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BS: Obama, religious bigot?

Richard Bridge 18 Apr 11 - 10:34 AM
katlaughing 18 Apr 11 - 10:44 AM
bobad 18 Apr 11 - 10:48 AM
Wesley S 18 Apr 11 - 11:12 AM
Donuel 18 Apr 11 - 11:14 AM
Bill D 18 Apr 11 - 11:26 AM
GUEST 18 Apr 11 - 12:25 PM
GUEST 18 Apr 11 - 12:26 PM
Richard Bridge 18 Apr 11 - 12:30 PM
Greg F. 18 Apr 11 - 12:37 PM
GUEST 18 Apr 11 - 12:43 PM
Ebbie 18 Apr 11 - 12:48 PM
Art Thieme 18 Apr 11 - 12:49 PM
MarkS 18 Apr 11 - 01:19 PM
Don Firth 18 Apr 11 - 02:18 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 18 Apr 11 - 02:35 PM
gnu 18 Apr 11 - 03:01 PM
akenaton 18 Apr 11 - 03:45 PM
McGrath of Harlow 18 Apr 11 - 05:02 PM
Richard Bridge 18 Apr 11 - 05:57 PM
Greg F. 18 Apr 11 - 06:37 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 18 Apr 11 - 07:51 PM
Bobert 18 Apr 11 - 08:09 PM
Ron Davies 18 Apr 11 - 08:25 PM
Ron Davies 18 Apr 11 - 09:18 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 19 Apr 11 - 12:15 AM
Ebbie 19 Apr 11 - 01:33 AM
Richard Bridge 19 Apr 11 - 01:42 AM
Joe Offer 19 Apr 11 - 02:36 AM
Stringsinger 19 Apr 11 - 12:13 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 19 Apr 11 - 12:37 PM
Ebbie 19 Apr 11 - 12:48 PM
Richard Bridge 19 Apr 11 - 01:07 PM
Brian May 19 Apr 11 - 02:19 PM
Don Firth 19 Apr 11 - 02:28 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 19 Apr 11 - 02:55 PM
Amos 19 Apr 11 - 03:03 PM
Amos 19 Apr 11 - 03:05 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 19 Apr 11 - 03:14 PM
Don Firth 19 Apr 11 - 03:17 PM
akenaton 19 Apr 11 - 05:10 PM
Little Hawk 19 Apr 11 - 05:59 PM
Richard Bridge 19 Apr 11 - 07:07 PM
Amos 19 Apr 11 - 07:20 PM
catspaw49 19 Apr 11 - 09:29 PM
GUEST,Crazy Horse 19 Apr 11 - 09:39 PM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 19 Apr 11 - 11:52 PM
LadyJean 20 Apr 11 - 01:05 AM
GUEST,Guest from Sanity 20 Apr 11 - 01:46 AM
akenaton 20 Apr 11 - 02:57 AM
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Subject: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 10:34 AM

After the recent revelations about why Obama is not very persona grata over here in the UK, I thought the following might be interesting.

I understand that he is opposed to gay marriage. He has however apparently no rational reason but says it is because of his religious faith.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: katlaughing
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 10:44 AM

*sigh* Do you have any legitimate source, Richard?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: bobad
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 10:48 AM

If that is true then it is very disappointing, a lot of people had higher expectations of him.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Wesley S
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 11:12 AM

Yes Richard - Please link to some sort of source for your ideas. It would be nice if they were credible too.


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Subject: RE: BS: Richard Bridge, plain ol bigot?
From: Donuel
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 11:14 AM

Staking out the centrist position he is neither an advocate for or opponent of gay marraige. He was a strong opponent of dadt.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Bill D
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 11:26 AM

He has said (approximately) that he personally views marriage as between a man and a woman, but he also has come out against discrimination.


one article


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 12:25 PM

Just shows, nobody's all bad, or completely dumb.

Mr Obama seems to be a little too honest for politics, when he is pushed into doing something he knows is wrong, or against his principles he is unable to disguise his feelings.

He is beginning to earn a bit of respect from me.


Maybe he is, or could be "the messiah"

Interesting.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 12:26 PM

That was me ....Ake    forgot to log in AGAIN!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 12:30 PM

I heard it as a passing comment from a writer taking part in a discussion programme on BBC radio 4 this morning. Looks like I might have been right then.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 12:37 PM

No, as said above, his personal stand on the issue is one thing - and largely his own busuness, as long as his PUBLIC position is non-discriminatory & he does't impose his views on anyone else..

