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BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?

Dave the Gnome 14 Jun 19 - 04:39 AM
Backwoodsman 14 Jun 19 - 03:23 AM
Steve Shaw 13 Jun 19 - 05:59 PM
Steve Shaw 13 Jun 19 - 11:48 AM
Raggytash 13 Jun 19 - 11:02 AM
Dave the Gnome 13 Jun 19 - 11:00 AM
Nigel Parsons 13 Jun 19 - 10:45 AM
Raggytash 13 Jun 19 - 10:36 AM
MikeL2 13 Jun 19 - 10:29 AM
Nigel Parsons 13 Jun 19 - 10:28 AM
Steve Shaw 13 Jun 19 - 10:03 AM
Steve Shaw 13 Jun 19 - 08:57 AM
Backwoodsman 13 Jun 19 - 06:57 AM
Raggytash 13 Jun 19 - 06:24 AM
Nigel Parsons 13 Jun 19 - 05:52 AM
Iains 13 Jun 19 - 05:22 AM
Steve Shaw 13 Jun 19 - 04:39 AM
Iains 13 Jun 19 - 04:35 AM
DMcG 13 Jun 19 - 04:15 AM
SPB-Cooperator 13 Jun 19 - 04:07 AM
DMcG 13 Jun 19 - 02:15 AM
The Sandman 13 Jun 19 - 12:30 AM
SPB-Cooperator 12 Jun 19 - 05:05 PM
Raggytash 12 Jun 19 - 03:44 PM
Dave the Gnome 12 Jun 19 - 03:22 PM
Iains 12 Jun 19 - 02:24 PM
DMcG 12 Jun 19 - 12:54 PM
Iains 12 Jun 19 - 12:02 PM
Raggytash 12 Jun 19 - 10:16 AM
Iains 12 Jun 19 - 09:29 AM
DMcG 12 Jun 19 - 02:14 AM
SPB-Cooperator 11 Jun 19 - 11:17 PM
Dave the Gnome 11 Jun 19 - 12:19 PM
SPB-Cooperator 11 Jun 19 - 11:37 AM
Raggytash 11 Jun 19 - 11:04 AM
Backwoodsman 11 Jun 19 - 11:00 AM
Jim Carroll 11 Jun 19 - 10:56 AM
Iains 11 Jun 19 - 10:40 AM
Raggytash 11 Jun 19 - 08:10 AM
Iains 11 Jun 19 - 08:01 AM
Dave the Gnome 11 Jun 19 - 06:51 AM
Backwoodsman 11 Jun 19 - 06:50 AM
Raggytash 11 Jun 19 - 06:45 AM
Iains 11 Jun 19 - 06:24 AM
Steve Shaw 11 Jun 19 - 05:24 AM
Dave the Gnome 11 Jun 19 - 04:50 AM
Backwoodsman 11 Jun 19 - 02:08 AM
Iains 10 Jun 19 - 04:52 AM
Backwoodsman 09 Jun 19 - 03:27 PM
Dave the Gnome 09 Jun 19 - 02:46 PM
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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 14 Jun 19 - 04:39 AM

It's gone viral, Steve. If anyone wants to see it just do a search for "Francesca Martinez Question Time" and you will find it all over the place. Magnificent indeed.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 14 Jun 19 - 03:23 AM

What a woman! Magnificent!


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 05:59 PM

Totally brilliant and heartrending contribution at the beginning of Question Time from Francesca Martinez. If you missed it catch it on the repeat or iPlayer. If you still vote Tory after hearing it, you deserve to hang your head in shame.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 11:48 AM

From dictionary.com:
pan-European:

"adjective:
of or relating to all or most of the countries of Europe."


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 11:02 AM

No not really Nigel.

Have you heard or read of any positive forecasts for the UK economy post Brexit for instance.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 11:00 AM

Again, everyone understands what was meant Nigel. Is there any news that says brexit will benefit the economy? Benefit the peace in Northern Ireland? Benefit the ordinary people of the UK as opposed to the Rees-Moggs and Rupert Murdochs of the world? Benefit the scientific research world? Benefit pan-European and world security? Benefit anything at all?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 10:45 AM

"Give us some good news . . ."
All being well it will happen by 31 October 2019.
Of course, you may not consider that good news!


