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More Music Less BS!

G.A.S.P. 06 May 99 - 10:42 AM
Peter Fisher 06 May 99 - 11:01 AM
MMario 06 May 99 - 11:03 AM
Margo 06 May 99 - 11:12 AM
KingBrilliant 06 May 99 - 11:15 AM
Allan C. 06 May 99 - 11:22 AM
Sam Pirt 06 May 99 - 11:22 AM
Big Mick 06 May 99 - 11:33 AM
MMario 06 May 99 - 11:40 AM
Peter T. 06 May 99 - 11:47 AM
Bert 06 May 99 - 11:57 AM
Rick Fielding 06 May 99 - 02:44 PM
katlaughing 06 May 99 - 03:57 PM
bbc 06 May 99 - 04:23 PM
MMario 06 May 99 - 04:29 PM
annamill 06 May 99 - 04:55 PM
katlaughing 06 May 99 - 05:06 PM
Banjer 06 May 99 - 05:45 PM
jets 06 May 99 - 06:33 PM
AllisonA(Animaterra) 06 May 99 - 06:59 PM
SeanM 06 May 99 - 07:02 PM
campfire 06 May 99 - 07:05 PM
Margo 06 May 99 - 07:14 PM
Shula 06 May 99 - 07:42 PM
bet 06 May 99 - 07:49 PM
John in Brisbane 06 May 99 - 08:04 PM
Tucker 06 May 99 - 09:34 PM
Sheye 06 May 99 - 09:46 PM
McMusic 06 May 99 - 09:54 PM
Lonesome EJ 06 May 99 - 11:04 PM
northfolk/al cholger 06 May 99 - 11:13 PM
BK 06 May 99 - 11:38 PM
bseed(charleskratz) 07 May 99 - 12:19 AM
Sandy Paton 07 May 99 - 12:38 AM
gargoyle 07 May 99 - 12:39 AM
katlaughing 07 May 99 - 12:52 AM
Bri 07 May 99 - 12:56 AM
ddw in windsor 07 May 99 - 01:15 AM
Night Owl 07 May 99 - 01:42 AM
SeanM 07 May 99 - 01:48 AM
Lonesome EJ 07 May 99 - 02:00 AM
bseed(charleskratz) 07 May 99 - 02:51 AM
reggie miles 07 May 99 - 03:16 AM
MudGuard 07 May 99 - 03:49 AM
leprechaun 07 May 99 - 04:04 AM
Banjer 07 May 99 - 04:49 AM
Wolfgang 07 May 99 - 05:24 AM
dwditty 07 May 99 - 05:46 AM
Big Mick 07 May 99 - 09:12 AM
Peter T. 07 May 99 - 09:38 AM
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Subject: More Music Less BS!
From: G.A.S.P.
Date: 06 May 99 - 10:42 AM

ENOUGH OF THIS NONSENSE!


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Peter Fisher
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:01 AM

Is that your last gasp?


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: MMario
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:03 AM

I presume you know how to NOT read?

MMario


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Margo
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:12 AM

To read thread, or not to read thread. That is the question. Whether it is nobler to suffer what you consider BS or pick and choose what looks interesting to you. Alas, poor gasp, I know you not, but you don't sound like a fellow of infinate wit and jest .

Let me not thrash Willy the Shake anymore, you get the point.

Margarita :>)


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: KingBrilliant
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:15 AM

Killjoy woz 'ere?

I LIKE a little nonsense with my music-stuff.


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Allan C.
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:22 AM

The stuff I believe you are labeling as B.S. is the very thing which makes the Mudcat the place most of us WANT to hang out. It would be a dreary place indeed if it became little more than a lyrics database and quick-question-simple-answer site. While there are some who prefer to visit a bare bones place, it has become quite evident that most of us prefer to visit a place which is furnished with amenities such as comradship, humor, compassion, and an amazing array of expertise. If you consider yourself to be among the former group, I am sure you can find another site more amenable to your requirements.


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Sam Pirt
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:22 AM

Just to throw an iron in the works, to some music is nonsence and has no place on this earth, I mean whats the point in it?!!!! (obiously these aren't my views, I am addicted to Music and song BIG TIME, and best of all, I DON'T CARE!!!)

Bye, Sam


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Big Mick
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:33 AM

Dear G.A.S.P.,

Glad you dropped by, sorry you don't get it. Hope you give a try for a bit, but doubt you will. Please make me admit later that I was wrong about you. I will do so cheerfully.