Jesus, this is like being back in junior high school.

Ya want "religious bigots" Richard, there's plenty of REAL ones out there trying to force people and nations to adhere to their personal religious beliefs, however idiotic.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 12:43 PM

Neither a leader nor a follower. More like a get-out-of-the-wayer.

----------- That still you, Ake? Time to defrost the cookies? Otherwise - no anonymous yadda-yadda, please. JoeClone--------


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Ebbie
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 12:48 PM

One of these times we should have a thread on how others perceive us based on our posts.

I think it should be from ourselves about ourselves. How do you think you come across, Richard Bridge?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Art Thieme
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 12:49 PM

It is a topic that has various ways of seeing it.

They asked him, and he said what he feels rather than modern view of this.

Art


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: MarkS
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 01:19 PM

This is just silly. Of all the comments which may be made about President Obama, bigotry is at the bottom of the list.
Way at the bottom.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Don Firth
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 02:18 PM

Well, what the hell!

There ARE those out there who, if they heard a vague rumor that Obama was having a bad bout with toe-nail fungus, they'd throw a hissy-fit and try to turn it into a case for claiming that he is unfit to be President.

Sheesh!!

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 02:35 PM

'Guest' (Akenaton, I think): "Mr Obama seems to be a little too honest for politics,..........."

WHAT????????????????????????????????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!???

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: gnu
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 03:01 PM

Speaking of nail fungus, I read on the internut that Vick's Vapor Rub does not cure it. It's one a them there "urban myths". Odd... only took one application for me two days ago. Worked a treat.

Now, as for Obama, I doubt if Vick's would get rid of his fungus... fungi?... you know, about him being a muslim... not being a Yank... whatever else can be dreamed up.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: akenaton
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 03:45 PM

Sorry GfS.....I know you're not a fan and neither am I.....but I notice he seems to have lost his sense of direction and confidence.

I think he is starting to realise that he has been used, and that nothing can be changed while the handlers for the system are in charge.

Sorry about the two guest posts......the third was not me.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 05:02 PM

The view that the word "marriage" should continue to mean what it has always meantand that an analagous arrangement between people of the same sex is a matter of linguistic preferance rather than bigotry.

It's a bit like a controversy as to whether people who use motorbikes should be called riders rather than drivers, with the word drivers being limited to those who use cars. (And how about push-bikes?)


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 05:57 PM

No, McGrath that is not true because not all countries give civil partnerships the same rights as married couples. The USA does not - tha tis to say that some states do not.

Ebbie - bovvered?

I will continue to assert what I think is right. And I haven't got my position as president to consider.

Nor have I an imaginary friend who permits me to cop out of arguments about right and wrong.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Greg F.
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 06:37 PM

No, but you have imaginary problems & crises that you choose to blow all out of proportion.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 07:51 PM

Akenaton: "Sorry GfS.....I know you're not a fan and neither am I.....but I notice he seems to have lost his sense of direction and confidence.


ROFLMAO!!!

If you read my posts about him all along, I've been saying that ALL ALONG....even during his run for the nomination! Personally, I'd like to have a LEADER, who does NOT FOLLOW the 'special interests', and rather put his nation first!


Dis dude ids jest pimpin'!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Bobert
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 08:09 PM

Black Christians tend to be less tolerant for both homosexuality and gay marriage... I'm not defending or attacking anyone here but just offering my observations...

B~


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Ron Davies
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 08:25 PM

Interesting. Richard is certainly an expert on bigotry--after all he helpfully informed us during the 2008 campaign that Obama was an "oreo".    Richard is so generous with his knowledge of this type.

It does appear that he has never liked Barack Obama, neither as candidate nor as President.

I'm sure of course that this thread has nothing to do with his antipathy for Obama.   Absolutely nothing. Of course not.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Ron Davies
Date: 18 Apr 11 - 09:18 PM

And we certainly need to pay attention to what Richard says. After all, he's done such a magnificent job in the UK.   That must be why so many UK Mudcatters are so overjoyed with the current political situation there.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 12:15 AM

Guest(?): "Wow. Offensive as ever "counselor"."

You think THAT was offensive????...and think what we got for a 'regime' isn't???????????????????????????????????????

