calling "The Star-Spangled Banner" the national anthem was not the result of any deliberation or contest. It was merely the ratification of what everybody knew. Long before (e.g., during W.W. I), people were beaten up for not standing when it was played.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 28 Aug 11 - 10:23 AM

On the other hand in order to have a decent argument you've got to have someone who has a different view of things. Not hard round here...


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: kendall
Date: 27 Aug 11 - 03:55 PM

Never argue with someone whose opinion you don't respect.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Desert Dancer
Date: 27 Aug 11 - 03:17 PM

The Star-Spangled Bummer, an article in the wonderful NY Times Disunion series on the Civil War, discusses attempts in 1861 to come up with a national anthem, and, in particular, to generate new candidates for one other than "Yankee Doodle," or "Hail, Columbia" or the "Star-Spangled Banner", which were all popular at the time. They were not successful.

The article concludes by saying, "In 1931, as the Great Depression again tested the country's resolve, the 'Star-Spangled Banner' was signed into law as America's official national anthem."

~ Becky in Tucson


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: CapriUni
Date: 04 Jul 06 - 01:37 PM

I found the full lyrics to this tune yesterday... Amazing how few Americans even know all the lyrics to the first verse...

Now if I may put on my "Poetry Critique" hat (It's purple, with tassles, by the way):

I really like the second verse. The details he chose -- the mists of the ocean, the dim light, the breeze -- all paint a clear picture of one man's perspective, and show, first, his anxiety and then, his relief.

The third and fourth verses, however, leave me cold. In both of these, he sinks into boasting and propaganda. He may, considering his experiences, have been entitled to these feelings. But boasting and propaganda make weak poems.

"Show, don't tell."


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Shields Folk
Date: 12 Jun 01 - 06:54 PM

Being late for the last two world wars is the reason Americans spend so much money on armaments. They want to be bang on time for the next one.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: toadfrog
Date: 12 Jun 01 - 01:02 AM

Joe: To answer your question, the tune is attributed to John Stafford Smith, who seems to have composed it for the Anacreon Society. Click also here, for corroboration. And for a short explanation, clack. Yet another site states that it was probably a joint work of members of the Anacreon Society, under Smith's leadership. (Sorry, forgot the clickie for that one. But here's another, just for luck, CLUCK. Actually, that's an interesting browse, looking for "Anacreon in Heaven" on the web!

I had believed that the third verse was dropped from the Natl. Anthem to keep the British happy, but this official-looking site gives proof through the note that our verse is still there!

Conclusive Proof! The third verse is part of the official Nat'l Anthem. The web site of the American Embassy to the United Kingdom says, "Their blood has wiped out their foul footsteps' pollution,"-right out in front of God and everybody! Either the Brits have a wonderful sense of humor, or they never noticed!


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 12 Jun 01 - 12:03 AM

Cranky Yankee has it right when he protests the hyphenation now increasing in the States. Living in Canada, with two official languages, taxpayer-supported separate schools for Catholics and Protestants (and now all of the other religious persuasions are getting into the act), Indians and others competing over fishing and hunting rights (Indians are hunting out of season and ignoring limits), etc., etc., I see a divided country where political correctness is rampant. If that is a confused sentence, that is what present conditions here make me- confused. By the way, Cranky Yankee may be interested in the Univ. Toronto poetry site, where Fort M'Henry is referred to and The Star Spangled Banner is linked to The Stars and Stripes Forever in the heading to Francis Scott Key's poem.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Joe Offer
Date: 11 Jun 01 - 08:35 PM

From the Smithsonisn Website.
-Joe Offer-
Complete version of "The Star-Spangled Banner" showing spelling and punctuation from Francis Scott Key's manuscript in the Maryland Historical Society collection.

O say can you see, by the dawn's early light,
What so proudly we hail'd at the twilight's last gleaming,
Whose broad stripes and bright stars through the perilous fight
O'er the ramparts we watch'd were so gallantly streaming?
And the rocket's red glare, the bomb bursting in air,
Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there,
O say does that star-spangled banner yet wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave?

On the shore dimly seen through the mists of the deep
Where the foe's haughty host in dread silence reposes,
What is that which the breeze, o'er the towering steep,
As it fitfully blows, half conceals, half discloses?
Now it catches the gleam of the morning's first beam,
In full glory reflected now shines in the stream,
'Tis the star-spangled banner - O long may it wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore,
That the havoc of war and the battle's confusion
A home and a Country should leave us no more?
Their blood has wash'd out their foul footstep's pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

O thus be it ever when freemen shall stand
Between their lov'd home and the war's desolation!
Blest with vict'ry and peace may the heav'n rescued land
Praise the power that hath made and preserv'd us a nation!
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto - "In God is our trust,"
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.


