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Eurovision 2021

Dave the Gnome 23 May 21 - 03:26 AM
SPB-Cooperator 23 May 21 - 04:01 AM
GUEST,Ray 23 May 21 - 04:23 AM
SPB-Cooperator 23 May 21 - 04:27 AM
Newport Boy 23 May 21 - 04:45 AM
G-Force 23 May 21 - 07:43 AM
Dave the Gnome 23 May 21 - 08:06 AM
WalkaboutsVerse 23 May 21 - 08:16 AM
Daniel Kelly 23 May 21 - 08:16 AM
WalkaboutsVerse 23 May 21 - 08:35 AM
GUEST 23 May 21 - 09:00 AM
Felipa 23 May 21 - 10:23 AM
GUEST,Hootenanny 23 May 21 - 10:34 AM
Steve Shaw 23 May 21 - 11:20 AM
GUEST 23 May 21 - 11:20 AM
WalkaboutsVerse 23 May 21 - 11:28 AM
Dave the Gnome 23 May 21 - 12:07 PM
WalkaboutsVerse 23 May 21 - 12:22 PM
punkfolkrocker 23 May 21 - 12:22 PM
Steve Shaw 23 May 21 - 12:33 PM
Dave the Gnome 23 May 21 - 12:35 PM
Felipa 23 May 21 - 01:11 PM
Dave the Gnome 23 May 21 - 01:17 PM
YorkshireYankee 23 May 21 - 01:20 PM
WalkaboutsVerse 23 May 21 - 01:23 PM
punkfolkrocker 23 May 21 - 02:12 PM
punkfolkrocker 23 May 21 - 02:28 PM
WalkaboutsVerse 23 May 21 - 02:31 PM
Dave the Gnome 23 May 21 - 02:31 PM
Dave the Gnome 23 May 21 - 02:37 PM
SPB-Cooperator 23 May 21 - 02:59 PM
GUEST,G 23 May 21 - 03:16 PM
punkfolkrocker 23 May 21 - 03:24 PM
WalkaboutsVerse 23 May 21 - 03:37 PM
GUEST,Colin Randall 23 May 21 - 04:08 PM
GUEST 23 May 21 - 04:32 PM
GUEST,Ray 23 May 21 - 04:38 PM
Dave the Gnome 23 May 21 - 04:53 PM
Steve Shaw 23 May 21 - 04:56 PM
WalkaboutsVerse 23 May 21 - 04:58 PM
Steve Shaw 23 May 21 - 04:59 PM
Dave the Gnome 23 May 21 - 05:15 PM
punkfolkrocker 23 May 21 - 05:18 PM
WalkaboutsVerse 23 May 21 - 05:19 PM
Dave the Gnome 23 May 21 - 05:45 PM
WalkaboutsVerse 23 May 21 - 06:30 PM
WalkaboutsVerse 23 May 21 - 07:04 PM
Malcolm Storey 23 May 21 - 07:51 PM
Dave the Gnome 24 May 21 - 02:50 AM
GUEST,Ray 24 May 21 - 03:27 AM
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Subject: Eurovision
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 May 21 - 03:26 AM

I usually start a thread while the Eurovision song contest is ongoing but I forgot this year!

Italy won and I thought they were quite good.
I liked the Belgian entry best
We got no points from either the jury or the public

What did others think?


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Subject: RE: Eurovision
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 23 May 21 - 04:01 AM

I thought the French entry was the best for a few decades. Proved, once again, that the UK commercial recording industry are only capable of churning out garbage due to mindless imbeciles insisting on buying what the multi-millionaire moguls decide that this is what the buying public want to hear.   Of course there could be another factor that due to **** like Johnson and Farage, all UK nationals are viewed as vermin, and should be treated as such by the rest of Europe,.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision
From: GUEST,Ray
Date: 23 May 21 - 04:23 AM

I thought last year’s competition was the best ever!


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Subject: RE: Eurovision
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 23 May 21 - 04:27 AM

:)


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Subject: RE: Eurovision
From: Newport Boy
Date: 23 May 21 - 04:45 AM

The last Eurovision contest I remember hearing was 1967 - since then it's passed me by.

