BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 01:36 PM

I suppose it is only right that a folk music site should encompass the noble art of pin dancing, as exemplified above.
Meanwhile tic toc!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 12:20 PM

Even Pizza delivery has on costs!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 12:09 PM

"'Most Incompetent Minister In Parliamentary History'."
Puts him first in line as next leader of the Tory Party I would think
Can't think of anybody more qualified - can anybody ?
Jim carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 12:00 PM


I am surprised that anyone can believe a contract has been awarded and then cancelled with absolutely no costs involved.

In normal circumstance I would agree, Raggy. Any competent business drawing up such a contract would include all sorts of penalty clauses to do with cancellation.

However, this company was the one using pizza delivery t&c's, so it is believable they *were* that incompetent.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 11:52 AM

"I condemn them for being such a bunch of greedy, self-serving twunts in the first place."

Apologies - I omitted 'incompetent' from the above in error. Should say, "I condemn them for being such a bunch of greedy, self-serving, incompetent twunts in the first place".

Grayling must qualify for the title 'Most Incompetent Minister In Parliamentary History'.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 11:43 AM

I am surprised that anyone can believe a contract has been awarded and then cancelled with absolutely no costs involved.

Does that mean that everyone who worked on the contract tendering process did so without pay, that all the office space and on costs were free .......... together with all the other associated costs.






Mind you some people seem to believe in Unicorns too!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 11:27 AM

LAID OUT SO FAR TO MAKE UP FOR BREXIT LOSSES
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 10:58 AM

Whether taxpayers money is involved depends on who you believe, who you count as a taxpayer and how you apportion costs. Here is a different viewpoint:


Keeping the site open is costing local taxpayers £7,224 a day, according to a local source, and the council – which has already spent months in fruitless negotiations with Seaborne – had proposed shutting it down to help balance the books.

The DfT persuaded the council to keep it open, claiming that talks with Seaborne were at an “advanced stage”, according to Paul Messenger, a local Conservative councillor.

He said the port was costing about £2m a year: “That’s why we haven’t got any road sweepers, that’s why we haven’t got any public lavatories.”

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 10:40 AM

Awkward things facts!


Ferry firm will get no moneuy upfront

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 10:34 AM

Not to say extremely irresponsibly stupid with the taxpayers money

Typical unfocused un-researched kneejerk reaction.

No tax payers money was involved has been very clearly stated by all sources.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 10:07 AM

Not to say extremely irresponsibly stupid with the taxpayers money
What moron hands out a massive amounbt of cash to a shipping line with no ships and no lace to land them if they had them ?
Sums up the standards of our politicians perfectly in my opinion
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 07:33 AM

I condemn them for being such a bunch of greedy, self-serving twunts in the first place.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: KarenH
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 07:20 AM

I see Grayling has cancelled the ferry contract awarded to the firm with no boats. That seems like sound policy to me. I applaud them for seeing sense on this.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 04:13 AM

I think it more likely money has come out of some government fund that is not directly related to current taxpayers, but is of course (after sufficient back and forth between accounts and departments and relabelling) still ultimately from either the current taxpayers or, via debt, from future taxpayers.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 04:08 AM

Maybe the Tory party paid for it, DMcG. After all, the contract lined the pockets of some of them...
Jolly good distraction techniques to divert attention from labour. They have many problems.


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/feb/08/luciana-berger-labour-members-antisemitism

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 03:59 AM

Maybe the Tory party paid for it, DMcG. After all, the contract lined the pockets of some of them...

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 03:44 AM

It seems the contract with the Ferry Company With No Ships has been cancelled. But I was struck by the curious phrase 'no taxpayer money has been paid'. Surely the more natural phrase would be 'no money has been paid' which obviously includes the former phrase. As it is, the phrase suggests money has been paid, but not directly attributable to current taxes.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 03:31 AM

I like the cut of his jib!


https://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/17356118.letter-mps-will-be-finished-if-they-go-back-on-brexit/

No wishy washy signs of appeasement from him.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Feb 19 - 02:59 AM