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 10:36 AM

Nigel, the rest of us understood just what Steve was saying, why oh why do you have to be so pedantic.

Tell you what, give us some good news about Brexit.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: MikeL2
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 10:29 AM

hi

there are a number of comments saying that we were the only EU country

that was not occupied in WW2.

The Channel Islands were occupied for most of the war.

I have been to the Channel Islands and have seen many examples of occupation. The underground hospital is probably the best example.

Cheers

MikeL2


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 10:28 AM

The last pan-European war led to the murder of six million Jews by fascists. Remember?
"pan-European"= across the whole of Europe.
I thought Steve Shaw had just accepted that not all of Europe was at war, nor even 'occupied'.

It seems he's back to Humpty-Dumpty use of English.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 10:03 AM

The dissolution of the EU would make war in Europe far more likely. The EU insists on democracy in its member states. Without the EU it is likely that some countries would retreat from democracy. We live in times in which the far right is in ascendancy. Democracies rarely fight each other in wars. The last pan-European war led to the murder of six million Jews by fascists. Remember?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 08:57 AM

That was a careless error on my part. I could have said one of the very few countries now in the EU not to have endured a fascist regime in the 20th century. Switzerland isn't an EU country, by the way. The point stands, however.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 06:57 AM

Adopting the very finest Nitpicking-Nigs tradition, I’d just mention that neither Iceland nor Switzerland are EU Member-States.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 06:24 AM

Ireland....................... Neutral in WW11
Iceland.......................      Ditto
Portugal......................      Ditto
Spain.........................      Ditto **
Sweden........................      Ditto
Switzerland...................      Ditto


** Franco did send just one "Blue" Division to fight one the Eastern Front


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 05:52 AM

That's an excellent point. We are the only EU country that didn't endure Nazi occupation.
For starters there's:
Ireland
Iceland
Portugal
Spain
Sweden
Switzerland,

Also any countries which were Allies of Germany wouldn't have "endured Nazi occupation".


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 05:22 AM

"The trouble is that the EU have been so good at creating cohesion that virtually everyone in the UK has forgotten what living in a fascist state means
Not quite true.
The Brexit party
Le Pen
Continual rioting in France including teargas released on May Day
Catalonia and banned MEP and Independence struggle.
I could go on!
A report rather out of date in view of the recent EU MEP elections.


https://www.ecfr.eu/publications/summary/crisis_cohesion_ten_year_review
and this has to be read with the Mandy Rice-davies view that "They would say that wouldn't they?"


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 04:39 AM

"The trouble is that the EU have been so good at creating cohesion that virtually everyone in the UK has forgotten what living in a fascist state means, and as mainland UK was never occupied in WW2 the noone here has experienced it for real, and bizarrely British people now would prefer to live in an insular, oppressive state, rather than the freedoms we enjoy through international cooperation."

That's an excellent point. We are the only EU country that didn't endure Nazi occupation. That helps to explain the difference between our insular national mindset (if there is such a thing) and that of the other EU members. I suppose they recall far more sharply than we do why the Common Market was founded in the first place. Neither my children nor I have ever been called up to fight in a European war. One of the many good reasons for being a member of the EU is to keep that threat at bay. And were there to be no no EU it would be a real threat, what with the rise of far-right populism.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 04:35 AM

I think it very unlikely to go anything like this far, but in extremis it would be police demanding to see your papers whenever they wished
This already happens within the EU in some countries. From personal experience I know that it happens regularly in Spain and Ireland if driving a vehicle Most of the time it is to check the car is legally on the road, but in both countries a driving license must be carried while driving so it is not unusual to be asked to show it. Other road blocks in Ireland are more thorough,involving social welfare and revenue officers as wellas the Gardaí, but are not as common. The UK is very lucky that such roadblocks are extremely rare, but ANPR has much the same impact.
Whether such checks are a good or bad thing, or if they reduce criminality, is another discussion. The reality is that such checks already exist elsewhere within the EU and are not considered onerous.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 04:15 AM