I was a bit of a fan of Sandie Shaw, who won with Puppet on a String. I was listening on BBC radio, with Rolf Harris one of the presenters. After the competition, he interviewed Sandie and the interview started with her entering the studio, a couple of words of greeting, then silence for about 5 seconds. Then her voice, reflectively, "He liked that, didn't he?"


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Subject: RE: Eurovision
From: G-Force
Date: 23 May 21 - 07:43 AM

I had hoped that now we've left the EU we could leave the Eurovision Song Contest too. However, judging by the few songs I heard this year, I'm glad we came last. I wouldn't want any song from here winning that.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 May 21 - 08:06 AM

Yea, France was pretty good too. I thought the Italian one leaned a bit on Kiss but it was OK.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 May 21 - 08:16 AM

And another tradition is my response with this: Eurovision should be a folk song not AMERICAN pop competition - anyone who thinks their pop, rock & (c)rap are somehow above English, or other European, folk & classical music is a fruitcake, frankly


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Subject: RE: Eurovision
From: Daniel Kelly
Date: 23 May 21 - 08:16 AM

I had a go at re-writing the UK song by James Newman as a ballad.

I felt really bad for him when they announced zero points both from the judges and the audience.

People say it has nothing to do with Brexit, but I'm skeptical.

I miss the 'folk' acts that we have had in the past years, mostly pop, power ballad, rap or rock this year.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 May 21 - 08:35 AM

Better


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Subject: RE: Eurovision
From: GUEST
Date: 23 May 21 - 09:00 AM

Why on earth would we seek a trade deal with Australia when they didn't have the loyalty to give us a single point


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Felipa
Date: 23 May 21 - 10:23 AM

why is Australia on the Eurovision judging panel? And does Israel, also well outside of Europe, still take part? (I didn't watch or listen to the competition).


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: GUEST,Hootenanny
Date: 23 May 21 - 10:34 AM

Why is this being talked about on Mudcat ?

I thought this site was supposedly set up for the discussion of folk, blues and related material not for pop circus and silliness.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 May 21 - 11:20 AM

I liked Bulgaria, Greece and Israel. Shows how much I know!

Leave it out, naysayers. There will always be a Eurovision. There are plenty of other channels.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: GUEST
Date: 23 May 21 - 11:20 AM

Because it's the music of the people?

Don't be such a bloody kill joy. That the Italian winner claimed he was 'looking at a broken glass' was quite funny:

We never used cocaine


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 May 21 - 11:28 AM

I'd rather listen to Italians performing an Italian folk song - with or without a Chianti or two.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 May 21 - 12:07 PM

What is folk music but the music of the people, WAV?

(Ducks and runs)

:D


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 May 21 - 12:22 PM

...rather than copying what the people of another nation do, Dave.

Paul McCartney, e.g., would not deny that the Beatles were very good at copying an aspect of American culture or that all their musical heroes were American artists, he would just say something like - it's a cool thing to do, man.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 23 May 21 - 12:22 PM

Here we go yet again..

The annual cranky identity parade of surviving old folky crackpots and bigots...

Eurovision embodies all the positivity, creativity, and colour,
missing from the grey dull hearts of miserable old moaners...

Mind you, I'm going to have my miserable old moan about Eurovision..

I'm still pissed off last year's competition was cancelled.
Many of the 2020 songs were far better than this year's...


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 May 21 - 12:33 PM

Alleluia.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 May 21 - 12:35 PM

Nations are a man made construct, WAV. We are all of one race and sing, dance and celebrate in much the same way. That you see song and music belonging to one culture speaks volumes about you and if you dislike the Eurovision so much please have the courtesy to stay off this thread.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Felipa
Date: 23 May 21 - 01:11 PM

Wikipedia has a partial answer to my question re Australian participation in Eurovision:

"Participation in the contest is primarily open to all broadcasters with active membership of the European Broadcasting Union (EBU). To become an active member of the EBU, a broadcaster has to be from a country which is covered by the European Broadcasting Area or a member state of the Council of Europe.[1] Eligibility to participate is not determined by geographic inclusion within the continent of Europe, despite the "Euro" in "Eurovision", nor does it have a direct connection with the European Union. Several countries geographically outside the boundaries of Europe have competed: Israel, Cyprus, and Armenia, in Western Asia, since 1973, 1981 and 2006 respectively; Morocco, in North Africa, in the 1980 competition alone; and Australia making a debut in the 2015 contest."

