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BS: Post Brexit life in the UK

Steve Shaw 18 Feb 18 - 05:19 PM
Iains 18 Feb 18 - 04:57 PM
Steve Shaw 18 Feb 18 - 10:24 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Feb 18 - 10:01 AM
Dave the Gnome 18 Feb 18 - 09:34 AM
DMcG 18 Feb 18 - 08:24 AM
Steve Shaw 18 Feb 18 - 08:22 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Feb 18 - 08:16 AM
Raggytash 18 Feb 18 - 08:05 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Feb 18 - 07:55 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Feb 18 - 07:52 AM
Iains 18 Feb 18 - 07:45 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Feb 18 - 07:40 AM
Dave the Gnome 18 Feb 18 - 07:15 AM
Raggytash 18 Feb 18 - 06:55 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Feb 18 - 06:40 AM
Raggytash 18 Feb 18 - 06:31 AM
Keith A of Hertford 18 Feb 18 - 06:17 AM
Jim Carroll 18 Feb 18 - 04:41 AM
Raggytash 18 Feb 18 - 04:17 AM
DMcG 18 Feb 18 - 04:17 AM
Iains 18 Feb 18 - 04:13 AM
Iains 18 Feb 18 - 03:37 AM
Steve Shaw 17 Feb 18 - 05:32 PM
Iains 17 Feb 18 - 02:58 PM
DMcG 17 Feb 18 - 02:08 PM
Jim Carroll 17 Feb 18 - 01:52 PM
Iains 17 Feb 18 - 01:27 PM
Jim Carroll 17 Feb 18 - 11:56 AM
Iains 17 Feb 18 - 11:48 AM
Jim Carroll 17 Feb 18 - 11:14 AM
Iains 17 Feb 18 - 10:58 AM
Iains 17 Feb 18 - 10:42 AM
Steve Shaw 16 Feb 18 - 08:17 PM
Nigel Parsons 16 Feb 18 - 07:37 PM
Iains 16 Feb 18 - 04:59 PM
Steve Shaw 16 Feb 18 - 04:30 PM
DMcG 16 Feb 18 - 04:06 PM
Raggytash 16 Feb 18 - 03:40 PM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Feb 18 - 12:48 PM
Nigel Parsons 16 Feb 18 - 10:54 AM
Dave the Gnome 16 Feb 18 - 10:47 AM
Iains 16 Feb 18 - 10:30 AM
Jim Carroll 16 Feb 18 - 10:13 AM
Iains 16 Feb 18 - 10:07 AM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Feb 18 - 09:40 AM
Keith A of Hertford 16 Feb 18 - 09:34 AM
Nigel Parsons 16 Feb 18 - 08:43 AM
Steve Shaw 16 Feb 18 - 08:30 AM
Steve Shaw 16 Feb 18 - 08:26 AM
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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 05:19 PM

No legs. No commie. No court action. Daily Express doing what the Daily Express does. I know you can't see it, poor you. Over two-thirds of Labour voters voted remain. Nine in ten Labour members voted remain. You do heartlands, I do age-related demography, you get predictably nasty. I shrug. You haven't got a clue...


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Iains
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 04:57 PM

So to cut to the quick in among the verbiage above. The official labour party position is Brexit full steam ahead. In a nutshell the rowdy members have no control over the direction the party is going.
As I have pointed out before the labour heartlands voted heartily for brexit. This sticks in the craw of the middle class labour party members, whose conceit dictates that they should determine the agenda.
Your party has a problem with the membership, the leader and a huge disconect with the labour heartlands.
   you had better not hope for an early election, you would preside over a massacre.
Meanwhile, about that Czech Mate. No threats of any court action yet?
No legs to it? I suspect more legs than a millipede!


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 10:24 AM

Here's a snippet from an email sent to Labour Party members today. Note the complete lack of any reference to brexit.

