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The National Trust. Folk CD

Ruth Archer 13 Jun 07 - 11:12 AM
Ruth Archer 13 Jun 07 - 11:09 AM
greg stephens 13 Jun 07 - 08:06 AM
The Borchester Echo 13 Jun 07 - 07:52 AM
Mr Fox 13 Jun 07 - 07:28 AM
Dave Earl 13 Jun 07 - 06:12 AM
Lizzie Cornish 13 Jun 07 - 05:44 AM
GUEST,Mary Brennan 13 Jun 07 - 05:13 AM
greg stephens 13 Jun 07 - 04:40 AM
GUEST,Moaning Minnie 13 Jun 07 - 04:30 AM
Sorcha 12 Jun 07 - 07:41 PM
Ruth Archer 12 Jun 07 - 07:16 PM
TheSnail 12 Jun 07 - 07:07 PM
Lizzie Cornish 12 Jun 07 - 06:23 PM
GUEST,Mr Gubbins (no, not that one!!!) 12 Jun 07 - 06:22 PM
Lizzie Cornish 12 Jun 07 - 06:22 PM
GUEST,Moaning Minnie 12 Jun 07 - 06:09 PM
Giant Folk Eyeball (inactive) 12 Jun 07 - 06:06 PM
Ruth Archer 12 Jun 07 - 05:38 PM
GUEST,Mr Gubbins (no, not that one!!!) 12 Jun 07 - 05:37 PM
GUEST,Mr Gubbins (no, not that one!!!) 12 Jun 07 - 05:35 PM
Blowzabella 12 Jun 07 - 05:34 PM
Lizzie Cornish 12 Jun 07 - 05:32 PM
TheSnail 12 Jun 07 - 05:30 PM
Blowzabella 12 Jun 07 - 05:30 PM
GUEST,Mr Gubbins (no, not that one!!!) 12 Jun 07 - 05:29 PM
Surreysinger 12 Jun 07 - 05:27 PM
Lizzie Cornish 12 Jun 07 - 05:25 PM
GUEST,Mr Gubbins (no, not that one!!!) 12 Jun 07 - 05:24 PM
Ruth Archer 12 Jun 07 - 05:15 PM
Folkiedave 12 Jun 07 - 05:12 PM
Sorcha 12 Jun 07 - 05:09 PM
Sorcha 12 Jun 07 - 05:08 PM
Lizzie Cornish 12 Jun 07 - 05:04 PM
The Borchester Echo 12 Jun 07 - 04:51 PM
Ruth Archer 12 Jun 07 - 04:46 PM
GUEST,Mr Gubbins (no, not that one!!!) 12 Jun 07 - 04:33 PM
Ruth Archer 12 Jun 07 - 04:11 PM
Lizzie Cornish 12 Jun 07 - 04:10 PM
greg stephens 12 Jun 07 - 03:59 PM
Blowzabella 12 Jun 07 - 03:55 PM
Giant Folk Eyeball (inactive) 12 Jun 07 - 03:31 PM
greg stephens 12 Jun 07 - 03:06 PM
Giant Folk Eyeball (inactive) 12 Jun 07 - 03:04 PM
greg stephens 12 Jun 07 - 02:45 PM
Giant Folk Eyeball (inactive) 12 Jun 07 - 02:43 PM
Giant Folk Eyeball (inactive) 12 Jun 07 - 02:25 PM
GUEST,Mary Brennan 12 Jun 07 - 12:49 PM
GUEST 12 Jun 07 - 12:49 PM
Lizzie Cornish 12 Jun 07 - 11:51 AM
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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 11:12 AM

The last sentence should have read "which WAS appropriate." I haven't come over all Yorkshire.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 11:09 AM

Just to be clear: no personal attacks on Lizzie have taken place. Some people have talked about the veracity of the CD's title, given the material it contains, which seems fair enough. I responded to some questions about English music, and a certain version of Englishness (which perhaps isn't a million miles away from that found in a National Trust souvenir shop), being subverted by the Right. As it happens, Lizzie posted a link to a music festival that has links with a Right-wing nationalist political movement. I merely highlighted the link, which were appropriate given the previous questions on the topic.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: greg stephens
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 08:06 AM