Grow up!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Ebbie
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 01:33 AM

Frankly, I don't believe for a minute that a certain Guest has ever been a counselor. Gave advice, yes.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 01:42 AM

Not unusually, badger-baiter, you misstate your case, possibly intentionally. What I reported was that that was a criticism being voiced of Obama during the run up to the election. And it was.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 02:36 AM

In the one of the debates during the election campaign, both McCain and Obama said they opposed gay marriage. In all other aspects, Obama has strongly defended the rights of gay people.

So, is opposing gay marriage a certified litmus test for anti-gay bigotry? If we are not in lockstep with the "approved" ideology, does that mean we're bigots? I think we throw the word bigot out a bit too easily these days, and then we fail to recognize the true bigotry that is all around us. True bigotry involves hating another person or wishing to destroy or harm another - it's not simply disagreeing with the other person's thinking. Mr. Obama may disagree with the idea of gay marriage, but he expressed his disagreement with great respect.

-Joe-


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Stringsinger
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 12:13 PM

Obama is first and foremost a politician. His speeches and his actions are not together.
His campaign speeches have been contradicted by his actions.

These contradictions can be enumerated but most people know what they are.

1. Gitmo
2. Iraq
3. Rich tax cuts
4. Nuke energy
5. Wall Street Advisors (his cabinet) and financiers (for his re-election)

There are more.

Watch for the notorious "Gang of Six" to destabilize Medicare, Social Security and Medicaid.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 12:37 PM

Ebbie: "Frankly, I don't believe for a minute that a certain Guest has ever been a counselor. Gave advice, yes."

Wrong..again....(though my education was not taken to primarily be a marriage and family counselor..but in the course of things, I was considered a damn good one!!)

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Ebbie
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 12:48 PM

Frankly, I doubt it.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 01:07 PM

My point is that his disapproval is based solely in "faith" which does not permit rational discussion. That's bigotry.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Brian May
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 02:19 PM

Oh boy . . . do you have any other words than 'bigot' in your vocabulary?

It almost doesn't matter what the subject is . . . 'bigot' or 'bigotry' is tossed in.

It does get a tad tedious.

And yes, I'm a volunteer, so I shall exercise that and refrain from reading any more on this latest muck-slinging competition.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Don Firth
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 02:28 PM

First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
No elected official, including the President, can—constitutionally—give legal status to his or her religious beliefs. Thus, it does not matter what Obama's feelings about same-sex marriage are; neither he, nor the entire Congress—nor the Supreme Court—can, again, constitutionally—abridge the civil rights of any one group of people.

Obama knows this!

Unfortunately, many other elected officials, and certain (but not all) religious groups, also know this, but refuse to accept it and demand that their religious beliefs prevail, despite the Constitution. They are sufficiently short-sighted that they apparently don't realize that if the constitutional protections are ignored, that very precident could someday backlash on them!

THAT's where the problem lies.

Neither Obama nor anyone else who may disagree with the idea of same-sex marriage, for religious or any other reason, can be fairly accused of being a bigot as long as they neither directly attempt, nor advocate, the passage of unconstitutional laws to have it outlawed.

Case in point:   California's Proposition 9 is unconstitutional, notwithstanding that it got something like 54% of the popular vote. The Constitution protects individuals and groups not just from tyrannical regimes, but from the tyranny of pure democracy (majority rules) as well. The tyranny of a pure democracy can be best exemplified by a lynch mob.

No. Obama is not a "bigot."

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 02:55 PM

Ebbie: "Frankly, I doubt it."

Frankly, you're wrong...AGAIN!!!!!..but it sure ain't the first time!


Don: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

No elected official, including the President, can—constitutionally—give legal status to his or her religious beliefs. Thus, it does not matter what Obama's feelings about same-sex marriage are; neither he, nor the entire Congress—nor the Supreme Court—can, again, constitutionally—abridge the civil rights of any one group of people."

..and NOT to open this endless diatribe between us, homosexual marriages do NOT fall under ANY of the Constitutional..here, I'll C and P it, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

The ridiculous thing is, that in the arguments AGAINST homosexual marriage, is that the opponents are using RELIGIOUS arguments, instead of Constitutionally legal arguments, as to what rights they have!..It would be almost the same as if someone was using Sharia law, to argue their slant on things. Fair enough???

