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BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit

BK Lick 11 Apr 14 - 02:39 AM
GUEST,NightWing, without a cookie 11 Apr 14 - 12:32 AM
BK Lick 10 Apr 14 - 11:33 PM
Nigel Parsons 10 Apr 14 - 05:01 AM
BK Lick 09 Apr 14 - 10:07 PM
Ringer 09 Apr 14 - 09:54 AM
Steve Shaw 08 Apr 14 - 07:59 PM
Bill D 08 Apr 14 - 07:40 PM
Rapparee 08 Apr 14 - 05:54 PM
Joe_F 07 Apr 14 - 08:39 PM
Ringer 07 Apr 14 - 09:55 AM
McGrath of Harlow 06 Apr 14 - 06:20 PM
Steve Shaw 06 Apr 14 - 07:27 AM
Doug Chadwick 06 Apr 14 - 04:41 AM
Joe Offer 06 Apr 14 - 03:17 AM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 14 - 08:33 PM
McGrath of Harlow 05 Apr 14 - 08:20 PM
Steve Shaw 05 Apr 14 - 08:06 PM
Dave MacKenzie 05 Apr 14 - 07:33 PM
GUEST 05 Apr 14 - 06:34 PM
McGrath of Harlow 04 Apr 14 - 08:00 PM
dick greenhaus 04 Apr 14 - 01:06 PM
Steve Shaw 04 Apr 14 - 10:17 AM
Joe_F 03 Apr 14 - 09:01 PM
Steve Shaw 03 Apr 14 - 07:00 AM
IanC 03 Apr 14 - 06:48 AM
Nigel Parsons 03 Apr 14 - 06:26 AM
beeliner 02 Apr 14 - 08:19 PM
Tug the Cox 02 Apr 14 - 11:50 AM
Dave the Gnome 02 Apr 14 - 10:39 AM
Steve Shaw 01 Apr 14 - 08:34 PM
Bill D 01 Apr 14 - 08:27 PM
Joe_F 01 Apr 14 - 08:11 PM
Dave the Gnome 01 Apr 14 - 04:24 PM
Mrrzy 01 Apr 14 - 04:20 PM
Nigel Parsons 01 Apr 14 - 04:15 PM
michaelr 01 Apr 14 - 03:28 PM
Dorothy Parshall 01 Apr 14 - 01:18 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 01 Apr 14 - 01:03 PM
brashley46 01 Apr 14 - 01:00 PM
MGM·Lion 01 Apr 14 - 12:43 PM
Q (Frank Staplin) 01 Apr 14 - 12:33 PM
Musket 01 Apr 14 - 12:31 PM
Dave the Gnome 01 Apr 14 - 12:23 PM
Will Fly 01 Apr 14 - 11:19 AM
Will Fly 01 Apr 14 - 11:18 AM
Louie Roy 01 Apr 14 - 11:13 AM
Dave the Gnome 01 Apr 14 - 10:56 AM
Will Fly 01 Apr 14 - 10:55 AM
Will Fly 01 Apr 14 - 10:51 AM
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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: BK Lick
Date: 11 Apr 14 - 02:39 AM

OK, I get that.
Then the slope of the degrees F line is 1
and the slope of slope of the degrees C line is 5/9.
But what's the meaning of "the correction for the slope of the graph (1 in 100 or 1 in 180)?"


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: GUEST,NightWing, without a cookie
Date: 11 Apr 14 - 12:32 AM

BK, make the x-axis degrees Fahrenheit and the y-axis be "degrees". One line will be degrees C, the other degrees F.

It works the same if you make the x-axis be Celsius.

BB,
NightWing


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: BK Lick
Date: 10 Apr 14 - 11:33 PM

Hmm...I can't seem to grok what the x and y axes represent in the two straight line graphs that intersect at -40.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 10 Apr 14 - 05:01 AM

Okay, Dick's method works, but it took a while to see why.
You have two striaght line graphs plotting temperatures in degrees C & degrees F.
These intersect at -40.
Adding 40 to any quoted temperature moves the intersection point to Zero degrees.
Multiplying by 5/9 (or 9/5) gives the correction for the slope of the graph (1 in 100 or 1 in 180).
Subtract 40 to reset the intersection point of the graphs.

Much easier that the equation I learnt in school: (F-32)/9=C/5

Unfortunately I've had that equation in my mind for 40+ years, so it won't be easy to replace!