Mr Fox: yes I pasionately do care. I have a lifelong love for English folk music, an obsessive devotion. Sure I care. So I want other people to enjoy it. I also passionately love jazz, I think "Savoy Blues" by the Louis Armstrong Hot Five is possibly the best track in the world ever. But nothing, absolutely nothing, would induce me to put it on a compilation of English contemporary folk music. Or of English traditional folk music. Or of Viennese kletzmer bands. It's a classic jazz recording from New Orleans musicians recorded in the USA. Similarly with a Scottish singer singing an old American protest song: "English contemporary music", it isn't.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 07:52 AM

English traditional music (and indeed English contemporary music) has a specific meaning.
To put out a sampler of music which is largely neither (however good some of the individual recordings may be) is scarcely of very much use in attempting to persuade the English that they have a recognisable and worthwhile cultural heritage.
The CD is meant, presumably, as an impulse buy along with all the other whimsy souvenir crap you get in these places.
I care that the public is being misled.
It is this sort of careless packaging that leads people to imagine that wifty-wafty, new-age Celtic drivel and angst-ridden teenage plinky-plonky whingeing is also f*lk music.
For a Key Stage 1 introduction to English trad, gift shops (or any other non-standard outlet could do a lot worse than stock Topic's two compilations Hidden English and Stepping Up.
And in view of the earlier remark about the ripping off activities of a similar venture at Past Times, an examination not just of presentation but of licensing arrangements might not go amiss.
Just how much (or little) are artists receiving for the dubious privilege of having their work so unsuitably showcased?


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Mr Fox
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 07:28 AM

>>Does anyone know who compiled this album?<<

Does anyone CARE? Shouldn't we just be thankful that interest in folk has come from an unexpected direction, rather than indulging in trainspotterish quibbles over origins and definitions?

"MY research has determined that Shakespeare contributed the word 'the' to verse eight of John Barleycorn in the reign of James I. therefore we can no longer call it a 'traditional' song......" For God's SAKE! Get a LIFE!!


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Dave Earl
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 06:12 AM

Lizzie

You said "who are of no importance to me whatsoever anymore."


The song says :-

I will walk alone by the black muddy river
And sing me song of my own

You know where that comes from doancha

:-)
Dave


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 05:44 AM

>>>Neither are we making personal attacks on Lizzie.<<<

Sadly Mary...that can't be said for all in here, but..as always it's the 'usual suspects' who are of no importance to me whatsoever anymore.

So...back to the CD then and the inner sleeve notes once again...continued from above......


"Another adopted folk song ' Farewell To The Gold'- which is performed beautiifully here by the duo Nancy Kerr and James Fagan - was written by a New Zealander, Paul Metsers, in 1969. Following a school trip on which Metsers had taken his class to old gold panning territory in the Shotover River, he read about a flash flood that occurred in 1863, and created a story about a pair of prospectors who are caught in the flood.

The tender ballad, 'Sally Wheatley' is performed here by the North Eastern duo Bob Fox and Stu Luckley. This delightful song was written by the great nineteenth century music hall artist, Joe Wilson. It tells a cautionary tale about how a man is caught out by 'courting too slow', taking his time to woo the titular Sally, only to see her go off with another man, 'cause she gans with Mr. Black, and they say he's gonna marry Sally Wheatley', the moral of the song - as Bob Fox puts it in the North Eastern vernacular - 'shy bairns get ne broth!'

The famous modern folk singer-songwriter Billy Bragg's moving song 'King James Version' is given a wonderful makeover by Eliza Carthy, with assistance from Spiers and Boden, as well as violist Ben Ivitsky. This song features on Eliza's fantastic 2005 album, Rough Music, the title of which alludes to an old English form of punishment for minor offences, designed to induce shame and encourage the offender to leave the community."

Brilliant stuff isn't it! :0) :0) :0) :0)


More a bit later on...

Lizzie :0)


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: GUEST,Mary Brennan
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 05:13 AM

This is the point that several of us are trying to make. It is a very pleasing CD - BUT it's not English folk. We're not dissing the National Trust or the music itself. Neither are we making personal attacks on Lizzie.

Yes, the National Trust is to be congratulated for releasing the odd folk CD - but some of their choices are very odd.

