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BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned

Azizi 19 May 08 - 07:52 PM
Rowan 19 May 08 - 06:57 PM
meself 19 May 08 - 01:00 AM
Rowan 19 May 08 - 12:00 AM
meself 18 May 08 - 11:40 PM
Azizi 18 May 08 - 11:27 PM
Azizi 18 May 08 - 11:17 PM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 18 May 08 - 08:46 PM
Rowan 18 May 08 - 06:52 PM
Azizi 18 May 08 - 09:05 AM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 18 May 08 - 07:18 AM
meself 18 May 08 - 01:24 AM
meself 17 May 08 - 10:15 PM
Azizi 17 May 08 - 10:38 AM
Jim Dixon 16 May 08 - 06:51 PM
Micca 15 May 08 - 07:01 PM
Don(Wyziwyg)T 15 May 08 - 05:14 PM
Little Hawk 14 May 08 - 07:55 PM
Jim Dixon 14 May 08 - 04:55 PM
Little Hawk 14 May 08 - 02:55 PM
Jim Dixon 14 May 08 - 01:22 PM
Bat Goddess 14 May 08 - 11:47 AM
Azizi 14 May 08 - 11:16 AM
theleveller 14 May 08 - 08:28 AM
Azizi 13 May 08 - 09:51 PM
Genie 13 May 08 - 06:23 PM
Little Hawk 13 May 08 - 11:42 AM
GUEST,Greycap 13 May 08 - 02:59 AM
Monique 13 May 08 - 02:36 AM
JennieG 12 May 08 - 11:56 PM
Azizi 12 May 08 - 11:28 PM
Azizi 12 May 08 - 11:08 PM
Azizi 12 May 08 - 10:25 PM
Azizi 12 May 08 - 10:17 PM
JennieG 12 May 08 - 08:05 PM
Azizi 12 May 08 - 08:05 PM
Azizi 12 May 08 - 08:01 PM
bobad 12 May 08 - 07:58 PM
Monique 12 May 08 - 07:34 PM
Azizi 12 May 08 - 07:28 PM
Azizi 12 May 08 - 07:19 PM
Azizi 12 May 08 - 07:00 PM
Azizi 12 May 08 - 06:47 PM
Azizi 12 May 08 - 06:44 PM
Little Hawk 12 May 08 - 06:36 PM
GUEST,Greycap 12 May 08 - 06:32 PM
Jim Dixon 12 May 08 - 03:44 PM
Jim Dixon 12 May 08 - 03:34 PM
Little Hawk 12 May 08 - 03:20 PM
Jim Dixon 12 May 08 - 02:13 PM
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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 19 May 08 - 07:52 PM

Thanks for the info, meself and Rowan. This is where I confess that I've not read any of Lewis Carroll's books. I guess I spent too much time reading comic books as a kid.

Just kiddin.

[But I did like a lot of the Superheroes comics, and Veronica & Archie, and Richie Rich, and...oh nevermind].

:o)


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Rowan
Date: 19 May 08 - 06:57 PM

Don't worry, meself; you were on the ball. The extract of Carroll's Preface (according to the same bit of Wikipedia) goes on to say;

"This also seems a fitting occasion to notice the other hard works in that poem. Humpty-Dumpty's theory, of two meanings packed into one word like a portmanteau, seems to me the right explanation for all.

For instance, take the two words "fuming" and "furious." Make up your mind that you will say both words, but leave it unsettled which you will say first. Now open your mouth and speak. If your thoughts incline ever so little towards " fuming," you will say "fuming-furious;" if they turn, by even a hair's breadth, towards "furious," you will say "furious-fuming;" but if you have the rarest of gifts, a perfectly balanced mind, you will say "frumious."

Cheers, Rowan


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: meself
Date: 19 May 08 - 01:00 AM

Ah! As I was typing 'fumious', I thought it odd that I had never noticed its apparent relation to the word 'fume' before ... now I know why!


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Rowan
Date: 19 May 08 - 12:00 AM

Meself has it, almost, although 'fumious bandersnatch' was 'frumious bandersnatch' the last time I looked.

