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BS: Richard III

olddude 23 Mar 15 - 06:01 PM
olddude 23 Mar 15 - 06:03 PM
GUEST 23 Mar 15 - 06:04 PM
GUEST 23 Mar 15 - 06:35 PM
maeve 23 Mar 15 - 06:49 PM
GUEST,# 23 Mar 15 - 06:52 PM
olddude 23 Mar 15 - 07:05 PM
GUEST 23 Mar 15 - 07:37 PM
LadyJean 23 Mar 15 - 07:38 PM
Sandra in Sydney 23 Mar 15 - 08:17 PM
maeve 23 Mar 15 - 08:45 PM
EBarnacle 23 Mar 15 - 09:58 PM
Backwoodsman 24 Mar 15 - 12:35 AM
Musket 24 Mar 15 - 02:41 AM
Nigel Parsons 24 Mar 15 - 03:50 AM
GUEST,Ellen Vannin 24 Mar 15 - 03:53 AM
The Sandman 24 Mar 15 - 04:08 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Mar 15 - 04:32 AM
Thompson 24 Mar 15 - 05:08 AM
Big Al Whittle 24 Mar 15 - 06:24 AM
GUEST,Officer Bollix 24 Mar 15 - 07:11 AM
OldNicKilby 24 Mar 15 - 07:25 AM
Rapparee 24 Mar 15 - 07:40 AM
GUEST 24 Mar 15 - 08:06 AM
Uncle_DaveO 24 Mar 15 - 08:20 AM
Keith A of Hertford 24 Mar 15 - 08:51 AM
Rumncoke 24 Mar 15 - 08:54 AM
Musket 24 Mar 15 - 08:58 AM
Stilly River Sage 24 Mar 15 - 09:02 AM
GUEST,punkfolkrocker 24 Mar 15 - 09:10 AM
Greg F. 24 Mar 15 - 09:39 AM
GUEST,leeneia 24 Mar 15 - 09:51 AM
Manitas_at_home 24 Mar 15 - 09:53 AM
Ed T 24 Mar 15 - 10:00 AM
Backwoodsman 24 Mar 15 - 10:23 AM
Manitas_at_home 24 Mar 15 - 10:57 AM
olddude 24 Mar 15 - 10:59 AM
Backwoodsman 24 Mar 15 - 11:10 AM
Backwoodsman 24 Mar 15 - 11:24 AM
Manitas_at_home 24 Mar 15 - 11:26 AM
Big Al Whittle 24 Mar 15 - 11:29 AM
GUEST,punkfolkrocker 24 Mar 15 - 11:43 AM
Backwoodsman 24 Mar 15 - 11:54 AM
Ernest 24 Mar 15 - 11:57 AM
MGM·Lion 24 Mar 15 - 12:40 PM
Ed T 24 Mar 15 - 12:56 PM
jonm 24 Mar 15 - 01:10 PM
Don Firth 24 Mar 15 - 01:25 PM
Will Fly 24 Mar 15 - 01:39 PM
MGM·Lion 24 Mar 15 - 05:23 PM
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Subject: BS: Richard I I I
From: olddude
Date: 23 Mar 15 - 06:01 PM

530 years and found in a parking lot.. Was he the guy that killed the kids to get the throne or am I thinking of someone else. How do they know it's him. I only heard bits and pieces of it


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: olddude
Date: 23 Mar 15 - 06:03 PM

Dang 530 years of parking is a lot of quarters in the meter


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Mar 15 - 06:04 PM

They identified him by DNA matching with a living relative.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Mar 15 - 06:35 PM

A box of old bones - who's paying for all this lavish regal reburial pomp and circumpants ???