The Tories have no plan and are failing Britain - with a housing crisis; underinvestment in our children's education; a failing economy; and an NHS pushed into a state of emergency.

Here's my question for PMQs week...

[box provided for typing my question]

Each Wednesday, Jeremy Corbyn will put questions to Theresa May. Let us know what question you'd like him to ask this week...




Here's an extract from a piece in today's Oberver, outlining the pressure from various sources to make Labour change direction on brexit.

Corbyn under pressure to shift Brexit stance

(Michael Savage. Policy editor)

Jeremy Corbyn has come under intense pressure to shift Labour's position on Brexit after 20,000 members demanded a say over the issue and former leader Neil Kinnock backed halting Britain's EU exit altogether.

It is understood that the Labour leader will also be confronted by some in his shadow cabinet this week who want him to back remaining in the single market and customs union.

Speaking to the Observer, Kinnock said he had been angered by claims from Boris Johnson, the foreign secretary, that the NHS should benefit from the money saved by leaving the European Union. He said the reality was that "we should stop Brexit to save the NHS" or at the very least "mitigate the damage" by staying within the single market.
"Even contempt for 'experts' cannot obscure the evidence that the Johnson-led Brexit vote has already damaged and will inflict future harm on the NHS," Kinnock said. Meanwhile "vitally - Brexit has already diminished, and will continue to depress, the revenues on which the NHS depends.

"If Johnson really wanted the extra NHS spending, which is sorely needed, he wouldn't be using the issue as a ploy to feed his lust for the Tory leadership but would be working to end Brexit.

"The truth is that we can either take the increasingly plain risks and costs of leaving the EU or have the stability, growth and revenues vital for crucial public services like the NHS and social care. Recognising that, we should stop Brexit to save the NHS, or, at very least, mitigate the damage by seeking European Economic Area membership."

Labour is currently backing a "jobs first" Brexit, but what this would mean in practice has remained vague. The party was sharply criticised when it emerged that none of the eight policy commissions it has set up since the elections focuses on Brexit.

The pressure on Labour's leadership comes as a second major donor pledged a six-figure sum to fund a campaign to stop Brexit and warned that he would "not be silenced." Stephen Peel, an Olympic rower and former Tory donor, said he had not been put off by attacks aimed at George Soros, the billionaire financier who faced a backlash from Brexiters after giving 400,000 pounds to a new anti-Brexit campaign.

He told the Observer he was giving 100,000 pounds to Best for Britain, which is organising a grassroots anti-Brexit campaign...

...He added: "We have heard the strident calls from those against us to try and close down debate and silence discussion over the disaster that Brexit appears to be. I for one, will not be silenced and will do all I can to support groups such as Best for Britain who seek to engage people across the country and make the case for Britain to lead, not leave Europe.

"The key task is to empower the people of Britain, provide clear information on Brexit, and encourage them to make their views known to their representatives in parliament."


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 10:01 AM

Jim,
This is THE D.U.P'S POSITION IN FULL SFA about excluding Ulster Irish

They are happy for the Act to recognise the Irish language, but ask for parity for their culture.
What is wrong with that?
Sinn Fein are adamant that only their language can be recognised?
Why are they so hostile to the majority culture?
Why are you?

DMcG, the publication was irrelevant because the facts were as stated, and can be found anywhere as I showed. The Irish Times gave the same facts.

And that means it is for the parties concerned to find a set of phrases or approaches that gives them a way forward. One act, three acts - I don't care.

I agree, and so does DUP. They want recognition in the Act or in a separate Act. Sinn Fein refuses to accept that.

Dave,
Leaving the EU will affect many more things than just European issues.

It will not effect policy on refugees or asylum seekers.


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 09:34 AM

Membership of the EU has no effect on peoples attitudes but the vote to leave increased the incidence of race hate crimes. Leaving the EU will affect many more things than just European issues.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: DMcG
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 08:24 AM

DMcG, the publication was irrelevant because ...