According to Wackypedia;
"The Hunting of the Snark (An Agony in 8 Fits)" is a nonsense poem written by Lewis Carroll (Charles Lutwidge Dodgson) in 1874, when he was 42 years old. It describes "with infinite humor the impossible voyage of an improbable crew to find an inconceivable creature".[1] It borrows occasionally from Carroll's short poem "Jabberwocky" in Through the Looking-Glass (especially the poem's creatures and portmanteau words), but it is a stand-alone work, first published in 1876 by Macmillan. The illustrations were by Henry Holiday.
In common with other Carroll works, the meaning of his poems has been queried and analysed in depth. One of the most comprehensive gatherings of information about the poem and its meaning is The Annotated Snark by Martin Gardner.

'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves did gyre and gimble in the wabe... is the opening line. I'll let you make your own mind up whether slithy toves are "good" or "bad". Carroll's Preface has it that

"As this poem is to some extent connected with the lay of the Jabberwock, let me take this opportunity of answering a question that has often been asked me, how to pronounce "slithy toves." The "i" in "slithy" is long, as in "writhe"; and "toves" is pronounced so as to rhyme with "groves." Again, the first "o" in "borogoves" is pronounced like the "o" in "borrow." I have heard people try to give it the sound of the "o" in "worry. Such is Human Perversity."

Cheers, Rowan


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: meself
Date: 18 May 08 - 11:40 PM

"Slithy tove" is from the nonsense poem 'Jabberwocky' by Lewis Carroll, in Through the Looking Glass. The 'snark', if I remember correctly, is, along with the 'fumious bandersnatch' dispatched in short order by the nameless hero. (Or does the 'snark' show up only in 'The Hunting of the Snark'? Hmmm ... )


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 18 May 08 - 11:27 PM

I meant to also say to Don that I'm pleased to get to know you.

I also want to say that I don't think you or anyone else posting on this thread is a slithy tove-since by the way Rowan used that referent it sounds like that's something bad [bad="bad" in the standard English lingo and not bad="good" in the African American lingo].


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 18 May 08 - 11:17 PM

So, Rowan, are you going to provide a definition for "slithy toves" or do you want those who are unfamiliar with those two words-like me-to guess, and probably end up guessing wrong?


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 18 May 08 - 08:46 PM

"I took exception to an imaginary Suss law in which the police targeted minority people.

Sometimes life is strange because it's so much like fiction {which may have nothing to do with the price of beans in Boston, but I think it sounds good}"

You're right Azizi, though you couldn't write it as fiction, cos nobody would believe it.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Rowan
Date: 18 May 08 - 06:52 PM

Brillig thread, Azizi.
I was going to add that you seem to have those slithy toves on the run (concerning snarks) but then I saw the correspondence with Don and I don't want anyone to infer I'm referring to him as a slithy tove; I'm not 'coz he's not.

When I saw Micca's guess that "take a boo" is more likely to come from the Cockney rhyming slang phrase which in full is "Take a butchers hook" that is "take a look" it seemed to me that Micca was relying on "boo" rhyming with "book" rather than with "you". I'd suggest "take a boo" is more likely to come from "peek-a-boo" and 'taking a peek' at whatever is the object of attention.

And theleveller's I've learned to say "no" reminded me of the old saw;

Questioner: Do you know what was the first oral contraceptive"
Repondent: No.
Questioner: That's right!

Cheers, Rowan (who had occasion to use "dithyrhambic", orally, the other day)


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 18 May 08 - 09:05 AM

Hello, Don(Wyziwyg)T.

Thank you for writing a post in response to my post that was written in response to your post. Also, thanks for sending me a private message that was in response to my private message that I wrote informing you of my post that was written {etc}

I appreciate your clarification that your post was serious in all regards and that there really was a "Suss Law" in England. {or should I have said Great Britain or The United Kingdom? Or maybe England and either Great Britain or The United Kingdom are correct since that law may have been instituted before there was a Great Britain or a United Kingdom??}

When I wrote in my 17 May 08 - 10:38 AM post about how a reader may not "get" that a comment is snark, this sentence would have better conveyed what I meant to say: "Determining whether a comment is serious or snark may be difficult if the reader is from a different culture than the person writing the comment. Being from a different culture may mean that the reader doesn't understand the comment's historical, cultural, and/or political context."

Minor or major misunderstandings can be more likely on forums and blogs such as Mudcat where posters are from different nations, and not just-perhaps- from different racial, ethnic, and/or religious backgrounds within the same nation. And minor or major misunderstanding can lead to bad feelings or anger between posters.

Don, I appreciate that you didn't get on a set * over my comment.

* get bent out of shape; take exception to; get angry about

Although I misunderstood your post, I assure you that I wasn't angry with you about it. I just wanted to be on record with a statement that if your post was snark [which I realize now that it wasn't],
I took exception to an imaginary Suss law in which the police targeted minority people.

