Mudcat Café message #2286003 The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #109167   Message #2286003
Posted By: Bee
12-Mar-08 - 12:33 AM
Thread Name: BS: I'd like to believe that there is a God
Subject: RE: BS: I'd like to believe that there is a God
Little Hawk, nope, I do not see it that way, because I am not talking about walking into a church and telling people their beliefs are nonsense. In fact I specifically said I would not want to disrupt or be negative about a prayer thread, and was aware that people find them comforting.

But if someone speaks to me about their beliefs, I do not see that my lack of belief should be considered the negative POV and theirs the positive. That is just the construct that is placed on religion, that it is seen to be positive by believers and has long been considered to be positive. I am quite able to see my secularism/naturalism as the positive starting point. In fact, once again, and likely quite unconsciously, you seem to have decided that my strongly held atheist stance has less value (and a negative one, at that) than that of any theist.

In fact, I see no reason why I should not be openly positive about my views, just as theists are about their views. They express disbelief about my understanding of the universe, therefore, they are negative towards my beliefs.

They are saying my clothes are ugly, in your analogy.

And I don't think your analogy works very well, anyway, since I'm not saying "You are all stupid deluded fools (your clothes are ugly)". If we were to stretch your clothing analogy, it might be more like discussing the utility of various kinds of clothing, and why I prefer not to wear their clothing style, and why they do prefer it. But that's really stretching it.

And this: "I recommend focusing more on positives. Persuade by enthusiasm about what you are for and what you like, rather than by criticism of and attack upon what others are for. It shouldn't matter what others are for so much, because they are not living your life for you. What they are for is basically their own business, because that's their life, not yours.

What you are for is likewise your business, because it's your life, not theirs."
= LH

Although you likely don't mean it to sound that way, is a suggestion that I shut up about my beliefs entirely, because the very mention of them is an 'attack' on believers. Theism infiltrates virtually every area of our lives, from Stevie Harper at the top saying God Bless Canada while allowing homophobic anti-science bigots to govern our country and influence our laws to the Jehovah's Witnesses at my door. Who I am always polite to, BTW, because they are my neighbours, not because they are theists. My point being: theists are in my business by default. At least they should be aware I exist, as a human being like them.