This is the first known printing of Key's poem. Called a broadside, it was probably printed in Baltimore on Sept. 17, 1814. It once belonged to Judge Joseph H. Nicholson, who was married to Key's wife's sister.
Defence of Fort McHenry

The annexed song was composed under the following circumstances -
A gentleman had left Baltimore, in a flag of truce for the purpose of getting released from the British fleet, a friend of his who had been captured at Marlborough.--He went as far as the mouth of the Patuxent, and was not permitted to return lest the intended attack on Baltimore should be disclosed. He was therefore brought up the Bay to the mouth of the Patapsco, where the flag vessel was kept under the guns of a frigate, and he was compelled to witness the bombardment of Fort McHenry, which the Admiral had boasted that he would carry in a few hours, and that the city must fall. He watched the flag at the Fort through the whole day with an anxiety that can be better felt than described, until the night prevented him from seeing it. In the night he watched the Bomb Shells, and at early dawn his eye was again greeted by the proudly waving flag of his country.

Tune - Anacreon in Heaven.

O! say can you see by the dawn's early light,
What so proudly we hailed at the twilight's last gleaming,
Whose broad stripes and bright stars through the perilous fight,
O'er the ramparts we watch'd, were so gallantly streaming?
And the Rockets' red glare, the Bombs bursting in air,
Gave proof through the night that our Flag was still there;
O! say does that star-spangled Banner yet wave,
O'er the Land of the free, and the home of the brave?

On the shore dimly seen through the mists of the deep,
Where the foe's haughty host in dread silence reposes,
What is that which the breeze, o'er the towering steep,
As it fitfully blows, half conceals, half discloses?
Now it catches the gleam of the morning's first beam,
In full glory reflected now shines in the stream,
'Tis the star-spangled banner, O! long may it wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

And where is that band who so vauntingly swore
That the havoc of war and the battle's confusion,
A home and a country, shall leave us no more?
Their blood has washed out their foul footsteps pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling and slave,
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,
And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave,
O'er the Land of the Free, and the Home of the Brave.


O! thus be it ever when freemen shall stand,
Between their lov'd home, and the war's desolation,
Blest with vict'ry and peace, may the Heav'n rescued land,
Praise the Power that hath made and preserv'd us a nation!
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto--"In God is our Trust;"
And the star-spangled Banner in triumph shall wave,
O'er the Land of the Free, and the Home of the Brave.


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Subject: ADD: Star Spangled Banner correction^^
From: Joe Offer
Date: 11 Jun 01 - 08:15 PM

OK, here's the correction I propose to submit to the Digital Tradition. The words of the first three verses are exactly what I found in the Army-Navy Hymnal from the Government Printing Office (give or take a contracted word spelling like heav'n), which I consider to be a fairly reliable source. I think it's quite possible that Jody's third verse was written by Key, but that it was not accepted by the U.S. Congress as part of the official national anthem. Can anybody give documented proof of the official version of the anthem, and of any other verses Key wrote?
So, who gets attribution for the tune?
-Joe Offer-
THE STAR SPANGLED BANNER
(Francis Scott Key)

Oh, say can you see by the dawn's early light
What so proudly we hailed at the twilight's last gleaming,
Whose broad stripes and bright stars, through the perilous fight
O'er the ramparts we watched were so gallantly streaming?
And the rockets' red glare, the bombs bursting in air,
Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there.
Oh say, does that star spangled banner yet wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave?

On the shore dimly seen through the mists of the deep,
Where the foe's haughty host in dread silence reposes,
What is that which the breeze, o'er the towering steep
As it fitfully blows half conceals, half discloses?
Now it catches the gleam of the morning's first beam,
In full glory reflected, now shines on the stream;
'Tis the star spangled banner! Oh long may it wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!

Oh, thus be it ever, when free men shall stand
Between their loved homes and the war's desolation.
Blessed with vict'ry and peace, may the heav'n-rescued land
Praise the Pow'r that hath made and preserved us a nation.
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto, "In God is our trust!"
And the star spangled banner in triumph shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!

Source: Army and Navy Hymnal, U.S. Government Printing Office, 1942.
The hymnal attributes the tune to John S. Smith, 1775.
"Heart Songs" (1909) attributes the tune to Samuel Arnold.


-----------------------------------------------------------------
Our national anthem was written by Frances Scott Key during the
attack of the British on Fort McHenry, September 13, 1814. Key
had gone out from Baltimore to the British fleet to obtain the
release of a friend, held prisoner. Her arrived on the eve of
the bombardment of the city by the British, and was detained on
his own vessel lest the plans of the attack be disclosed. All
day an night he watched the battle anxiously from the deck. When
morning dawned and showed the Stars and Stripes still floating
over the fort, he was deeply moved and quickly wrote the words of
the poem. They were later set to the tune of an old English
drinking song, "Anacreon in Heaven," a song widely sung in this
country at that time.

Here is a seldom-used third verse that is reputed to have been written by Key. If this verse is used, the final (fourth) verse is the one that begins, "Oh, thus be it ever..."

Now where is the foe who so vauntingly swore,
Midst the havoc of War and the battle's confusion,
A home and a country they'd leave us no more.
Their blood has washed out their foul footsteps' pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling or slave,
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave.
And, The Star Spangled Banner in triumph shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.