Sometimes life is strange because it's so much like fiction {which may have nothing to do with the price of beans in Boston, but I think it sounds good}

:o)

Best wishes,

Azizi


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 18 May 08 - 07:18 AM

Miss Azizi,

If you ask anyone who knows me you will learn that I have ZERO sense of humour where racism is concerned.

My post re the Suss law is entirely serious, and, to the best of my knowledge, entirely accurate, excepting my stated uncertainty as to the exact date of repeal.

There were indeed allegations that some who were perceived, probably with SOME justification, as institutionally racist officers, were unfairly targetting ethnic minority citizens for "stop and search", amounting to harrassment.

The right to stop and search "on suspicion" was indeed curtailed, though there IS currently a debate going on about bringing it back in some modified and monitered way.

I reserve sarcasm mostly for responses to attacks on my ethics, and my humour is for the most part fairly obvious. I would hate to have to worry about posting on serious subjects for fear of being misunderstood.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: meself
Date: 18 May 08 - 01:24 AM

Speaking of which - I just came across this usage of that term on another thread:

Subject: RE: German folk music
From: GeorgeH - PM
Date: 21 Aug 01 - 06:28 AM

Yeh, I was just wanting to be a bit provocative . .
More mishief than anything - you sussed me! (Although I do stand by what I said . . I cannot see any basis for the view that the IRA are left wing.)

G.




(Now - let's not get sidetracked into a squabble about the IRA!)


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: meself
Date: 17 May 08 - 10:15 PM

I took Don's post at face-value (there's another curious expression!) - in other words, I assumed he was simply relating fact, not trying to funny ...

By the way, the police once stopped me for a chat when I was heading into an alley, late at night, with a rectangular violin case in hand. I was just taking a short-cut home from a gig, but it must have looked suspicious ... so they sussed me out!


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 17 May 08 - 10:38 AM

A relatively new word for me is snark.

There are a number of definitions of the word "snark" that can be found online. One definition for the word "snark" is "an imaginary animal created by Lewis Carroll in his poem The Hunting of the Snark

Etymology: prob. < sn(ake) + (sh)ark"
http://www.yourdictionary.com/snark

Here's some other definitions of the word "snark":

[Lewis Carroll, via the Michigan Terminal System]
1. A system failure. When a user's process bombed, the operator would get the message "Help, Help, Snark in MTS!"

2. More generally, any kind of unexplained or threatening
event on a computer (especially if it might be a boojum).
Often used to refer to an event or a log file entry that might
indicate an attempted security violation. See snivitz.

3. UUCP name of snark.thyrsus.com, home site of the Hacker
Jargon File versions 2.*.*.

http://dictionary.die.net/snark



However, I've become more familiar with the use of that term by bloggers to refer to sarcastic, perhaps witty comments. I'm not sure how the word "snark" came to mean "a sarcastic comment." But that wrod is certainly used that way on a number of blogs.

The problem is determining whether a blogger meant his or her comment to be taken seriously or read as a snark. Besides writing the word "snark" after a comment, there doesn't seem to be an easy way to indicate that an Internet post is supposed to be taken sarcastically. This can lead to a lot of confusion and arguments.

Here's a comment from a dailykos poster about the problems inherent in writing on the Internet:

On the web, without the benefit of inflection and facial expression, I think it's doubly and triply important to go out of one's way to be clear about meaning and tone. Half the time I feel I'm having to make clear what I DON"T mean.

Typically, one makes a comment, it is misunderstood in several different ways. If both parties are sufficiently committed to communication, the misunderstandings are finally pared away and the original meaning gets through. In the meantime, the whole exercise has exhausted or antagonized people to the effect that the original simple meaning seems less important than the frustrating struggle to be heard clearly.

In short, on the internet, fighting begets fighting, even in the face of agreement.
-geomoo, May 16, 2008
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/5/16/17255/1845/372/494909

**

Sometimes snark comments are quite obviously snarky and sometimes people find it more difficult to determine if a comment should be taken seriously, or should be considered a snark.

The person reading a snark comment might not "get" that the comment is snark because that reader is unfamiliar with a particular culture, and thus doesn't understand the cultural context of the comment. Also, readers may have difficulty discerning whether a comment is snark or not because they don't know the person who wrote the comment [they don't know that person's background and his or her posting history and therefore can't use that to judge whether the person is being serious or not].

