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BS: Nationalism - a good or bad thing?

Jim Carroll 08 Nov 16 - 08:30 PM
Allan Conn 09 Nov 16 - 06:53 AM
Jason Xion Wang 09 Nov 16 - 07:26 AM
Stu 09 Nov 16 - 09:54 AM
akenaton 09 Nov 16 - 05:23 PM
Greg F. 09 Nov 16 - 06:11 PM
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Subject: RE: BS: Nationalism - a good or bad thing?
From: Jim Carroll
Date: 08 Nov 16 - 08:30 PM

BREXIT VIOLENCE
Jim Carroll


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Subject: RE: BS: Nationalism - a good or bad thing?
From: Allan Conn
Date: 09 Nov 16 - 06:53 AM

"It's quite interesting how the Scot nats distance themselves from the Brit nats. Scottish nationalism has (at least in the mind of it's supporters) elevated itself to a level of political sophistication and is possessed of a far more noble spirit of civic inclusivity than could ever be south of the border."

Sorry got to comment on that too. When I said British nationalism I was not condemning it - merely pointing out that it is another form of nationalism. They've just tied their idea of the nation to that represented by the union flag whereas Scots Nats have tied it to their idea of the nation to that represented by the Saltire. Some view themselves as Scottish who just happen to currently be within a wider union whilst others see themselves as Brits who just happen to be Scottish. Some see their nationality as Scottish some as British. Some see it as equally both. Neither is superior to the other and neither is bad.

If someone is asking me now though is the type if nationalism displayed by the bulk of the Yes movement and the Scottish gvt the same negative nationalism as displayed by the likes of the BNP or Siol nan Gaidheal then of course I would say no. As already shown by the inclusive welcoming speech already displayed further up the thread. They are clearly not the same and all I am saying is that you can't tar all nationalism with the same brush. The simple fact is that the rhetoric coming from the current Scottish gvt is far more inclusive and welcoming than the rhetoric that comes out of the BNP etc - or even in fact out of the Leave campaign or May's current gvt! That is a fact. No-one suggested that the English in general are incapable of being inclusive and welcoming!

As for the British Empire thing Stu I am sorry but I just don't get that point. The issues affecting us (whether we are Scottish or British nats) are about the here and now and what is best for the country in the future - not about the British empire.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nationalism - a good or bad thing?
From: Jason Xion Wang
Date: 09 Nov 16 - 07:26 AM

It's nothing but crap.

Chinese people love it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Nationalism - a good or bad thing?
From: Stu
Date: 09 Nov 16 - 09:54 AM

"are about the here and now and what is best for the country in the future"

I think that's quite wrong, I see 'the empire' frequently referred to on social media etc. There is a distinct feeling amongst some Scots Nats that they are shrugging off an age old oppressor and corruptor of their culture. In a sense this is true in that the south-east of England has a disproportionate influence over as Scotland, Wales and the North of Ireland as well as the rest of England, but the idea that 'the English' were the sole protagonists in Empire and everyone else was roped is wrong. This is part of the attitude of superiority coming from north of the border.

"or even in fact out of the Leave campaign or May's current gvt"

Agree. I have as much influence over any of those goons as anyone in Scotland does. No-one speaks for me; I live in a safe tory seat and with the proposed gerrymandering it'll become totally unassailable.

I don't blame the Scots for wanting to leave (as we're now ruled by fuckwits and liars), but it still saddens me so much to see the ordinary working folk of the UK being divided by the drift to the right we are currently enduring. It spells the end of our collective bargaining power that, should we ever become a cohesive people again would be the only thing that will save us from the flag wavers, demagogues and populists that are becoming free to stamp on all of our rights.

I always great that the future would be one of coming together for the common good, but it appears all everyone wants to do is withdraw to their own patch of turf.


"I suspect Stu that you don't really know the meaning of "multiculturalism""

I suspect I certainly do; I live in a multicultural society and am all the better for it. You've been left behind old fella!


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Subject: RE: BS: Nationalism - a good or bad thing?
From: akenaton
Date: 09 Nov 16 - 05:23 PM

Acme.....in the few milliseconds that I have left (in real time), I am heartened to think that your children will have become "old farts" just like me.......some call it gaining wisdom, it usually comes through life experience.....but not always :0)


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Subject: RE: BS: Nationalism - a good or bad thing?
From: Greg F.
Date: 09 Nov 16 - 06:11 PM

"old farts" just like me.......some call it gaining wisdom

Others, Ake, particularly pertaining to your situation, call it succumbing to dementia.


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