Furthermore, the last, or fourth, verse does not end with a repeat of the last two lines of the third verse. It ends thusly:

And the Star Spangled Banner in triumph shall wave
WHILE the land of the free IS the home of the Brave.

Source: The Scottish Students' Song Book
Published for the Song Book Committee: of the Students'Representative councils of Scotland. by Bayley & Ferguson: 14:Paternoster: Row: London. C 1891. (that's the way it was punctuated)


@patriotic
filename[ STARSPAN
DC

^^
Click here for the Star-Spangled Banner site at the Smithsonian Institution.


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Subject: ADD Verse: Star Spangled Banner^^
From: Joe Offer
Date: 11 Jun 01 - 08:03 PM

Copied from a message posted by Cranky Yankee in the FAQ.
-Joe Offer-
The Star Spangled Banner, for one, is in the digitrad. However, it does not contain the third verse(not uncommon in the U.S.) The third verse ties everything together providing the continuity that this great piece of literature otherwise lacks. Here it is.

THE STAR SPANGLED BANNER (also, "The defence of Ft. McHenry)
words by Francis Scott Key..Melody by John Stafford Smith

III
Now where is the foe who so vauntingly swore,
Midst the havoc of War and the battle's confusion,
A home and a country they'd leave us no more.
Their blood has washed out their foul footsteps pollution.
No refuge could save the hireling or slave,
From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave.
And, The Star Spangled Banner in triumph shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave.
.
Furthermore, the last , or fourth, verse does not end with a repeat of the last two lines of the third verse. It ends thusly:

And the Star Spangled Banner in triumph shall wave
WHILE the land of the free IS the home of the Brave.

Source: The Scottish Students' Song Book
Published for the Song Book Committee: of the Students'Representative councils of Scotland. by Bayley & Ferguson: 14:Paternoster: Row: London. C 1891. (that's the way it was punctuated)

Jody Gibson^^


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: TamthebamfraeScotland
Date: 01 May 01 - 01:01 PM


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: TamthebamfraeScotland
Date: 01 May 01 - 12:59 PM

ok then


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: GUEST,Sailor Dan
Date: 30 Apr 01 - 09:25 PM

Well lets see, I think we may have blasted everything and everyone in the world and have named 36 different songs to replace the Star Spangled Banner, We have gotten a lot of history about numerous things, I havent been to all of the states or all of the countries, I havent met everyone or explored whats behind everyones ideas of what america is, isnt, was, wasnt, should be or shouldnt be.

I am Catholic now, was born a Jew and Bar Mitzvahed. My heritage is Irish, Polish, German, and are filled with Priests, Rabbi's, Cantors and Nuns. My immediate family is combined Caucasian, Oriental and African. They are republican, democratic and liberal, they are Yankees, Southerners Westerners, Easteners. There is a Lady that stands in NY harbor that says "give me your tired your poor, etc.

My vote for a song that should be the American National Anthem, is the one that starts off "This is My Country"

Just remember life isnt fair and isnt served on a silver platter and I wouldnt go around opening the closed closets of all countries.

THIS IS MY COUNTRY ...............


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: TamthebamfraeScotland
Date: 30 Apr 01 - 05:43 PM

I was going to saying something about 'cutting Americans and other nations down' but what's the use anyway, if you think that's what I'm doing then fine however I'm not and I never wanted to do cut anyone down.

I thought I might give you some facts about America that you might not have read about.

So this will be my last message because I feel like I'm losing the battle here because it seems whenever I write anything some people get the wrong idea.

I might not as smart as some people but at least I try.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: CarolC
Date: 29 Apr 01 - 04:06 PM

busbitter, a lot of us in the U.S. have Scottish ancestry. So if you're trying to cut 'Americans' down with that one, you're wasting your time. It just doesn't wash.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Fiolar
Date: 29 Apr 01 - 11:39 AM

Methinks you jest. Of the 56 signatories of the Declaration 48 were born in what was to become the United States. Of the other eight, two were born in England, three in Ireland, two in Scotland and one in Wales. To call half the signatories "Scots" is stretching things a bit.It may be that the ancestors of some of them were of Scottish origin but that is a different kettle of fish. I am Irish but my son who was born in England regards himself as British and hold a passport to that effect.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: TamthebamfraeScotland
Date: 29 Apr 01 - 08:40 AM

Oh I forgot to mention that if it wasn't for the Scots who signed the declartion of independance then America would still be under the English yoke.

I thought I would mention that.

John Paul Jones came from Scotland, and more than half of the men who signed the declertion were Scots.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: CarolC
Date: 26 Apr 01 - 05:53 AM

Jose, can you see
By the Donsellee Light...

I like it!


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Chanteyranger
Date: 26 Apr 01 - 04:16 AM

Dunc, the American comedian Bill Dana, in his character of "Jose Jimenez," said that when he went to his first baseball game, he was touched that everyone was concerned that he should have a good view, because just before the game started, everyone stood up and said, "Jose, can you see?"

-chanteyranger


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Dunc
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 02:44 PM

I'm sure I was not the only non American to go through a large part of my life thinking that there was a US coastal town / city called Donsellee.
It had to be on the coast 'cause it had a light house.
It had to be famous 'cause it featured in the American National Anthem....