Do you challenge any of that?

Yes, I challenge the claim the publication is irrelevant. Had you said 'The Northwich Guardian reported...', or 'The DUP said ... according this report' I would not have raised the point. But claiming 'The Guardian' said it is misleading. Someone might decide to quote you later and think the national newspaper said "Sinn Fein wants a standalone piece of legislation to protect speakers 'an Irish Language Act' but the DUP has long insisted it would only countenance new laws if they also incorporate other cultures, such as Ulster Scots", which they did not do (or at least, that link does not demonstrate they did).


I challenge it for the same reason I might challenge a claim that Jim said something when it was Steve or even Iains: because it is misleading, whether accidentally or intentionally. This whole topic is complex enough without misleading people.


Which view is closest to yours DMcG?

As I said before, I don't think it is about language at all. It is about peoples' sense of identity, on both sides of the debate. And that means it is for the parties concerned to find a set of phrases or approaches that gives them a way forward. One act, three acts - I don't care. What I care about is them finding a way through, and I am happy with anything they agree.


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 08:22 AM

"Is it Czech Mate for commie corbyn?"

The story has no legs and won't gain any. Your link is to the ravings of a far-right long-time nutter in a far-right "news"paper. I suppose we shouldn't be surprised that you associate yourself with such gutter-dwellers. You make excellent bedfellows.

One more thing. Jeremy has never been a "commie." He's a dyed-in-the-wool Labour man and always has been, rebellious bugger though he's been. He even admits to not having read much Marx. Me too! Sorry to pollute your postings with facts. One thing about him that does pee me off: so far he has failed to provided effective opposition to May on Brexit. I live in hope that, when things get really bad in the next few months, he will take the party out of the pro-brexit club and declare against the impending disaster. That's what the majority of Labour voters voted for in the referendum and it's what almost the whole party membership voted for. Get behind us, Jezza!


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 08:16 AM

Keith
You do not link your claim, indicating that, as usual it is partial and selective
This is THE D.U.P'S POSITION IN FULL SFA about excluding Ulster Irish
This is what the D.U.P. is about
The letter, a copy of which has been obtained by the BBC, says the party's manifesto makes it "absolutely clear" that the DUP "won't sign up to any deal that diminishes Northern Ireland as a part of the United Kingdom"
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Raggytash
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 08:05 AM

Tariffs on Wine.



The Facts


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 07:55 AM

Dave,
Us leaving the EU should have no effect upon these agreements.
That is the point I was making. The operative word is "should". No one really knows.


Membership of the EU HAS no effect on those agreements, so leaving it will make no difference.
Your suggestion is baseless. You have no case.


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 07:52 AM

Jim,
Irish Times, "The DUP wants a composite Act that also embraces Ulster Scots, while Sinn Fein is insistent on a stand-alone Irish language Act. "

The DUP's position is clearly inclusive while Sinn Fein's would appear sectarian and divisive.
Where do you stand?

Rag, There is no tarif on EU wine now, but there would be after Brexit without a trade agreement.
Wine from outside EU, Australia, Chile Argentina, S.Africa, California etc. is subject to a tarif now.

EU wine would become more expensive, but other wines would not.


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Iains
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 07:45 AM

Is it Czech Mate for commie corbyn?


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 07:40 AM

Give it a rest Keith - the first step has to be re-establishing a language that was beaten to death by colonisation
That last people to have a say in it were those who beat it to death in the fiirs place and continue to do so - the ruling Unionist establishment backed by the desperately clinging-on remnants of the Empire (who should have no say whatever)
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 07:15 AM

Us leaving the EU should have no effect upon these agreements.

That is the point I was making. The operative word is "should". No one really knows.

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Raggytash
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 06:55 AM

Interesting article on the BBC website today concerning the impact of Brexit on French wine growers. It particularly states:

"But their main preoccupation was exchange rates (which of course have already moved sharply to make euro exports to the UK more expensive). The fact there might also be a tariff on French wine had not really sunk in."