Did you see what I did there?


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: greg stephens
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 04:40 AM

CD title: English Folksongs. Subtitle: contemporary English folk music. Does anyone know who compiled this album? It seems to be cobbled together from some remarkably inappropriate material.
For example, the incomparable Christine Kidd, one of my favourite folkies, is indubitably Scottish.And her Cotton Girls song is billed as traditional American So, fine as it is, what on earth is it doing on a National Trust CD billed as contemporary English folk song?


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: GUEST,Moaning Minnie
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 04:30 AM

I've got a copy. Bought it in April in Wales!


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Sorcha
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 07:41 PM

:0 yourownself. Oh, Ah forghat. Ah shall try to speak Ehnglish ahn this thread.

Go back to Canada. Most of us were happier then. Eh?


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 07:16 PM

Indeed. I hasten to add that the only reason it was brought up here is because someone in this thread posted a link to a related website. It's the sort of thing that really has to be acknowledged.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: TheSnail
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 07:07 PM

Thanks Ruth. Bit of a heavy read.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 06:23 PM

;0)


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: GUEST,Mr Gubbins (no, not that one!!!)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 06:22 PM

"Lizzie, I'm not quite sure what point you think you're making by quoting great chunks from the cover of the CD"

Well it is in keeping with the title of this thread, which IS after all

The National Trust. Folk CD
:-)


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 06:22 PM

I'm just illustrating that whoever put the CD together is well aware that some of the songs aren't English and they're not frightened to say so either. :0)

Mmmmmmmm...I'm listening to my CD right now..Oh you SO have get a copy....

I'd type a bit more out for you all, but my contactlenses are misting up with tiredness now...so it's all a blur...great for looking in the mirror though, I look about 30 years younger than when I woke up this morning! :0)

Heehee!


"HANG THAT WOMAN! SHE DARES TO LAUGH IN THIS NOW EXTREMELY SERIOUS THREAD WOT US SERIOUS ONES 'AVE TAKEN OVER AND ARE NOW IN CHARGE OF..."


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: GUEST,Moaning Minnie
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 06:09 PM

Lizzie, I'm not quite sure what point you think you're making by quoting great chunks from the cover of the CD.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Giant Folk Eyeball (inactive)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 06:06 PM

Sorry, probably my fault the thread took a detour. Thanks for the link above - I'll go and take a look now.
Cheers
Nigel


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:38 PM

Snail:

http://www.mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=101144&messages=162


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: GUEST,Mr Gubbins (no, not that one!!!)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:37 PM

ooops....

"They shall not pass" (French: "On ne passe pas", Spanish: "¡No pasarán!") is a propaganda slogan used to express determination to defend a position against an enemy"

The phrase has been used as recently as December 2002 by Colonel Emmanual Maurin, commanding a French Foreign Legion unit in Côte d'Ivoire.

oh dear it was co-opted.... ;-)


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: GUEST,Mr Gubbins (no, not that one!!!)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:35 PM


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Blowzabella
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:34 PM

Not to detract but, you do realise that these intos will have been written by the providers of the music, rather then the NT. Yes, they have been published by the NT, but I shouldn't assume any great musical knowledge ... not just yet ...


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:32 PM

Next bit... :0)

"In 'Military Road' Judy Dinning and her band, Lucky Bags, create a delightful musical accompaniment, blending softly arpeggiated guitar and celtic harp patterns, on top of which beautifullly harmonised vocals weave a soothing tapestry. This song was written by Jez Lowe (HURRAY!!..that's me not the NT!)....whose group, The Bad Pennies,   Judy was a member of for a number of years. Another brilliant female vocalist is Maddie Southorn whose second album 'The Pilgrom Soul' features the goregous piano-led song 'River', whilst the Scottish singer Christine Kydd performs 'Cotton Mill Girls, a traditional protest song from America, where women workers in the cotton mills began striking during the mid-eighteenth century, due to poor working conditions.."


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: TheSnail
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:30 PM

I agree that this thread is about the National Trust, not the National Front but infiltration of English traditional music by right wing groups is of current concern to me. Could someone point me to the thread referred to?

(Never mind Justice for England, with Boris Johnson as president and Henry Kelly as a vice-president, how can they expect to be taken seriously?)