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: maeve
Date: 23 Mar 15 - 06:49 PM

Dan- http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/earth/environment/archaeology/10031896/King-Richard-IIIs-teeth-and-jaw-reveal-monarchs-anxious-l


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: GUEST,#
Date: 23 Mar 15 - 06:52 PM

I doubt it'll be the Plantagenets.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: olddude
Date: 23 Mar 15 - 07:05 PM

Thanks maeve


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Mar 15 - 07:37 PM

Al Capone sent his hoods out to borrow a book from the Chicago Library. When they got there they said to the librarian "Mr Capone wants a book called 'Dick The Shit' "
The librarian said she'd never heard of it so they riddled the library with bullets.
They tell Al that the library doesn't have 'Dick The Shit'.
Al Capone says "It's not 'Dick The Shit', I asked for 'Richard the Turd"


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: LadyJean
Date: 23 Mar 15 - 07:38 PM

The jury is still out on Richard's murder of his nephews.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: Sandra in Sydney
Date: 23 Mar 15 - 08:17 PM

maeve's link is not working for me - page with recent stories

see the June 14 article - 'Richard III's bones will be reburied in a coffin made by his descendant' - The story says the woodworker is a seven times great-nephew of the last Plantagenet king, not a descendant - the article title was probably written by a sub-editor.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: maeve
Date: 23 Mar 15 - 08:45 PM

Trying again, for Sandra is correct my link failed.Anyone having trouble with these randomly chosen two links, please search for the link titles.

King Richard III's teeth and jaw reveal monarch's anxious life and violent death (The Telegram)
:

Richard III taken to final resting place after 500 years (The Guardian)


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: EBarnacle
Date: 23 Mar 15 - 09:58 PM

There is a recent book detailing the archeological search which resulted in the find. The dig was partially sponsored by the Richard the third Society, which is largely concerned with rehabilitating his name.
I believe the title is "The Search for Richard III."


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 12:35 AM

Here Ya go, oldude...

Stuff about Richard lll


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: Musket
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 02:41 AM

So... Does that mean our Liz isn't necessarily the heir to the throne?

That'll be nice for the Christians who after all the arguing over women Bishops didn't actually like having a woman as head of their church.

Rather funny really that during the coronation God is asked if she got through the interview OK.

When I visited the Bosworth battlefield, there were lots of "and his men came over that hill there " stuff and a small print in the guide saying it was possibly four miles away in reality.

Still. Fascinating stuff and of course, Dick III was a real King with power, and thankfully we have a constitutional monarchy now, all the waving and fleecing tourists without letting them actually make any decisions other than whether to get the corgis neutered.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 03:50 AM

Richard three eyes:

Must be related to that fish in The Simpsons.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: GUEST,Ellen Vannin
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 03:53 AM

At the time of Richard III there were two methods of getting the crown - inherit it or win it by getting rid of the previous incumbent. We later added another method - get offered the crown by parliament if the current incumbent wasn't doing his job to parliament's satisfaction. I have heard that there were 43 nearer relatives who were passed over when George I was offered the throne, but parliament felt he would be the best (ie most compliant) candidate.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: The Sandman
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 04:08 AM

The Battle of Bosworth Field.
(Dick Miles)

1.On the 22nd of August with glistening sword and shield.
Brave Richard king of England,did fight at Bosworth Field.
He led his troops in battle,and death did bravely face
The White Rose did fall never more to be replaced.
Chorus.A horse, a horse,my kingdom for a horse.

2.Fight on stout hearted swordsman for king and country fight.
and aim you well bold archers the enemy well fright.
oh take you heed Northumberland and false Lord Stanley.
Have courage me lads for victorious we shall be.
Chorus.

3. So thick and fast the arrows around the king did fly
when to the south marching up the hill false Stanley he did spy.
he mounted on his charger,to fight all for his crown
The White Rose did fall never more to leave the ground
Chorus

4.Unseated from his charger as on the ground lay he
surrounded and out numberd by lord stanleys infantry
they quickly stoop to kill as hawks high in the sky
The White Rose did fall theselast words he then did cry
Chorus

5.and so the last of the House of York to death did come at last
He ruled his people fairly and the law for bail he passed
a good and noble ruler by the Tudors so disgraced.
The White Rose did fall never more to be replaced.
chorus.

copyright, Dick Miles.
this song was written about 1984,and recorded on Cheating the Tide GVR227,with Martin Carthy playing guitar.
my inspiration was a book called The Daughter of Time,by Josephine Tey,I realised that Richard the Third,had been unfairly treated by historians,and particularly by William Shakespeare.
Shakespeare was writing at a time when if you criticised the existing monarchy you could be executed,and had to be careful not to upset the ruling Tudor dynasty,who were close relatives of Henry the Seventh.
I think this tune is suited to open guitar tuning,I played it in emodal or Eminor,but I would of course be happy for anyone to sing the song,and do it just how they want.
I am not sure but I think the tune is in the dorian mode. Dick Miles


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 04:32 AM

When the coffin was processed to the Cathedral to lie in state, thousands lined the route and threw white roses.
People are being advised to stay away now because the wait to see it is so long.