It is interesting to read they are fearful of tariffs being imposed when some on here would have us believe it could not possibly happen.

French Wine


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 06:40 AM

Also from WIKI,
" The Northern Ireland Department of Culture, Arts and Leisure considers Ulster Scots to be "the local variety of the Scots language."[42] "

"Ulster Scots is defined in an Agreement between the Government of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the Government of Ireland establishing implementation bodies done at Dublin on the 8th day of March 1999 in the following terms:
"Ullans" is to be understood as the variety of the Scots language traditionally found in parts of Northern Ireland and Donegal."

"The North/South Co-operation (Implementation Bodies) Northern Ireland Order 1999,[44] which gave effect to the implementation bodies incorporated the text of the agreement in its Schedule 1.
The declaration made by the United Kingdom Government regarding the European Charter for Regional or Minority Languages reads as follows:[45]
The United Kingdom declares, in accordance with Article 2, paragraph 1 of the Charter that it recognises that Scots and Ulster Scots meet the Charter's definition of a regional or minority language for the purposes of Part II of the Charter."

"The legislative remit laid down for the agency by the North/South Co-operation (Implementation Bodies) Northern Ireland Order 1999 is: "the promotion of greater awareness and the use of Ullans and of Ulster-Scots cultural issues, both within Northern Ireland and throughout the island".
The agency has adopted a mission statement: to promote the study, conservation, development and use of Ulster Scots as a living language; to encourage and develop the full range of its attendant culture; and to promote an understanding of the history of the Ulster-Scots people."

Irish Times,
"The DUP wants a composite Act that also embraces Ulster Scots, while Sinn F?in is insistent on a stand-alone Irish language Act. "

I am with DUP on this one. Their view is in line with the Good Friday Agreement.
I think Sinn Fein's position is sectarian and divisive.
How about you Rag?


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Raggytash
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 06:31 AM

From Wiki:

"Some definitions of Ulster Scots may also include Standard English spoken with an Ulster Scots accent"


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 06:17 AM

DMcG, the publication was irrelevant because what I posted was not editorial opinion but direct quotes of Kearney and Robinson giving the positions of their respective parties, Sinn Fein and the DUP.

Do you challenge any of that?
If not you accept the FACT that DUP is demanding equal recognition for both cultures, in line with the spirit and letter of the GFA, while Sinn Fein wants recognition only for their culture.

Here is Kearney (Sinn Fein) quoted by Jim's Irish Times.
"There must be a free-standing acht na Gaeilge, Irish language act. It is essential to ensure that we see the re-establishment of the political institutions. It is absolutely pivotal to the rights and equality agenda here in the north of Ireland."

Now Robinson (DUP) from the same Irish Times article.
"Earlier, former DUP leader and First Minister Peter Robinson supported the DUP argument that any agreement in relation to Irish must involve a composite act that also embraced Ulster Scots.
"There is no credibility in asserting your need to have your culture respected if you blatantly disrespect that of others," Mr Robinson posted on Facebook."
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/sinn-f?in-and-dup-remain-deadlocked-as-time-for-deal-narrows-1.3135466

Another Irish Times article,
"The DUP wants a composite Act that also embraces Ulster Scots, while Sinn F?in is insistent on a stand-alone Irish language Act. "
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/british-and-irish-sources-reject-sinn-f?in-s-stormont-demands-1.3139593

Which view is closest to yours DMcG? Jim?


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 04:41 AM

Professor Anthony Glees "EXPERT on TERROR"
You can't blame the Tories - their ongoing incompetence has made an election inevitable - crap like this are only the first shots
You ain't seen nuffin' yet!
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Raggytash
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 04:17 AM

The media campaign against Corbyn has been relentless since he was elected. This is yet another example.


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: DMcG
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 04:17 AM

Still nothing to do with Brexit, though, is it?


