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User Name Thread Name Subject Posted
Piers BS: Paris Immigrant?Riots (154* d) RE: BS: Paris Immigrant?Riots 11 Nov 05

Friend, It is you that should apologise for me supporting the murderous, theiving economic system that ravages and pillages the planet and most of its people.

I'm not the kind of socialist who wants to shoot capitalists. So who is of the capitalist class and who is of the working class makes no difference to me. It is the system of economic organisation that we intend to transform into one that benefits all of humanity, the capitalist class which you flatter yourself with belonging to because you own a few shares is an irrelevance. Where do pensions come from? Where does the money that some workers use to buy shares come from? It is from wage labour. Pensions are deferred wages, that they are used in the finance market is irrelevant, though not when someone gambles it away. Capital, liquid or solid, is wealth used to produce more wealth. Most of the capital is owned by a least people, whilst most of the labour is done by most of the people.

It is so typical that some think democracy can only apply to the state, the system by which we are governed and not governing ourselves. The idea that people can sit down discuss and debate how to produce and distribute goods and services is an anathema to capitalism: minority control of the means of production requires a minority making decisions. In capitalism the 'invisible hand of the market' sorts it out, who needs conscious planning? We have the potential feed, clothe, house and entertain the entire human population several times over yet millions are malnourished, poorly housed and miserable. This is what system of 'no profit, no production' and 'can't pay, can't have' means.

As for self-love, I believe I will be best off by co-operating with fellow humans to build a society where the whole point of work is to satisfy human needs rather than making a profit for the capital owners, and work is a pleasure not a struggle.

Have a splendid weekend

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