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BS: I would like to apologise

Mr Red 08 Jul 19 - 02:12 PM
punkfolkrocker 08 Jul 19 - 02:18 PM
Stilly River Sage 08 Jul 19 - 02:47 PM
gillymor 08 Jul 19 - 02:56 PM
David Carter (UK) 08 Jul 19 - 03:10 PM
Iains 08 Jul 19 - 03:18 PM
Mrrzy 08 Jul 19 - 03:21 PM
meself 08 Jul 19 - 03:23 PM
David Carter (UK) 08 Jul 19 - 04:15 PM
Big Al Whittle 08 Jul 19 - 04:34 PM
olddude 08 Jul 19 - 05:05 PM
Rapparee 08 Jul 19 - 10:25 PM
Mr Red 09 Jul 19 - 02:37 AM
Mr Red 09 Jul 19 - 02:49 AM
David Carter (UK) 09 Jul 19 - 04:04 AM
SPB-Cooperator 09 Jul 19 - 04:31 AM
David Carter (UK) 09 Jul 19 - 06:39 AM
olddude 09 Jul 19 - 09:04 AM
Jim Carroll 09 Jul 19 - 09:16 AM
Iains 09 Jul 19 - 09:21 AM
punkfolkrocker 09 Jul 19 - 09:47 AM
punkfolkrocker 09 Jul 19 - 10:05 AM
olddude 09 Jul 19 - 10:13 AM
Mrrzy 09 Jul 19 - 11:03 AM
Iains 09 Jul 19 - 01:21 PM
gillymor 09 Jul 19 - 01:41 PM
peteaberdeen 09 Jul 19 - 01:43 PM
Iains 09 Jul 19 - 01:59 PM
punkfolkrocker 09 Jul 19 - 02:07 PM
EBarnacle 09 Jul 19 - 03:20 PM
Stilly River Sage 09 Jul 19 - 03:32 PM
Big Al Whittle 09 Jul 19 - 06:02 PM
Dave the Gnome 10 Jul 19 - 11:10 AM
Stilly River Sage 10 Jul 19 - 11:21 AM
Iains 10 Jul 19 - 11:36 AM
meself 10 Jul 19 - 12:48 PM
Mossback 10 Jul 19 - 01:07 PM
Dave the Gnome 10 Jul 19 - 01:08 PM
Stilly River Sage 10 Jul 19 - 01:13 PM
David Carter (UK) 10 Jul 19 - 02:23 PM
Mr Red 10 Jul 19 - 02:27 PM
meself 10 Jul 19 - 03:09 PM
Stilly River Sage 10 Jul 19 - 03:41 PM
Dave the Gnome 10 Jul 19 - 03:49 PM
Dave the Gnome 10 Jul 19 - 03:50 PM
David Carter (UK) 10 Jul 19 - 03:52 PM
meself 10 Jul 19 - 04:15 PM
Big Al Whittle 10 Jul 19 - 04:57 PM
David Carter (UK) 10 Jul 19 - 05:09 PM
meself 10 Jul 19 - 05:19 PM
Mr Red 11 Jul 19 - 03:14 AM
David Carter (UK) 11 Jul 19 - 03:27 AM
Big Al Whittle 11 Jul 19 - 04:15 AM
David Carter (UK) 11 Jul 19 - 04:30 AM
meself 11 Jul 19 - 10:45 AM
Dave the Gnome 12 Jul 19 - 03:03 AM
David Carter (UK) 12 Jul 19 - 03:37 AM
Mr Red 12 Jul 19 - 08:53 AM
Mrrzy 12 Jul 19 - 09:06 AM
punkfolkrocker 12 Jul 19 - 09:20 AM
David Carter (UK) 12 Jul 19 - 10:19 AM
Stilly River Sage 12 Jul 19 - 10:48 AM
Mrrzy 12 Jul 19 - 01:59 PM
Dave the Gnome 12 Jul 19 - 02:01 PM
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Subject: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Mr Red
Date: 08 Jul 19 - 02:12 PM

For the comments by the UK ambassador to Washington.

He said a few things about Trump that have been precised as:

"Inept", "Insecure", "Incompetent".

I would like to apologise......................

But .................

Nah.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 08 Jul 19 - 02:18 PM

Quick.. everyone rush to distance yourselves from the ambassador's ill-considered personal opinions...


That's all they are, a stressed and confused man's personal opinions..
He will be spending more time with his family to recuperate and reconsider...


