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RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!

GUEST,petr 17 Feb 01 - 04:35 PM
Little Hawk 17 Feb 01 - 03:26 PM
kendall 16 Feb 01 - 03:30 PM
kendall 16 Feb 01 - 03:24 PM
Matt_R 15 Feb 01 - 10:44 PM
Sorcha 15 Feb 01 - 10:39 PM
catspaw49 15 Feb 01 - 10:37 PM
wdyat12 15 Feb 01 - 10:23 PM
catspaw49 15 Feb 01 - 09:36 PM
kendall 15 Feb 01 - 09:23 PM
katlaughing 15 Feb 01 - 04:58 PM
Ebbie 15 Feb 01 - 04:00 PM
kendall 15 Feb 01 - 03:48 PM
Kim C 15 Feb 01 - 03:42 PM
LR Mole 15 Feb 01 - 11:33 AM
GUEST,Matt_R 15 Feb 01 - 08:44 AM
kendall 15 Feb 01 - 08:34 AM
Mr Red 15 Feb 01 - 08:07 AM
rube1 15 Feb 01 - 07:11 AM
wdyat12 14 Feb 01 - 11:42 PM
Matt_R 14 Feb 01 - 11:32 PM
Pseudolus 14 Feb 01 - 11:12 PM
kendall 14 Feb 01 - 11:06 PM
Matt_R 14 Feb 01 - 10:53 PM
CarolC 14 Feb 01 - 10:31 PM
Troll 14 Feb 01 - 10:29 PM
kendall 14 Feb 01 - 10:19 PM
CarolC 14 Feb 01 - 09:50 PM
Matt_R 14 Feb 01 - 09:39 PM
hesperis 14 Feb 01 - 09:38 PM
CarolC 14 Feb 01 - 09:37 PM
Matt_R 14 Feb 01 - 09:28 PM
Bill D 14 Feb 01 - 09:20 PM
CarolC 14 Feb 01 - 09:13 PM
kendall 14 Feb 01 - 08:51 PM
kendall 14 Feb 01 - 05:20 PM
Kim C 14 Feb 01 - 12:55 PM
GUEST,Matt_R 14 Feb 01 - 12:02 PM
Pseudolus 14 Feb 01 - 11:52 AM
Bill D 14 Feb 01 - 11:49 AM
Lepus Rex 14 Feb 01 - 11:49 AM
Pseudolus 14 Feb 01 - 11:45 AM
Homeless 14 Feb 01 - 11:26 AM
Homeless 14 Feb 01 - 11:14 AM
GUEST,Matt_R 14 Feb 01 - 11:00 AM
Pseudolus 14 Feb 01 - 10:49 AM
GUEST,Matt_R 14 Feb 01 - 10:48 AM
Bardford 14 Feb 01 - 10:38 AM
GUEST,Matt_R 14 Feb 01 - 10:30 AM
Pseudolus 14 Feb 01 - 10:27 AM
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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: GUEST,petr
Date: 17 Feb 01 - 04:35 PM

My favorite coffee shop/bagel place has a lot of young kids working there and often theres music I find to loud even though I like reggae I dont want to listen to it all the time. The music varies depending on whats on the cd changer. Since I like to go there to read I find when I cant sit outside (if its cold) Ill listen to my discman and shut out the other stuff. Sometimes though Ive heard some enchanting music being played and asked what it was. I do agree that we dont get enough silence. At a fiddle festival after 5 days of constant music (during the waking hours) having a walk in the woods in complete silence was soothing break.

on the subject of muzak, I hate it, as its an attempt to make a bland music that will please everyone and probably pleases no one. Recently I heard a bird conservation society in england had birdsongs their phone system. People loved it so much that they called all the time and asked to be put on hold. Maybe others can learn from that.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Little Hawk
Date: 17 Feb 01 - 03:26 PM

To call you a dinosaur would not be fair, Kendall, because you are not extinct...yet. :-)

Listen, guys, you think you've got it bad? I went to lunch at the Bagel place yeserday, and had to sit through an entire collection of the Carpenters greatest hits...

- LH


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: kendall
Date: 16 Feb 01 - 03:30 PM

Sorcha deah, let me explain. When women have something to say, they tend to "pussy foot" around. When guys have something on their minds, they dont "Beat around the bush" Matt thinks I'm a dinosaur, I think of him as a young piss ant. We dont hate each other... at least, I dont think so.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: kendall
Date: 16 Feb 01 - 03:24 PM

Naw, Matt...girls just dont understand guys thats all! Spaw, do you ever forget anything? Actually, I think I was born this way (Not threaded all the way on)


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Matt_R
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 10:44 PM

Fighting? Who's fighting? Not me! Kendall, where you fighting? I didn't think you were!