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Iains
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 04:13 AM

The story is growing legs.


https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/920394/jeremy-corbyn-spy-links-czechoslovakia-espionage-select-committee-investigation-p

I wonder which story has most substance? Labour spying, or Russian election shenanigans in the US?
I cannot wait to see how this develops. 13 Russians take on the might of the FBI, CIA,NSA and a alphabet soup of other agencies and perform their dastardly deed to swing the Presidential election? Yeah, Right????


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Iains
Date: 18 Feb 18 - 03:37 AM

Stop insulting me, I stop retaliating. SIMPLES!
Shaw your unwarranted post is simply trolling. You and your fellow mudrats are constantly accusing me of being drunk, insecure and a host of other insults to try to give more authority to your ramblings.

             physician, heal thyself.


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 17 Feb 18 - 05:32 PM

By a very long chalk, Iains, you are the most gratuitously insulting person on this board that we've seen here for years. The fact that you can accuse anyone else of being insulting, in the light of your own own dismal record, speaks volumes about your unstable mental state. You are clearly not normal. You seriously need to take stock, preferably by taking time out.


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Iains
Date: 17 Feb 18 - 02:58 PM

My only problem is with your gratuitous insults. They are compromising two threads at the moment and several contributors have commented on your abysmal behaviour. You are not very good at taking advice are you?


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: DMcG
Date: 17 Feb 18 - 02:08 PM

you like this idea of relaxation of standards or you may not. But is it what Leavers voted for?

(By the way, I do have a speech impediment.)


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 Feb 18 - 01:52 PM

"I.m glad "
It seems we both have typo problems
Do tyou have problems with people with speech impediments - would fit in with your ageism and racism
Hope it isn't in the genes
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Iains
Date: 17 Feb 18 - 01:27 PM

I.m glad you agree with me about gibbering. does your speech have as many impediments as your attempted spelling? try less lemon!


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 Feb 18 - 11:56 AM

"I see our sour little scouser is still biting on lemons as he gibbers away!"
Yep - still at a loss for an answer - try therapy
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Iains
Date: 17 Feb 18 - 11:48 AM

Speakeing for the wrld again Iains?

I see our sour little scouser is still biting on lemons as he gibbers away! Tell me, are your random keystrokes part of a contest between yourself and a monkey? To see who can type something sensible first?


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 17 Feb 18 - 11:14 AM

"No one wants to listen to you!"
Speakeing for the wrld again Iains?
Little has changed in a DECADE and a HALF
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Iains
Date: 17 Feb 18 - 10:58 AM

https://www.euractiv.com/section/global-europe/news/under-new-eu-rules-refugees-face-asylum-rejection-if-they-leave-country-of-a


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Iains
Date: 17 Feb 18 - 10:42 AM

The vast majority of refugees make landfall in mainland europe. Their status and future treatment is determined by international law in whatever country they first landed. Their subsequent migration within Europe is strangely enough with the status of migrants.Different laws apply.
To spell this out to the slow of thought, the protocols apply as soon as the asylum seeker makes landfall in europe. Subsequent travel within Europe is either with permission to retain refugee status, or merely as migrants(economic?)


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 08:17 PM

Those protocols apply to refugees already in this country. What we are currently doing is striving as hard as we can to keep them out in the first place so that we won't have to apply the protocols. 0nly 20,000 in five years under the Tories, remember, Nigel and Iains? Who do you think you're trying to kid?


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 07:37 PM

Acceptance of refugees and asylum seekers will be unchanged.

"How can anyone possibly know that when no-one knows what the full effects of brexit will be yet?"

Because the UK is signed up to the The Protocol Relating to the Status of Refugees.This is a key treaty in international refugee law which entered into force on 4 October 1967. 146 countries are parties to the Protocol. The earlier 1951 United Nations Convention Relating to the Status of Refugees placed both temporal and geographic restrictions on refugees. Interestingly the US is a signatory to the earlier convention, but not the later Convention.