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 08 Jul 19 - 02:47 PM

There's a lot of that going around.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: gillymor
Date: 08 Jul 19 - 02:56 PM

Tread lightly, remember what we did to your airports in 1775.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 08 Jul 19 - 03:10 PM

Part of his job is to appraise Her Majesty's government of the situation in the country he is sent to. If he does not do this because of fear that the host government will find out and disapprove, he is hamstrung and cannot do his job. Thats why his communications are supposed to be completely confidential. Whoever has leaked these communications from within the foreign office is guilty of treason.

Farage says that he is unsuitable because he is a globalist. What else is an ambassador who has served in several countries supposed to be? You cannot just have an ambassador who is a sympathiser with the current regime in the country to which he/she is sent. Does the ambassador to China need to be a communist? Does the ambassador to Saudi Arabia need to be an Islamist? They should have a working knowledge of the country to which they go.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Iains
Date: 08 Jul 19 - 03:18 PM

Well you have to admit it will do wonders for anglo-american relations, it should turn the special relationship quite toxic. Seems like the ambassador is a remainiac loose cannon with loose lips. Will the establishment really support him?


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Mrrzy
Date: 08 Jul 19 - 03:21 PM

Anybody remember when the American cables got leaked?


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: meself
Date: 08 Jul 19 - 03:23 PM

"guilty of treason" - Treason?! Really?


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 08 Jul 19 - 04:15 PM

Somebody who most likely has signed the official secrets act, leaking confidential communications for political purposes. I would have there was at least a case for a treason charge. Last person to be convicted of treason was William Joyce, who was broadcasting support for Nazi Germany. Presumably the clause in the treason act of 1351 under which he was convicted was this:

"Levying war against the king in his realm, or adhering to the king's enemies, giving them aid and comfort in his realm or elsewhere"

To convict the leaker you would have to make the case that aid and comfort were given to the enemies of the sovereign by the leak. Which sort of depends upon who you think they are.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 08 Jul 19 - 04:34 PM

A bit rich coming from the country that contributed Philby, Burgess, Maclean, Blunt to our security services.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: olddude
Date: 08 Jul 19 - 05:05 PM

Gilly- hahaha well now there is coffee all up my nose


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Rapparee
Date: 08 Jul 19 - 10:25 PM

"[William Cecil, Lord Berghley, is] a common man, although very clever, false, lying, a great heretic and foolish enough to believe that not all the princes of Christendom combined were in a position to violate his country's sovereignty."   -- Guerau de Espés, Spanish ambassador the England, ca. 1570.

“Henry [VIII] is so greedy that all the riches in the world would not satisfy him… to make himself rich he has impoverished his people. This King…. does not trust a single man… and will not cease to dip his hand in blood as long as he doubts the people.” (Charles de Marillac, French Ambassador, 1540)

The Spanish Ambassador complained to Talleyrand that the seals on his diplomatic letters had been broken. Talleyrand replied, "I shall wager I can guess how the thing happened. I am convinced your despatch was opened by some one who desired to know what was inside."


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Mr Red
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 02:37 AM

Stilly - ROTFLMAO


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Mr Red
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 02:49 AM

the Farrage Balloon says he is unsuitable? From a superannuated DJ who wants the job himself?


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 04:04 AM

Farage's position seems to be that the ambassador to a foreign country has to be a boot licker to its regime.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 04:31 AM

Only one person is in danger of turning the Anglo-American relationship toxic the inept, insecure, incompetent, revolting, corrupt liar Trump. While Trump is in power we do not need or even want any relationship, trade or otherwise with America.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 06:39 AM

Agree entirely SPB. When you get rid of him, come back. Until then we don't need your trade of your "security" cooperation. We are better off doing a deal with the Chinese. And make sure you turn in the keys to Lakenheath when you leave.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: olddude
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 09:04 AM

Well the Chinese are making some really good guitars lately


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 09:16 AM

"it should turn the special relationship quite toxi"
Special relationship with a degenerate nutcase ?
Chacun a son gout, I suppose
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Iains
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 09:21 AM

The Special Relationship is an unofficial term often used to describe the political, diplomatic, cultural, economic, military, and historical relations between the United Kingdom and the United States.
Is the US a degenerate nutcase?


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 09:47 AM

A president who sees himself and his personal whims in terms of an all powerful Roman Emperor,
who regards himself as the USA personified,
who his craziest worshipers declare is an emissary of God...

"Degenerate nutcase" isn't too unfitting a description...


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 10:05 AM

Iains - I also acknowledge that too many of the most fanatical British far right,
would be very delighted indeed if Trump
did actually conquer the planet..
and seize the title of World President, Dictator of Earth, the moon,
and the entire universe...


