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BS: If I were a remainer...

DMcG 29 Mar 19 - 02:15 AM
Iains 28 Mar 19 - 11:19 AM
punkfolkrocker 28 Mar 19 - 10:04 AM
punkfolkrocker 28 Mar 19 - 10:02 AM
Acorn4 28 Mar 19 - 10:02 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Mar 19 - 09:50 AM
punkfolkrocker 28 Mar 19 - 08:28 AM
punkfolkrocker 28 Mar 19 - 09:25 AM
Donuel 28 Mar 19 - 09:10 AM
Dave the Gnome 28 Mar 19 - 08:53 AM
Iains 28 Mar 19 - 08:45 AM
punkfolkrocker 28 Mar 19 - 08:43 AM
punkfolkrocker 28 Mar 19 - 08:29 AM
Iains 28 Mar 19 - 08:26 AM
Backwoodsman 28 Mar 19 - 08:15 AM
punkfolkrocker 28 Mar 19 - 08:07 AM
The Sandman 28 Mar 19 - 05:30 AM
The Sandman 28 Mar 19 - 05:26 AM
Bonnie Shaljean 27 Mar 19 - 04:30 PM
Dave the Gnome 27 Mar 19 - 04:25 PM
punkfolkrocker 27 Mar 19 - 04:03 PM
punkfolkrocker 27 Mar 19 - 04:00 PM
Big Al Whittle 27 Mar 19 - 03:54 PM
Iains 27 Mar 19 - 03:47 PM
punkfolkrocker 27 Mar 19 - 03:41 PM
The Sandman 26 Mar 19 - 10:34 AM
punkfolkrocker 26 Mar 19 - 10:11 AM
The Sandman 26 Mar 19 - 09:43 AM
The Sandman 26 Mar 19 - 09:40 AM
Iains 26 Mar 19 - 09:38 AM
punkfolkrocker 26 Mar 19 - 09:25 AM
Iains 26 Mar 19 - 09:21 AM
The Sandman 26 Mar 19 - 09:06 AM
punkfolkrocker 26 Mar 19 - 09:06 AM
punkfolkrocker 26 Mar 19 - 09:02 AM
Iains 26 Mar 19 - 06:17 AM
The Sandman 26 Mar 19 - 04:46 AM
The Sandman 26 Mar 19 - 04:36 AM
punkfolkrocker 25 Mar 19 - 12:08 PM
Backwoodsman 25 Mar 19 - 12:00 PM
Bonnie Shaljean 25 Mar 19 - 11:49 AM
DMcG 25 Mar 19 - 06:09 AM
Big Al Whittle 25 Mar 19 - 05:47 AM
Backwoodsman 25 Mar 19 - 04:30 AM
The Sandman 25 Mar 19 - 04:26 AM
Backwoodsman 25 Mar 19 - 04:00 AM
punkfolkrocker 24 Mar 19 - 12:55 PM
Dave the Gnome 24 Mar 19 - 12:47 PM
punkfolkrocker 24 Mar 19 - 12:39 PM
The Sandman 24 Mar 19 - 12:37 PM
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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: DMcG
Date: 29 Mar 19 - 02:15 AM

Voting for a party on one single issue is an absurdity.

I agree. However, it is now looking likely that the Conservative manifesto and approach to the next general election is likely to strive to make it a single issue one.


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Iains
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 11:19 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3t8P1eqyvo


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 10:04 AM

errmmm.. sounds like I just described the tory govt.. on one of their better days...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 10:02 AM

Me and Iains collaborating on a punk bagpipe project CD sounds like it could just work..

What with the best bands in all music history being fraught with internal tension,
infighting, intense love/hate dynamics, and occasional explosive punch ups...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Acorn4
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 10:02 AM

The one thing that concerns Teresa May and whoever is pulling her strings is a Jeremy Corbyn led government. She has actually said as good as "over my dead body".

She knows that the whole of the Brexit shambles is a no score draw between the parties, whereas if it came to discussing policies Labour might continue the recovery they had at the last election.

Is it just possible that she is just trying deliberately to string out the whole Brextrication thing as long as possible, hoping to lure Labour into some kind of trap either through intended or unintended consequences or even unintended consequences of unintended consequences.

Play for time and hope something turns up. Not saying this for definite but it is a possibility.


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 09:50 AM

Take up something quieter and more constructive. Learn to play the bagpipes :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 08:28 AM

..btw.. now Keefs gone.. I can use a replacement...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 09:25 AM

I can regard Iains with some respect, or total disdain...

It depends on the degree of provocative bollocks he is talking in any particular post...