The principle of non-refoulement, which prohibits the return of a refugee to a territory where his or her life or freedom is threatened, is considered a rule of customary international law. As such it is binding an all States, regard-less of whether they have acceded to the 1951 Convention or 1967 Protocol.

A "migrant" is anyone who seeks to move overseas. A "refugee" does so in conditions where they have been forced from their homeland. And an "asylum seeker" is someone who says he or she is a refugee, but whose claim has not yet been definitively evaluated.


Thank you Iains. And for the benefit of those who cannot understand plain English.
The above agreements were entered into before the UK became part of the EU. Us leaving the EU should have no effect upon these agreements.


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Iains
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 04:59 PM

Acceptance of refugees and asylum seekers will be unchanged.

"How can anyone possibly know that when no-one knows what the full effects of brexit will be yet?"

Because the UK is signed up to the The Protocol Relating to the Status of Refugees.This is a key treaty in international refugee law which entered into force on 4 October 1967. 146 countries are parties to the Protocol. The earlier 1951 United Nations Convention Relating to the Status of Refugees placed both temporal and geographic restrictions on refugees. Interestingly the US is a signatory to the earlier convention, but not the later Convention.

The principle of non-refoulement, which prohibits the return of a refugee to a territory where his or her life or freedom is threatened, is considered a rule of customary international law. As such it is binding an all States, regard-less of whether they have acceded to the 1951 Convention or 1967 Protocol.

A "migrant" is anyone who seeks to move overseas. A "refugee" does so in conditions where they have been forced from their homeland. And an "asylum seeker" is someone who says he or she is a refugee, but whose claim has not yet been definitively evaluated.


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 04:30 PM

Thanks for making my point for me, Nigel.


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: DMcG
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 04:06 PM

Keith: when people refer to the "Guardian" they usually mean the national newspaper, not the provincial paper "The Northwich Guardian"


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Raggytash
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 03:40 PM

Jim ........... hoops, hoops and more hoops!!


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 12:48 PM

Dave,
Brexit only effects immigration. Acceptance of refugees and asylum seekers will be unchanged.

How can anyone possibly know that when no-one knows what the full effects of brexit will be yet?


Easy Dave. Immigration from EU is a Brexit issue.
Other immigrants, refugees and asylum seekers are irrelevant to the issue of EU membership.

Jim, your last rant was also irrelevant to anything discussed here.
Please be clear, do you agree with DUP that both cultures should be treated equally, or with Sinn Fein that nothing but the Irish language be recognised in law?

Guardian,
"Sinn Fein wants a standalone piece of legislation to protect speakers – an Irish Language Act – but the DUP has long insisted it would only countenance new laws if they also incorporate other cultures, such as Ulster Scots. "
http://www.northwichguardian.co.uk/families/national/15991612.Irish_language_debate_hinders_hopes_of_Stormont_powersharing_breakthrough/


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 10:54 AM

From: Steve Shaw - PM
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 08:26 AM

They come here, Dave, drivin' down us wages, stealing us daughters, cloggin' up us 'ealth service, mekkin' funny wailin' noises from them mosque wotsits...

...showin' us what real food is, fixin' plummin and lecturing c, runnin' cheap all-night taxis when us needs to get 'ome pissed, cleanin' us Premier Inns, pickin' us veg and daffs, wipin' us old folks' bums fer next ter nowt, lookin' after us sick, doctorin' us when us 'as funny turns...bugger...


And before that it was the Romans. And what did they ever do for us?


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 10:47 AM

You are confusing immigration with asylum.

I'm not confusing anything with anything. I am clarifying what was meant by "People with valuable skills will always be welcome".

Brexit only effects immigration. Acceptance of refugees and asylum seekers will be unchanged.

How can anyone possibly know that when no-one knows what the full effects of brexit will be yet?