footnote 1. https://www.ebu.ch/about/members/admission
"Admission". EBU. European Broadcasting Union. Retrieved 12 April 2017.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_in_the_Eurovision_Song_Contest also gives a list, with some details, of countries which have unsuccessfully applied to join the competition


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 May 21 - 01:17 PM

Thank you Felipa. Another thing about Eurovision that seems to be escaping some. Again from Wiki -

The Eurovision Song Contest's founding stemmed from a desire to promote cooperation between European countries in the years following the Second World War through cross-border television broadcasts, which gave rise to the founding of the European Broadcasting Union (EBU) in 1950.

And why leave it at cooperation between European countries? We are one world. In the words of a very Eurovisionish advert for an American product...

I'd like to teach the world to sing in perfect harmony

:D


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: YorkshireYankee
Date: 23 May 21 - 01:20 PM

Daniel Kelly, I thought your re-working of the English entry was brilliant, and head and shoulders above the Eurovision rendition/ Well done!


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 May 21 - 01:23 PM

"That you see song and music belonging to one culture speaks volumes about you"...just above, Dave, I said I'd like to hear an Italian folk song on Eurovision. With a major in anthropology and shoe-string travel through about 40 nations, I doubt anyone loves our world/our United Nations being multicultural more than I and, thus, I don't like Eurovision being all about American culture.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 23 May 21 - 02:12 PM

walky - any narrow-minded tourist can visit more than 40 nations
and never have their mind expanded...


.. and anthropology hasn't exactly stood up well to close academic scrutiny over recent decades...

You are probably a prime example why..

Walky says - "I love other races and cultures as long as they stay where they are and don't move in here..."

.. off you go then, scuttle back down to your own thread.
You've more than said your piece in this one...


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 23 May 21 - 02:28 PM

Daniel - you've transformed a drab mediocre Eurovision failure
into a potential contemporary folk standard..

Just about everything about the UK entry was shoddy and dismal, apart from the core song itself...

You have easily proven that...


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 May 21 - 02:31 PM

I love fair-trade and eco-tourism between our United Nations.

And, in line with what Hootenanny posted, American pop and rock already swamp our airwaves and internet so, if you do wish for such a discussion on Mudcat, surely you should at least accept some criticism - without resorting to cheap shots, PFR.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 May 21 - 02:31 PM

I don't like Eurovision being all about American culture

It isn't. Apart from in your mind. Your 'major in anthropology', whatever that may be as it certainly is not an English thing, is of no obvious use when it comes to either logic or music.

I'll tell you what. You start a thread about something you enjoy and I will do my upmost to shit on that, politicise it and get it shut down. Ok?


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 May 21 - 02:37 PM

If you don't like something, fine. I accept that. Just say you don't like it and leave. Don't try to turn every thread into a platform for your own politics and poetry.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 23 May 21 - 02:59 PM

Thank you Felipa for saving me the bother of having to explain the EBU to the wiflully ignorant.   Also, what they forget is that being in the EBU means that he UK can participate and broadcast a number of sporting events. The ESC is one of many things we can participate in thanks to our participation in the EBU,


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: GUEST,G
Date: 23 May 21 - 03:16 PM

I've not watched the eurovision contest for over 20 years, when Turkey received "nil points".

It seems to be more about politics than music.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 23 May 21 - 03:24 PM

It could seem like anything you can possibly imagine,
if you haven't watched it for over 20 years...!!!???


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 May 21 - 03:37 PM

Dave - you may like it that the different nationals in Eurovision are performing pop and rock (rather than their own folk songs) but denying that they are aspects of American culture is moronic - and, as I say, Paul McCartney, e.g., would not deny it.

E.g., we could, rather, be hearing some great fado from Portugal, and some great flamenco from Spain...


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: GUEST,Colin Randall
Date: 23 May 21 - 04:08 PM

As any good Brexiter would say, the vote was rigged to punish us for our ludicrous act of self-harm. James Newman won! Trump won! Vaccination sucks! Johnny Foreigner to blame!


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: GUEST
Date: 23 May 21 - 04:32 PM

Where did that "American Pop" come from, WAV?