...."by the Donsellee Light".

I'm just a simple Scotsman and it was an easy mistake to make.
Tell me that I'm not alone in making that mistake.
Please tell me...


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: TamthebamfraeScotland
Date: 25 Apr 01 - 08:16 AM

I know that I fly off the handle now and again, but that's just me.

So if I've offended anyone then I'm sorry.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: TamthebamfraeScotland
Date: 16 Mar 01 - 02:06 PM

I think that national anthem should be, This land is your land or If I had a hammer.

Tom


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: GUEST,Pete Peterson at work
Date: 12 Mar 01 - 01:37 PM

WOW! The expertise here on Mudcat really blows me away some times. Now I know where to go for advice on sailing. . . the man who was teaching me, 30 yr ago, to sail drowned in a boating accident, which kinda soured me on the whole idea.
last weekend wound up doing a Historical Society gig (in Revolutionary War costume) and remembered to take off my digital wristwatch, but, as always happens, we were asked "can you sing the Star Spangled Banner?" and of course we grinned and said SORRY, it hadn't been written yet! But we can sing you the old words to the same tune. . .
Green Hills of Earth. . . has anybody ever written a tune for it? Maybe we do need a Planetary National Anthem. . . the Jamaican "One Love" might be a good place to start (me ducks)


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Sarah2
Date: 12 Mar 01 - 01:04 AM

Bruce, sorry, I don't think I've ever been to Omaha. (Maybe went through it on vacation as a very young child, but, that won't count.) It's just a suggestion for The Moving National Capital City fantasy I have; I think those guys lose touch in DC and ought to be sent somewhere new after each presidential election. Get 'em back to confronting reality and turn DC into a political theme park -- see, we're halfway there already!

Cranky Yankee, what a delight your posts are. Your complete "Star Spangled Banner" reminded me it was the first thing I ever recited, back in third grade. Me da helped me learn it, down to putting feeling into it instead of just "da-da, da-da-da, da-da-da-da-da-da, etc." Taught me a lot about reading and understanding poetry, he did, with that song. In fact, the thing he did first was have me write it out as if it were prose. I guess that's why your post, without the line breaks, made me think of it. So thanks for that.

So, even if we're stuck in some mezzo soprano key at the ball game, now we can at least appreciate its history, and smile to ourselves..."I wonder who else here knows we're singing a folk song...?"

Sarah


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 11 Mar 01 - 01:35 PM

Welcome folks. Memories of Newport are forever mingled with a lobster pot dinner I had there. And that's a good thing!


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: CRANKY YANKEE
Date: 10 Mar 01 - 06:05 AM

In one of my previous spasms, I mention "The North American Wooly Mamouth". The line should read, "Hunted the North American Wooly Mamouth TO EXTINCTION". SPAW, either you or I should hire a proofreader, or, at the very least, read our copy over before it is submitted BUSBITER, Don't you dare quit, I'd rather have the opiniion of someone who can think, write and say things while standing on his (or her) feet and right off the top of his (or her) head without carefully examining each word so as to cover his (or her) ass, than the opinion of those people who carefuuly consider what they are saying for political correctness. (pffhew, as I wipe my brow)

CHANTEYRANGER. Being as a Chanteyman has to have the exp[erience and qualification to be in charge of whatever operation they are engaged in and must be completely familiar with the mechanics and operation of the running rigging of what ever vessel he's been hired to work on, (very minimum RATING OF "AB" BETTER OF BOATSWAIN OR MATE) and not just a folksinger who sings chanteys, what are your qualifications. (not to be nasty , just curious and hoping for the best) I am a full time professional Boatswain-Chanteyman, perhaps, the last. I've served as both on several vessels, most notably the Hermaphrodite Brig (erroneously referred to as a "Brigantine") "Black Pearl", the full rigged ship "HMS Rose" (accurate replica of an 18th century 20 gun, 6th rate warship) amd the tops'l schooners "Bill of Rights" and "Aurora. I was not only "Rose's" Boatswain, but my wife and I did the original rigging and I trained the crew, being the only one of her original crew with any extensive experience with "Square Rigging". This included the Captain who did a magnificent job of teaching what we referred (lovingly) to as, "A plumber, a gorilla and a bunch of Hippies", how to follow orders while still thinking for themselves. Capt. Jolyn Bireley , a magnificently able cfommander, Formed 20 Men and 5 Women, most of whom were complete landsmen, into a crew of confident, disciplined ad competent seamen. On a sailing vessel, the words, "man", "manned" and "men" have no sexual distinction connected to them. They simply mean "hand", "handled" and "hands". "Rosie" could never have done her maiden voyage, given the size of her crew, without the use of sea chanteys to coordinate the work. None of this has anything to do with our (USA'S) National Anthem. I'd have started a new subject if I knew how. I'm very new to "computering" and almost illiterate. (how's that for a brand new word that I think I just made up)

To be classified as a "Ship", a sailing vessel must be rigged "Square to the mast" (hence, "square rigging") on three or more masts. In other words it must have, AT THE VERY LEAST, THE WHOLE NINE YARDS". Square rigged sails are fastened to long sticks called, "yards", at each end of which there is a section of lesser diameter called, "yardarms" or "The short end of the stick" When crewmen are needed up in the rigging for setting or furling sails, they "get on the stick" and the last one up gets "the short end of the stick".