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: BK Lick
Date: 09 Apr 14 - 10:07 PM

Have to agree with Ringer -- and I'm embarrassed to say I have a PhD in math.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: Ringer
Date: 09 Apr 14 - 09:54 AM

Dick greenhaus' algorithm (Date: 04 Apr 14 - 01:06 PM), "add 40, multiply, subtract 40" is astonishing! It works both for converting C to F and also F to C. I've been working with math all my life and the sheer beauty of Dick's method overwhelms me. (Perhaps I should get out more.)


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 08 Apr 14 - 07:59 PM

I know all the C/F equivalents by heart for all values likely to be encountered either here in Bude or on my holidays (preferably spent in Mediterranean summers when I can afford 'em, which is not often). So anything from minus ten to plus 40 Celsius. We once got to minus nine in Bude a few winters ago. Very rare. The highest on record it's ever been in Bude is plus 32. It happened twice in 1976 and once in my garden in August 1995. The hottest weather I've ever been in was in Perth, Australia a few years ago when it got to plus 36 (in April, not their hottest time of year), though it did push that in London in 1976 once or twice at the end of June. My climatic experiences are a good match for my equable temperament, I feel.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: Bill D
Date: 08 Apr 14 - 07:40 PM

I have learned...memorized... and relearned & re-memorized that 5/9th formula for 60 years. I'm glad they just DO it these days. Besides, I doubt that many folks anymore CAN multiply by 5/9ths and 9/5ths in a reasonable amount of time.

I see the advantages of both systems, and it may be that I just grew up doing F, but it 'seems' easier having more whole #s rather than sticking .5s to be accurate.

No matter, I have my programs to convert furlongs to fortnights ...and C to F anytime it's relevant.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: Rapparee
Date: 08 Apr 14 - 05:54 PM

Out here in the Wild, Arid, High Desert country, it can go from -35F to +104F at various times (no, not in the same hour or day!). Folks will say stuff like, "Yeah, it's fifteen below, but it's a dry cold" or "It's 103, but it's a dry hear."

My butt! It's -15 or it's +103. Either way it's too cold or too hot. Temperature only means something in relation to something else -- the boiling point of lead, when you need a parka, or the temperature at which certain chemicals will melt together to form a propellant for your home-made rocket.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: Joe_F
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 08:39 PM

360 is a nice number -- divisible by 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 8, 9, 10, 12, 15, 18, 20,.... It is also close to the number of days in a year.

If you have just drawn a circle, the easiest way to divide its circumference is into six 60-deg arcs: just march around using the same compass setting.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: Ringer
Date: 07 Apr 14 - 09:55 AM

"The puzzle of course is where 60 seconda in a minute and 60 minutes in an hour came from."

Babylon, I understand.

Incidentally, the way I heard it, Mr Farenheit used salt/ice as zero, and the temperature of his dog's arse as 100. Then he found pure water froze at 32 and, extending his straight line towards the hot, found that water boiled at 212.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 06 Apr 14 - 06:20 PM

The one part of the metricising mania started by the French Revolution was effectively halted was when it comes to time. The ten day week they called the "decade" never caught on. And we've still an intransigant duodecimal relic in the 24 hours in a day, and 12 months in a year.

The puzzle of course is where 60 seconda in a minute and 60 minutes in an hour came from.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 06 Apr 14 - 07:27 AM

Good point, Doug. So we're lumbered with point fives and stuff now. Even my car computer does centigrade in point fives. Still, there's no going back. Probably. ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Doug Chadwick
Date: 06 Apr 14 - 04:41 AM

Intersesting correspodences are 16C=61F....28C=82F.

....give or take a bit.   16oC = 60.8oF
                                    28oC = 82.4oF

The problem with the Celsius scale is that 1 degree is such a large change in temperature.

From experience, 1 degree Fahrenheit appears to be the "sensible" change in temperature. If I think "it's getting a bit warm/cold in here" then the temperature has changed by about 1oF (assuming that I'm not in a draught). Hence the unusual number of 180 degrees between freezing and boiling compared to Celsius's convenient 100 degrees.

DC


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Subject: RE: BS: Celsius -Fahrenheit
From: Joe Offer
Date: 06 Apr 14 - 03:17 AM

Changing 90 degrees f to celsius?

Go to Google and enter 90 degrees f in c.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 08:33 PM

Probably? No shit, Sherlock! :-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 08:20 PM

5 fingers on 2 hands, that makes 12. (And apropos of nothing, Anne Boleyn had six fingers on each hand.)