Just to be clear - I am strongly opposed to such ID checks. It is simply that it is one way of overcoming the problems that some of the more right-wing will come up with.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 04:07 AM

Obligation to show papers/ID on the street would be a massive erosion of freedoms, almost going back to wartime/cold war Europe. Even countries that have retain obligations to carry id rarely enforce it these days, unlike 70s 80s Czechoslovakia where the brutal VB would arrest people for not carrying id and carry out frequent spot check to make sure people are complying

We indeed seem to be shifting towards far right politics, and if that happens, the impact on personal freedom would be far far worse that what leavers wrongly imaging that the EU impose on us.

Reading that farage whats to relax gun laws should be a serious warning of what may be to come in the future.

The trouble is that the EU have been so good at creating cohesion that virtually everyone in the UK has forgotten what living in a fascist state means, and as mainland UK was never occupied in WW2 the noone here has experienced it for real, and bizarrely British people now would prefer to live in an insular, oppressive state, rather than the freedoms we enjoy through international cooperation.

We should be worried about that and also the readiness of people to blame people from Europe for their oppression.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 02:15 AM

I am not so sure about the Common Travel Area exception. It did exist before the EU, certainly, but at the time the Republic did not have the free movement with France, etc etc: it had a hard border with Europe. As a member of the EU, that has changed. So now there is free movement into the Republic, there would be free movement via the CTA between the Republic and the North, and free movement between Northern Ireland and the rest of the UK.

This may happen, because Parliament doesn't seem to think at all about Ireland unless it is forced into it, but I think there is only one way of avoiding it while still having a CTA: much more frequent ID checks of all UK citizens as they go about their daily business to find people who have got in by some means. I think it very unlikely to go anything like this far, but in extremis it would be police demanding to see your papers whenever they wished. We have already gone a fair way down this road as it is, with identity needing to be proved when getting a job, or renting a flat, for example.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: The Sandman
Date: 13 Jun 19 - 12:30 AM

SPB The exception will be travel from uk to ireland, this is covered by the common travel arrangement which predates either country joining the common market, however the whole situation is a complete mess, what is need is either a general election or a second referendum


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 12 Jun 19 - 05:05 PM

The significance is that if we are forced to leave without a deal, for the next 10 years when we visit other states we can pretend to be ignorant and try to use the biometric microchip gates on the grounds that an EU passport should work in EU passport channels. If enough visitors do this, then hopefully passport officials will eventually get fed up and just give us free movement anyway.

A more important issue is that by virtue of being a national in an EU member state, we enjoy the same visa-free travel as the rest of the EU outside of the EU - for example ETA for visiting Canada. What has the FCO done so far to force the rest of the world to put in place identical passport arrangements for the UK on 1 November - just in case?? If Visas will be required in the future, what arrangements have the FCO made to ensure that the tax payer and not the individual foots the bill?   What arrangements have the FCA made in the event of reciprocal visaless travel ending to force the embassies and consular offices to have staff at every airport in the UK to process visas at less than an hour's notice, and for the FCA present to pay the visa fees?

Another issue - HM Customs have not yet confirmed that there will be no change to the rules regarding limits and duties of purchases made in EU states, or if there will be changes, the FCO putting in place measures for the tax payers rather than the individual to pay the additional duties.

What measures have the FCA put in place to force the EU to allow UK nationals to live/study/work in/retire to other EU states beyond the 90 day restrictions that applies to the rest of the world?

We are about to face the biggest degradation of our rights in living memory, and our useless government is prepared to just let it happen as if people don't matter?

Finally, why are UK nationals, if they fall in love with someone fro Europe, why leavers think they have the right to decide whether or not they can pursue heir relationships. If the Tories get away with the minimum wage cap, then surely we should be deporting all UK nationals who fail to meet the same earning level. In my book having different rules for different people is racist.

I could go on for hours about further losses of rights, but I will leave it at this. I hope all the above is in line with the original purpose of this thread.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 12 Jun 19 - 03:44 PM

Ye gods and little fishes ....... sorry guys I know this is not strictly Brexit but one of the Tory hopefuls as leader of the party, and therefore the government, who have to sort out the complete shambles left by May is alleged to have claimed £8,750 in expenses for a personal photographer.