Mick


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: MMario
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:40 AM

In fairness to gasp; we have been through a rather stressful couple of weeks, and I think may have broken out in a little more silliness then perhaps usual. But I've been 'catting for quite some time now and STILL haven't worked my way through all the old threads that ARE about music. So there is plenty of material out there, gasp, if the current stuff isn't up to your standards.

MMario


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Peter T.
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:47 AM

I have checked out the Database for "More Music, Less B.S." without success, nor can I find any lines that begin "Enough of this Nonsense". Could you clarify, or try elsewhere?

Yours, Peter T.


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Bert
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:57 AM

There should be a little "TRACE" button out there somewhere that allows you to select which threads are of interest to you.

Bert.


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 06 May 99 - 02:44 PM

Mick, thank you. It was SO simple, and yet I couldn't come up with it no matter how hard I tried. I'm referring to your phrase "sorry you don't get it". From now on, anytime I see something that I perceive as totally dumb or rude or inappropriate, I don't have to risk censure by responding heatedly, I can just say "sorry you don't get it", and at least I'LL know what I really meant.


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: katlaughing
Date: 06 May 99 - 03:57 PM

What Allan, Mick, MMario, Rick, PeterT., Margarita, and the rest of them said, only double, no....TRIPLE!!!! Sheesh! Set your button for 365 days of threads and then tell me ya can't find enough to read on music!!! Is somebody forcing you to read these?

katlaughing and grinning,NONSENSICALLY!!!!


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: bbc
Date: 06 May 99 - 04:23 PM

You've all said it well, but I feel the need to throw in my 2-cents worth, too. A couple of thoughts--1)G.A.S.P., we all came in for music, but we found a really neat group of people, as well. Give us a try. 2)If you want music threads, a more positive approach to getting them is to start one, rather than complaining that there aren't enough. Hope to hear more about your interests & areas of expertise in the future.

bbc


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: MMario
Date: 06 May 99 - 04:29 PM

KatL - did you Say "tiple"?


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: annamill
Date: 06 May 99 - 04:55 PM

Yeah! Buzz off! NOI

Was that too terse?

Anna


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: katlaughing
Date: 06 May 99 - 05:06 PM

TIPLE...TIPLE...TIPLE!!!YES! YES!YES!


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Banjer
Date: 06 May 99 - 05:45 PM

I also cannot add anything to what my fellow Mudcatters have already and so eloquently said. You, Mr G.A.S.P. are one of the many reasons that switches marked OFF were invented. If you don't like it here, go elsewhere. As stated previously, we would love to have you as part of the community, but please don't inconvenience yourself. The same route by which you came in will also let you out!


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: jets
Date: 06 May 99 - 06:33 PM

I for one find the BS interesting and often very informative .I often get a laugh,I get tips on how to get over things like stage fright and other thoughts on performing .I also read things that I am not in agreement with but do take an interest in what your thoughts are. The BS is a great part of the reason that I am here


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: AllisonA(Animaterra)
Date: 06 May 99 - 06:59 PM

Hey, all, this is starting to sound just a wee bit ... well, insensitive is the most tactful word I can think of at the moment. While Joe O is away I feel I should step in as the local peacemaker and remind you all that one of the real joys of this place is the courtesy and openness we all share- yeah, even ol' Paw and the other outrageous members (I name no names!) G*A*S*P came on strong, but the point has been made and very well. Now, come on, y'all, there's gotta be some great songs about BS!
Allison (tsk-tsking and finger wagging)


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: SeanM
Date: 06 May 99 - 07:02 PM

Songs about BS? I'd like to nominate at least fully half of the complete catalog of Disco... Maybe all of it...

M


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: campfire
Date: 06 May 99 - 07:05 PM

My 2 cents - Did you never tell a co-worker about a movie you saw? Or ask someone who sits next to you in church where they grew up? None of these bits of information "matter" in relation to how or why you might be speaking to someone, but they fill out the personalities and help in getting to know someone. If I don't want to make small talk at work, I close my office door. If I only have a few minutes on-line, and want to stick to "business", I probably skip some threads. Anyone here has the same choice. Only read what interests you. But if you're open, you'll be surprised what you might find.

campfire


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Margo
Date: 06 May 99 - 07:14 PM

Hey, you know what? Gasp didn't exactly say explicitly what he meant by nonsense. He left it up to us to jump to conclusions. If gasp really wants a discussion he/she ought to tell us exactly what he's talking about. Come back GASP and tell us! Come Baaaaaaaaack........

Margarita


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Shula
Date: 06 May 99 - 07:42 PM

Dear G.A.S.P.,

During the educational stone-age in which I served my time, I once had a teacher who thoughtfully pointed out that while I might, indeed, read during recess, I should not be excused to make use of the swings, slides, see-saws and jungle-jims during class.