Duodecimal is in principle much better, but the language we use is tied to decimal (20, 30 etc), and so is our system of numerals. A pity we abandoned existing duodecimal elements such as pennies and shillings and inches and feet. Probably no going back now.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 08:06 PM

We had a maths teacher at school (in the mid-60s, I hasten to add) who was vehemently opposed to anything decimal. He declared that the system we then had for currency and measurement, based on twelve, was much more useful, in that 12 can be divided by 2, 3, 4 and 6, whereas ten can be divided only by 2 and 5. His downfall, of course, was that we have ten digits on our hands, which lent a degree of awkwardness to counting in twelves. He did have an answer to that for the missing two, though, which I won't convey now: suffice to say that we were an all-boys school...


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 07:33 PM

The name got changed from Centigrade because Fahrenheit was based on a 100 degrees, even if nobody can remember what they were supposed to be, and it was realized that water only boils at 100 degrees at sea level. I still don't see the attraction of decimal arithmetic; Pre metric we counted in everything but tens, and it was much easier shopping for dozens when everuthing was in pence and shillings.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: GUEST
Date: 05 Apr 14 - 06:34 PM

Celsius, you're breakin' my heart,
You're shakin' my comfidence daily...


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 08:00 PM

Changing the name from Centigrade to Celsius was a bit questionable. True enough the Swedish Scientist Anders Celsius was the one who though of having 100 degrees between the freezing and boiling point of water, but he had 0 as the boiling point and 100 as freezing point.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 01:06 PM

An easier-to-remember conversion algorithm is:

Add 40 to the temperature to be converted.
Multipy by 5/9 if you'rr coverting from F to C, OR
Multply by 9/5 if you're converting from C to F

Subreact 40 and there's your answer


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 04 Apr 14 - 10:17 AM

And we get Danish Scurvy-grass, a neat little seaside plant, growing all along our motorway (heavily-salted in winter) central reservations. In flower right now. V. pretty!


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Joe_F
Date: 03 Apr 14 - 09:01 PM

Not seawater, saturated brine (ice water with salt at the bottom).


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 03 Apr 14 - 07:00 AM

Which is why we salt icy roads in winter.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: IanC
Date: 03 Apr 14 - 06:48 AM

Bit of a problem with the seawater argument ... (from Wikipedia)

The freezing point of seawater decreases as salt concentration increases. At typical salinity it freezes at about −2 °C (28 °F). The coldest seawater ever recorded (in a liquid state) was in 2010, in a stream under an Antarctic glacier, and measured −2.6 °C (27.3 °F).

:-)


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 03 Apr 14 - 06:26 AM

The theory I've heard is that the lowest temperature which could be considered as a constant was the freezing point of salt water/sea water. This was used as the starting point. Boiling (pure) water was used for the other endpoint.
I don't believe that the Fahrenheit system was ever intended to have a specific meaning for 100 degrees. A scale of 180 degrees (half a circle) made much more sense as it allowed each degree to be smaller (giving amost double the precision) and allowed division by a greater number of factors.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: beeliner
Date: 02 Apr 14 - 08:19 PM

I have heard that Herr Fahrenheit stuck his thermometer in freezing brine to mark 0, and then in his mouth, or somewhere, to mark 100. (He seems to have run a little hot.

Another theory is that he intended 0 to represent the coldest reading in an average year and 100 the warmest.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Tug the Cox
Date: 02 Apr 14 - 11:50 AM

Intersesting correspodences are 16C=61F....28C=82F.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 02 Apr 14 - 10:39 AM

Not if you're three foot eight and spit downwards hard it doesn't.

Have you been watching me?

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 08:34 PM

Your spit freezes before it hits the ground.

Not if you're three foot eight and spit downwards hard it doesn't.

Unfortunately for those requiring neat packages, "freezing" is closer to 273.1K.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 08:27 PM

program for Windows users


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Joe_F
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 08:11 PM

Minus 40 has a number of other curious properties: The mercury freezes in the thermometer. Oak trees freeze to death. Your spit freezes before it hits the ground.

I have heard that Herr Fahrenheit stuck his thermometer in freezing brine to mark 0, and then in his mouth, or somewhere, to mark 100. (He seems to have run a little hot.)

If I were dictator, I would go for the Kelvin scale. Then there would be no nonsense about negative temperatures. Freezing, 273 K. Room temperature, 293 K. Boiling, 373 K.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 04:24 PM

Well spotted, michaelr :-) It was an errr, errrmmm, deliberate pun...