For example, Don(Wyziwyg)T, I admit that I don't know whether your
15 May 08 - 05:14 PM post is serious in whole or in part, or is wholly snark or some other attempt at witticism. For instance, when you said that the word "suss" came from the word "suspicious", I thought that your post might be serious. But then when I continued reading it, I reversed that conclusion.

Don(Wyziwyg)T, I admit that sometimes I don't have a good sense of humor. I also admit that I don't know you well. But, I wanna say that I didn't find the last part of your post funny-though it might indeed be witty- as it seemed to be close to actual police practices that occur in many African American and Latino communities. One such practice that I'm referring to is Driving While Black {DWB}


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 16 May 08 - 06:51 PM

Why are groups of Morris dancers called "sides"?

And when they get together, do they sing "Which Side Are You On?"

Here's another word I learned recently: "backscatter." It's when you suddenly get a ton of messages in your inbox, all automatically generated, saying that an e-mail that you sent could not be delivered because it had an invalid address. Except you didn't send it. Some spammer did, and they sent it in your name.

It happened to me, and the IT department of the university where I work explained it.

There's some information at Yahoo News.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Micca
Date: 15 May 08 - 07:01 PM

Jim, There is a morris side in the UK (London I think) called "Prince Albert Morris" where all the "members" are reputed to be pierced in this fashion


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Don(Wyziwyg)T
Date: 15 May 08 - 05:14 PM

Suss goes back at least to Edwardian times, as a cockney abbreviation of the word suspicion.

It arose out of the fact that British policemen were allowed to stop and search anyone out on the streets, especially if they were carrying a bag or rucksack, "on suspicion of possibly going equipped for crime". Referred to as "The Suss Law", it was repealed, I think in the 80s (not certain about that), following claims that it was being abused by police targetting ethnic minority groups.

Don T.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 May 08 - 07:55 PM

Well, looks like they just lowered the bar on stupidity, doesn't it? ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 14 May 08 - 04:55 PM

Yeah, unfortunately, though, I am no longer up to date on current slang.

Which reminds me, I recently learned that a "Prince Albert" is "one of the common forms of male genital piercing." Warning: the cringe factor of this illustration is rather high.

I learned that from my son, who had to explain a joke to me.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Little Hawk
Date: 14 May 08 - 02:55 PM

Wow. That's pretty remarkable, Jim. You have made your mark on our cultural history. ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 14 May 08 - 01:22 PM

On the subject of defining new words, you might enjoy this story:

Back when I was a college student in, I think, 1967 or 68, I took an "interim" poetry course—the only English class I ever took in college, because I tested out of the requirement. One day the professor told the class that someone had started, or was planning to start, a journal called "Current Slang." He invited us to write down all the recent, trendy slang words we knew, along with definitions, each on a separate 3 x 5 card. After a few days, he collected all the cards and mailed them off to the editor.

One of the words I contributed was "moon" as a verb. I defined it as "to display one's bare buttocks as a taunt." Actually, I had known that usage for a year or two by that time, but I must have been the first person to submit a definition, because when the journal came out, my definition was used. Boy, was I proud! Only an undergraduate, and already a published author in a scholarly journal! (OK, an author of just one sentence, but still…!)

I just now Googled the phrase "display one's bare buttocks as a taunt" and I found one quote in a blog:
    The first recorded instance usage [sic] of "moon" as "exposing the buttocks" comes in 1968, defined in Current Slang (Univ. S. Dakota) thusly: "Moon, to display one's bare buttocks as a taunt."
So if that blogger is correct, my definition was not only the first definition published in that particular journal, but the first usage recorded anywhere. Is that right?

I see my definition didn't quite make it verbatim into other dictionaries, though. Answers.com has
    Slang. To expose one's buttocks to (others) as a prank or disrespectful gesture: "threatened to moon a passing . . . camera crew" (Vanity Fair).

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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Bat Goddess
Date: 14 May 08 - 11:47 AM

Speaking of dogfish (see The Walrus above), "dogfish" is Maine lingo for summer tourist -- as they both (tourists and dogfish, a variety of small shark) show up in the summer and are destructive.

You don't see perforations on the sides of computer paper much any more, for easy removal of the pin feed section of the sheet, but there was a contest back in the early '90s to name what was removed to make the 8.5 x 11 sheet. I liked the term "snap" ("just pull the snap off and give me the invoice") but I think something else actually won.