Now that youth has fled, I can still read whenever I please, but I have realised, too late to do more than watch, that I miss the swings un-swung every mite as much as I would have missed the books unread.

Were we all ascetic scholars, what would we have to sing of? And why, from such a narrow view, would we wish to sing at all?

Gently,

Shula


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: bet
Date: 06 May 99 - 07:49 PM

G.A.S.P. bye!


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 06 May 99 - 08:04 PM

As an old sewerage engineer friend tells me "What's shit to you is bread and butter to me!" I'm more than happy to accept our diversity, but I have a very practical difficulty with the counsel offered above.

I don't have the time these days to read all the threads, so I try to pick those threads that provide new lyrics and tunes, or new information about existing folk songs.

But here's the rub! There are a lot of new songs buried in the bullshit (i.e. not my bread and butter), or under headings that appear innocuous to me. Is there some way of ensuring that this cream rises to the top and becomes more visible?

Regards
John


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Tucker
Date: 06 May 99 - 09:34 PM

Hey Guys and Dolls, G.A.S.P. seems to be a web surfer who wandered into our place. He riled a few feathers (that's ok, at least it was a non-'catter) He obviously didn't see the listing of songs or ask any pertinent questions, vent...he'll never see your answers... and let's get on with being mudcatters


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Sheye
Date: 06 May 99 - 09:46 PM

Read this quote and just HAD to share:

When asked to comment on the music of Richard Wagner, Mark Twain replied: "Maybe it's not as bad as it sounds."


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: McMusic
Date: 06 May 99 - 09:54 PM

Personally, I rather enjoy all of you. And as far as BS goes--there ain't nothin' in th' world wrong with Broad Shoulders!!


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:04 PM

GASP...post your e-mail address and I'll send ya a f#*ing song

Sincerely, LEJ


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: northfolk/al cholger
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:13 PM

BS? Put it on the ground, Spread it all around, Dig it with a hoe it will make your garden grow...

hope that is the one last gasp!


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: BK
Date: 06 May 99 - 11:38 PM

Some of my favorite songs are abt bs -compelte silliness! such as "To Morrow" (probably in the database). Try it, maybe you'll like it.. It will not cause cancer or emphysema...

Also: you never know what jewels might come out of threads w/unlikely sounding titles... things like... TIPPLES! (maybe pronounced tee-play?)

Cheers, BK


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: bseed(charleskratz)
Date: 07 May 99 - 12:19 AM

Dammit, Northfolk, I was gonna post that one. --seed


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 07 May 99 - 12:38 AM

I first came in because a good friend told me there was a discussion going on about the record label I started some 38 years ago. I read that thread, then began looking at others. Strange thing happened: I began to get to "know" a number of the members of this community, and they have become extremely precious to me. If their banter gets off topic occasionally, it doesn't bother me at all, because it give me more insight into the people with whom I am exchanging ideas and information. I see that as a genuine benefit. GASP might experience the same thing just by hanging around awhile and getting acquainted.

If giving our good wishes and prayers to one of our friends, as we all have been giving them to Catspaw over the past weeks is what you consider to be BS, then, I'd guess you will never be satisfied with this forum. In that case, I'm sorry, and I'll bid you fare well, honestly. Perhaps you'll find what you're seeking elsewhere. I hope so.

Sandy (perhaps the oldest member of the crew, and still learning)


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: gargoyle
Date: 07 May 99 - 12:39 AM

May I suggest two boards?

One for the B.S. type people, call it Mud II. Or perhaps limiting "chat" to the "chat-room."

And the original Mud for those who were drawn here because it is viable alternative to "newgroups" and AOL..... and a legitimatly recognized source for MUSICAL information, MUSICAL dialogue, MUSICAL insight, MUSICAL expertise.

Mudders, Go back, count your own posts recorded in the directory. And then do a self assesment, are you "social" or are you "folk."

G.A.S.P. I for one am with you. You certainly got the BIRDS here to cackling when you kicked the hen house.


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: katlaughing
Date: 07 May 99 - 12:52 AM

Has anyone considered that GASP may be a regular incognito? If so, I feel sad that he/she doesn't feel confident/comfortable enough to come out and tell us what is bothering him/her without hiding behind an acronym. The reaction may have been a bit more tolerant.

Gargoyle: what's the dif between social and folk? I always found they went hand in hand, like two birds of a feather, two peas in a pod, like ham and eggs, etc.

How can one be folk and not be social? Is it a zen kind of thing, where one sings folk to an empty room, so as not to be social?