I'm delighted that Mrs. Cranky Yankee (MA FAZOO) and I have met all of you

If someone who sings Sea Chanteys for entertainmnent or even to coordinate work where someone else is in charge, refers to themselves as being "Chanteymen", THEN, WHAT DO YOU CALL ME? (never mind your first answer)

Love and kisses

(Mr) Jody Gibson Newport, Rhode Island


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: catspaw49
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 11:45 PM

Thanks Amos, but I don't think the 'airs' produced here in Ohio are the ones we want to use in any anthem, unless you want to consider "Ode to the Little Brown Shack Out Back" as a possibility.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Amos
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 11:26 PM

I really believe Ma is right -- we need a true, a beautiful, a Terran Anthem, and I think a good starting point would be Robert Heinlein's "Green Hills of Earth". But we need to take out the rocket jockey stuff and find a jolly air to put it to. Now the jolliest airs in these parts are produced in Ohio, se we should probably ask one of the elders there...


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: catspaw49
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 11:14 PM

LOL....Well Crank and Ma.....We're glad to have you both!!!

Spaw


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: CRANKY YANKEE
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 10:59 PM

The last two spasms under the name, "Cranky Yankee" were, in fact written by my wife, "MA FAZOO" WITH WHOM I DON'T ALWAYS SEE EYE TO AYE. (we're both square rig sailors and riggers) She says that we need a "Planatal Anthem" That's ok with me. It could start with, "Old Macdonald had a farm, EEYAYE, EE-EYE, YO. DOT COM. 'spaw, she says she does'nt know why she used caps, she's not even a capitalist. See what I have to live with?


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: GUEST,Bruce O.
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 10:58 PM

Sarah, Omaha was a great place to grow up in, but I found after a couple months elsewhere that I had no urge to return except to see what's left. Those holsteins that used to be in the pasture across Dodge from U. of Omaha weren't the the last time I looked. Is Peony Park still around? I got my social security card at age 12 so I could get a job helping to clean it up after it got flooded (again). Mud 6 inches deep. My grandfater's house in East Omaha got flooded every time the Missouri decided it was flood time, and he came to live with us in west Omaha (about a mile from the Aksarben). We'd got down every night to see how much of the chimney was visible, and every one would palaver for about half an hour about how soon he'd get back to clean up. Missouri floods were better than those at Peony Park; the mud was only about a 1/2 inch deep, and the walls were cleaner than before the flood. Automatic spring cleaning.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: catspaw49
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 10:21 PM

Yeah........We're glad to MA, but caps aren't needed unless you're really mad or something. Welcome to the 'Cat and we hope you too will learn to love this place as much as some of us do.

NOW STOP IT WITH THE CAPS!!!!!!!!!!

Spaw (:<))


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: CRANKY YANKEE
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 10:16 PM

JUST WENT IN TO SEE IF CRANKY YANKEE HAD ANY FEEDBACK TO HIS COMMENTS, AND TO MY HORROR, FOUND THAT ALL HIS (LENGHTY) MESSAGES HAD MY NAME ON THEM! YOU SEE FOLKS (JEAD HANGING DOWN IN EXAGGERATED SHAME) I'M MARRIED TO THE MAN. HE'S THE ONE WHO GAVE YOU ALL THE HISTORY LESSONS AND WHO WAS RIGHTLY CALLED A CURMUDGEON FOR IT. AS YOU CAN PROBABLY TELL WE HAVE A MOST INTERESTING HOUSEHOLD. HOPE TO READ MANY MORE FASCINATING THOUGHTS FROM THE FOLKS AT MUDCAT. GLAD WE FOUND YOU. LOVE MA


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: CRANKY YANKEE
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 10:07 PM

THANKYOU, ART FOR THE KOTTKE JOKE. ONCE, WHEN HE WAS SINGING HERE IN NEWPORT,RI AT SALT THEATER (NOW DEFUNCT) HE REFERRED TO HIS OWN VOICE AS SOUNDING LIKE :GOOSE FARTS." SO YOUR JOKE GAVE ME 2 LAUGHS FOR THE PRICE OF ONE. AS FOR THE AMERICAN ANTHEM, AS A SONG, I CAN'T FAULT IT. ANTHEMS IN GENERAL, HOWEVER, GIVE ME THE PIP. UNLESS MAYBE WE COULD WRITE A TERRAN ONE. BUT WILL THAT EVER HAPPEN? NO, BY SAGAN, NOT UNTIL WE DISCOVER INTELLIGENT LIFE ELSEWHERE IN THE MULTIVERS AND NEED A SNAPPY TUNE TO KEEP OUR PECKERS UP FOR THE FIRST INTERGALACTIC WAR. RAVE ON.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: catspaw49
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 10:00 PM

Well Leej, I think you HAVE been the fly on the wall................