Most of the time, one way or another, intended or [more likely..] unintentional,
he gives me a chuckle...

My perverse sense of humour prevents me becoming the sterotypical snowflake antifa lefty,
that the right have convinced themselves are so representitive of ordinary socially aware decent compassionate people...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Donuel
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 09:10 AM

In uncertain times fear only magnifies possibile problems.
Let us prey...

THE LORD SPRAYER

"Our Father, Richard in Heaven,
Harold be Thy name.
Thy King Dome come,
Thy Will be dumb,
On earth, as it isn't Heaven.
Give us this day our jelly bread,
And forgive us our dress patches
As we forgive those who dress bass against us.
And lead us not into Penn Station
But deliver us from Evel.
For Thine is the King Dome
And the powder
And the glory for river."


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 08:53 AM

He's fast losing people to wind up, PFR. Looks like you are it for now. Sorry :-(


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Iains
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 08:45 AM

Strange that you never hear the Swiss squealing about their numerous referendums.
It is called direct democracy - jus' like BREXIT!


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 08:43 AM

Iains - I care about real life economic practicalities that will worsen me and my family's income and standard of living..

We can't afford the luxury of your kind of belligerently fanatical obession with constitutional theory...

The abstract academic concept of 'sovereignty' matters sweet F A...!!!

Except to those sufficiently well off, who will no doubt profiteer from brexit...

btw.. "y'all".. the UK far right are so influenced by Trumpists, they are turning into pantomime yanks...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 08:29 AM

..and that the outcome of this fiasco [ie how worse]
seems to be at the mercy of a handfull of hardline zealots DUP..

Now really is a bloody good time to wash our hands of Northern Ireland once and for alll...

of course this shit minority tory govt can't for obvious reasons,
but May's costly dependency on them has bit her in the arse...

I bet if hardline brexiteers were given the option
"you can have brexit entirely your own way, but on conditionn we relinquish the north,
and Ireland is re-unified"...

that'd scare DUP shitless...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Iains
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 08:26 AM

just because a fanatical minority of rich nationalist ex public school boys
with an obsession for arcane academic constituional history & law,
have stirred up the worst xenophobic impulses of the greater less educated masses...

17.4 million gace their democratic decision.
You lost
Get over it.!

Amazing how the left insist on overturning democracy because they lost.

Y'all make good Democrats!


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 08:15 AM

Me too pfr.


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 08:07 AM

It angers me that after 10 years or more of austerity
my family will be even worse off for the long term,
just because a fanatical minority of rich nationalist ex public school boys
with an obsession for arcane academic constituional history & law,
have stirred up the worst xenophobic impulses of the greater less educated masses...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: The Sandman
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 05:30 AM

100, and the uk enjoyed a privileged position in the eu having been allowed to keep its own currency , which i think was sensible


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: The Sandman
Date: 28 Mar 19 - 05:26 AM

ians not stupid but they have beenm conned, the complications were not explained neither was the legal stature of the referndum that is the fasult of david cameron ,farage, ans some other conservative polticians, personally i have no objection to a soft brexit, but i would rather the uk remained than there was a no deal


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 27 Mar 19 - 04:30 PM

Al, just for the record, in case this thread does get closed down:

No matter what happens in the Brexit dogfight, my high opinion of you is - and will stay - unchanged. I'll always admire you for your intelligence, your talent, your humour - and your moral courage in making a real attempt at communication with the other side, even when it's bound to get your head used as target practice. Please remember that.


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 27 Mar 19 - 04:25 PM

Oh, stay around, Al. We need the rest of the song

"It I were a remainer
and you were a leaver..."


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 27 Mar 19 - 04:03 PM

Al - have patience - and trust [some of..] us...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 27 Mar 19 - 04:00 PM

"...bands won’t be able to tour like “before the EU” Read more at https://www.nm


Iains - never was sure if you're a musician or not [a musiciain...???]
but here's an interesting article from a youngish journalist,
writing in a style that appeals to a younger hipper readership...

I just mentioned that in case some of us struggle with 'youth' sense of humour...

The points made are still valid for consideration by us old gits..


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 27 Mar 19 - 03:54 PM

i'd be grateful if the mods closed this down. its just turned into the usual tripe.


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Iains
Date: 27 Mar 19 - 03:47 PM

PFR Our decision to   join a European Common Market was fine. Having it morph into a political union is not. Thw gamw plan id creeping federalism to a fullon US of Europe with centralised taxation, defence and political union and destruction of the nation state.
You may be head over heels in love with the concept, I ain't!