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Sorcha
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 10:39 PM

Are you guys through fighing yet? Both of you are being juvenile, and everybody else is trying to do damage control.........


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: catspaw49
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 10:37 PM

Stop what? Stop the diligent pursuit of the truth? How can we do that? Its a known fact that Kendall is 3 frets short of a neck and we are probing the reasons as to how and why this is. We are looking for clues here.....like the fact that he once left his house for 3 days because he had a runaway printer that was filling the whole place with printouts of porn stars. Since he states he hates loud music, that isn't it and our search must continue. I personally am now tracking on his predisposition for eating coffee soaked Fruit Loops.

Matt is a different case and possibly more troubling since he is not normal either and though he admits to liking loud music, his mental incapacity seems to predate this by several years.

Spaw

Spaw


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: wdyat12
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 10:23 PM

Stop that Right Now!

wdyat12


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: catspaw49
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 09:36 PM

What caused it in your case Kendall?

Spaw


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: kendall
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 09:23 PM

Those who know have warned us that too much noise will drive us crazy. It is a serious health hazard.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: katlaughing
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 04:58 PM

On a more serious note and in relation to some of what has been said earlier in this thread about society and no silence, sometimes it can be fatal: click here


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 04:00 PM

I must say that Matt's brevity in that pithy line tickled my funny bone. Quite often humor in your posts doesn't come through clearly enough to suit me, Matt, but it did, there. LOL

Ebbie


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: kendall
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 03:48 PM

No Matt, I did not say you were not intelligent. In fact, I believe from your posts that you are quite bright. That has nothing to do with being witty. I am a master of the caustic remark and the perfect squelch, but, I dont choose to do that here, because I dont dislike anyone here, (at least, not enough to let the dogs out)


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Kim C
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 03:42 PM

Matt and Kendall, I think you both have important things to say from time to time, and I don't think anybody here is unintelligent.

Mister's uncle, who is a curmudgeon from the word Go, once said almost exactly that same thing to me about the battle of wits. While Uncle is very often unreasonable in his arguments, he was right. Even if he is wrong a lot of the time, he is still older and wiser than me so I just don't argue with him anymore. I just nod my head and have another glass of wine. And once in awhile, we will actually agree on something. :)

I do agree that volume does not replace talent - but I also think there is a time and place for volume, and a time and place for silence. I love rock music. Always have. I also love classical music and have to agree with Kendall here that some of it is noise - I don't care for the arty dissonance that some modern composers like to use.

But I say, if it sounds good, it IS good, even if it's only good to you.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: LR Mole
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 11:33 AM

Hm. No, I don't believe I shall join in.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: GUEST,Matt_R
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 08:44 AM

I believe I've just been called unintelligent.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: kendall
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 08:34 AM

Maybe I should have been more careful about how I said what I said. Fact is, I do not mean to attack anyone personally. All I'm saying is, I dont care for Jazz (except Dixieland) I hate Rock in any form, and, I detest muzak. I dont mean to say I hate those who do. Matt, I've been called a "Music bigot" before, and maybe I am, but, if you want to get into a name calling contest, go elsewhere. In a battle of wits you dont "pack the gear".


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Mr Red
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 08:07 AM

I like pipe music - except maybe the bagpipes - nargh only kidding. I guess we have to vote with our feet, & I don't mean tapping. Workplace is the worst - fortunately I don't have that kinda job but I have spent time in those places. Usually the music is the least nauseating thing.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: rube1
Date: 15 Feb 01 - 07:11 AM

kendall, I do have at least a spoonful of brains and I also would not classify "all" folk music as "diddly o day or whatever." I'm absolutely with you there. But my spoonful of brains is not taxed in the least by those "diddly o day" choruses. Please and thank you, nix nix. I can tolerate or tune out almost anything musical or semi-musical, including muzak, but not thos fiddle dee di do dee do day doding dong doodlyedy dum day do dees.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: wdyat12
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 11:42 PM

Love Your Dads,

I lost my dad when I was 20 and there is so much I never told him, but he shared 20 years of his life with me.

wdyat12


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Matt_R
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 11:32 PM

Pseud, my Dad is awesome. He gives us hugs and kisses and tells how he loves us, and we're 22,20, and 19. I wish everyone could have loving caring relationships with their parents. I'm blessed that I do.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Pseudolus
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 11:12 PM

Couldn't have said it better myself Matt and that thing about your Dad? love it.... I want my kids to feel about me at 21 the way you do about your Dad.....