Jonn Elledge is spot on with his analysys, BWM. Trouble is, he refers to EU countries such as France and Germany as allies and our rabid brexiteers don't like that. They will remind you about WW1 and WW2. When you point out that we allied ourselves with France and Belgium in those conflicts they will remind you about Agincourt. When you remind them that we were allied with The Low Countries in the 100 years war they will probably struggle unless they can dredge up some sea battles with the Dutch. Chances are they will just call you a traitor and collaborator and say that even if we are not at war with them, we should be. After all, they are European, eat babies and want to shag your wife. And that's before they start on the New Statesman being a communist mouthpiece for Soviet domination ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 05:57 PM

A piece from The New Statesman carefully explaining the nature of the Abusive Relationship the UK now has with the EU, brought about by the shameful behaviour of Brexiteers, and their ridiculous word-twisting and over-reaction to Mr. Tusk's 'special place in Hell' comment.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 05:29 PM

For those incapable of following links to videos, here is a transcript of Barroness Warsi's interview in The Independent

States early on

The peer, who served in a number of roles under David Cameron when he was Prime Minister, admitted that the EU referendum was held to keep the Conservative Party together and insufficient plans were made for Britain voting to leave the EU.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 01:03 PM

That Farage and others have registered a new party named "Brexit" has been widely reported. That is, I think, a Project Fear worthy of the name. It is quite possible that the party gathers a lot of those in search of The One True Brexit, and like all single issue parties it will probably be very reticent on what else it stands for. It could highly dangerous and will feed on the resentments over Brexit whatever the outcome. We need to be very alert to the risks.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 12:42 PM

Farage forming a new political party. From Guido the leading source of news on brexit.

!!!!!!!
Cannot wait for the new show to hit the road!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 12:20 PM

??????

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 11:50 AM

I see the link is through farcebook. Says it all really!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 10:53 AM

If anyone is in any doubt as to the fact that the Tories created this fuck up, listen to one of your own

Baroness Warsi on Brexit.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 10:13 AM

Whale oil beef hooked!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 09:56 AM

The only oil I eat is extra virgin olive oil.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 09:52 AM

The regulations people seem to be focused on are things like food standards, which do vary greatly all over the world. If you don't think Monbiot is suitable, look at the Huffington Post article. Or better still the original documents sent to the US government. They are not hard to find ("Negotiating Objectives for a U.S.-United Kingdom Trade Agrement")

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 09:06 AM

Good bit on disaster capitalists hoping to cash in on post-Brexit bonfire of the health and safety and environmental regs in the Grauniad:

The only problem is that it is an article from a rabid leftwing newspaper desperate to peddle anything that makes a case for resisting Brexit. It is purely conjecture and the articles author, Mr Monbiot is a treehugger of some repute, so impartiality when reporting is hardly one of his fortes.
I also think the entire subject of rolling back safety standards is simply a canard.

From my own experience the safety culture in the oil industry is virtually identical worldwide. Much of the present safety regime stems directly from the UK Piper Alpha disaster and resulting public enquiry. I would suggest that winding back safety legislation is far more difficult than introducing it. Do you seriously believe safety regimes in industry would be rolled back without the workers having some say in the matter?

More project fear I am afraid. Rather like producing economic forecasts dating from Dec. in order to belittle GDP of the UK relative to the EU. Better to wait until the government releases the actual figures for 4th quarter growth (due on the 11th Feb). Comparing GDP growth of countries based on actual figures becomes a silly pastime when comparing it to UK estimates dreamed up by the Bank of England. After all the Bank Of England has previous form when it comes to producing hopelessly incorrect estimates.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: KarenH
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 07:57 AM

The US's desire for laws making it okay for companies to sue states is nothing new: I think this was a possibility within the EU. And of course they were lobbying the EU on similar terms, which was one argument I heard in favour of coming out.

What do we want with their stuff anyway? Odd bit of good music, what else is there? Spam like in the war? Suppose it might come to that though :(

Good bit on disaster capitalists hoping to cash in on post-Brexit bonfire of the health and safety and environmental regs in the Grauniad:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/feb/07/disaster-capitalists-no-deal-brexit-environment

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 07:28 AM

It's not exactly a secret, we've known for a long time what the intentions of the Trump-led US government are with regard to a trade agreement with the Brexited, exposed and, in comparative terms, considerably weaker UK. And, of course, they will have us firmly by the testicles.