That being said, the courts will decide it, not the 'Mudcatters'..and we've beaten each other up enough on this topic.
If the opponents lose, it will be because of the grounds they are basing their argument on. If the proponents win, it will be because, they knocked out the opponents premise.
As far as the freedom to do as people like, that is already screwed up LONG before it got to this issue!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Amos
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 03:03 PM

Oh, fer chrissake. He voiced a moral opinion about theproper role of marriag. It may be a misplaced opinion in some eyes, including mine, but it sure as hell is not bigotry. Having an opinion does not constitute bigotry. In fact the very q


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Amos
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 03:05 PM

...the very quote you offer shows Mr Obama tolerating opinions other than his own, which by definition is the antithesis of bigotry. Don't be asinine.


A


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 03:14 PM

Amos: "...the very quote you offer shows Mr Obama tolerating opinions other than his own,.."

To whom are you referring?

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Don Firth
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 03:17 PM

GfS, I did not say that same-sex marriage specifically is protected under the Constitution. But the rights of minority groups are. And a law that infringes the rights of a minority group (such as LGBT) is NOT Constitutional.

Simple as that. If you think otherwise, argue it out with a constitutional attorney, not me.

End of discussion.

Don Firth


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: akenaton
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 05:10 PM

"My point is that his disapproval is based solely in "faith" which does not permit rational discussion. That's bigotry."


Richard I am an atheist and do not support homosexual marriage, I always put up what I think is a reasonable case.
You have often referred to me as a "bigot".

It does seem as Brian says, that you are rather fond of the word!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Little Hawk
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 05:59 PM

Why has no one here yet started a threat called:

"Obama - satanic, cold-blooded space alien secret agent from lizard-man civilization located in Orion Nebula...He is clearly intent upon the destruction of all that we love and cherish!"?

Yes, I know it's too loooooooong for a threat title. ;-) Still, I should think it would stir much useful (cough! cough!)..."discussion"...here. Probably hit at least 500 posts in a couple of days, no problem.

And such a juicy and trenchant subject it would be for the accolytes of Recreational Outrage to flock to and do heroic battle with one another over the supine body of Mr Obama!

"Bigot!" "Liberal!" "Scumbag!" "Idiot!" "Homophobe!" "Obamaphile!" Ah, yes, the joys of constructive debate in the halls of the untrammeled political mind. Let slip the Dorks of War!!! ;-D

Man, oh man...I think I'll go view the Crazy Horse webcam for an hour or two and unwind. Or maybe get really CRAZY and practice my guitar! I just can't TAKE this much significant controversy and meaningful dialogue.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 07:07 PM

If it walks like a duck, why should I call it a chicken?


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: Amos
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 07:20 PM

Because you are confusing duckdom with your own blockheadedness.

Words have definitions--they aren't there solely to satiate your perverse appetite for self-indulgent histrionics.

A


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: catspaw49
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 09:29 PM

I've often wondered what the stuffing was in a true stuffed shirt...........Apparently, and at least in this case, obviously the stuffing is made of complete bullshit.


Spaw


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: GUEST,Crazy Horse
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 09:39 PM

Still missing you, brother. But not much. ;-) Hey! An owl just shit on my damn nose!


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 19 Apr 11 - 11:52 PM

I think Little Hawk pretty much covered it all, as far as Obama....AND NO ONE CONTRADICTED EITHER!!!!!!!!

Now boys and girls, you've come a long way!

wink!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: LadyJean
Date: 20 Apr 11 - 01:05 AM

President Obama is an intelligent, educated, thoughtful man who is in a difficult position.

To begin with he is the first African American president. Which means some Americans, usually while swearing they aren't racist, are giving him grief because of his race.

Then, he inherited a colossal mess, most of it courtesy of his predecessor one of the biggest fools ever to waste space in the oval office.

Add to this the fact that his opposition is very well organized and very very well funded, and you see the problem.

Obama wants to close Guantanamo, and Fox News announces that the internees will be walking down Main Street. So the public sets up a howl, and Gitmo stays.

Obama knows that John Kerry lost the election because of fears and queers. So, he proceeds with caution.


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 20 Apr 11 - 01:46 AM

Awww..how simply wonderful, and simply simplistic!..and I was thinking all along that his bad days were only because his new cologne irritated him!

GfS


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Subject: RE: BS: Obama, religious bigot?
From: akenaton
Date: 20 Apr 11 - 02:57 AM

I think the word we are all searching for is "hypocrisy"
Pops up everywhere doesn't it?..... and this system breeds it.


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