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: olddude
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 10:13 AM

I want to be dictator of the moon so i could moon everyone on earth all at one time


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Mrrzy
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 11:03 AM

So, good, nobody remembers the US stuff being leaked. This too shall pass, in other words.
When the Tehran embassy was taken over in 1979, the cable read, there's 10 000 ragheads out chewing the flag, please advise. That was understandably never made public. We (my family) knew the communicators, some of whom survived. After being hostages


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Iains
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 01:21 PM

The only point I make is that the special relationship is with a country, not a person.
This is rather bourne out by the fact that this evening proposed talks
between Wilber Ross the US trade secretary and Liam Fox have been cancelled.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: gillymor
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 01:41 PM

Old Wilbur probably would have just dozed off anyway.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: peteaberdeen
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 01:43 PM

is that really the only point you are going to make, ian? good.....


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Iains
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 01:59 PM

I am not getting involved in American politics. Brexit is my concern.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 02:07 PM

Maybe brexit is a subset of USA politics...???

Wresting our plunderable wealth away from Europe for the benefit of Trump's raiders...???


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: EBarnacle
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 03:20 PM

What seems to be missing is an understanding that the Yellow Peril is a golem. Instead of a holy man to put the word of God in his mouth and instruct him, though, he has Putin.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 03:32 PM

This is true.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 09 Jul 19 - 06:02 PM

Am I the only one who has completely lost understanding of this thread...?


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 11:10 AM

I apologise unreservedly for everything that has happened, ever, in the world. Including this post.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 11:21 AM

Speaking the truth to someone like Trump is rarely going to make him happy.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Iains
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 11:36 AM

The person that broke the news about the Ambassadoor(whohas now resigned) is suing the Guardian for Defamation.

Isabel Oakeshott is suing the The Guardian after it suggested that the way in which she got her agenda setting diplomatic cables scoop over the weekend was by sleeping with either Nigel Farage or Arron Banks. She has hired hardball lawyer Donal Blaney to secure the removal of the comments and an apology…

In the print version of an article by The Guardian’s John Crace, the paper published the line “Not least because the only way Isabel Oakeshott, the journalist who got the leaked emails, ever gets a scoop is if Nigel or Arron Banks slips it to her.” In the online version this read “Not least because the only way Isabel Oakeshott, the journalist who got the leaked emails, ever gets a scoop is if he or Arron Banks leave it conveniently tucked under her pillow.”

Ouch! That will put a dent in the coffers.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: meself
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 12:48 PM

"Speaking the truth to someone like Trump" -- Of course, he wasn't speaking to trump; he was whispering, so to speak, to a third party, in accordance with his duties. To be fair, though, I don't think any head of state would be overly-pleased with such extreme criticism of himself and his government from an ambassador, and if it's made public, it can't be ignored. The ambassador had no choice but to resign.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Mossback
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 01:07 PM

Pays to keep in mind that Darroch was 100% correct in his analysis; if anything he went easy on Trump and his gang of felons.

The person that really owes the world an apology is Trump.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 01:08 PM

Of course now he has resigned the memoirs will follow and the shit really will hit the fan. On both sides of the pond.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 01:13 PM

meself, typically those things are said all of the time. Leaders are routinely burned in effigy. MOST world leaders ignore that as part of the cost of holding office. They can't afford to let that nonsense bother them.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 02:23 PM

Oakshott, as I have posted in another thread, needs to be put in a darkened room with six burly WPCs, until she names the miscreant who leaked the information to her.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Mr Red
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 02:27 PM

Ouch! That will put a dent in the coffers.

Maybe, though the first thing a libel lawyer asks is "how much can you afford to loose?" For good reason. Still, a sugar daddy maybe be at hand to answer that one.

So now we know who to blame, maybe we should be concerned. Who was paying for the treason? Or what other reason would the person have for such a immoral (& illegal) act?

Does the phrase "in bed with" have more than one meaning?

Lets face it there is a vacancy going if she has spare room in her flat for a failed PM. And what did he have to say about Trump?


We are indeed living in interesting times.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: meself
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 03:09 PM

SRS: Criticism coming from an ambassador is a completely different matter from criticism from journalists, political enemies, protesters, etc. If you or anyone else can produce an instance of an ambassador having statements of this nature made public without similar consequences, I'd be interested - and surprised.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 03:41 PM

The point isn't that they were said, it's that they were leaked, correct? Any rational human being on the face of the planet has no doubt said or thought the exact same thing. Trump is a self-serving sociopath and everyone knows it.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 03:49 PM

It is coming to light that this is a total stitchup by the Johnson team to get a brexiteer close to the White House and lick the arse of the orange madman. Hopefully it will all come out and put another another mail in the coffins of the unholy duo.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 03:50 PM

Or even a nail!