Late yesterday while surfing copyediting websites I came across a WONDERFUL turn of phrase for an online moderator -- "troll whisperer" ; I've already passed it on to a couple people who can use it. It was in an article by Gerri Berendzen.

Linn


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 14 May 08 - 11:16 AM

theleveller, good job!

I know how to say that word in English and in Spanish.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: theleveller
Date: 14 May 08 - 08:28 AM

I've learned to say "no".


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 13 May 08 - 09:51 PM

Genie, click here for definitions for "pringe": http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Pringe.

Those entries indicate that "pringe" is an insulting term for a man. The words "prick" and "minge" are mentioned in those definitions. It's possible that "pringe" was coined by using the beginning letter for the word "prick" and rhyming the word "minge".

According to entries giving the definition of that word "minge" is a vulgar term which specifically refers to the hair around the vagina. You won't be surprised to learn that urbandictionary.com has a long list of phrases that start with "minge."
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=minge

I hasten to say that I had no knowledge of either of those words before researching them tonight. But if these definitions are accurate, the most polite interpretation of the sentence "Tom, as the Historian, 'pringed' the audience a couple of times" is that a couple of times, Tom, the Historian, did not speak kindly about that play's audience. Of course, thats interpretation is just a guess. I may be completely wrong. [That has happened from time to time in my life-being wrong that is and not being pringed].

**

Btw, Gene, I've never read or heard the word "dithyrambic" before either. Thanks for sharing these words with us-though I'm sure that no Mudcat member or Mudcat regular guest would ever even think about using the first two words...


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Genie
Date: 13 May 08 - 06:23 PM

I've learned two new words in the last couple days.
Well, in one case I shouldn't really say "learned" because I don't know what the word means. Don't even know if it's a "legit" word or slang. Maybe you can help me.
That mystery word is "pringe" (v. transitive). One example of its usage was:
"Tom, as the Historian, "pringed" the audience a couple of times." (This was in a discussion about a Broadway play.)
Anyone know what "pringe" means?

The other is an actual word - just not one very commonly used:
"dithyrambic" - adj. or noun

"1 : a poem, usually short, in an inspired wild irregular strain
2 : a statement or writing in an exalted or enthusiastic vein"

(I may have to do a little more research on the common usage of that one.)


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Little Hawk
Date: 13 May 08 - 11:42 AM

That song, "Valley Girl", like TOTALLY covers it all, Azizi. Oh my God! Majorly cool! What a bitchin' song! I am, like, over the moon, like, you know?


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: GUEST,Greycap
Date: 13 May 08 - 02:59 AM

Monique & Bobad,
Thanks for the assist - I can say 'thanks' to my local librarian, now, with more confidence.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Monique
Date: 13 May 08 - 02:36 AM

Azizi, I'm posting from France, the Polish thing was in my Polish/French dictionary BUT sorry, I didn't read all the explanation about "dz" and got it wrong, it says that "ę" (I copied/pasted and it didn't show properly) is pronounced like French "in" but that it's denasalized before some consonants including "k". I actually didn't check on line. But here and there it sounds different from on Bobad's link, it sounds Djen/Jen-koo-yen with "en" sounding like the French "in".


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: JennieG
Date: 12 May 08 - 11:56 PM

Azizi, I don't know that the 'Bring It On' movies were as big here in Oz as they were in the US. But the big thing now is 'Gossip Girls' - I think it's a TV series? - we are starting to get the books. (I'm a library assistant not a teacher) In 2000 when 'Bring It On' started I was working in a co-ed school, the culture there was very different to the all-girls school where I have worked since 2002.

Not far from work is a large shopping mall, Westfield (a chain of malls) at Burwood. That's where the girls hang out after school - the chickybabe shops, the ones with tiny clothing and thumping loud music, are just inside the front door. One has to run the teenage gauntlet to get to the food shops inside!

Cheers
JennieG


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 12 May 08 - 11:28 PM

Also, Jennie, another cheer that was featured in that first Bring It On movie, was called "Bang Bang Choo Choo Train". That cheer was performed by the Clovers ["inner-city" squad] and isn't Valley Girl lingo. I saw that cheer performed in 1997 in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania area before the Bring It On movies. My website Cocojams has also received a lot of different versions of that cheer, which I've posted on the cheerleading page as well as on the School Yard Taunting Rhymes page and on the Foot Stomping Cheer's page.