I see many on here deny it yet it is their stated agenda and they are proud to admit to hoodwinking the electorate in order to implement their various schemes. Yet the remainers insist the brexiteers are stupid!


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 27 Mar 19 - 03:41 PM

From a skint musicians point of view...

A random example.."The La Super Rica Fuzz is available now for $179/£220"

so today, how does $179 become 220 quid..!!!!???? *

..and this is not so unusual in rip off Britain...


Which is why EU membership is working out so well for us...

[* Obviously recomended retail price is a guideline, and it pays to shop around.
But it just about always works out cheaper to buy from Europe].


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: The Sandman
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 10:34 AM

tariffs between the uk and ireland will probably rise


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 10:11 AM

Iains - so basically swapping a known and consistent source of affordable purchases
for complete uncertainty...

A gamble nationalist zealots have taken without consideration for those many citizens it will directly affect adversely ...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: The Sandman
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 09:43 AM

and it was the uk, or rather a small majority of those who voted in the uk that decided to leave that is not the fault of ireland it was a decision made by the uk ant even a majority of the total electorate a small majority of those who voted, uk expatriots could not vote


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: The Sandman
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 09:40 AM

you need to think, if the irish economy suffers as a result of loss of trade to britain ,of course social welfare pensioners perks might be cut, if the uk economy crashes my pension is worth less, it is a no win situatioin for me , thankyou to the consevatives and ukip, bloody idiots


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Iains
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 09:38 AM

I think it highly unlikely tariffs between the US and UK post brexit would rise. I would have thought the reverse more likely. Cheaper steak being an obvious benefit and well sterilised chickens. Tariffs between the EU and UK post brexit is anybodies guess. For musical instruments I cannot see much need for change. However: a view below.

. Many musical instruments are manufactured outside the EU and are subject to tariffs, VAT and bureaucracy when imported currently, so this is not likely to change in the short term. In the longer term, tariffs on imports of musical instruments may be reduced or eliminated, but as they are small anyway the impact is likely to be minimal.

One potential impact is that some private UK purchasers may be dissuaded from buying from retailers in the EU because of the risk of instruments being held up in customs with all the bureaucratic problems that that involves

https://www.doublereed.co.uk/news/impact-assessment-brexit-and-the-musical-instrument-market/


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 09:25 AM

Iains - my question next please...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Iains
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 09:21 AM

Why would someone resident in west Cork feel that cuts in social welfare will result from Brexit. Agreements are already in place for pension payments, regardless of outcome.If you are claiming Irish benefits they are far more generous than those in the UK. The only major way Ireland will be impacted by brexit is by her own intransigence.
For example post no deal brexit the UK will recognise Irish driving licenses. Ireland has stated the opposite for UK licences in the republic.


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: The Sandman
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 09:06 AM

I would rather remain and have those things in place than take a gamble and probably /possibly have austerity and cuts in social welfare, nothing strange in that


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 09:06 AM

ps.. previously all I've heard is, "be a patriot and be prepared make sacrifices to regain our sovereigntity"...

So comforting to be told that by multi millionaire brexiteers...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 09:02 AM

Iains - for years we skint musicians in particular have enjoyed excellent low price bargains
from Thomann Germany, and Amazon EU, etc...

Lowest prices, and no import duties, on Equipment and CDs I for one could not ever afford at inflated UK prices.

Tell me this will still be so after Brexit...???


Btw.. it's at least a decade since it was possible to buy similar from USA
and after Customs fees, VAT, and shipping still work out significantly cheaper than UK...
Which is why on this score, Europe is so crucial for me...

So seriously, tell I need not worry about losing this after Brexit...?????


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Iains
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 06:17 AM

From: The Sandman - PM
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 04:46 AM

What a peculiar post. Do you have anything tangible to suggest your pension will no longer be paid or a local bus service will cease or the mobile library will suddenly vanish in a puff of smoke post brexit.
    I have seen nothing in the Southern Star to suggest such hysterics have any grounding in reality and I have heard nothing on the Ballydehob rumour mill either. Project fear on steroids I suggest!


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: The Sandman
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 04:46 AM

Here in rural ireland , i have freebus and train travel i have a free library service at the bottom of my road, a bus that passes my door twice a week, i have a pension, in the evnt of brxit particularly no deal, these things may disappear, thankyou very much David Cameron. i would rather keep those things than have pie in the sky.


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: The Sandman
Date: 26 Mar 19 - 04:36 AM

throwing insults does not affect how i will vote, what makes me inclined to change my mind is the thought of a dose of severe austerity


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 25 Mar 19 - 12:08 PM

play ground insulting & bullying politics don't help anyone...