My dictionary defines "folksy" as "friendly or sociable". Sounds good to me, but then I AM social and folk, so what do I know?

katlaughing, companionably, won't you join me?


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Bri
Date: 07 May 99 - 12:56 AM

I must say I have never even considered all the weird conversations as BS... it's just "normal" and it's what the Mudcat is to me, since it's never been anyother way and frankly, I can't see why it would bother anyone! I mean, u still get the info u asked for, but in a much more interesting and insightful fashion..why don't u just ask on the thread for no chat if u don't want it???


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: ddw in windsor
Date: 07 May 99 - 01:15 AM

Wonder if G.A.S.P. ever figured out that it takes a little nonsense now and then to be able to recognize sense when we meet it?

ddw


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Night Owl
Date: 07 May 99 - 01:42 AM

Still don't understand how you can separate a legitimate Folk/Blues site from the phoalks's blues and giggles. I don't think the mudcats is an intellectual exercise...I think its music is a heart thing....that "MUSICAL information, MUSICAL dialogue, MUSICAL insight, and MUSICAL expertise", after all,... comes from REAL people!! Maybe reading and UNDERSTANDING songs and lyrics from the database before deciding whether or not to bother with the Forum....would be helpful.


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: SeanM
Date: 07 May 99 - 01:48 AM

I've got to believe in the side of restraint. We're a remarkable example of free speech here... there are no limits to topics, and the discussion covers a lot of ground. Sadly, if all you're looking for is music, and nothing but music, I hear that alt.whatever has plenty of groups that do nothing but sit and discuss tonal scales and shape note to the nth degree...

Read the name! It's the Mudcat CAFE! I don't know about you, but if I wandered into a cafe and found nothing but people sitting around babbling about tuning problems, I'd back out the door...slowly...and call the local asylum.

Sorry to those of you who seem to want a strictly musical forum, but I'd have to say you've found a social gathering of musicians and devotees of the style, and not a professional shop talk forum...

M


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 07 May 99 - 02:00 AM

Nicely put, Sean


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: bseed(charleskratz)
Date: 07 May 99 - 02:51 AM

Me, too, Sean. Any of you ever check out Harp-L or Banjo-L? Chat by email (70 messages a day, half of 'em on changing the pitch of reeds by filing them or putting a dab of epoxy on them, arguments about what pitch you should tune your banjo head to). There seems to be all the music here you could possibly want: the fact that the "B.S." threads are at the top of the list a lot means that lots of 'Catters like them (and believe it or not, Gargoyle, I'm not the only one who keeps refreshing them). --seed


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: reggie miles
Date: 07 May 99 - 03:16 AM

I haven't explored all the past threads yet so I don't know what has gone before. It's been a challenge just finding time to keep up with what takes place on a day to day basis. It seems though the threads about musical subjects clearly state their purpose, (Need lyrics for...)etc. and the less than musically centered threads are easy enough to spot as well. Catagorizing them into Mud and Mudlite could make it a little easier for those challenged by the search but for me the hunt aye that's the thing. You never know, as was previously stated, what may catch your eye and where it may carry you. To put it in even simpler terms, if you stick your head in a thousand garage sales you're bound to find something. Some don't have the patience or persistence or what ever it takes to do that. If it was easy everybody would be doing it. I was never musically blessed with any sort of great innate ability. That part of what I do has never come easily. Rather the opposite seems to be true in my case. I have however managed to keep at it. Now after twenty years or so of playing at this music stuff I find that a great many of those who gather to listen to my songs seem to enjoy a good deal of my incessant babbling (or BS if you will) as well. A cosmic balance has been struck, in my favor too, because I get as big a kick out of entertaining with stories as I do out of entertaining with music. Honing that verbal banter you refer to as BS my dear G.A.S.P. could be just the skill you need to balance your musical abilities. If you have a specific question that you need assistance with please by all means ask and at least a couple hundred minds will try to respond to your inquiry. Reggie


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: MudGuard
Date: 07 May 99 - 03:49 AM

Hi G.A.S.P.,
considering the long list of your postings which concern music (exactly 0 posts) and your even longer list of BS posts (exactly 1 posts), I calculate a BS/music rate of infinity (1 divided by 0).
So who are you to complain about the general BS/music rate???
Andreas


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: leprechaun
Date: 07 May 99 - 04:04 AM

I'm glad I read this one because I was feeling guilty about my overly long non-musical tirade on another thread.