Here's one example:

bang bang choo choo train train come on girls lets do this thing i cant y not i cant y not cause by back is acking and my bras to tight and my body shaking from the left to the right and my momma said my pants to tight but my boyfriend said they fit just rite
-ashley k.; 3/13/2007

http://cocojams.com/cheerleader_cheers.htm

**

In the version that I heard in 1997 was structured and performed as a foot stomping cheer-the group said the first "bang bang choo choo train" line and said a girl's name. That girl said the back is aching/bra's too tight/bootie [meaning her behind] shaking from the left to the right line. The cheer then started again with a new soloist who gave her name or nickname, and this pattern continued until every girl in the group had one turn as the soloist. This was performed to a moderately tempo, percussive beat that alternated bass sounding foot stomps and [individual] handclaps.

**

Jenny, I'd love to find out if girls who attend your high school in Australia know "Bang Bang Choo Choo Train" and whether they learned it from the Bring It On movies.

Thanks, in advance!


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 12 May 08 - 11:08 PM

Jennie, when you get back to teaching at your high school, if it's possible, I'd love it if you could find out if students in your school are familiar with the four Bring It On cheerleader movies? Here's a link to the wikipedia for the first movie in that series [2000]. I ask because the characters for the suburban cheerleading squad in that series-The Toros, speak "Valley Girl". In the first movie-and I think some of the others-that cheerleading squad competes against what is described as an inner city cheerleading squad [the first squad is primarily composed of White high school girls, and the second squad is primarily composed of Black high school girls].

I've received lots of examples of the cheers that were featured in those movies, including some that are written in "Valley Girlese". Here's one of the many versions of a cheer that was featured in the first Bring It On movie:

"Like totally, for sure I just got a manicure The sun, I swear It's bleaching out my hair I just lost an earring But I gotta' keep on cheering 33 to 44 I don't know that silly score Win Win Fight Fight Gee I hope I look alright? Don't answer."
-Cheer Mom; 9/13/2006; http://cocojams.com/cheerleader_cheers.htm

Cheer Mom wrote this comment: "First I wanted to point out that that cheer about the Toros (in the Like, totally genre) is from [the movie] Bring it on. Copied exactly. I coach midget football cheer and my girls do a version of that".

-snip-

Jennie, could this [at least part] of the reason why girls in your school are speaking Valley Girl lingo?


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 12 May 08 - 10:25 PM

Here's some information about Valley Girl talk. [I vaguely recall posting this same quote on another Mudcat thread, but I don't have a clue which one it was].

"In "Like, totally, the end of one mall's era," CNN April 15, 1999, Anne McDermott wrote the following: "There was a time when the Sherman Oaks Galleria was the most famous mall in America, at least among those of a certain age. They loved the Galleria and loved that it was mentioned in the 1982 Frank and Moon Unit Zappa hit single, "Valley Girl." And why not? The Galleria was widely considered to be the birthplace of the "Val" (as Valley Girls would refer to each other in a kind of shorthand). It all began in the fall of 1980. That's when the Galleria opened in the heart of Los Angeles' San Fernando Valley, better known locally as "the valley." Back then, the three-story, skylighted, enclosed structure was considered the epitome of all that was cool in mass consumption. Teens discovered the Galleria and quickly packed the place. It had everything: trendy boutiques, Pac-Man game booths and what passed for exotic fare at the food arcade (yes, even hot dogs on a stick). Plenty of the mall rats enjoying all this were boys, but, for some reason, it was the girls who were noticed. And somehow, someone, somewhere, thought to call them "Valley Girls." Like, totally, a lingo To be called a "Valley Girl" was not exactly a compliment. It conjured up images of vacuous, giggly girls with lots of time on their hands and a bizarre language on their lips. Moon Zappa captured a lot of that talk in 'Valley Girl,' the song she wrote and recorded with her father. Naturally enough, she learned her Val-Speak at the Galleria, where she got to know a lot of Vals. Moon Zappa satirized the culture with lyrics that emphasized the air-headedness of Valley Girls, but in a recent interview, she said she only wrote the song so she could spend more time with her father. In those days, Frank Zappa was touring with his band nine months of the year, and Moon, then 14, simply missed her dad."

http://history.sandiego.edu/GEN/snd/valleygirl.html

[Click that link for Valley Girl; Song and lyrics by Frank Zappa, performed by Zappa's 14-year old daughter Moon Unit, recorded on the album "Ship Arriving Too Late To Save a Drowning Witch" released May 1982]


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 12 May 08 - 10:17 PM

Hey, JennieG! I'm sure all of us hope that you feel better soon [become uncrooked?]