So MA FAZOO, do all those others end with "Play Ball" or what?

Spaw


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 09:34 PM

Cranky, with posts like those, you are well on your way to competing with Kendall for the resident curmudgeon title. I enjoyed the history lesson. I never knew the whole story.

LEJ


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: CRANKY YANKEE
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 09:03 PM

can't we all just get along? Hey whoever transcribed my last bit about the star spangled banner, how about putting the paragraphs and numbers the way I wrote them?

following may or may not be politically correct. Frankly Scarlet, I don't give a damn. In the first place, I STRONGLY OBJECT TO THE TERM, "NATIVE AMERICAN" AS BEING EXCLUSIVELY USED TO DESCRIBE THE STONE AGE PEOPLE WHO FIRST INHABITED THE WESTERN HEMISPHERE. There are no indigenous Homo Sapiens in the Americas. My grandparents were born in Europe, My parents were both born in Brooklyn, N.Y. I was born in Brooklyn in 1929, and, I AM A NATIVE AMERICAN, AS NATIVE AS ANYONE ELSE. Look it up in your Fu==nkyn wagnals. My wife's family has been in Newport,RI since 1639. And she's a Native American as are my three children. My old friend, Tall Oak of the Naragansett Nation is also a Native American. Now then, we are all making too much of our ethnic heritqage. Tshe sooner we start to call ourselves, "Americans" and forget about all the hyphens, the sooner we'll begin to be the people that I know we can become. England didn't start to really become a world power until they canned the , "I'm a Norman, you're a Saxon" crap and started to think of themselves as being "Englishmen" (and Women) I know that the politically correct thinking of the day is to preserve your ehtnic culture and identity. But, that is devisive and keeps us in seperate groups. I'm against B-lingual edication. It tends to discourage unity. Some of the people who were here before the Italian or Russian immigrants got here had well developed civilizations, The Cherokee had an elected government with a woman at it'sd head, a written language (invented by a guy named, " Sequoia" A well documented history, etc. They may not have had the material things that the europeans had, but they were certainly as civilized. At the same time, the "Great preservers of the environment" (or so they said) hunted the North American Wooly Mammouth to . This is within recorded history. Why? Because they were easy There were many attrocities commited by past peoples. I don't deny this. But here's the bottom line: I WOULDN'T OWN A SLAVE, I WOULDN'T DO ANY OF ATROCIOUS THINGS THAT PAST PEOPLES HAVE BEEN ACCUSED OF. fURTHERMORE, I WOULDN'T TURN A BLIND EYE TO ANYONE ELSES ATTROCIOUS BEHAVIOR. I've demonstrated my stand against intollerance over and over again, ever since I learned to think for myself, at age 15 or so. I had my own civil rights and integration movement going well before it became fashionable. While I was stationed in England in the USAF (I was a T/Sgt Air Traffic Controller at RAF Lakenheath) I formed the first integrated country music group ever to record for a major label, The Muleskinners. We recorded for the Parlophone Co. George Martin was the A&R director of Parlophone at the time. This was in 1958. I was a member of CORE in the 60's and put my own body on the line more than once. At the same time, there have been social changes and advancements that I never thought I'd live to see. I'm fiercely proud of my southern countrymen and what they've accomplished during my lifetime. I'm still at it, working to effect social change. If your curious , E-Mail...RISHOTOKANHQPROV@PRODIGY,NET nOW IF THIS DOESN'T MEET WITH YOUR POLITICAL APPROVAL, gopissuparope.com


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: CRANKY YANKEE
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 07:02 PM

