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Origin: Scottish Soldier

18 Oct 99 - 10:53 AM
Lesley N. 18 Oct 99 - 03:21 PM
John in Brisbane 18 Oct 99 - 07:41 PM
Lesley N. 18 Oct 99 - 08:32 PM
John in Brisbane 18 Oct 99 - 09:39 PM
Sam in Indiana. 19 Oct 99 - 11:52 AM
Sam in Indiana. 19 Oct 99 - 12:13 PM
Lesley N. 19 Oct 99 - 04:19 PM
Malcolm Douglas 19 Oct 99 - 08:09 PM
A piper 21 Oct 99 - 12:53 PM
Margo 21 Oct 99 - 06:49 PM
Murray on Saltspring 21 Oct 99 - 11:42 PM
Wolfgang 22 Oct 99 - 04:34 AM
Murray on Saltspring 22 Oct 99 - 10:59 PM
Wolfgang 26 Oct 99 - 04:12 AM
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Subject: Scottish Soldier
From:
Date: 18 Oct 99 - 10:53 AM

I am trying out to find the story behind the song Scottish soldier. The song talks about him dying in Tyrol and I know that Scottish troops were sent to Tyrol around 1745. Does anybody know what happened back then and what battle was taking place?


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: Lesley N.
Date: 18 Oct 99 - 03:21 PM

Don't have much about the Soldier himself but the tune is a pipe tune The Green Hills of Tyrol which was written during the Crimean War (1853-1856) by a Pipe Major in a Scottish Regiment. He adapted part of the William Tell opera, after hearing a band play it.

I've read more about it but the brain can't seem to find the right connections at the moment. I'm sure someone else will come up with exactly what you'd like.


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 18 Oct 99 - 07:41 PM

Lesley, I posted a thread on this subject about 2 weeks ago for The Waterfall, http://www.mudcat.org/thread.CFM?threadID=14183, including the tune to the chorus which to my ears is a dead ringer for Scottish Soldier. I would appreciate your thoughts, and indeed Bruce O's if you happen to see this. If there are any pipers who could comment, I suspect that the range and scale of the Highland pipes would rener The Waterfall into a tune very close to Scottish Soldier. Regards, John


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: Lesley N.
Date: 18 Oct 99 - 08:32 PM

What we really need is a piper - Barry (Taylor, that is) are you listening?

A long while back I sequenced a tune and made the melody line the pipes. Somebody wrote me back and said, no way would the pipe be able to play all those notes!!! (Unlike some they were very nice - rather amused at my ignorance I expect.) I kept it because I liked the sound but I've always felt guilty about it - and haven't used the pipes for a voice since!! Which proves I shouldn't be the one to judge Waterfall... I will take a look at it though - sounds interesting!


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 18 Oct 99 - 09:39 PM

Lesley, as always I'd appreciate your feedback. Yes it would be great to hear from a piper - my only knowledge is that the scale is limited to pentatonic, but have no idea of the range or key signatures available. There was a thread a long time ago which covered Pentatonic Tunes, but I haven't/won't have the time to research it for the moment. Regards, John


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: Sam in Indiana.
Date: 19 Oct 99 - 11:52 AM


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: Sam in Indiana.
Date: 19 Oct 99 - 12:13 PM

The lyrics for the Scottish Soldier were written by Scottish comedian Andy Stewart. Probably in the middle 60's. There are a lot of pipe tunes that Andy wrote the lyrics for. "Morag o' Dunvegan" By the Lochside. {Lochanside.} Campbelltown Loch. {Glendaruel Highlanders} Tunes of Glory. {Black Bear} Barren Rocks of Aden The origin of of titles in pipe music could readily be answered easily . The Scots were some of the greatest mercenaries that ever lived. They left home to seek a fortune which was not available in their own homeland.


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: Lesley N.
Date: 19 Oct 99 - 04:19 PM

Words to "The Green Hills of Tyrol" date much farther back (Baring-Gould collected a set). However, the DT lyrics to GREEN HILLS OF TYROL (http://www.mudcat.org/!!-song99.cfm?stuff=Spring99+D+5064774) don't have the same first line as the broadsides did (which is all I have of them). Are those the words by Andy Stewart?


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 19 Oct 99 - 08:09 PM

Lesley

Pretty much, from what I remember.

Malcolm


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: A piper
Date: 21 Oct 99 - 12:53 PM

Apparently Barry Taylor isn't listening, perhaps this will help. For a site which explains the bagpipe scale click here. To see the sheet music for the GHB tune Green Hills of Tyrol and get a midi go here.

Tully


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: Margo
Date: 21 Oct 99 - 06:49 PM

Thanks for the piper info. Do you know of a similar page for Uilleian pipes? Margo


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: Murray on Saltspring
Date: 21 Oct 99 - 11:42 PM

The words are by Andy Stewart, about 1960 as I remember (he introduced it on the Scottish TV programme "The White Heather Club", I think. He took his hint from the title of the pipe tune, which was composed [or I should say adapted for the pipes] by John Macleod, 93rd Highlanders, during the Crimean War, after listening to a Sardinian band playing a continental tune. The theme, from an Alpine folk tune, had been used also by Rossini in the William Tell ballet music. Macleod's version is in a good few books of pipe tunes, e.g. Scots Guards Standard Settings, 218 [with the harmony ("seconds") as well]. BTW there's another set of words that was sung by the Inverscotia Singers, in Patriot Songs for Camp & Celidh, "The Green Hills", beginning "Oh the green hills are calling me" chorus, "For the calling of the hills I hear" etc.


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: Wolfgang
Date: 22 Oct 99 - 04:34 AM

Thanks, Murray, I think, that's the explanation and also answers John's question in Der Wasserfall thread. Where did you get the information from, or more specifically: I'm very interested in the use of folktunes in classical music (and vice versa). Has someone already compiled this information in a book?

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: Murray on Saltspring
Date: 22 Oct 99 - 10:59 PM

I can't give you chapter and verse, Wolfgang, that's just the info I've collected in my Scottish Song Index. I'm glad you reminded me about Der Wasserfall, which I have in a little book from Salzburg, "Fein sein, beinander bleiben", ed. by Cesar Bresgen (1947), which has a different (second) verse to the one in the text in the link above. I'll send it to you by e-mail if you like. Anyway, tho I can't access it right now, my guess is that the roots of the Rossini tune are dealt with in a book by a chap called Fuld, title something like "The Book of World-Famous melodies", or such--he tries to find the first published version of many tunes, from classics to pops, including of course a few folk-tunes. Good hunting! Murray


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Subject: RE: Scottish Soldier
From: Wolfgang
Date: 26 Oct 99 - 04:12 AM

Thanks, Murray,
I'll have to have such a book and I'm sure I'll be able to find it one way or the other. I enjoy hunting down books or records. No need for the e-mail though, thanks.

Wolfgang


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