It is a piece of real history. The last king of England to die in battle.
The funeral will be a national event.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: Thompson
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 05:08 AM

I was reminded, looking at the interested crowds lining the route, of the old funeral joke: "Give the people what they want, and they'll surely come."

He doesn't seem to have been at all a good person; in fact, rather than good or evil, he sounds as if he might have been under the influence of paranoia. The fury with which he was killed - stabbed again and again, in the arse and the head, would remind you of the attack on Gadaffi in his last moments.

I'd personally find it at the very least suspicious that the nephews under his care would have quietly disappeared from sight, and then never have been seen again. Cui bono?

As for the legitimacy of the current British royals, Henry VII, the first of the Tudors (shits of the first water) married the daughter of Edward VI, Elizabeth of York, so their children were a mixture of Plantagenet and Tudor (shudder).


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 06:24 AM

quote of the week
TV reporter to historian:-
Now Richard III - he did, at one time, have something of a bad reputation......
And I'm thinking.........yeh and Hitler was a little bit naughty!


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: GUEST,Officer Bollix
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 07:11 AM

High time Mudcat had a 'like' button. I L'dOL at Dick the Shit.

Otherwise, what a waste of public money. Interesting as an article in the Radio Times, utterly irrelavant to life in the 21st Century UK. Depressing.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: OldNicKilby
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 07:25 AM

Well I for one am very proud of the events of Sunday, well managed and staged. It was a shame that it seemed that every bloody Vicar in the county got a seat in the Cathedral , but Hey Ho. A great event for Leicester and many are quite rightly proud. The only ones who are not are the jealous Tykes who cost Leicester a cool £250,000 mounting the challenge. It will bring a great deal of Tourist cash into our City


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: Rapparee
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 07:40 AM

With his Brooklyn/Chicago accent it would have been "Richard DA (or possibly D') Turd."


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 08:06 AM

Public spending priorities - box of old bones or teachers and nurses... hmmmm ?????


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 08:20 AM

I can recommend the book about the search for Richard
III's grave. FASkinatin' !!

No one claimed that he personally did the nephews in;
he was not even in the area at the time the "murder"
was thought to have happened. Did he arrange for the
murderer to do it? That's another question.

Actually, there was no real reason to believe that
they were even dead. They were missing from the Tower, which
was the Royal residence at the time, where they had been kept.
It was only after quite a number of years that the accusatory
finger was pointed at him.

Dave Oesterreich


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 08:51 AM

Very little public money is being spent on this.
There really is no down side to this event, except for Mudcat professional whingers.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard I I I
From: Rumncoke
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 08:54 AM

Well - he was Richard of York - I feel he should have been repatriated.

I've not been involved being down on the South coast - where I noticed that the 'plant a genete' was in bloom on Sunday.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Musket
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 08:58 AM

Or people who aren't as fascinated by military nonsense as you are. What makes dying in battle so special?

Yeah, good for the tourists, fascinating for those who enjoy royal history but those for whom it is as important as stamps collecting or religious stuff.. Whingers?

zzzzz


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 09:02 AM

You need to get your hands on a copy of Josephine Tey's The Daughter of Time. It is a popular mystery (pub. ca 1951) in which she credibly makes the case for Richard's innocence in the murder of the princes in the tower. Over the years since its publication a lot of people have been waiting for the other shoe to drop, such as the events this week.

SRS


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 09:10 AM

Now for me and many others, news of this recent find of old bones is far more fascinating and awe inspiring...