And still, the Brexshiteers blunder on towards the brink...the extent of their idiocy is breathtaking.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 07:02 AM

It is remarkably well aligned with what Raab, Patel and others argued in favour of in Britannia Unchained, so there is no need to delude ourselves that no UK government would agree.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 06:51 AM

So much for 'Taking back control'!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 06:45 AM

Reported on Guardian live:
Donald Trump is being urged to play hardball with the UK when it negotiates a trade deal with the US after leaving the EU, Huffington Post reports.

It says the US Department of Trade asked industry what the president should extract from post-Brexit Britain and the answers from lobbyists for big firms included:

* Changing how NHS chiefs buy drugs to suit big US pharmaceutical companies

* Britain scrapping its safety-first approach to safety and food standards.

* Law changes that would allow foreign companies to sue the British state.

* Removing protections for traditional British products.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 06:31 AM

Would that also have applied to John Wayne?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 06:18 AM

I find it impossible to have any respect for a man who lacks the spine to admit he's bald.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 05:31 AM

"Thanks for the link, Monique."
Ditto
One of the things Britain has totally failed to grasp is that it is their choice and their problem so pointing fingers and blaming everybody else for the ongoing mess is cowardly and stupid
This crass decision has impacted on so many other people who are forced to clean up after the mess that is Brexit and still May is demanding that they compromise to accommodate her - how insane can this get before somebody pulls the plug?
Britain is now an international laughing-stock alongside Comb-over Trump
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 04:25 AM

Donald Tusk tells Theresa May that Jeremy Corbyn plan could end Brexit deadlock

What is the betting that May will not go for any part of Corbyn's plan and it will still be his fault?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 04:18 AM

Thanks for the link, Monique.

Out of interest, I think you are in France aren't you? If so, what is the general French view of Brexit?

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Monique
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 03:44 AM

Link

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 03:30 AM

I was trying to post the link to that piece earlier, Dave, but I couldn't get it to work. Tom Peck says precisely what I was thinking when I saw that interview yesterday - the dead eyes, the grimacing mouth...the lights were on, but there was no-one home.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 08 Feb 19 - 03:26 AM

Just got it Jim - :-D

Lovely quote posted by a friend on Facebook (Thanks Maureen)

"“I’m going to deliver it on time,” she carried on. “That’s what I’m going to do for the British public.” It is scarcely worth repeating that half the country doesn’t want it delivered on time. They don’t want it delivered at all. At some point, in the near and far too late future, it’s possible she’ll work out she should never have pretended to be Winston Churchill, charged with some sacred mission to deliver Britain to its promised land. The promised land will be terrible. She knows it, and not only can she not say it, she can’t extend her emotional range to acknowledge that she is dragging at least half her country kicking and screaming towards it."
-Tom Peck in today's Independent

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 19 - 02:20 PM

******* Becket..... !!!
See one of his plays and your glad he got stabbed in the cathedral
She's wasted on Castle though !!!
Jim

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 07 Feb 19 - 01:22 PM

Happy days are here again?
Perhaps.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 19 - 01:16 PM

HAPPY DAYS are HERE AGAIN - DEFINITELY NOT
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 19 - 01:09 PM

Bank of England have said that Britain is facing the slowest rise in the economy for over a decade thanks to Brexit
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 07 Feb 19 - 11:55 AM

More good news from the IMF.
"I'm no great follower of the economic predictions which the IMF is prone to make, but when it is downgrading so many EU economies (especially Germany and France) and forecasting that the UK is likely to enjoy the best economic growth – despite Brexit – we should listen."

http://www.cityam.com/272046/despite-apocalyptic-brexit-warnings-good-news-keeps-coming

Here comes the gold. Perhaps frankincense and myrrh come after the 29th March when we kick the wise(?) men of Brussels into touch.

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 07 Feb 19 - 11:08 AM

Dissent in the Labour ranks. Brought by the illustrious Guido(of course)

https://order-order.com/2019/02/07/leslie-tells-corbyn-pick-phone-maduro/

You would think they would concentrate on Brexit,but with corbyn at the helm perhaps not!

Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 07 Feb 19 - 10:43 AM

"You people are weird."
I find people who make statements and refuse to reply to responses even weirder - sort of "none so deaf...." if you know what I mean
I didn't bring divorce into anything I used it as an example of how people are prone to changing their minds when the consequences become clear to them - not catered for in the UK
You ignore, your compatriot Nigel does a runner
He who refusees to fight, but runs away
Lives to run another day - as they say
Jim Carroll