WHAT!!!

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jun/12/esther-mcvey-expensed-thousands-of-pounds-for-personal-photographer


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Jun 19 - 03:22 PM

I guess all the tricks that May tried to bypass governmental procedures has been forgotten by the Mayflies.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 12 Jun 19 - 02:24 PM

Not so. Parliament must be accountable to the electorate. For a rabble to seize control with the connivance of the speaker leads to zero accountability. There lies the way to the socialist paradise, National Socialism, a totalitarian state! It can onlybe described as reckless behaviour
" The Commons is not itself able to govern. Governing requires coherence    in    responding    to    events    and    circumstances    nationally    and internationally. Therefore, for so long as the Commons is unwilling to withdraw its confidence, Her Majesty’s ministers can and should insist on their responsibility to govern. Legislation designed to usurp the Government’s functions should be blocked, in the first instance by relying on the House’s own procedures. If the Speaker were to subvert the normal rules, as he has, the Government might   legitimately   prorogue   Parliament,   ending   a   session   of   Parliament prematurely to prevent a Bill from being passed by both Houses.


https://policyexchange.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/Endangering-Constitutional-Government.pdf


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 12 Jun 19 - 12:54 PM

trying to wrest control of Parliament with no accountability

It is possible to argue that the attempt was wise, or unwise. It is possible to argue that the attempt was desirable or not. It is possible to argue that it was a good use of an opposition day or not.

Just about the only thing it is not possible to argue was that it was not accountable. The opposition had to account for the reasons they wanted to do this, and Parliament held them to account and found them wanting. But is was 100% held to account for its proposal.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 12 Jun 19 - 12:02 PM

The cross party motion failed. The government has won and rightly so.
A Lawful opposition is one thing,trying to wrest control of Parliament with no accountability smacks of sedition.
Perhaps this should be tested in the courts- it has far more substance than numbers on the side of a bus.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 12 Jun 19 - 10:16 AM

Possibly his most coherent post to date.

Back to Brexit. A cross party motion aims to give PM the opportunity to block a no-deal exit from the EU.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 12 Jun 19 - 09:29 AM

There are many nasty things found in Irish bogs. One, that is yet another import, is the Canadian Pitcher Plant.
First the victim is lured to the rim of the pitchers by attractive meaty-coloured patterns, and by tempting droplets of nectar. When the victim aarives, it soon loses its footing on the slippery ridges around the throat of the pitcher, helped by hairs which point downward preventing its escape. Victims drown in a watery grave containing digestive juices and detergents for penetrating the microscopic breathing holes along the sides of an insect's body.

The plant increases its chances of making a successful catch by spicing its nectar with intoxicating narcotic, so that the victims roll around in a drunken stupor. The walls of the pitcher are lined with slippery cells, and with no foothold to grab onto, the prisoner slowly falls into the watery depths of the pitcher.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: DMcG
Date: 12 Jun 19 - 02:14 AM

It was very pertinent, SPB. It is a good example of how we have managed to get some of the imagery Brexiteers want, but none of the substance.

The value of a passport is entirely in how other countries treat it (plus some in-country ID purposes.) To that end, it matters not a jot whether the cover says European, United Kingdom, Rivendell or The Land of the Orange Ogres(*). Do other countries - France, Germany US, Argentina, Thailand and the hundred or so others - recognise it as valid? That is all that counts in the end. So changing the wording on the cover has the same real significance as changing the colour. A meaningless alteration to keep Brexiteers happier, but no change of any significance at all.


* A friend once lived in a rented property of that name. Any similarity to Trump is co-incidental.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 11:17 PM

Steve, I thought my last post about the pre-emptive actions of the passport office was pertinent to the thread subject.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 12:19 PM

Hello Jim. Good to see you back :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 11:37 AM

I have just spoken to the passport office and despite the fact we have not left the EU, they are already refusing to issue European Union Passports.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 11:04 AM

Editorial content my arse, sound bites of the lowest quality from a disreputable, right wing blogger, who had links to the BNP and described himself as a "right-wing pain in the butt" who, again in his own words, "sought to "smear Labour MPs and left-leaning lawyers and writers"

Strange bedfellows you keep.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 11:00 AM

Any good news about BrexShit?