And with regards to Ozziespeak, please share more, more [examples]!!


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: JennieG
Date: 12 May 08 - 08:05 PM

Love the thread Azizi! Words and language are fascinating....after all that's how we human beans communicate with each other.

Working in a girls' high school (but off work this week because I am crook*) I have noticed the Valley Girl/Paris Hilton wannabee speech is rife. I have been asked "do you, like, have the book with the yellow cover on, like, you know, that historical thing that happened a long time ago? like?"

The English language is constantly changing and evolving but I'm not sure in what particular direction........

*crook = Ozziespeak for not well, I have shingles, ouch

Cheers
Jennie


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 12 May 08 - 08:05 PM

Oh. Which Polish pronunciation is the right one? Or are there regional variations and both are right?

True, it's unlikely, but who knows... I might have to say "thank you" in Polish one day].

And, is there a Polish saying that translates like the English "You're welcome"?


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 12 May 08 - 08:01 PM

Monique, how is "Tsee" pronounced? Like "tee-see" {with "tee" pronounced like "tea", the hot drink and "see" like "sea", the body of water?}

Also, Monique, are posting from Poland? And are any these slang words and phrases used in Poland?


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: bobad
Date: 12 May 08 - 07:58 PM

Greycap - thank you in Polish is "Dziekuję" - pronounced JEN koo yeh

Hear it here


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Monique
Date: 12 May 08 - 07:34 PM

Polish thanks: Dziękuję: pronounced Tsee-enkooyen, the last "en" being a nasal sound like "in" in French


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 12 May 08 - 07:28 PM

I just read this post on a political blog and thought that it's relevant to this thread:

"... Some terms may be widely recognizable, but carry alternate meanings in particular regions. The back forty, which means a large, remote, often barren stretch of land, and is used throughout the north and the west, takes on a figurative cast when lumberjacks in New England use it to refer to an out-of-the-way place. And if someone is wasting your time, a Michigander might say, "He's been plowing the back forty." "
-CATHERINE, on May 12th, 2008 at 3:16 pm

http://ruralvotes.com/thefield/?p=1183#comments


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 12 May 08 - 07:19 PM

I just got hipped to the phrase "I drink your milkshake". Supposedly that phrase is hot, or at least it was hot for a while and now some folks say it has become less hot {which isn't the same thing as "cool"}.

Here's some info from urbandictionary.com about that phrase:

"i drink your milkshake

Line used by Daniel Day Lewis (Daniel Plainview) in the movie "There will be Blood".

This line is used to insult opposition in the moment of victory or revenge.

"I drink your milkshake!" - This can be used after dumping girl/boyfriend, quiting your job, scoring a winning point or teasing a friend bitterly.
by Nigel Clarke New York, New York Jan 24, 2008

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=i+drink+your+milkshake

-snip-

And here's an brief essay about that phrase:

"I'm gonna drink your milkshake!
You sit there thinking you got it all figured out.

You know how you're going to make a lot of money... or how you're going to make this church grow ... or how you're going to beat the competition ... or how you're going to be better than someone else ... How your milkshake is better than the next guy's in flavor, quantity, everything.

And then you realize that someone's got their straw in your milkshake, sucking out all the good stuff before you know what's happened.

In the movie, There Will Be Blood, the Daniel Day-Lewis character shouts in a pivotal scene, "I drink your milkshake." The phrase has already hit YouTube with parodies. It's the new buzz phrase du semaine.

See the movie.

And keep an eye on your milkshake. Don't assume that there isn't someone else who's got a bigger, longer, better straw.

In fact, chances are, there probably is."

http://tmerril.blogs.com/timothy_merrill/2008/02/im-gonna-drink.html


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 12 May 08 - 07:00 PM

Here's an example of a contemporary American slang word that I don't think came from African Americans -"pwned".

There are a number of entries from urbandictionary.com posters for the word "pwned". Here's one of them:

pwned   

"Unlike the other people who have posted definitions that are ridiculous, do not have substantial backing, or are simply mis-informed, I will give the complete definition of what "pwned" means.

1. The origins of "pwned" are debated but there are two possible sources:
a. A prominent quake player mis spelled "owned" and the new word "pwned" was adopted by people who thought it was "1337".
b. A warcraft map designer misspelled "owned" and thus people started using "pwned" instead.

The definitions are as follows:
In video games:
1. Completely annihilated or dominated.
2. Perfectly owned, meaning the other player did not do any damage.