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Iains
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 10:30 AM

"ruthlessly exploited in the past and left impoverished,"
Strange. I see nothing in the article below to support the statement. But never let the facts get in the way of a good story. After all we learned from Paul Joseph Goebbels that the sound bite is all important, never mind the truth.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/refugee-crisis-migrants-bangladesh-libya-italy-numbers-smuggling-dhaka-dubai-turk


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 10:13 AM

"Jim, your last rant was not relevant to anything discussed here."
Not a rant Keith - a fact
Irish history is stained with the blood of English interference
"but want the majority culture recognised equally."
Equality has been ignored, even suppressed for nearly a century - now, when an equilibrium is being reached all of a sudden it has become important to you people
Sinn Fein want nothing of the sort you eejit - they want a positive discrimination that will restore Irish back into the North after centuries of suppression
Do you sertiously believe that any party would attempt to remove a dominant language from the curriculum
Ulstre Scotch is a dialect rather than a language and that is established where people choose to use it
We are talking about an entirely different language that has been virtually driven out of existence by a foreign power
Mind your own business for crying out loud - howw many times have you told me I have no say in what happens in England because I no loner live there, even though I was born and spent well over half my life there?
You appear to have spent a few holidays here butt out ad learn your lesson
It's academic anyway - if the British Government go on the way they are doing, they will lose both England and Scotland
ou talk about "majorites - how about the fact that the sicx counties and Scotland vored against Brexit - are you going to give them the right to back out?
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Iains
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 10:07 AM

"People escaping from countries that we have either ruthlessly exploited in the past and left impoverished, people from countries that our foreign policy has completely screwed up, or both?"
Opinion masquerading as fact again.
Now for some facts:(you read it in the Guardian. You know it makes sense.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/dec/09/what-caused-the-refugee-crisis-google

Jimmy you are talking shit again. No one wants to listen to you!


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 09:40 AM

Jim, your last rant was not relevant to anything discussed here.
Whatever your view of DUP, they are happy for the Irish language to be recognised in law, but want the majority culture recognised equally.
Sinn Fein want Irish language only and nothing else is acceptable to them. Is that your view too?


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 09:34 AM

Dave,
What about refugees with nowhere else to go or those fleeing from regimes where death and torture are commonplace? Are you saying that the only people we should let in are those who can serve us well?

You are confusing immigration with asylum.
Brexit only effects immigration. Acceptance of refugees and asylum seekers will be unchanged.


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 08:43 AM

From: Steve Shaw
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 07:53 AM
You do realise that you are talking about real, live, vulnerable human beings, people the same as you and me but a damn sight less lucky, do you, Nigel? People escaping from countries that we have either ruthlessly exploited in the past and left impoverished, people from countries that our foreign policy has completely screwed up, or both?


Yes, I do understand what refugees are.
I don't agree that this all stems from our foreign policy. Whether all refugees are from ex-British colonies, whether it is that colonial past (rather than more recent dictators / religious uprisings) which has caused their current problems.
Whether any of this is caused by trying to increase the population in lands which cannot cope with an increased population.

What I am not trying to do is belittle the suffering of these people, just clarify whether there is any justification to your claim that our (past) foreign policy is the sole (or even part) cause.


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 08:30 AM

"Lecturing c" was meant to be "lectric!"


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Subject: RE: BS: Post Brexit life in the UK
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 16 Feb 18 - 08:26 AM

They come here, Dave, drivin' down us wages, stealing us daughters, cloggin' up us 'ealth service, mekkin' funny wailin' noises from them mosque wotsits...

...showin' us what real food is, fixin' plummin and lecturing c, runnin' cheap all-night taxis when us needs to get 'ome pissed, cleanin' us Premier Inns, pickin' us veg and daffs, wipin' us old folks' bums fer next ter nowt, lookin' after us sick, doctorin' us when us 'as funny turns...bugger...


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