Frank


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: kendall
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 11:06 PM

Troll, you may join Spaw and me. Being a republican, you could probably use a friend! LOL. Matt, I was exposed to classical music at a young age, and, grew to love much of it. However, some of it is noise to me, and I dont care who wrote it. There are many kinds of music that I like, however, we seem to be focused on what I DONT like.Neither You nor anyone else will never make me like muzak, or anything that is run by electricity. Volume will never replace talent. You will probably never be a lover of folk music. Let's leave it at that, ok? "On a dead mans door, you can knock forever."(Or on a Dead Heads door)


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Matt_R
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 10:53 PM

Well, if you asked anyone in real life about me, manners would probably be the first thing they would say. And WHY IN GOD'S NAME does everyone ASSUME that since my Dad was in the military, that he was the stereotypical domineering military dictator? My Dad is a great warm, caring guy, not an "enforcer".

Maybe the reason I don't like like musical bigots is because I USED to be one. And maybe if someone got in MY face and told me off, I might got the hint to discover more music later than 17 years of age (a mere 4 years ago) before I realized there was something beyond my own constricted, narrow mind. I lumped everything together, pulled stereotypes...while never ever sitting down to just LISTEN to something. And I think that that first venture into classical music allowed me to explore beyond the stereotypes and to use the theories of music analysis and theory to understand all the music I began to listen to.

I perservere. I eat chocolate covered coffee beans...the little devils are nasty and make you cringe, but I can't stop eating them. Now I never cringe...to me they are delicious and quite addicting. The mind has an amazing way of attaching itself to something, no matter how nasty, when it is frequently in contact. It's like that with anything. But if you're unwilling to LISTEN, to STOP smacking everything you don't understand, you'll never get anywhere.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 10:31 PM

I know, kendall. I realized after I posted that you would probably point that out. The way I look at it is that as someone who should know better, I need to do my best to set a good example. Young people learn what they live, and live what they learn. Matt isn't a kid. He's a young adult. However, you and I are supposed to be older and wiser, aren't we? Do you think your manners are better than Matt's?

I think if we took the name headings and musical references away, it would be difficult to tell the difference between your posts and Matt's posts. Sorry.

Carol


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Troll
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 10:29 PM

Kendall, can I join you and 'Spaw?
Bardford, the attendant you asked about the music at the gas station was not the owner but some minimum-wage register jockey who couldn't care less if you don't come back. Find out who the owner is and let him know of your displeasure with the music and his employees attitude. That may get results.And lastly, Matt_R is a bright but VERY immature young man who, in all probability, would never address Kendall (or anyone else) in the manner he uses on the Forum if they were face-to-face.
The safety of distance can make even the most timid bold beyond what is sensible and rude and obnoxious toward people whose life experience is probably far beyond what they will ever experience first hand.
Are constructivism stabiles art? Some would say no; that they fall more in the craft area. I have no opinion one way or the other. But I have seen stuff exhibited as art that did absolutely nothing for me personally and I feel that I have a fair feeling for the subject. My first ex-wife was a working artist and the Memsahib has a degree in art history.
The point is this Matt_R. If Kendall doesn't like your taste(?) in music, it's his right to say so. His Etch-a-Sketch analogy is quite apt.
You may think that a crucifix in a glass of piss is art but I don't and I don't think that ANYTHING played at deafening volumes is good music.
I recall seeing a bumper sticker about 10 years ago that said,"If it's too loud, you're too old". That's not "in your face", thats rude, crass, and totally inconsiderate and by no rational definition should art or music be any of those things.
If it chooses to be then if had better expect the criticism it gets.

troll


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: kendall
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 10:19 PM

Interesting how you focus on how I talk to Matt. Did you read what he said to me? Yes, I had kids. The oldest is 28, and, has learned manners. Matt, I might know a lot more about art than you think. Remember, I've been around three times as long as you have.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 09:50 PM

Matt, I want you to know that I never do this for anyone, but I'm going to do it for you now... (here goes... )

LOL!!!!

Carol


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Matt_R
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 09:39 PM

No, take me with you!