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 03:52 PM

That is the point, although the likes of Johnson would have you believe something else. An ambassador's communications with their government should be strictly confidential. Whoever leaked them has committed a serious crime. As you say, what was in those communications is not really new and not really controversial. I don't think there was any need for him to resign, and the British Prime Minister needed to be strong enough to say that we decide who the ambassador is, not the host country. We couldn't for instance have the Chinese government insisting that our ambassador to China should be a communist. And having decided who the ambassador is, they need to be free to report back on what they find out about the host regime, even if that regime were to disagree.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: meself
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 04:15 PM

It happens from time to time that a nation will demand the recall of another nation's ambassador, and, as far as I know, it an accepted convention. That is not what happened here, of course, but it seemed clear that the ambassador would be unable to do his job effectively now; hence, his resignation. I don't get what's hard to understand about that.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 04:57 PM

Has he said what led him to think those thoughts about Trump?


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 05:09 PM

Meself: no its not what happened here. And he was doing his job effectively, that seems to be part of Trump's problem.

Big Al: If he did say what led him to think those thoughts about Trump, that is of course confidential. So only senior politicians and civil servants should know. On the other hand lots of other people seem to think the same thoughts about Trump, he is hardly alone


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: meself
Date: 10 Jul 19 - 05:19 PM

No one said he WASN'T doing his job effectively - it's that he will NO LONGER be able to do his job effectively. You can't be much of an ambassador if no one's answering your phone calls.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Mr Red
Date: 11 Jul 19 - 03:14 AM

another mail in the coffins of the unholy duo.

almost right first time, just one spelling mistake - that should be e-mail!



And FWIW all it has done is emasculated the UK - as if we aren't the laughing stock of the world already. The blond tussle hair-brained buffo's persona is already rubbing off on the nation!

We are indeed living in interesting times.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 11 Jul 19 - 03:27 AM

He was quite capable of carrying out his job effectively. All that was required was for May to say to Trump that he was our ambassador and that Trump would be expected to treat him with respect.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 11 Jul 19 - 04:15 AM

nevertheless - it would be interesting to know what made him say those things about Trump.

Now the cats out of the bag - what possible harm could it do. And if there are genuine causes for concern - not just the 'right on' comics so beloved of our tv companies - I think we really should know.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 11 Jul 19 - 04:30 AM

You see his behaviour towards Iran and ask if there is genuine cause for concern???


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: meself
Date: 11 Jul 19 - 10:45 AM

"All that was required was for May to say to Trump that he was our ambassador and that Trump would be expected to treat him with respect."

Oh. Yes, I'm sure that work.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Jul 19 - 03:03 AM

It's about time we disassociated ourselves from that moron anyway. How long has he got to go now and is he likely to get back in?


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 12 Jul 19 - 03:37 AM

Actually, I think it would meself. Trump is a bully, and like all bullies he is a coward. Standing up to him is the only way to deal with him. About the only person who seems to know how to deal with Trump is Kim Jong-un.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Mr Red
Date: 12 Jul 19 - 08:53 AM

Quick, get the UK Ambassador for North Korea for transfer while the Farrage Balloon is still trying to puff himslf up.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Mrrzy
Date: 12 Jul 19 - 09:06 AM

Wait, torture her till she reveals her source? Really, David Carter?


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 12 Jul 19 - 09:20 AM

yes.. there's real world torture, which is very bad - humanity at it's worst..

and then there's comedy torture.. a genre of jokes to cheer folks up in the midst of such a shit nasty existence...

Sensible folks don't get the two confused...


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: David Carter (UK)
Date: 12 Jul 19 - 10:19 AM

Guantanamo was still open last time I heard.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 12 Jul 19 - 10:48 AM

Another Mitch McConnell move. He refused to let the Senate vote on any changes Obama wanted to make to put Guantanamo prisoners in regular federal facilities or into an online one set up for that group. And Trump doesn't give a rat's ass about Guantanamo so now who knows what goes on there.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Mrrzy
Date: 12 Jul 19 - 01:59 PM

Is anybody sending people who don't betray sources to Guantanamo? If not, why bring it up in this context?

Sure there are torture jokes. Funny torture jokes? Not so many.


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Subject: RE: BS: I would like to apologise
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Jul 19 - 02:01 PM

No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!


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