The song said "it's all rock and roll to me". I say it's all jig and feel to me. There is no such thing as exclusive cultures

Now, will you do as I ask and start your own thread or do I have to get this one closed?


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: GUEST,Ray
Date: 23 May 21 - 04:38 PM

Watched the last hour just to make sure that, as usual, Greece gave maximum points to Cyprus and vice versa and wasn’t disappointed.

Strikes me that everyone avoids voting for the UK entry - because of brexit or otherwise. Why then is the whole fiasco conducted in English?


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 May 21 - 04:53 PM

Sorry, guest 23 May 21 - 04:32 PM was me. No idea where my bickie went!


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 May 21 - 04:56 PM

Sorry, mate, but Mrs Steve and I (who wouldn't miss the show for the earth) both said, sort of independently of each other (well, at least we were sitting on separate settees...) that the Brit entry was, compared to the others, shite, and that we wouldn't be surprised if it got nul points (as it turns out, the only thing we were right about). I think that (a) the standard last night was very high and that the production values were fantastic, (b) the contest is an amazing celebration of unity. I wouldn't buy a single record of any song from last night. But so what. Curl up with a bottle of wine and a lump of cheese once a year for three hours of something determinedly bloody cheerful and uber-cheesy. I have 364 days 21 hours for other culture if I want it. 365 if I really want it.

By the way, WAV, I love the influence of American culture. It gave us Negro spirituals, call and response, Paul Robeson, Pete Seeger, the blues, bluegrass, Lennie Bernstein, George Gershwin, Samuel Barber, Elvis, rock 'n' roll, Charles Ives, Aaron Copland, Woody Guthrie, country music...Andre Previn...

I didn't mention Dylan and jazz because I hate both. But...OK...Dylan and jazz...Satchmo...

I love that we are influenced by American culture. I hope they feel the same way about our culture.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 May 21 - 04:58 PM

Briefly, pop, rock, blues, jazz, Guest, evolved in American and have, of course, been copied by many around the world - from ABBA in Sweden to the Beatles and Rolling Stones in England (while others joined the folk revival).


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 23 May 21 - 04:59 PM

I forgot to mention those amazing musicals...


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 May 21 - 05:15 PM

Briefly, pop, rock, blues, jazz, Guest, evolved in American

And, pray tell, what did they evolve from?


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 23 May 21 - 05:18 PM

Walky takes advantage of mudcat being online..

If this was a real world pub conversation between mates.

It probably wouldn't be long before walky ended up on his arse outside the front door..

With his poetry manifesto book shoved deeply between his buttocks...


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 May 21 - 05:19 PM

You don't need me to tell you that, Dave - a lot of influences from a lot of immigration.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 23 May 21 - 05:45 PM

It was indeed from many cultures WAV. African, Asian, British...

So, the circle is squared. Eurovision learns from American culture that learned from European culture that learned from African culture that learned from... What?


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 May 21 - 06:30 PM

No, Steve, rather, the most popular music in the nations of Europe and most of the world/the one that doing well at makes by far the most money, is copied American pop and rock, which is performed at Eurovision rather than the folk songs of those nations, such as my above examples of fado and flamenco.

Whether or not we like Americanisation, it's foolish to deny the existence of it...and why, Dave, don't you like fado, E-trads, flamenco, etc.?


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: WalkaboutsVerse
Date: 23 May 21 - 07:04 PM

...Sean-nós...


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Malcolm Storey
Date: 23 May 21 - 07:51 PM

Never watched Eurovision - I think that is what this thread is supposed to be about.
Why the squabbling - or is it private?
The pubs I drank in when Eurovision started did not have TVs in the bar - but they did have decent beer and proper crack.
Hey ho!!


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 24 May 21 - 02:50 AM

I like all sorts of music but there is good and bad in all genres. Eurovision is not about showcasing a countries own culture, it is about songs that appeal to the widest possible range of countries and tastes. If you want folk music, go to a folk festival. If you don't like Eurovision, don't watch it. Simple.


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Subject: RE: Eurovision 2021
From: GUEST,Ray
Date: 24 May 21 - 03:27 AM

Just watched the last hour to make sure Greece were still giving maximum points to Cyprus, as usual, and vice versa.

The Eurovision countries clearly hate the British entries; brexit or otherwise, but I can’t understand why the whole fisaco is conducted in English?


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