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: hesperis
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 09:38 PM

What about the rights of songbirds? Even in National parks, some songbirds are forgetting their mating calls, because of ever-present noise. One guy is campaigning for "one inch of silence", and it is astounding to realize what is in fact lost by all the music and noise that we make in "modern" life. There would have to be no noise-making activity in a radius of miles to get a mere one inch.

And humans need silence too...

I read the article in a not-online mag, and don't even remember the title. Has anyone else got a link?


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 09:37 PM

On the other hand, it looks like you boys are having fun, so I'll just shut the door when I leave, shall I?


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Matt_R
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 09:28 PM

Wbat an etch a sketch is to art? HA! What do you know about art? Constructivism wire stabiles look EXACTLY like Etch-A-Sketch doodles.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Bill D
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 09:20 PM

"Because "you don't like it? Tough shit!" is the only way to go. "

...wow...I wish I was likely to live to be 100, and could ask you about that again in 40 years. I hope you realize, Matt, that not all young people feel like that..(too many for my taste, but not all)...seems to me that the way you express it is very much YOUR personal issue...

...but, you are correct, I doubt that your explanation WOULD convince me, so I will not engage you about it again...


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: CarolC
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 09:13 PM

Hey kendall, do you have any kids?

I have a son who is seventeen. I have a very high opinion of him. His tastes in music are broad, but they do include some forms of music that I don't like. And sometimes he makes some ettiquette blunders. He's human and he's still learning. But I would never talk to him the way you talk to Matt.

My son is Mudcatter, "indieman". I'm glad he's a Mudcat member. I think he can learn from the old farts if he wants to. I also think the old farts can learn from him if they want to.

Best wishes,

Carol


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: kendall
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 08:51 PM

Well well, the kid has a temper tantrum. I'm afraid the joke's on you Matt. I love the pipes, and, would be glad to have them skirling at my funeral. Fortunately, I wont be able to hear them, or, any more of that shit you call music. This site is dedicated to blues and folk. Wouldn't you be happier playing with kids your own age?


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: kendall
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 05:20 PM

Matt, you just dont get it. The kind of crap I refer to is not music. It is an annoyance at least, and cause for assault at worst. I have walked out of many a store because of it, and, the fact is they need me more than I need them.So, I say "Tough shit for them". When I ask them to turn it down, sometimes they say "I dont even hear it." I reply "Then why the hell do you have it"? As far as younger people go, they dont know what it is like to have been brought up with manners and respect for other people.In your case, you probably learned manners from your military dad, and, that shitty noise is more of a protest. I guess it is all part of the "Dumbing down of America". I still say, Muzak is to music what Etch-a-Sketch is to art. If you want to listen to that primitive racket, go ahead. just dont get in my face with it.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Kim C
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 12:55 PM

Let me see if I can say this where it makes sense. When I go to a public place WITHOUT the express intent of hearing music, like the grocery or Target or the mall, I have other things on my mind and 99 times out of 100 don't pay a lick of attention to what's on the speakers. I go to those places to run errands or do other business and music doesn't really figure into it. Around here several places just play local radio stations. I suppose if I happened into some place that played particularly obnoxious music, it might influence my decision to go back or not, but in my sphere that has never been an issue.

Y'all would have loved what they were playing in the tattoo salon the last time I was there. I don't even know what it was. It could only be described as train wreck music. There was a little ZZ Top in there, but I didn't recognize anything else. One of those bands didn't even sound like they were speaking English but they were. BUT I knew it was going to be like that when I went in there, so I didn't fret it. I'm sure if I had asked them to throw something else into the mix they would have done it for me - but when your butt's on fire, well, you don't think about that stuff. ;)


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: GUEST,Matt_R
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 12:02 PM

Because "you don't like it? Tough shit!" is the only way to go. Any amount of explanation wouldn't convince you, so what's left.

Folkies can say:

"I'm a rambler I'm a gambler
I'm a long way from home
And if you don't like me
You can leave me alone"

or

"You can't keep me from singing"

But US, noooo we're not allowed to have our own opinions. And I don't know why us young shitheads like the intense, loud, violent, in-your-face music. Go ask Stravinsky, or Beethoven, or Liszt. They might know.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Pseudolus
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 11:52 AM

When I suggested that the owner has rights, I meant he/she has the rights to form an opinion of what the clientelle wants and go with that decision. I didn't mean to imply that he/she made the decision on an island.