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 10:56 AM

" same silly games as he who must not be mentioned?"
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/5173475/Guido-Fawkes-the-colourful-life-of-the-man-who-brought-down-Damian-McBride.html


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 10:40 AM

I guess I will have to grovel. I had it fixed in my mind you were using a nom de plume of Mr Robinson whom I have frequently been accused of supporting.

If we are going to disregard journalists because of drunk driving, bankruptcy and other failings and not gauge their worth by their editorial content, why hold politicians in such high esteem? Were you not one of those arguing they were mighty men like men of yore, much more qualified to make decisions than the little people. One quite happily admits to having used class One drugs, one has been booted out for perverting the course of justice,several are subject to possible recall procedures because of lying to their electorate and labour MPs have been accused of antisemitism. I would suggest their feet of clay are far more hydrated than those of Mr Guido.
Let us look at Mr Gove,a PM hopeful.
After the revelation that Gove was sniffing lines of cocaine whilst writing lines attacking middle-class cocaine use, rival campaigns are now trawling through Gove’s Times articles looking for interesting policy positions. One that was passed to Guido is particularly appealing and would likely go down a treat with a large segment of the Tory membership. “Bring back hanging”, a classic vote winner with Tory members if there ever was one!
or
Chucklebuttie having her kids educated in public schools, with
Diane Abbot, Emily Thornberry and Seumas Milne sending their children to selective state schools, while Angela Rayner blasted the Government’s plans for a new model of grammar schools insisting they “do not improve social mobility” and are “not good for our education system”. Classic labour hypocrisy there I am afraid. Dachas for the elite, the gulags for the hoipolloi

Your outrage would appear most exceedingly selective,but then blinkers are a by product of wearing lefty rose tinted specs.
Too much gruniard addles the brain!

.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 08:10 AM

Easily done, From one of your posts dated 7th April.

"https://order-order.com/2019/04/05/corbyns-evidence-shows-cooking-books-terrorist-wreath-laying-trip/

from Guido of course. The scourge of bubbleheaded leftards!"

I don't expect an apology, people of your ilk never apologise.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 08:01 AM

And this from the man who frequently quotes the ex bankrupt, four times convicted Paul Staines

I look forward to seeing you supply the evidence for the above. Are you trying to play the same silly games as he who must not be mentioned?
Just one quote will suffice. Failing that an apology will fit the bill nicely.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 06:51 AM

Financially, ex bankrupt. Morally, still so.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 06:50 AM

Brexit a shambles? "Look over there - Labour anti-semitism!".

Brexit Party beaten in the Peterborough By-Election? "Look over there, Labour vote-rigging!".

Is that really the best they, or their delusional, red-faced-Gammon supporters can do?

Pathetic.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Raggytash
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 06:45 AM

"so predictable and so shabby. Yup. look at Labour in Peterborough having a criminal convicted of electoral fraud helping in the last couple of elections,with the postal votes concentrated in one ward. Political correctness and accusations of waycism are inhibiting the clean up of these Augean stables."

And this from the man who frequently quotes the ex bankrupt, four times convicted Paul Staines.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 06:24 AM

so predictable and so shabby
Yup. look at Labour in Peterborough having a criminal convicted of electoral fraud helping in the last couple of elections,with the postal votes concentrated in one ward. Political correctness and accusations of waycism are inhibiting the clean up of these Augean stables.

“For the Parliamentary by-election held on 6 June 2019 there were 13,682 postal votes issued”, an official announcement from Peterborough’s returning officer began. “9,898 of these were returned of which 400 were rejected due to either the signature or date of birth (or both) not matching our records.”
The number of votes cast at the various polling stations across the City was 24,500. Overall, the total number of verified ballot papers (including the almost 10,000 postal votes that made their way to the count room) was 33,998.

This means that of the votes counted that led to the win of Labour’s anti-semitic candidate Lisa Forbes, a whopping 29% were postal votes – a method of voting renowned for the way in which it is easily manipulated by election-riggers like Tariq Mahmood and his murky associates.