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Blowzabella
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:30 PM

Hi Lizzie

Good to see you back

now you know I am a defender of the tradition ... and not just the sung or played tradition but lots of other things too but, please wil you take a look at this link and tell me what you think. I think it is a tradition too far now ... sad to say, i have participated but only once - never went back ...   

Appleby Horse fair thread


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: GUEST,Mr Gubbins (no, not that one!!!)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:29 PM

slightly off-topic.

"commissioned folky CDs"

The Wild Side Of Town. The Albion Band and Chris Baines.
Released on Celtic Music unfortunately


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Surreysinger
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:27 PM

All questions regarding right or left wing connotations aside, having looked at that link, I note that it is exceedingly "last year" any way ... there doesn't seem to be much point in linking to something which may or may not have taken place in 2006 (I note that reference is only made to provisional artistes )and is not current.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:25 PM

Ok..Track 3, from the inside cover..

"Martin Carthy ( a renowned folk singer and sometime member of the great Steeleye Span); and family side project, Blue Murder, which also includes Norma's brother, Mike (Norma, Mike and sister Lal began their folk careers as The Watersons, whose richly textured vocal harmonies became popular during the 1960's and 70's) The first of these performances is 'Black Muddy River' by Waterson-Carthy, which features Norma Waterson singing lead, Martin Carthy playing guitar, Eliza on fiddle and Tim van Eyken, of Dr. Faustus on melodeon. A performance of this song was anonymously sent to Martin and Norma on a cassette tape, some years ago and they only discovered who had written it whilst recording the song for Norma's first solo album - surprisingly, 'Black Muddy Water' was a song by the American band The Grateful Dead, written by the band's singer Jerry Carcia and Robert Hunter. This beautiful performance demonstrates how easily a song with the right sentiment, no matter what it's origins, can become assimilated into the English folk repertoire."


Black Muddy Water is what is written on the page here, but I'd presume 'Water' should actually be 'River'

Well I don't know about you, but I think the information in there is way above what you would normally get on most CDs. :0)


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: GUEST,Mr Gubbins (no, not that one!!!)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:24 PM

"This very same movement was discussed at length recently on Mudcat"
it appears it's going to be discussed all over again, by some...

Focus..stay on track...The National Trust. Folk CD
there...wasn't that easy....? :-)


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:15 PM

Others asked whether the far right has tried to hijack Englishness. It was apposite, though perhaps unfortunate, that a festival to which you posted a link happens to have, on its official website, a link to a far-right political movement.

This very same movement was discussed at length recently on Mudcat,with the festival you've posted your link to getting a mention, which is why the name rang a bell.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Folkiedave
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:12 PM

I think Joan and Diane are correct to point out the dangers of racism on this or any other thread.

When did you get back from Canada?


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Sorcha
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:09 PM

But, I thought you spoke Canuck now??? Eh?


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Sorcha
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:08 PM

English???? Eh? Scuse me, but I don't speak English. I spik 'Merkan. Can you translate?


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:04 PM

Ahem....'Scuse me Gals...

I know you love to call everyone and anyone a racist at the drop of a hat, but could you take this arguement elsewhere, this thread is about The National Trust supporting English folk music and musicians.

Maybe you could start your own one entitled 'Places Where The BNP Lurk' and tell folk that they're more than likely in your Lavendar Pot Pourri or selling you that English Rose Room Perfume Spray...you know...things like that...

We're all quite happy in here talking about things English....

Thanks ever so much...

Lizzie :0)


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 04:51 PM

Well, whaddya know?

Guess what Mr Gubbins came out with in the sinisterly-named Justice for England thread in which a innocence-feigning apologist for the BNP had a go at leading us onto a Mayday demonstration and English music hijacking expedition:

'last thing English music needed was to be hijacked by the far right.'

or the far left....


Then and now: ¡No Pasarán!


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 04:46 PM

rather more sinister when it's the far Right, I'm afraid.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: GUEST,Mr Gubbins (no, not that one!!!)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 04:33 PM

"when the Right sneaks in and tries to hijack issues around nationality"

the same can be said for the left, so the problem continues.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 04:11 PM

"Nigel S: there are indeed far-right people trying to muscle in on folk here."