Frank


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Bill D
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 11:49 AM

....there IS background music that is 'almost' unnoticable, I have learned to tune it out. By definition, it is seldom music with any character, but sometimes it does enhance a mood for the time of day...etc...this is ususally used by bigger stores and is professionally done Musak.

On the other hand, 'personal' choices by small business owners, played on boomboxes set on a shelf, can range all over the map!....and they can please 90%..or 2%! I suppose a business owner can play whatever he wants, but if he plays loud rock or rap...or even Classical Bagpipes, it going to distract me and many others, and may be a bad idea, no matter WHAT his 'rights' are. I live in a large metropolitan area, and can usually find a place that does not offend...what if my only choice of pharmacies in a small town is run by a guy with a taste for Tuvan throat singing?...yeah, I know, I don't have to be there long, so live with it. Hell of a solution..

Matt....seems to me that there is a real issue as to WHY 'young people' keep pushing the envelope for louder, more intense music that is often violent and 'in your face'....

I am just sort of tired of a world that is moving away from trying to consider the feeling of others, and moving TOWARD "you don't like it? Tough shit!"


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Lepus Rex
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 11:49 AM

Heh, I bet Bad Elevator Music came to your town, Matt, and it was really cool, because no other Elevator Music had ever bothered to visit your town and talk to you kids, right? Billy Ray Cyrus was opening, wasn't he?

Seriously, I hate the stuff. For some reason, I can't tune out noise. Bad music in a store actually makes me buy LESS, I think, because it's so damned distracting.

People do notice when you play something 'strange' or 'different' though. At my work (a small, family-owned shop), no customer has ever asked about the cheesy pop-rock my co-workers listen to. It's just there. But when my cds are on, there's always a comment, usually something positive. Even if they hate it, at least they HEAR it.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Pseudolus
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 11:45 AM

Homeless: Just to be sure I am clear, I agree with almost everything you said, It IS annoying that you can't get away from it if you want to. Where we part ways is when we talk about things like "intentional, unnecessary sensory stimulus". I understand and appreciate that that's your opinion....but it is not universal. I've heard folks talk about how they dance in the grocery store, or they tune it out, or that it doesn't bother them at all. If I have a business, and for pennies I can pump in music that studies shows will help my business, I would do it in a heartbeat and I would consider it a necessary sesory stimulus for my business.

I guess the thing that gets to me is the overall feeling here that if somethng bothers me a little, I will just avoid it, if it bothers me a lot, THEY'LL have to change. That's my perception anyway.....I'll give you an example. There are a lot of TV commercials that I think are in poor taste or just stupid. I try to ignore them. Lately the United Way has been running a commercial that has a child calling 911 crying that, "Daddy is hurting my Mommy!!!" It ends with the announcer saying, "Go ahead, do nothing...." or something along those lines. Clearly the implication is that this kid will have to see his Mommy beaten unless I pledge money to the United Way, or if not that exactly, it is all about guilt. I hate that commercial. I've contributed to other funds that exist for battered women and children but I still felt guilty. I wish the commercial will go off the air and that they'll stop. But i do feel that they have every right to run it. For me, until they stop, I simply won't give to the United Way. And finally, Don'tcha think, "no music" IS a musical preference?

Frank


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Homeless
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 11:26 AM

What is the solution to the problem as you see it?
Preferably, don't pipe music into public places, or,
minimally, turn it down/off if so requested. If someone wants to add music to a situation they can always use a personal stereo and headphones. Unfortunately, there's not yet a personal system that will provide silence.

And doesn't the solution have to consider the right of music selection for the owners?
No. If he is in business, he needs to put the interests of his clientelle above his own. If he wants to listen to music, by all means he should be able to listen himself, but he shouldn't inflict it on clients. Again, a personal stereo would work for this. However, this line of thought is alien to me - I would think that the owner of a store would be wanting to concentrate on running the business while on site, not enjoying music.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Homeless
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 11:14 AM

