Mudcat Café message #1652104 The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #73264   Message #1652104
Posted By: beardedbruce
20-Jan-06 - 01:31 PM
Thread Name: BS: NON-Partisan political comments
Subject: RE: BS: NON-Partisan political comments
Arne,

"OK. So, pray tell: What motivates you to turn such a blind eye to the incompetence, mendaciousness, and outright criminality of the maladministration and the Republican party then? If you think I'm misstating the case, I'd bring to your attention:"

Not a blind eye- it is just that they are better than the alternative offered by the Democrats, IMO.



"1). Dubya's comments that no one in the maladministration (Libby and Rove included) were involved in the Plame outing (and his comments that anyone who did such would be fired)."

As I stated, IF there are people found to have committed illegal acts, they should be prosecuted. Period. Regardless of party.


"2). Dubya's repeated contention that war in Iraq was the "last" option, and that he hadn't decide to go in there, when there's repeated accounts from multiple sources that Iraq had been in the works almost from the inception of Dubya's maladministration."

This was discussed- PLANS are always being made for POSSIBLE actions, just in case. I have seen NO EVIDENCE that any decision, other than to have Saddam comply with his obligations, was made PRIOR to the DEADLINE date specified in UNR 1441.

"3). Dubya's repeated assertions that warrants were needed for wiretaps and that he wasn't doing any warrantless snoops."

Repeated? I have not seen them- can you provide a link?
I will wait for facts before deciding the point.



"4). The maladministration's claims that Dubya didn't know Abramoff (despite Abramaoff's 200 or so visits to the White House, his logged meetings with Dubya, and his being a member of the Dubya transition team. Hey, for that matter, remember Dubya's "Kenny who?" for his old pal (and biggest contributor) "Kenny Boy" Lay."

Again, send me links.


"[Arne]:"That Dubya out-and-out lied when he said: "He [Saddam] wouldn't let them [the weapons inspectors] in" and that is why Dubya decided to invade."

Yep. Not only is that not the truth, but it's not even close. I've tried to look at how it could be charitably interpretetd as a twisting of the truth, a somewhat dishonest and misleading slant on the truth, or a reasonable mistake. No matter how I look at it, t's none of those things, Bruce, and it's time you displayed some honesty and fessed up to it. Or you can explain why Saddam letting the inspectors in (an obvious and established fact) is "Saddam not letting them in"."


So, after the deadline, he let the inspectors have the access they wanted- AFTER THE DEADLINE HAD PASSED. From his past history, he always gave in just enough to get away with NOT complying with the UN resolutions- Can you provide ANY evidence that he was providing ANY of the information specifically pointed out in the UN report required by 1441, that stated he was in substatantial non-compliance? The ONLY thing I had heard was that, IF he did provide that information, the inspectors would have been able to do their job- NOT THAT HE WAS COOPERATING.



"We have gone around about the weapons inspectors- And the UN report says that Saddam was in "substantial non-compliance" at the time of the deadline.

Oh, nonsense. And as I said, disagreeing with your misinterpretation and selective cut'n'paste of the facts hardly constitutes personal attack on you. What "deadline"? What "report"?

Have you bothered to read the UN REPORT required by 1441? It appears you have major problems in comprehension of the English language.

Do you understand "FINAL" at all?

"hat does that have to do with the state on the ground in March of 2003? And more importantly, isn't it up to the United Nations to decide what action to take in the face of any "substantial non-compliance"?"

State on the ground in MARCH- Saddam had failed to comply with his last and final chance, and the UN had stated that. He had the choice to open his borders, and did not- His RESISTANCE to the US invasion was sufficient reason, from the ceasefire terms of the Kuwait war, to invade.


"David S. Broder " The first -- and to my mind weakest -- instance is the claim that Bush took the nation to war on the basis of false intelligence about Iraq's weapons of mass destruction. But there is no clear evidence as yet that Bush willfully concocted or knowingly distorted the intelligence he received about Saddam Hussein's military programs. Interpretations of that intelligence varied within the government, but the Clinton administration, of which Gore was an important part, came to the same conclusions that Bush did -- and so did other governments in the Western alliance."


You state this is hogwash, but provide no justification of your opinion. You may think it whatever you like- but if you want others to agree with you, you might want to at least outline the facts you believe support your view. This is your usual method of argument- I still await all the FACTS that would show me why you have your opinions.