In fact, the website of the very same English Music Festival mentioned further up the page was rumbled on Mudcat not so very long ago for containing a link to the "Justice for England" campaign, subject of much recent discussion on this forum:

http://www.englishmusicfestival.org.uk/links.html

Many members agreed that Justice for England was a right-wing movement, and any music festival happy to be linked to it would be highly suspect by association.

This is the problem: when the Right sneaks in and tries to hijack issues around nationality, it can be very sneaky. The music is unfortunately quite vulnerable to subversion.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 04:10 PM

A little from the inside cover..Well a lot of a little really, very informative..


"English folk music is embedded in traditions founded over hundreds of years, whilst simultaeously constantly evovling, mixing and matching tunes and texts and adding new melodies and lyrics to those which have been long established. This collection presents the best of both worlds, with old and new sitting side by side in perfect harmony.

We begin with Oysterband's hypnotic rendition of the ancient folk song 'John Barleycorn'. The character John Barleycorn is the personification of the cereal crop barley and the song tells of its progression and transformation from seed into beer. John Barleycorn is included in the 1568 Bannatyne Manuscript, plenty of broadside editions exist from the seventeenth century and many have since written their own versions, including the Scottish poet Robert Burns, who, in 1782 chose to use the story as a celebration of the other alcoholic beverage that is made from barley, whiskey.

Just as the sailor in 'Across The Line' has 'sailed the whole world over, across the seven seas' this shanty embraces the same seafaring spirit with words that are thought to originate in Australia - 'I courted my sweetheart underneath the Kaori trees' - and a melody from Brazil (Clube Da Esquina No 2, written by Milton Nascimento, Lo Borges and Marcio Borges), and brass flourishes which were inspired by Benjamin Britten's 'Sea Interludes' This song has been assembled by the folk big band Bellowhead, a rapidly upcoming force in folk music which was put together by the eminent duo John Spiers and Jon Boden, who are heard later on this collection performing 'Go And Leave Me', a rather sweet Victorian ballad which was popular in the music hall.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: greg stephens
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 03:59 PM

Certainly confiscate the teacher's guitar.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Blowzabella
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 03:55 PM

Not NT but I do know that some pals of mine were severally AND severely 'ripped orf' by Past Times wen they did a CD for them some year sago ... got about £30 each for it ... hmmm it was marketed as 'Beat The Drum' in case any of you have it, I had it - AND it was one of my favourite Cds long before I met the poor beggars who made it.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Giant Folk Eyeball (inactive)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 03:31 PM

Erm, I don't have a problem with quality sausage merchants not putting weirdly random items near the sausages. And I almost understand the allegory... But is Dylan the Kentucky Fried Chicken or the ginger biscuits? And shouldn't someone confiscate the teacher's guitar?
Cheers
Nigel


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: greg stephens
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 03:06 PM

Nigel S: there are indeed far-right people trying to muscle in on folk here. Like the turbo-folk of Serbia which is an ongoing phenomenon. Who you share your display stand with is an issue that will be discussed in an increasing way over the next few years. I am very happy, for example, if anybody wants to put a Cumbrian traditional tune or song CD next to one of of my similar efforts in my display case in a Cumberland sausage shop But I don't particular want Bob Dylan or Show of Hands or the local schoolteacher's electric guitar chillout improvisations in the same stand in that particular shop, because that would be confusing. And I very very especially don't want a CD of some BNP guitar strummer singing about what a wonderful county Cumbria would be if there weren't any Kurdish asylum seekers there. These are things we all have to decide. Same as the man who runs the organic sausage shop in the first place: if he's got a display case full of his ten brands of interestingly flavoured Cumberland sausages, he's not going to put a pile of Kentucky Fried Chicken bits in the corner, or the old-fashioned ginger biscuits either. They'll go somewhere else. That's the way these chaps run things. It may be over-regimented, or even over-"pure" if you like, but it lets people know what to expect.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Giant Folk Eyeball (inactive)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 03:04 PM

Hmmm... doesn't the NT own John Lennon's auntie's suburban semi? However, Greg, you make very fair points. I just think that someone may hear a CD like this, decide they want to hear more, say, Waterson Carthy or Nancy Kerr & James Fagan and go out and buy an album. They may explore further, and at some point decide they'd like to find out about English fiddle tunes... and hopefully someone like your good self could point them in the right direction. Actually, could you, please, if you have a few moments?!

