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Lyr Req: Sixteen Come Next Sunday (Bothy Band)

DigiTrad:
ROCKY MOUNTAIN
WHAUR ARE YE GAUN, MY BONNIE WEE LASS?
YON HIGH HIGH HILL


Related threads:
Origins: Seventeen Come Sunday/Waukrife Mammy (101)
(origins) Origins: How old are you my pretty little miss? (27)
Tune Req: How old are you my pretty little miss (9)
Lyr Req: Seventeen Come Sunday (11)
Lyr Req: The Night Visit (Christy Moore) (7)
Lyr Req: My Pretty Fair Maid (15)
Lith a doodle, As I Rode Out ? (16)
Lyr Req: Sixteen Come Next Sunday (7)


GUEST,Annette 15 Mar 00 - 07:12 AM
Peg 15 Mar 00 - 11:11 AM
Ranks 15 Mar 00 - 12:10 PM
Liz the Squeak 15 Mar 00 - 12:18 PM
Malcolm Douglas 15 Mar 00 - 02:53 PM
Amos 15 Mar 00 - 02:56 PM
Amos 15 Mar 00 - 03:15 PM
GUEST,Annraoi 15 Mar 00 - 03:27 PM
John in Brisbane 15 Mar 00 - 11:06 PM
Jon Freeman 15 Mar 00 - 11:14 PM
Snuffy 16 Mar 00 - 03:20 AM
GeorgeH 16 Mar 00 - 08:44 AM
Annette 18 Mar 00 - 06:39 PM
GUEST 29 Nov 09 - 07:29 AM
MGM·Lion 29 Nov 09 - 07:45 AM
Jim Carroll 29 Nov 09 - 08:01 AM
GUEST 31 Jan 11 - 10:06 AM
BenDaglish 30 May 11 - 10:15 AM
GUEST,JTT 30 May 11 - 10:09 PM
GUEST 11 Apr 14 - 03:48 PM
GUEST 11 Apr 14 - 09:48 PM
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Subject: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: GUEST,Annette
Date: 15 Mar 00 - 07:12 AM

Hi, I am looking for the lyrics of a song done by the Bothy Band called something like sixteen come next Sunday. It starts like: As I went down to ???? I met with a bonny wee lassie.... etc. Can anyone help me to the lyrics of this song?? thanks very much


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Subject: Lyr Add: SIXTEEN COME SUNDAY
From: Peg
Date: 15 Mar 00 - 11:11 AM

^^
SIXTEEN COME SUNDAY

As I walked down yon heathery moor
I met a bonnie wee lassie
she winked at me as she passed me by
and oh but she was handsome
with me (phonetic pronunciation follows!!) T(w)rat-a-kin, ah-ta-kin, ant-in-aye
with my trat-a-kin, ah-ta-kin, aye-doh.

Where are you goin', me bonnie wee lass
where are ye goin' me honey?
Quite mannerly she answered me
I've a message for me mammy
with me T(w)rat-a-kin, ah-ta-kin, ant-in-aye
with my t(w)rat-a-kin, ah-ta-kin, aye-doh.

Oh what's yer age, me bonnie wee lass,
Oh what's yer age me honey?
Quite mannerly she answered me
I'll be sixteen come next Sunday
with me T(w)rat-a-kin, ah-ta-kin, ant-in-aye
with my t(w)rat-a-kin, ah-ta-kin, aye-doh.

Oh where do ye live, me bonnie wee lass,
Oh where do ye live, me honey?
Quite mannerly she answered me
Way down in yon green valley
with me etc.

Oh where do ye lie, me bonnie wee lass,
Oh where do ye lie, me honey?
Quite mannerly she answered me
In a bed behind me mammy
with me etc.

Will ye marry me, me bonnie wee lass,
Will ye marry me, me honey?
Quite mannerly she answered me
Will ye wait 'til I ask me mammy,
with me etc.

If I come down to yer house
When the moon be shinin' clearly
Will you open yer door and let me in
And yer mammy she won't hear me
with me etc.

So I went down to her house
but her mammy chanced to hear me
She pulled her daughter by the hair
and she hit her three times over
with me etc.
(Then I repeat the first verse again)

peg


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: Ranks
Date: 15 Mar 00 - 12:10 PM

Steeleye Span and some others sang 17 come sunday. It still would be under age sex.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 15 Mar 00 - 12:18 PM

The Kipper family also did a version, much funnier and probably nearer the truth.....

LTS


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 15 Mar 00 - 02:53 PM

Ranks:

No it wouldn't!