Pseudolus - I think I see one of the miscommunications here. My general bitch is not that one particular establishment has music, but that they *all* do. If it were only one establishment that was playing the music, yes, it could be avoided easily. But as many people on this thread have said, music is present everywhere. I cannot remember the last time I went to a restaurant that did not have any music whatsoever. So I do exercise my option not to eat out anymore.
But, I do have to buy groceries. And every grocery store in the area has some kind of music also. Strip malls pipe the music to loudspeakers outside the stores, so I'm forced to hear it while I walk to/from the car. A month or so back I was walk to the county building downtown and there was music being played over loudspeakers - and there weren't even any stores in the area. Every department store has it.
If I accompany someone to a place, chances we are going to want to talk. If we cannot talk in normal conversational tones because of a TV/sound system, that is an assault. If the sound system is so loud that I want to plug my ears, that is a physical assault.
The fallacy in my comparison with the smoke, water, vinegar was that I was trying to personalize it for Matt. To revamp it, suppose that every public place did one or more of those things. Re: you comment on still having ice water on you - an attach is not defined by how long it's effects last, but that it was committed to begin with. And there have been many time I have left somewhere and had a ringing in my ears, or a bit of tune or lyrics running thru my head.
I say that it is an attack because it is an intentional, unnecessary sensory stimulus. It is a way to distracting people so that their full mental facilities are unavailable. Depending on what type of music is played, it can alter peoples moods or actions (see above posts regarding moving people the store or getting them to linger). If the music being played is distasteful to a person, it can alter their mood in a negative way - making them uncomfortable, irritable, or angry. And I don't suggest that an establishment change their music to suit my musical preferences. But it would be nice if there was no music whatsoever - then there wouldn't be disagreement as which patrons like what genre of music.

What is the sound of one hand clapping?
I don't know - I can't hear it for the damn muzak.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: GUEST,Matt_R
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 11:00 AM

Oh yes kendall, that's what we ALL want, music that take brains to understand. "Any moron can understand the shit they play in stores." Music that anyone can understand? God forbid, we wouldn't want THAT, now WOULD we? How horrifying!!!! It might become FOLK! Kendall, I hope they play Amazing Graze on 10,000 bagpipes and a fuzz bass with krumhorn orchestra at your funeral. To celebrate one less musical bigot in the world. And I'm sure there are lots of traditional music performers from other parts of the world that would consider your damn nasal whiney repetitive sea chanteys "screeching" as well.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Pseudolus
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 10:49 AM

I understand that Bardford but I guess my question is, What is the solution to the problem as you see it? And doesn't the solution have to consider the right of music selection for the owners?

Frank


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: GUEST,Matt_R
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 10:48 AM

Would you rather be deaf? My sister is a sign language minor, so I've spent a LOT of time with hard-of-hearing people. People who have never heard music and have to settle for mere floor and speaker vibrations. People who are advantageously deaf who can suddenly hear music no longer. Imagine a world without music at all...maybe then you'll think twice about your belly-aching about music that isn't your style. Get over it. There are more important things in this world to get upset about that are worth your time.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Bardford
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 10:38 AM

There's issues of choice here. Sure, I may choose not to patronize your establishment for many reasons, including the background music, but odds are the establishment next door that I walk into is piping in similar stuff. Even outdoors, there is little escape from audiojunk. Do my ears have property rights?

Bardford


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: GUEST,Matt_R
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 10:30 AM

I think us younger people have a lessened sensibility to what we like and don't like. I think it's easier for a younger person to like your kind of music than you to like ours. It's just a generational thing. Probably my grandchildren will be interest even more in all kinds of music.


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Subject: RE: RANT (Please join in):Musical Wallpaper!
From: Pseudolus
Date: 14 Feb 01 - 10:27 AM

I know I shouldn't do this but I am still so confused. I'm looking to be educated here. Here goes.....Let's say I own a business, I've decided that in my establishment I will pump in some music, and for whatever reason, I've chosen muzak. It may be because I've heard studies about the effect it has on customer's buying habits or God forbid it's because I just like it. Now, someone walks in and doesn't like it. I am not tying them down to a chair forcing them to listen or forcing them to stay for any length of time. Can't they just leave? Can't they find another place more conducive to their tastes? By telling me that I am wrong for having THAT kind of music aren't you forcing YOUR musical preferences on me? And why is that fair for you and not for me? I don't have a business and if I did I wouldn't choose muzak but those who do are not persecuting me.

There is no comparison (imho) with the smoke in the face, ice water spilled, and vinegar on the food to this issue because with the music, you can just leave. With the others it was a specific attack on one individual and after I leave, I would still have ice water all over me.

I can fully understand why you don't like a certain kind of music but I don't understand why you consider it an attack. Is a Pub that hires folk musicians as weekend entertainment "forcing" folk down everyone's throat? Or is that just a way of molding the personality of the establishment. If someone doesn't like folk music, they would go somewhere else where there is another type of entertainment or even none at all. It's a very similar thing....

Frank


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