The jaw-dropping figure also equates to a staggering 69.6% valid return rate of all postal votes sent out.
But that wasn’t the only shock in store for Peterborians and citizens across the country, as the council’s statement also unwittingly exposed the equally damning results of the 2017 snap election, which saw incumbent Tory Brexiteer Stewart Jackson lose his seat to criminal Fiona Onasanya by under 700 votes.

“In the 2017 Parliamentary election for the Peterborough constituency there were 14,293 postal votes issued” the announcement continued. “11,930 of these were returned of which 379 were rejected due to either the signature or date of birth (or both) not matching our records. This equates to 81% valid return rate”,

During both elections – for Labour’s Onasanya and Labour’s Lisa Forbes – close friend of Peterborough Labour leader Shaz Nawaz, convicted vote-rigger Tariq Mahmood, was hired to play a key role in the election campaign team and on both occasions, despite his fondness for destroying democracy, was given exclusive access to the election count room.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 05:24 AM

Well, to drag matters back from opportunistic and sour-grapist attacks on "Labour's antisemitism," so predictable and so shabby, there's a piece in today's Guardian ("EU view of Tory leadership candidates deeply critical, say sources") that should burst the over-optimistic and hubristic bubble in which the leading candidates appear to exist. Johnson, Raab and Hunt are all, in turn, excoriated and shrugged at. If they really think that the EU is in any shape or form going to reopen negotiations on "the deal" then they are sadly deluded. No matter who wins the poisoned chalice they will simply be Theresa May Mk II as far as the EU is concerned. Not only that, there will still be no parliamentary majority for the Tories and no majority for anything remotely like anything that's been on the table so far, certainly not for no-deal. I note that talk of the 39 billion is in the offing again. Just think about the reaction of our biggest trading partner if we crash out and refuse to pay our dues...

The Tory leadership bid is just as amazingly unreal as the whole bloody brexit shambles. One noticeable thing from the Guardian piece, however, is that Gove doesn't figure in it. In spite of his obnoxiously-patronising attitude and his sheer hypocrisy over his drug-taking (about which, frankly, I give not a shit, even though I've never taken an illicit substance in my life), I have a funny feeling that he'd be the least bad of a bloody awful bunch...


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 04:50 AM

You could point out that all the facts are substantiated by a report from the media reform coilition, John, but that would encourage him to greater heights of nonsensical invective. Far better just to leave it to the moderation team. Nowt to do with brexit so quite rightly destined for the bin.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 11 Jun 19 - 02:08 AM

A letter here, from a number of eminent individuals with intellects immensely superior to that of our Resident Right-Wing Extremist, and minds considerably more open than his, expressing concern about biased reporting of alleged ‘anti-semitism’ in the LP, and Jeremy Corbyn in particular.


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Iains
Date: 10 Jun 19 - 04:52 AM

There is a major distinction to be made between signing a petition
1)to rerun a perfectly legal referendum because you cannot accept the majority vote
2)to investigate potential electoral fraud, in an area where previous criminal activity has been associated with voting irregularities.

If you think both petitions are the same further discussion with you is pointless, because you obviously lack the knowledge to be able to differentiate between a potential crime and   a refusal to accept a democratic vote. Your recent contributions are merely intended to provoke instead of addressing the issues.
Your Peterborough Labour MP has now been castigated by 6 Labour MPs for her antisemitic stance and yet Corbyn refuses to act. Do you not think that is a matter for concern, especially in the light of a recently initiated formal investigation into antisemitism within the Labour Party? Your attempts here to trivialise and mock their nvestigation will have zero impact on its outcome.

https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/en/our-work/news/investigation-opened-labour-party-following-complaints-about-antisemitism


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 09 Jun 19 - 03:27 PM

I know, Dave - Mea Culpa, Mea Culpa, Mea Maxima Culpa! ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Brexit #3: A futile gesture?
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 09 Jun 19 - 02:46 PM

Why are you still addressing the twonk, John?


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Mudcat time: 19 October 9:17 AM EDT

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