Malcolm


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: Amos
Date: 15 Mar 00 - 02:56 PM

Interesting that this English tune is so clearly an ancestor to the Appalachian song, "Fly Around My Pretty Little Miss", with many of the same lines.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: Amos
Date: 15 Mar 00 - 03:15 PM

I notice that although "Weevily Wheat" is in the DT, "Fly Around My Pretty Little Miss" does not appear to be. I will offer it up separately once I double-check.

A


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: GUEST,Annraoi
Date: 15 Mar 00 - 03:27 PM

Tommy Makem's mother, Sarah, had a nice version of this which was used as the sig. tune for a BBC Radio series during the late 50's. She called it "As I Roved Out" Annraoi


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 15 Mar 00 - 11:06 PM

I admit that I haven't had a chance to look at the items that are in the datavase, but the thread lyrics are also used in 'Black Jack Davey', or at least the version that I know. Any relationship? Regards, John


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 15 Mar 00 - 11:14 PM

Ranks ust out of curiostiy where are you from and what is the age liit there, I know different countries have different rules on all sorts of age things. In the UK where I live, I thhink you can leave home, marry and have kids at 16 but can't drink or vote until 18...

Jon


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Subject: Lyr/Tune Add: I'M SEVENTEEN COME SUNDAY
From: Snuffy
Date: 16 Mar 00 - 03:20 AM

^^
I'M SEVENTEEN COME SUNDAY

As I rose up one May morning,
One May morning so early,
I overtook a pretty, fair maid
Just as the sun was dawning

CHO:
With my rue rum ray,
Fother diddle ay,
Wok fol air diddle i-do.

Her stockings white, and her boots were bright
And her buckling shone like silver
She had a dark and a rolling eye
And her hair hung round her shoulder

"Where are you going, my pretty, fair maid
Where are you going, my honey?"
She answered me right cheerfully
"I've an errand for my mummy."

"How old are you, my pretty, fair maid
How old are you, my honey?"
She answered me right cheerfully
"I am seventeen come Sunday"

"Will you take a man, my sweet pretty maid
Will you take a man, my honey?"
She answered me right cheerfully
"I darst not for my mummy

Will you come down to my mummy's house
When the moon is shining clearly?
If you come down, I'll let you in
And me mummy shall not hear me"

I went down to her mummy's house
When the moon shone bright and clearly?
She did come down, and let me in
And I lay in her arms till morning

"Oh, it's now I am with my soldier lad,
His ways they are so winning.
The drum and fife are my delight
And a pint o' rum in the morning"

Collected by Percy Grainger at Redbourne, Lincolnshire September 1905. Versions also collected in Sussex, Somerset and Scotland. Burns re-wrote the words in "The Scots Musical Museum", vol IV, no. 397, and there are also broadside versions of the text.


X: 1
T:I'm Seventeen Come Sunday
M:2/4
L:1/8
Q:1/8=180
C:collected by Percy Grainger
S:Mr Fred Atkinson, September 1905
O:English
A:Lincolnshire
K:DDor
A>G|FD EC|DD DE/F/|GE CE|
M:3/4 L:1/8
G2A3A|cAc2d2|c/c/A c2B>A|
M:2/4
AGED|A>B cE|ED C2|D/D/E/D/ C2|DA AG/F/|E2 D2-|Dz||

Wassail! V


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: GeorgeH
Date: 16 Mar 00 - 08:44 AM

I'm amazed this wasn't already in the DT . .

As Liz remarked, the Kippers do an hillarious version, "Not sixteen till Sunday", identifying the "age of consent" for sex in the UK.

Am I right in recalling (from 30 years ago) that the age varies from state to state in the US??

G.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: Annette
Date: 18 Mar 00 - 06:39 PM

Thank you all.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: GUEST
Date: 29 Nov 09 - 07:29 AM

Hi has anyone worked out chords to this - the Bothy band version?

It seems to be Am G etc


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 29 Nov 09 - 07:45 AM

'Age of consent', oft referred to in this thread, is an arbitrary man-made and variable construct anyhow, not a Law of Nature. There was no such in British law till mid-C19. The girl in the song, taking it to date from earlier than that, and the young narrator, would have been breaking no laws except parental prohibitions — which could, tho, be effective: I seem to recall one version where the mother

"seized her by the hair of her head
And out of the room she brought her
And with the butt of a hazel twig
She was the well-paid daughter".

Now whose version is that? Dubliners, perhaps? Anyone remember?