'Monster salamanders' found in fossilised mass grave


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Greg F.
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 09:39 AM

With his Brooklyn/Chicago accent it would have been "Richard DA (or possibly D') Turd."

Dat's TOID, Rap.

<


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 09:51 AM

Here's a good video about it all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDHDvnnK4nI

But what about music? Did they play any interesting music at the funeral? Early-music freaks want to know.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Manitas_at_home
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 09:53 AM

"
Well - he was Richard of York - I feel he should have been repatriated."

He was also Duke of Gloucester...


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Ed T
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 10:00 AM

Did he ever fibd a horse?


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 10:23 AM

Lee dia, the funeral hasn't happened yet. The remains are lying in an open coffin in Leicester Cathedral, on view to the public. The funeral takes place this coming Thursday, IIRC.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Manitas_at_home
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 10:57 AM

I thought the coffin was closed? On Sunday, at the service, it was covered with a pall.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: olddude
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 10:59 AM

I think it's really cool how they found him and identified the remains. Just read up on it. Cool history and gives people a tie to the past. One of his dependants made the casket.. Neat


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 11:10 AM

It was covered, Manitas, but I seem to recall that the BBC news bulletins yesterday described the coffin as being 'open'. They could simply have removed the lid for viewing, of course. I'm sure it will be closed for the burial.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 11:24 AM

Just looked at pics taken inside the cathedral, the coffin looks to be draped with a dark covering-cloth, and has what appears to be a crown on the top. So either BBC news had it wrong, or I mis-heard (certainly not impossible!) and the coffin is not open.

Apologies foe the error.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Manitas_at_home
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 11:26 AM

Open or Oaken?


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 11:29 AM

well lets face it - sod all ever happens in Leicester.

if they make this fuss over a bag of bones, they'll have to close the M1 when Gary Lineker or Engelbert snuffs it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 11:43 AM

I recall eating a kebab in Leicester that made me throw up almost immediately...

That's mainly all I remember about Leicester ???

Nah... no amount of fuss about those old royal bones is ever likely to tempt me back to Leicester...


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 11:54 AM

Yep, they very likely said "Oaken", Manitas. My ears have had too many years being blasted by Rock 'n' Roll played at high volume.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Ernest
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 11:57 AM

Little it is known that Mr. Shakespeare even quoted him wrongly. What he really said was:

"A horse! A horse! A kingdom for a horse that can sing a folksong!"


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 12:40 PM

Satch right!


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Ed T
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 12:56 PM

"A horse! A horse! A kingdom for a horse that can sing a folksong!"

I talked with Ed the horse and he confirmed this quote, from traditional horse knowledge. However, it is commonly referred to as stable, herd or "ass" songs in this community-versus folk songs.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: jonm
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 01:10 PM

A hearse, a hearse.....


I'll get my coat.



All he was really was a below par king.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Don Firth
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 01:25 PM

[The way I heard it, the quote about the singing horse--or the NOT singing horse--came from Big Bill Broonzy when asked if a song he had just sung was a folk song. Subsequently attributed to everyone and his pet chicken....]

In a production of Shakespeare's "Richard the Third," when the great John Barrymore cried out the famous line, "A horse! A horse! My kingdom for a horse!" this struck one audience member as hilarious and he broke into raucous laughter. Stunned silence in the theater as Barrymore's intense eyes slowly swiveled to gaze up at the place from which the laughter had come. Then he raised his arm, pointed a trembling hand, and intoned, "Or saddle me yon braying ass in the balcony!!"

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: Will Fly
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 01:39 PM

Leicester in the 1960s was a great place for music - loads of folk, blues, jazz and rock being played everywhere. Bought my first blues album - "Sonny Terry and Brownie McGhee" - in Leicester market, and worked in the upstairs music bar in the old Victoria tavern.

Rock on Dick!


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard III
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 24 Mar 15 - 05:23 PM

Don Firth -- The "dreary axiom" {Bert Lloyd] is attribd both to Armstrong & Broonzy. It's surprised anyone would want to be known as the originator of anything so bloody stupid -- but maybe we'd better not start that one again, eh? I mean, I've never heard a horse reciting Paradise Lost so does that mean it's a

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz


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