By the time "To Anachreon in Heaven"'s melody got to 1815 ish Baltimore, it seems that everyone was singing one or another sets of lyrics to this extremely popular tune. Well, the story goes, the British troops that had just demolished the Washington DC militia and burned that city to the ground, found a very different reception fom the Baltimore militia. ("militia" is a plural word and includes every able bodied person between the ages of 16 and 60, not a member of the official military establishment, capable of temporary combat service) They, tthe British, met with well trained and well armed militia units who beat the crap out of them. They, the British again, decided that an overland attack on Baltimore was not an option, and that a sea borne assault was more likely to be successful. They would first, however, have to silence the long range, heavy guns of Fort McHenry. To try to get past Ft. McHenry's Field artillery would be futile. So, limping back to their fleet, the British Forces spent the night in "Upper Camden" (or someting like that) Maryland. The Headman of that community, Dr. Bean, after conferring with the town council, notified the British Commander that they would offer no resistance, as there was none to offer, and that they would feed them before they went on their way the next morning. This was acceptable to the British C.O. But, three British soldiers went AWOL, stayed behind, got drunk and very rowdy, upon which, they were arrested and locked up in the town jail. The Commander of the British Expeditionary Force, hearing that three of his soldiers had been captured, and, not knowing the true details of this act, sent a detail of Royal Marines to secure their rescue and to arrest Dr. Bean. Dr Bean was imprisoned on the British Flagship. He would be dealt with after the attack on Ft Mc Henry. The Town Council of Upper Camden secured the services of a much liked and very respected lawyer, Francis Scott Key, who was known to have a very pleasing personality and convincing manner. Mr Key sailed out to the British Fleet on his own little sloop, under a flag of truce, was welcomed aboard the British Flagship where he convinced the commander that the soldiers' arrest had not ben an act of warfare, but a simple civil matter. He acquainted the Commander with the true details of the actions that resulted in the arrest, and assured the Commander that anyone, American or English, who behaved in so disgraceful a manner would have been arrested. Mr.Key's argument was accepted, Dr. Bean was released and the three soldiers were arrested, "Awaiting the King's Pleasure". However, MR. Key, his companion and Dr. Bean, for their own safety, were asked to spend the night aboard their little sloop, tied up next to the British Flagship, as,that very night, The fleet would bombard Ft.McHenry, and attempt to silence their guns. All that night the three Americans watched as everything the fleet had, including newly developed exploding cannonballs and rockets, was hurled at at the defenders ashore. The following morning, in the silence following the attack, The three Americans, not knowing if they even had a Country left, peered anxiously through the slowly dissipating morning fog until, finally, they caught sight of the huge 15 starred and 15 striped flag, now on display at the Smithsonian, still flying over the fort. Overcome by emotion, tears of joy in his eyes, (as reported by the other two) and with John Stafford Smith's melody in mind, Francis Scott Key composed the deathless 4 stanza poem which he named, "The Defense of Fort McHenry" Returning to Baltimore they had a panphlet printed up that very night, Mr. Key had a pamphlet printed up with the changed title, "The Star Spangled Banner" with the notation, that the poem was to be sung to the melody of, "To Anachreon in Heaven". This pamphlet was distributed, free of charge, to the citizenry of Baltimore the following morning, by the three friends, where it was an immediate hit.

There are, indeed, 4 verses to this song. Just before World War I, American music publishers stopped printing the 3d verse (you'll see why) because we were once again, solid friends with the Mother Country. British publishers continued printing all 4 verses. The third verse caught my eye when I was looking through the "Scottish Students' Song Book" published in 1891. With all 4 verses the song has continuity. Our newly elected (?) Vice President, in a rebuttal to one of President Clinton's first speeches ended his adress with, "Remember, we are the only Country in the world who's National Anthem begins and ends with a question". I GUESS HE NEVER READ THE WHOLE POEM or even the 3 verse version. and this typical Republican is our Vice President. Mr. Bush, I wish you a long , long life. I'm a folksinger and I like this song a lot, and I sing it as part of my performance every now and then. The guitar accompaniement isn't at all difficult. I do it in "G". Here's the whole song.

                        I
OH SAY CAN YOU SEE BY THE DAWN'S EARLY LIGHT,
WHAT SO PROUDLY WE HAILED AT THE TWILIGHTS LAST GLEAMING
WHOSE BROAD STRIPES AND BRIGHT STARS
THROUGH THE PERILOUS FIGHT
O'ER THE RAMPARTS WE WATCHED WERE SO GALLANTLY STREAMING
AND THE ROCKETS RED GLARE, BPMBS BURSTING IN AIR
GAVE PROOF THROUGH THE NIGHT THAT OUR FLAG WAS STILL THERE
OH, SAY, DOES THAT STAR SPANGLED BANNER YET WAVE
O'ER THE LAND OF THE FREE AND THE HOME OF THE BRAVE?.


II
ON THE SHORE, DIMLY SEEN, THROUGH THE MISTS OF THE DEEP
WHERE THE FOE'S HAUGHTY HOST IN DREAD SILENCE REPOSES
WHAT IS THAT WHICH THE BREEZE, O'ER THE TOWERING STEEP
SO FITFULLY BLOWS, HALF CONCEALS, HALF DISCLOSES?
NOW IT CATCHES THE GLEAM OF THE MORNING'S FIRST BEAM
IN FULL GLORY REFLECTED NOW SHINES IN THE STREAM
'TIS THE STAR SPANGLED BANNER, OH, LONG MAY IT WAVE
O'ER THE LAND OF THE FREE AND THE HOME OF THE BRAVE.

III
NOW WHERE IS THE FOE WHO SO VAUNTINGLY SWORE
MIDST THE HAVOC OF WAR AND THE BATTLE'S CONFUSION
A HOME AND A COUNTRY THEY'D LEAVE US NO MORE?
THEIR BLOOD HAS WASHED OUT THEIR FOUL FOOTSTEPS POLLUTION.
NO REFUGE COULD SAVE THE HIRELING OR SLAVE,
FROM THE TERROR OF FLIGHT OR THE GLOOM OF THE GRAVE.
AND THE STAR SPANGLED BANNER IN TRIUMPH SHALL WAVE
O'ER THE LAND OF THE FREE AND THE HOME OF THE BRAVE.