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Subject: Lyr Add: NEW ROSS TOWN (from Mary Delaney)
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 29 Nov 09 - 08:01 AM

This from Tipperary Travelling woman Mary Delaney along with the CD note.
Jim Carroll
^^
New Ross Town
(Roud 277, Laws 017)
Mary Delaney

For, as I went out on a moonlight night
As the moon shined bright and clearly,
When a New Ross girl I chanced to meet,
She looks at me surprising;
We had a roo ry rah, fol the diddle ah,
Roo ry, roo ry, roo ry rah.

"Oh, will I go, my dear," he says,
"Or will I go my honey?"
Nice and gay she answered me,
"Go down and ask me mammy."
We'll have roo ry rah, fol the diddle ah,
Roo ry rah she was a tome* old hag.

Oh, I went down to her mammy's house
When the moon shined bright and clearly,
She opened the door and let me in
And her mammy never heard us;
We had...

"Oh, soldier dear, will you marry me
For now is your time or ever,
Oh, Holy God, will you marry me?
If you don't and I'm ruined for ever;"
With my...

"You are too young, my dear," he says,
"You are too young, my honey."
"For if you think I am too young,
Go down and ask me mammy;"
We'll have...

"How old are you, my dear," he says,
"How old are you, my honey?"
Nice and gay she answered me,
"Gone seventeen since Sunday."
With my ...

"Now I have a wife and a comely wife,
And a wife, I won't forsake her,
There's ne'er a town I would walk down
Where I'd get one if I take her."
With my roo ry rah, fol the diddle ah,
Roo ry rah you are a tome old hag.

[* tome : good - Gammon or Cant]

Usually known as Seventeen Come Sunday, this was extremely popular throughout Eng¬land where it has been described as 'one of the most widely known folk songs of all'. The two texts published in the Sharp Collection conclude with the couple who have spent the night together getting married, while Mary's ends with the girl's demands of marriage being rejected. Quite often, as here, the seducer is a soldier.
In Scotland, Robert Burns found the song in Nithsdale and sent a re-written version of it to the Scofs Musical Museum (1787-1803) where it was published under the title A Waukrife Minnie; (A Watchful Mother). It was claimed there that it had never before appeared in print.
The Irish variants seem to have been found mainly in the northern counties. We recorded this from Mary on a number of occasions and, although it was one of her favourite songs and among the first she gave us, she never sang it the same way twice. She would cut out verses or change them around as the mood took her and, at one time, she sang:
"You are too young, my dear," he said. "You are too young my honey." "Oh, if you think I am too young, You must lay me down and try me."
She learned the song some thirty years earlier from Co Tipperary traveller, 'Snap' Cash.

Ref: Scots Musical Museum, (vol. 4), James Johnson, Wm Blackwood, 1853.
Other CDs: Bob Hart - MTCD 301-2 & TSCD660; Walter Pardon - MTCD 305-6, Joe Heaney-Topic
TSCD651 &TSCD518D.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Jan 11 - 10:06 AM

I play it with the capo on 1 (so if not playing the guitar, up all of the following by a semitone)
C          D
C D C D    A
C D C D C   G C


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: BenDaglish
Date: 30 May 11 - 10:15 AM

'Standard' chords to the Grainger tune posted above, in Am with a little bit of Fairportisation...

Am G | Am Am | G G | Em Em Em
C C F | C C D | Em Em | G G
Am Am | G G | Am Am G |Am ..


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: sixteen come next Sunday or so
From: GUEST,JTT
Date: 30 May 11 - 10:09 PM

As far as I recall, legal marriage age in Ireland in the early 20th century was 12 for a girl and 14 for a boy, so I don't think the 'age of consent' is in question.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Sixteen Come Next Sunday (Bothy Band)
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Apr 14 - 03:48 PM


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Sixteen Come Next Sunday (Bothy Band)
From: GUEST
Date: 11 Apr 14 - 09:48 PM

The question of marriage and the age of consent are often confused. For social stability in feudal times, marriage was often planned well in advance: the informal Hapsburg motto was, "Marry!" However, there was in general a recognition that childhood marriage was rather a betrothal and might not come to consummation at puberty: the couple tended still to have a say.
With the fall of the feudal system in the 15th Century, the age of marriage generally rose somewhat, and although there were many marriages at a younger age, permitted by law and undertaken to provide for accidents, it may have become the exception rather than the rule. For example, in Oliver Twist, Nancy has been thieving for twelve years, and started at half Oliver's age, ie five, making her age 17. Yet at the same time she's been around the block a few times, and is the mistress of the far older Bill Sykes. The precedents of the work show that the criticism of such sexual mores in 1837 was already prevalent, and although it took another forty years for such paedophilia to be recognised in Law, the parity of Dickens comments and the gist of the contemporary broadside versions of this ballad come to much the same conclusion: marriage before 17 was frowned on.


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