I pwned your head with my awp.

OR

I just pwned your ass noob!"
-by jack Nov 17, 2003

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pwned&defid=835533

-snip-

According to Wikipedia, "pnwed" is "derived from the word "own"... that implies domination or humiliation of a rival, used primarily in the Internet gaming culture to taunt an opponent who has just been soundly defeated. Past tense is sometimes spelled pwnt (pronounced with a t sound), pwned, pwnd, pwn3d, or powned (with the standard d sound). Examples include "pwnage" or "you just got pwned".

In Internet security jargon, to "pwn" means "to compromise" or "to control", specifically another computer (server or PC), web site, gateway device, or application; it is synonymous with one of the definitions of hacking or cracking. An outside party who has "owned" or "pwned" a system has obtained unauthorized administrative control of the system."...

Use, online and in popular culture

The 2006 South Park episode, Make Love, Not Warcraft, satirized the game World of Warcraft. In the episode, the word is pronounced [poʊn] (pone), rhyming with "own".
"Looks like you're about to get pwned. Yeah!" - Eric Cartman (20m 30s into episode)
"That was such über-pwnage" - Kyle Broflovski (soon after above) ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pwn


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 12 May 08 - 06:47 PM

Jim Dixon, with regard to the second paragraph of your 12 May 08 - 03:34 PM post, I'm not sure if convenience or a more specific definition or a broader definition are reasons why many slang words are coined. I think that many of these words are coined as expressions of creativity which serve to differentiate the hip from the un-hip {the cool from the square}. Those who are hip to the latest slang words & phrase are cool, and hip. Those who still use old slang words/phrases or standard words & phrases are square.

In addition, I think that slang serves as an important way of expressing & reinforcing in-group identity. Those groups may be limited to a particular racial/ethnic population, and/or may cross racial/ethnic lines. For instance, many of the words & phrases in contemporary American slang come from hip-hop culture. I think it's fair to say that hip-hop culture originated among African Americans and that African Americans continue to be most influential population in how persons in hip-hop culture express themselves {music, dance, verbal and written communication, naming practices, clothing styles etc}. However, other populations besides African Americans have influenced hip-hop. For example, there's little doubt that the music industry [which doesn't have African Americans in the real power positions] has promoted gangsta rap over other forms of hip-hop music. This emphasis on gangsta rap influences which recording artists, and which records, and which slang words & expressions receive the most play.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Azizi
Date: 12 May 08 - 06:44 PM

Thanks for posting to this thread. Keep those examples and comments coming!


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 May 08 - 06:36 PM

"Pkcsknlzntchiztlsk!"

Don't ask me how to pronounce it. ;-)


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: GUEST,Greycap
Date: 12 May 08 - 06:32 PM

The one that I really, really want to know is how to pronounce the Polish word for 'Thanks' if any 'Catter can assist?
The spelling is weird and gives no indication what the noise should sound like.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 12 May 08 - 03:44 PM

"Prime," "Choice," and "Select" are official terms defined by the US Department of Agriculture for the grading of beef.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 12 May 08 - 03:34 PM

There are a whole bunch of words that "dis" or "diss" could be short for: disrespect, disparage, discount, dismiss, discredit, disdain, disallow, dishonor—and if I had a dictionary handy, I could probably find some more. They all describe ways we don't want people to treat us. I'd like to think whoever coined "diss" had all of them in mind.

I think, when people coin, or use, new words, it isn't only for convenience—in this case, not only because it's easier to pronounce one syllable than three. It's also because they want a word that doesn't mean exactly what the older word meant. They want a word that is either more specific, or (in this case) broader than the original. I think "diss" was meant to describe a broader range of attitudes and behaviors than "disrespect" alone would mean.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Little Hawk
Date: 12 May 08 - 03:20 PM

Then there's the "viddo". It's similar. It's when you search the net for good videos of Winona Ryder, but you somehow end up linking to old footage of Maggie Thatcher addressing the Commons...

This can bloody well ruin your mood for the rest of the day.


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Subject: RE: BS: New Words & Phrases You've Learned
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 12 May 08 - 02:13 PM

A word I learned within the last year or so is "scanno." Analogous to "typo," it means an error introduced by an optical scanner, or more accurately, the combination of an optical scanner and an OCR program that converts the image to editable or searchable text. A common "scanno" is to substitute the number "1" for the letter "l" or a number "0" for the letter "O." You run into a lot of scannos when you search old books with Google Book Search.


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