IV
SO THUS BE IT EVER WHEN FREE MEN SHALL STAND
BETWEEN THEIR LOVED HOMES AND THE WARS DESOLATION
BLESSED WITH VICTORY AND PEACE MAY THIS HEAVEN RESCUED LAND
PRAISE THE POWER THAT HATH MADE AND PRESERVED US A NATION
THEN CONQUER WE MUST WHEN OUR CAUSE IT IS JUST
AND THIS BE OUR MOTTO, "IN GOD IS OUR TRUST"
THEN THE STAR SPANGLED BANNER IN TRIUMPH SHALL WAVE
WHILE THE LAND OF THE FREE IS THE HOME OF THE BRAVE


Now, perhaps you'll re think your position. Considering the conditions under which this remarkable piece of literature was composed, do you still think we should exchange it for some non-descript piece of drivel?
IN FULL GLORY REFLECTED NOW SHINES IN THE STREAM
Line Breaks <br> added. Preformat commands <pre> (beginning) and </pre> (end) added to space Roman numerals.
-Joe Offer, who prefers "America the Beautiful" and does not consider it "drivel"-


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 04:51 PM

Oh to be a fly on the wall at the gatherings of the Anachreon Society!


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: CRANKY YANKEE
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 03:38 PM

Wshat's the matter with all of you? If singing "The Defemse of Fort McHenry" (The original name of "The Star Spangled Banner") is too difficult for you, then I sugest you find a differnt key to sing it in. If that doesn't work, find a good singing teacher. The Melody of "To nachreon in heaven", written by John Stafford Smith, was a very much used one, in the late 18th and early 19th centuries there were at least 11 different sets of lyrics sung to this tune. These are well documented. Among them was John Adams' presidential campaign song, "Adams and Liberty", each verse of which ended with, "And ne'er shall the sons of Columbia be slaves, while the land grows a tree or the sea rolls a wave". So, it appears that the old timers were better singers than you are. The original song, was written in 1775 as an anthem for The Anachreonic Society if London". Anachreon was an old Athenian philosopher, who advocated, "Boozing and Broads" to excess. He was long dead by the time the society which was named for him, was formed. It was assumed that he was in Heaven. The aforementioned song, describes a petition sent, "To Anachreon, in Heaven" and his reply. The first verse says:

TO ANACHREON,IN HEAVEN, WHERE HE DWELT IN FULL GLEE, A FEW SONS OF HARMONY, SENT A PETITION. THAT HE, THEIR INSTRUCTOR AND PATRON, WOULD BE, WHEN THE ANSWER ARRIVED, FROM THE JOLLY OLD GRECIAN, "VOICE, FIDDLE AND FLUTE, NO LONGER BE MUTE, I'LL LEND YOU MY NAME, AND, INSTRUCT YOU, TO BOOT, AND, I WILL TEACH YOU, LIKE ME, TO ENTWINE, THE MYRTLE OF VENUS WITH BACCHUS' WINE"


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Fiolar
Date: 09 Mar 01 - 08:30 AM

History is a dead duck as far as many kids are concerned nowadays. In a recent poll carried out on behalf of Abbey National among seven to 16 year olds, sixty percent were unsure what happened in 1066, with 18 percent stating it was the Battle of Waterloo. As for USA forty-four percent thought it meant the "Union States of America." National Anthems used to be honoured and were always stood for. I suppose really that many would regard them now as something from a byegone age and would probably think something by Robbie Williams or Eminem more suitable.


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: mousethief
Date: 08 Mar 01 - 01:44 PM

Hear, hear!


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 08 Mar 01 - 12:52 PM

Spud, your reaction is understandable. None of us would have the option to be politically enlightened and open-minded without the sacrifices your generation made. Thank you.

LEJ


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 08 Mar 01 - 08:13 AM

It could be worse for you Americans - you could have ended up with God Save Our Queen - I hate that tune... now the Welsh have a great tune - even makes a good waltz -not that my Welsh friends seem to approve of me playing it that way on melodeon.

Jon


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: GUEST,Sarah at work
Date: 08 Mar 01 - 07:57 AM

Amos,

Nah, I vote for Omaha first -- and then move it again every 4 years, the second year of any presidency. Keep the little darlings busy for a while, and maybe get them back in touch with reality.

I mean, New Orleans is a nice town -- why would you want to permanently scar it?

Sarah (at work)


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Amos
Date: 07 Mar 01 - 11:47 PM

Hell with it. Let's adopt the "Marseilleise". Allons, enfants de la patrieeeeeeeUH! La jour du GLOIRE est arrivee!!! That's blood-stirring, stand up and kill-the-invader type music that we can all be proud of. None of this "Oh, sayyyyyy" stuff. Spit it out and get it saud!!! Oui MonSIEUR!!! And while we're practicing all this Francophilia I think we should move the Capitol down to N'Awrleans.

A


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Subject: RE: American National Anthem
From: Spud Murphy
Date: 07 Mar 01 - 10:13 PM

To all Mudcatters: I apologize for my lapse of sensitivity in the matter of Political Correctness but that's been under my hide for a long time and it just had to come out. Won't happen again.

Joe, that wasn't aimed at you. You just nudged the door ajar.

Spud


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