You see, this English folk business is a relatively new thing to me, getting to hear it via the deeply impure(!) psychedelic folk, folk rock etc which I still enjoy. I'm hugely enjoying much of what I'm hearing and only regret I never heard it years ago. And I think, warts and all, flawed or not, CDs like this have to be a good thing in that they may start other people on the voyage of deeply pleasurable discovery I'm currently on. I've even started buying secondhand vinyl again!

And sorry, I'm going wildly off topic with all this self disclosure..

Cheers
Nigel


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: greg stephens
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 02:45 PM

Nigel Spencer: I agree with you that purity is overrated. But I don't grasp how a record that is so "impure"(your term, not mine) will succeed in interesting casual passers-by in English folk, if it actually contains little or no English folk. My area of particular enjoyment and interest, for example, is the tradition of English fiddle tunes, of which many thousand examples exist. But how will a CD that doesn't actually contain any English fiddle tunes succeed in interesting anyone in English fiddle tunes? I don't follow your logic here.
    The National Trust keeps up its level of visitor numbers by owning a variety of historic buildings and bits of landscape, that collectively form a linked and moderately coherent body of stuff that many(but not all) people find interesting. You like old buildings and fells in the Lake District and sand dunes? Great, go join the NT and visit a few of their properties, they deliver the goods. You want recently constructed supermarket distribution centres? Well, you'll have to wait a generation to see if the NT decides they are of interest and within their remit.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Giant Folk Eyeball (inactive)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 02:43 PM

"Do bear in mind, however, that these non-specialist twee gift shops joints have been conned more than once in the past into stocking the BNP-propaganda end of the 'English' market and artists have had to struggle to get their work withdrawn from this sort of 'endorsement'."

What's the story here? Sounds like quite an interesting cautionary tale. I've always been suprised that the far right haven't muscled in on traditional music and tried to claim it as their own special thing. Or maybe they have tried and been successfully repelled? Or are there artists out there who should be avoided like the plague?

Cheers
Nigel


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Giant Folk Eyeball (inactive)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 02:25 PM

Judging by the artists appearing, I'd have thought anyone taking home either of these CDs and not knowing much folk music would be pretty pleased with what they'd bought - and might even explore further. I'm not sure they'd mind or even care that some of the English acts appearing were singing songs from elsewhere: and in any case, I'd have thought purity in any form was a massively overrated virtue. I suspect they'd only start worrying about it after completely immersing themselves in folk music for many years. Which this CD could be a starting point for, for someone out there...
Cheers
Nigel


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: GUEST,Mary Brennan
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 12:49 PM

I've had the new National Trust CD for some time now and like it very much - though it isn't English Folk music.

I also have a National Trust CD called "A Lot of Jolly Good Folk" which I bought in 2002. Now, at a quick glance, I reckon this one IS English Folk Music. It's got tracks by Ralph McTell, Richard Thompson, Carthy/Swarb, Eliza, Pentangle, Martin Simpson, Nic Jones, Lal Waterson and Olly Knight, Steeleye Span, Albion Band, Silly Sisters, Watersons, Maddy Prior, Bert Jansch.

Most of the tracks were licensed from Topic.

Now that's what I call English Folk Music! Perhaps I should ring the National Trust and go "YAAAY" at them. They might re-release it then.


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: GUEST
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 12:49 PM

Mary asks Is the music of Wales the one with Siwsann George on...

I can't remember but will check...though this may take some time...Grandson number 2 "rearranged" them for me over the bank holiday...:-))

Baz

who took it better than he might...


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Subject: RE: The National Trust. Folk CD
From: Lizzie Cornish
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 11:51 AM

Well if it's Classical you're after there's also

THE ENGLISH MUSIC FESTIVAL

And...there is this beautiful video, which, although it's on the site above under the final heading of 'media'...I can't watch from my computer, as my server has started to block the videos..GRRRRRR!

It's very lovely...

THE MUSIC OF RALPH VAUGHAN WILLIAMS along Devon's River Torridge


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