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Banjer
Date: 07 May 99 - 04:49 AM

Well said, everyone....I too would like G.A.S.P., whatever that means, to answer the question, "Where does social stop and folk begin?". Is not much folk music, especially that of this country's turbulent 50's and 60's, a commentary of social standards of the time? Goodnes, if songs like "Blowin' In The Wind", et.al are not social folk, then what are they? Have I missed the point all these years?
I also will apologize to those I have upset and those that I will upset in the future with my BS posts, which far outnumber my musical posts. I know a hell of a lot more about bullshit than I do music right now (but I'm learning), so I will continue to share that which I have the most of!
Like Sandy pointed out in an earlier post, if all this is about the three threads regarding Catspaw and his dillema, then that I DO NOT apologize for. That came from the social heart of every folkie on this site and if that is what upset G.A.S.P, he may do well to find other areas, because hopefully that sense of community that makes this site what it is is will never disappear!
Wasn't it Abraham Lincoln that said, "You can please some of the people all of the time, All the people some of the time, But you will never please ALL the people ALL of the time"?


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Wolfgang
Date: 07 May 99 - 05:24 AM

Any chance of more threads about songs was a thread a while ago with a similar complaint but with less responses perhaps due to the moderate wording of the complaint. I bet you that GASP is a regular (as katlaughing has first presumed) for why should any casual visitor complain. And I bet you (s)he is a person I and many others would hate to loose as a contributor and friend. So let us take the wording of this thread as an indicator of the amount of anger and not as a hint that we are not supposed to take the complaint serious (I know, many of you have).
I too think that the balance between music and chat has changed in the last couple of months. I wouldn't love Mudcat as much as I do without the occasional chat, the occasional mocking or ironic remark, sure not without thread about political/social background to the music. But chiefly I come here for the music, the songs, the history of songs, information about songwriters, about recordings and all that. I'd love to see relatively more threads of the (unsurpassed) Spancil Hill type thread combining music, lyrics, background information and the occasional chatty remark. My problem is similar to John is Brisbane. I cannot read anymore all threads or posts but have increasing difficulties sorting out what to read and what not. I nearly missed (and perhaps have already but never would know) two or three songs I had looking for for a long time since they were buried amidst a thread I usually do not open.
GASP wants to stay here, why else should (s)he complain for (s)he surely does know how to hit an EXIT button and needs not to be taught that. So please accept that for a growing minority (?) not the chat as such but its increasing rate is a growing concern. Mudcat cannot afford to willingly accept loosing contributors mainly or even solely interested in music.

Wolfgang


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: dwditty
Date: 07 May 99 - 05:46 AM

Someone please check to see if Art is laughing.
DW


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Big Mick
Date: 07 May 99 - 09:12 AM

I have maintained from the begining that we are a community of musicians, whose main focus is folk and blues music. As in any community, as the diversity of the group expands, and as many voices and ideas are heard, we have begun to breakdown into "factions" as we face certain issues. The key is to not let the factions fracture the whole. A successful community learns that diversity of thought is to be revelled in. That is what I meant when I said "sorry you don't get it". I no longer can read all the threads, so I rely on the title of the thread, who the author is, and intuition to help me choose which I read. If you long for the good old days when we could read all the threads and know all the contributors, then limit the amount of chat. We will then become a boring little town where someone will remember the lyrics and chords to most every folk/blues song that ever was written. And we will be like anyone of a hundred sites on the Net. And, I would suggest, we would lose some of our most interesting citizens. It is exactly that which some of you seek to limit that keeps us vibrant and makes us unique. The "sappy" non-musical comments that have been mentioned, I will wager, will spawn music. I will bet money that any number of 'Catters have been inspired to write songs based on topics from our non-musical conversations, arguments, silliness and love for one another. Music is moral law, said the philosopher. And we all have been blessed to help in the administration of that law. To use an analogy, could you imagine a society where the law was administered by robots? What I am trying to say is that without the human context of understanding, that which we rely on for protection would quickly become repressive. And so it is with the music, the moral law, that we seek to administer. These discussions, silliness, banter and outright disagreements (such as my recent encounter with Sapper, whom I have found to be a welcome addition to our town) have actually made me a better and more rounded interpreter of the stories I sing.

And as we all have said, if you discover a thread is not to your taste, don't read it. I do it all the time.

All the best,

Mick


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Subject: RE: More Music Less BS!
From: Peter T.
Date: 07 May 99 - 09:38 AM

Perhaps this thread is beginning to prove GASP's point in a contrary way. So:

F#
G
A
C
and back to F#.
Now, where were we....

(music and B.S. together again on one thread. What more could you ask for in life?)
Yours, Peter T.


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Mudcat time: 25 January 5:29 PM EST

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