:D tG


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Mrrzy
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 04:20 PM

Right, -40 is -40 regardless of Celsius or Fahrenheit.

I can finally think in both, rather than having to do the math.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 04:15 PM

Brashley46:
There are 180 Fahrenheit degrees between freezing and boiling; old Herr Fahrenheit assigned the zero value to the coldest temp he had ever experienced, which was 32 of his degrees below freezing. Celsius divided the difference between freezing and boiling to 100 of his degrees, and started the scale at freezing = zero.

Close, but no ceeegar.
Anders Celsius devised a scale in which the boiling point of pure water (at sea level) was 0 degrees, and the freezing point 100 degrees. These days we use the scale the other way around. When I was in school it (the modern version) was referred to as the centigrade scale.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: michaelr
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 03:28 PM

DtG -- "it gets bugger" LOL


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Dorothy Parshall
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 01:18 PM

To convert almost anything except lead to gold

I simply cannot bother with math!


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 01:03 PM

Right, M. My poor typing. (10 C = 50 C? I guess we are all poor typists or proofers).
Here in Calgary we must have clothes for -40 (C and F) and plus 30C on some summer days.
I remember summers in New Mexico- At one of our favorite camping spots, ice in the water bucket at dawn and 90F in the afternoon.


Aside- I put typers and my MS gave me the red underline, so I quickly changed it to typists- purists everywhere!


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: brashley46
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 01:00 PM

There are 180 Fahrenheit degrees between freezing and boiling; old Herr Fahrenheit assigned the zero value to the coldest temp he had ever experienced, which was 32 of his degrees below freezing. Celsius divided the difference between freezing and boiling to 100 of his degrees, and started the scale at freezing = zero.

As a hospital worker in the Ontario system I got used to Celsius temperatures real quick.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 12:43 PM

Q ~~ Your 20C equiv is 10 out - a typo I expect.

A very helpful hint I got from a newspaper correspondent when forecasts started using C when my generation had all been brought up to F, was that for all practical "What will the weather be like, will I need a coat?" purposes, a simple formula to get a near-enough approximation was to double the C # & add 30:

so that 10C would be about 50C, 20C would be approx 70F; near enough to know the temp for practical everyday purposes. Was v grateful for that aid to coping with the changeover.

~M~


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 12:33 PM

Above readings.
5 C = 41 F
10 C = 50 F
15 C = 59 F
20 C = 58 F
25 C = 77 F
30 C = 86 F
100 C = 212 F
177 C = 350 F (moderate oven)
200 C = 400 F
230 C = 450 F
290 C = 550 F (Broiling temperature)

My outdoor thermometer has both scales.
For the rest, why not use a google table or handy-dandy pocket calculator?


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Musket
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 12:31 PM

I see if my tongue sticks to it. Easiest way of distinguishing between plus or very minus.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 12:23 PM

Can take a bit of time to get your head round it, LR. Just think that when you subtract something from a negative, it gets bugger, IE more negative and when you add something to a negative it gets smaller. IE less negative. Another way of putting what will said is -40 -32 = -72. Try it on a calculator - It works. Honest!

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Will Fly
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 11:19 AM

Whoops - subtracted a minus from a minus in the first line! Should be:


Subtract 32 from -40F. Answer = -72
Multiply by 5. Answer = -360
Divide by 9. Answer = -40


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Will Fly
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 11:18 AM

The formula works regardless of plus or minus.

Subtract -32 from -40F. Answer = -72
Multiply by 5. Answer = -360
Divide by 9. Answer = -40

Simples.


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Louie Roy
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 11:13 AM

Like I said above zero no problem It's below zero when things change


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 10:56 AM

Simple way - Double it and add 30. Works roughly. Proper way, multiply by 9/5 and add 32. -40 is the only temp. that is the same in both I think. -40 x 9/5 = -72. Add 32 = -40. Farenheit to centigrade formula is (simple) subtract 30 and half it. Proper way, subtract 32 and multiply by 5/9.

Seemples

DtG


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Will Fly
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 10:55 AM

Sorry - forgot to add the equation: C = 5/9 (F-32)


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Subject: RE: BS: Celius -Fahrenheit
From: Will Fly
Date: 01 Apr 14 - 10:51 AM

-40F = -40C

-10F = -23C
-20F = -29C
-30F = -34C

So - not a simple +/-32 arithmetic sum.


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