Well it shouldn't...

But it actually does...

It helps those who want to divide and misdirect 'us' into petty bickering confrontational factions..

While 'they' get on with grabbing all they can from us,
to further enrich themselves...

This much should be bleedin' obvious..?????


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 25 Mar 19 - 12:00 PM

Not to mention the death-threats that Leavers are so fond of throwing out. I've never seen a Remainer making death threats, but I've been told by numerous Leavers on FaceBook and other forums that I'm a 'Traitor who should be arrested, marched out and shot) because I support Remain.

And the most abusive, insulting, trolling poster on this forum is a rabid Leaver.


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 25 Mar 19 - 11:49 AM

And can I point out that I get just as sick of being insulted and called names by leavers. It works both ways.


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: DMcG
Date: 25 Mar 19 - 06:09 AM

As a remainer, can I second "The point of the thread was that the remainers stop insulting people"? If remainers want to convince leavers to change their mind - not all of them, of course, but that group who were more-or-less undecided, but went for leave on balance - throwing insults is a very poor way to do it.


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 25 Mar 19 - 05:47 AM

well its precisely the Brexshitter type of abuse that makes sensible debate an impossibility.

And what of the many articles there must be that don't confirm your point of view. Will you read 20 of them back to back?

The point of the thread was that the remainers stop insulting people, which many people find distressing - and organise themselves into meaningful action - if that what they actually want.

just maybe you wonder if they 're all getting off on the insults. the young kids obviously are. still thats forgiveable - its what its like being young.

You need people leading the movement who actually believe in REMAIN. Corbyn may or may not. Still its your call.


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 25 Mar 19 - 04:30 AM

I don't have your crystal ball Dick, so I wouldn't presume to predict what will happen ten years into the future. I'll bow to the fact that you seem to have the power of foresight denied to us mere mortals.

Any chance you could PM me with the winning numbers for the next Euromillions jackpot draw?


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: The Sandman
Date: 25 Mar 19 - 04:26 AM

i think it is unfair to call Al embittered.
Back woodsman, i dont disagree with a lot of what you say, however i have a feeling that the days of the EU are numbered, in 10 years time it will fall apart, however that is not a reason to inflict hardship on ourselves for the next 4 /5 years, furthermoreweneed longer to try and sort the present political mess


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 25 Mar 19 - 04:00 AM

I'd recommend embittered BrexShit supporters like Al to read this piece and the twenty essays it links to.

There are lessons to be learned from the disastrous debacle of BrexShit, and the article goes a long way to explain causes of the feelings of disenfranchisement and abandonment the Brexshitters clearly feel but which, as I've tried on many occasions to impress on Al, apparently without success, are more accurately attributable to the political systems, and domestic policies of successive governments here at home in the UK.

I don't believe any of the Remainers here claim that the EU is a perfect construct, but I do truly and firmly believe that the benefits it's given us - not the least being beneficial trade arrangements and agreements, harmonised customs arrangements, H&S Regulations, Employment Protection laws and, most of all, peace with our 27 partner-nations for the longest continuous period ever - hugely outweigh the 'hopes' on which Brexshiteers seem to have pinned their decision to vote Leave, and which I believe will prove eventually to have been futile.

But, as they say, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. I suspect there will be a few still-thirsty Brexit-dobbins coming along shortly, 'neigh-saying' this post.


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 24 Mar 19 - 12:55 PM

Actually, I wish a lot of the upper middle class Oxbridge, and radical student Labour supporters,
[and all others obsessed with divisive and distracting middle east, and identity politics]
would bugger off and join the Liberals...!!!


Letting Labour steer back to concentrating on it's core essentials again...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 24 Mar 19 - 12:47 PM

I am not advocating voting for the lib dems,

I know you're not, Dick , but that is precisely what Al advocates in his opening post. IE, "If you really belive what you've been saying you believe in - why not get behind the Liberrals instead of Jeremy."


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: punkfolkrocker
Date: 24 Mar 19 - 12:39 PM

Iain - that may have been the technical 'fact'.


But Thatcher's tories pushed it right to the forefront of their policy and propaganda agenda...
A previously lesser known housing rule became fanatically weaponised under thatcher's ideology,
to attack and break up state social provision...

That seriously can not be dismissed so easily...

A similar level of cynical hard hearted tory ideolgy drives brexit...


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Subject: RE: BS: If I were a remainer...
From: The Sandman
Date: 24 Mar 19 - 12:37 PM

I am not advocating voting for the lib dems, i was trying to explain als point. ian come on lets have more than just sovereignty , that answere is weak


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